Survivor:Challenge/Common Thread (GAME OVER! FEED BACK WELCOME)

[Lathum]

Why did GE go paper?

[st.cronin]

Gram, ITC, and Pass were the only ones who played along. And who knows if they were actually playing along, or thought the whole thing was a trick.

[GoldenEagle]

Checking in for the first time today, really. I will around for the night.

[Abe Sargent]

That's right Lathum, avoid the fact that I owned you in RPS. Good ol Rock, nothign beats rock!


-Anxiety

[Lathum]

That's right Lathum, avoid the fact that I owned you in RPS. Good ol Rock, nothign beats rock!


-Anxiety

lol. I got nothing.

[st.cronin]

Checking in for the first time today, really. I will around for the night.

I am very curious to hear your thoughts on what's going on.

[Abe Sargent]

Love ya Lathum!

[Lathum]

Love ya Lathum!

right back at ya !! :)

( in a straight way )

[Lathum]

Isn't tonight date night. Why are you home?

[Poli]

You're still my boy, cronin, but I can't throw a challenge.

[st.cronin]

You're still my boy, cronin, but I can't throw a challenge.

Just vote off a wolf, ok?

[Poli]

Roger.

[Poli]

Check this out.

[Poli]

Yeah buddy. Grey. At work. Without all the formatting. Without all the run time errors. I'm taking advantage of it.

[Poli]

Again.

[Poli]

I love grey.

[Lathum]

looks green to me

[Poli]

You can't stop me, you can only hope to contain me.

[Poli]

Gah!

[ImTheCrew]

grey to me, maybe its firefox/ie problems

[Barkeep49]

AE: lathum's giving you a hard time.

[GoldenEagle]

It looks grey to me, AE. Kept it real.

[Lathum]

AE: lathum's giving you a hard time.

party pooper

[GoldenEagle]

I just looked at it in IE and got hit with a survey thing. I love Firefox.

[Poli]

AE: lathum's giving you a hard time.
Yeah, I know. I love grey.

[Lathum]

Yeah, I know. I love gays.

:eek:

[st.cronin]

well, he is in the navy

[Lathum]

well, he is in the navy

zing!!!!!

[GoldenEagle]

I am very curious to hear your thoughts on what's going on.

Nothing really comes to mind at this point. JE and his over the top this is Survivor and not WW is a bit odd but I am not ready to convict him at this point. It will be an interesting day of voting tomorrow. We will see what happens.

[st.cronin]

Nothing really comes to mind at this point. JE and his over the top this is Survivor and not WW is a bit odd but I am not ready to convict him at this point. It will be an interesting day of voting tomorrow. We will see what happens.

Has your tribe discussed anything regarding where they want the seer to look?

[Grammaticus]

I think the seer needs to look at Pass or myself.

[Lathum]

I think the seer needs to look at Pass or myself.

I would agree

[Grammaticus]

I would suggest the seer viewing Pass first as I am most likely to get votes in the council today/tomorrow.

[KWhit]

I would suggest the seer viewing Pass first as I am most likely to get votes in the council today/tomorrow.

That makes me think Gramm should be viewed.

[Lathum]

I don't think the order much matters unless the wolves can start killing tonight

[Alan T]

I would suggest the seer viewing Pass first as I am most likely to get votes in the council today/tomorrow.

I wouldn't understand this at all, unless you are talking about Jonathan, Anxiety or Kwhit, then I would understand. I couldn't understand any Oz members voting you.

[Poli]

My guess is the wolves get to start killing with the merge. I'm guessing two or more had to know about each other in order to have a kill.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

My guess is the wolves get to start killing with the merge. I'm guessing two or more had to know about each other in order to have a kill.

The tribes merged yesterday. BK said that everyone with a night action could do something last night. Still no kills.

[Alan T]

I would suggest the seer viewing Pass first as I am most likely to get votes in the council today/tomorrow.

to clarify what I mean.. I can see Kwhit, Anxiety or Jonathan being in survivor mode. Right now they care less about who is or isn't a wolf and they just want to survive..

But Ardent, ITC, Goldeneagle, you or Pass.. I think the solution is pretty easy for the vote.

You can take

a 33% chance at catching a wolf, or a 16% chance at catching a wolf. I think it seems like a no brainer I guess,

As long as the people who want to catch wolves vote that way, you shouldn't worry about the people who are just voting to stay alive.

[Lathum]

I am not a fan of the concept that the wolves need to find each other before they can kill. It is a mathmatical improbability 2 wolves wouldn't have connected by now

[st.cronin]

Helsing members, since Howard didn't buy our offer of cooperation today, what does everybody think of just posting in this thread tomorrow (with obvious exceptions of things Barkeep requires for the challenge).

[Alan T]

Helsing members, since Howard didn't buy our offer of cooperation today, what does everybody think of just posting in this thread tomorrow (with obvious exceptions of things Barkeep requires for the challenge).


Doesnt matter to me either way. I don't really have anything to hide. I was hoping though that the seer would be able to either clear or damn Gramm/Pass the next two days and then have a clean party to talk privately. Our side is a little more grey, so I don't feel confident talking about anything really sensitive in there anyways.

[Passacaglia]

Morning all. I'm cool with Gram wanting me checked out first. Since I'm happy to oblige, I won't even accuse him of acting wolflike for it! :)

[Barkeep49]

C'mon in Survivors.

I do have some bad news. Last night GoldenEagle's body was found. It was mangled. Ripped to shreds. Generally? An unpleasant sight. Even worse news is that some sort of coded message was found. We decided to decode it and it turns out that it was a list of players. Next to some was written villager and some (or was it one? Maybe it was none?) was written wolf. Alas a careless intern "dropped" it into the fire and so we can't show it to you. Such a shame.

Today is a combined reward and immunity challenge. Here is a grid:

http://yekrats.com/letterweaving.png

There are 100 letters inside the grid and 20 letters on the outside. The goal of this challenge is simple: use as many of the letters as possible to form words. The words you form must use a letter on the outside of the grid to start and then use a letter in that row or column. So, for instance, you could form It (I+21) or Be (B+41). Once you've used a letter, inside or outside the grid, you may not use it again. Whichever tribe can use the most letters wins.

The winning tribe's reward, besides immunity, is that they will designate two players from the losing tribe. The following day at tribal council those two will be the player voted off.

The word lists and the two players who the tribe would like to make eligible for tribal council are due by 10 PM. A word must be found in either dictionary.com or m-w.com in order to count. No proper nouns will be accepted, but otherwise all WORDS will be accepted (meaning prefixes and suffixes and the like also do not count).

Survivors ready? Go!

[Abe Sargent]

Hmm. Well, NOW it's werewolf. Why do we think that the wolves took so long to kill?


-Anxiety

[Lathum]

Fuck. I guess someone knew GE was the seer

[Lathum]

BK, question. Can you use a letter on the inside once going across and once going down?

[GoldenEagle]

I am not sore loser or anything, but I know for a fact there was some serious cheating going on in this game. I really do not understand why people can not play fairly.

[SnDvls]

I am not sore loser or anything, but I know for a fact there was some serious cheating going on in this game. I really do not understand why people can not play fairly.

OOC: Please send this to BK so he can get to the bottom of it and take care of it. we all want a fair game

[ImTheCrew]

what do you mean ge

[Barkeep49]

BK, question. Can you use a letter on the inside once going across and once going down?
No. Once period.

[Lathum]

If I had to guess I think he means he was the seer ( pretty obvious) and he was the first one killed. I am also assuming the fact he was the seer was discussed in OZ's thread at some point and he feels one of the wolves was reading the Oz thread and shouldn't have been, hence him being the first wolf target.

[ImTheCrew]

or one of the oz told some one

[Lathum]

or one of the oz told some one

well unless they told someone in a thread then someone is cheating.

I don't want to fuel this fire, especially since barkeep hasn't commented on it yet so I think it best to discuss this after the game.

[Barkeep49]

Cheating is possible in any game. Because of the more unusual restrictions here I think people are thinking about it more. I maintain my stance that most people around here are honest. If GE, or other people, have solid evidence of cheating ala Tyrith, which of course turned out to be more of a gray than clear cut case of cheating, please let me know. Otherwise I'd encourage people to play the game.

[ImTheCrew]

i was refering that someone in hesling tribe let it out, because i know that the howard tribe did not

[ImTheCrew]

the new howard and hesling

[ImTheCrew]

just a possiblity

[Alan T]

Barkeep, Is the goal to use the most letters or make the most words (using letters only once)? Your instructions says both at different points.

[SnDvls]

If I had to guess I think he means he was the seer ( pretty obvious) and he was the first one killed. I am also assuming the fact he was the seer was discussed in OZ's thread at some point and he feels one of the wolves was reading the Oz thread and shouldn't have been, hence him being the first wolf target.


this could also point to a conversion and it was in Oz...just a thought. I'd like to believe no one cheated in this game and think BK will handle it.

[ImTheCrew]

and how did everyone know that GE was the SEER?

[Barkeep49]

Barkeep, Is the goal to use the most letters or make the most words (using letters only once)? Your instructions says both at different points.
Letters. I've now fixed it.

[Barkeep49]

and how did everyone know that GE was the SEER?
From the way I wrote his death.

[Abe Sargent]

I am not sore loser or anything, but I know for a fact there was some serious cheating going on in this game. I really do not understand why people can not play fairly.

uh-oh

[ImTheCrew]

From the way I wrote his death.
how so barkeep(im new so go easy on me ;))

[SnDvls]

From the way I wrote his death.

funny cause I didn't get that from that at all :( guess I just thought the names thing was thrown in there to have fun with us.

[GoldenEagle]

I will hold my reservations until after the game.

[Lathum]

I think the list in the fire makes it obvious. I also think from the write up GE found a wolf

[Lathum]

I suggest the members of Howard look at GE's posts and see who he may have scanned.

[path12]

and how did everyone know that GE was the SEER?


I didn't know.

[Lathum]

C'mon in Survivors.

I do have some bad news. Last night GoldenEagle's body was found. It was mangled. Ripped to shreds. Generally? An unpleasant sight. Even worse news is that some sort of coded message was found. We decided to decode it and it turns out that it was a list of players. Next to some was written villager and some (or was it one? Maybe it was none?) was written wolf. Alas a careless intern "dropped" it into the fire and so we can't show it to you. Such a shame.



I think this makes it pretty clear

[ImTheCrew]

oh yes it does, thanks for the obvious

[Jonathan Ezarik]

I suggest the members of Howard look at GE's posts and see who he may have scanned.

I just read over his posts in our thread, but I don't see anything from him that hints at who he was scanning last night. As far as I know, the plan was to scan our old Helsing members (either Pass or Gramm) since Anxiety, KWhit, and I are going to be voted out.

[Lathum]

So was anything discussed in the OZ thread about the seers ability? For example, can the seer only scan his tribe members, etc...

Anything that can help us narrow down who may have been scanned.

[ImTheCrew]

i only know his first two scans, me and RA i was clean, he was found to be a wolf

[Passacaglia]

So was anything discussed in the OZ thread about the seers ability? For example, can the seer only scan his tribe members, etc...

Anything that can help us narrow down who may have been scanned.

I think this is a valid question at this point. We never asked you who the seer was, but we did ask if you knew who the seer was. That's a big difference in questions. At the time, you said you didn't know who the seer was. Want to change your answer?

[Lathum]

i only know his first two scans, me and RA i was clean, he was found to be a wolf

how do you know you were scanned?

[Passacaglia]

i only know his first two scans, me and RA i was clean, he was found to be a wolf

He scanned two people? And told you guys about it?

[Lathum]

I can understand why some of you guys would be irked.

This is what happened: our seer did not out RA. RA came out, for some reason, and said "I'm a wolf. But I can help your tribe win challenges." Then he said some other stuff. Naturally, we voted him out.

What he claimed:

1. The wolves could not communicate
2. He had tried to contact Lathum, and Lathum came up as not a wolf.

I personally do not believe he was telling the truth about both of those, and think it's possible he was lying about both.

Someone is lying.

[Poli]

Cronin is telling the truth.

[ImTheCrew]

RA admitted to being a wolf before GE said he scanned both of us

[ImTheCrew]

the post had been deleted im not really sure, what happend but they almost picked a new seer randomly and they didnt for some reason, i went to look back at him admitting maybe 15-20 mins after and they were gone.

GE posted that he could edit the post ( the one he admitted to being a seer) then barkeep corrected him a few minutes later then after that both post were gone.

[Lathum]

RA admitted to being a wolf before GE said he scanned both of us

can a member of Oz confirm this?

[ImTheCrew]

cronin should be able to he brought the idea of a new random seer

[Lathum]

the post had been deleted im not really sure, what happend but they almost picked a new seer randomly and they didnt for some reason, i went to look back at him admitting maybe 15-20 mins after and they were gone.

GE posted that he could edit the post ( the one he admitted to being a seer) then barkeep corrected him a few minutes later then after that both post were gone.

I know this is your first game so I hope it doesn't seem like I am cross examining you but this doesn't really add up. And I have yet to play a game where a post was deleted.

Something doesn't add up

[ImTheCrew]

He scanned two people? And told you guys about it? he did b/c he thought he could edited later then barkeep told him he couldnt

[ImTheCrew]

I know this is your first game so I hope it doesn't seem like I am cross examining you but this doesn't really add up. And I have yet to play a game where a post was deleted.

Something doesn't add up

No not at all i thought it was wierd to maybe i just couldnt find it???? idk can the old oz members go back in look?

[Jonathan Ezarik]

I'm having a hard time keeping up with all of Oz's stories.

[ImTheCrew]

Cronin is Right but ge did admit later that he scanned myself and RA he also put a PS in his post saying this....

"PS: i can edited this per barkeep"

[Passacaglia]

RA admitted to being a wolf before GE said he scanned both of us

He scanned you both in one night?

[Barkeep49]

GE and I had a misunderstanding. Based on that misunderstanding he came out as seer. It had been GE's intention to inform his tribe that he was the seer and then edit the post so that if anyone read it later they wouldn't know. Editing posts is still a no-no. In the end, in order to fix the misunderstanding a whole bunch of posts were deleted, to erase the evidence. That's the story

[Poli]

I feel a whole lot better about confirming this now...but sure makes me look BAD again. I told my new tribe it was a gut feeling.

Thanks, ITC.:rolleyes:

[Passacaglia]

That story adds up to me. That was probably right around the time that Barkeep posted, reminding us that we can only edit a post for color, not for content. Sounds like Oz had to play with some screwy things going on. Maybe they knew that GE was the seer, but had to play it like they didn't know, because of that screw-up?

[ImTheCrew]

[quote=Jonathan Ezarik;1392463]I'm having a hard time keeping up with all of Oz's stories.[/quote

i had no part in the lathum or w/e happend there with the false scan, i missed all that never even found out why we did it either.

All i know is RA admitted to being a wolf, then soon after GE admitted to being a seer(it was deleted pretty quick so not many ozzites saw it but im pretty sure cronin made comments after that about it so he should be able to back me up on this"

[ImTheCrew]

That story adds up to me. That was probably right around the time that Barkeep posted, reminding us that we can only edit a post for color, not for content. Sounds like Oz had to play with some screwy things going on. Maybe they knew that GE was the seer, but had to play it like they didn't know, because of that screw-up?

it was :)

[ImTheCrew]

He scanned you both in one night?
No i believe he said night 1 was me night 2 was RA, but it might be the other way around

[Poli]

That story adds up to me. That was probably right around the time that Barkeep posted, reminding us that we can only edit a post for color, not for content. Sounds like Oz had to play with some screwy things going on. Maybe they knew that GE was the seer, but had to play it like they didn't know, because of that screw-up?
Ding.

[ImTheCrew]

I feel a whole lot better about confirming this now...but sure makes me look BAD again. I told my new tribe it was a gut feeling.

Thanks, ITC.:rolleyes:


Sorry :(

[Poli]

No i believe he said night 1 was me night 2 was RA, but it might be the other way around
It was the other way around.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

this could also point to a conversion and it was in Oz...just a thought.

Hello? This is what I was screaming about yesterday. I hope now you all will stop taking it on faith that Oz is free of wolves.

[Passacaglia]

I feel a whole lot better about confirming this now...but sure makes me look BAD again. I told my new tribe it was a gut feeling.

Thanks, ITC.:rolleyes:

It doesn't look like you're bad, but it does look like you guys took advantage of GE's mistake. He thought he could edit the post, and told all of you he was the seer, then managed to get his post deleted. It sounds like you guys were privvy to information that you should not have been by the rules of the game, and still tried to hold it over everyone. I wouldn't call that cheating really, just taking advantage of a bending of the rules.

[SnDvls]

All espicially Helsing

I can not participate in today's challenge I have insider info on the answers and thus do not believe it is fair to take part in the challenge. I have already told BK this info and he should be responding to this post soon as we've talked about it via PM.

Thanks

[Passacaglia]

All espicially Helsing

I can not participate in today's challenge I have insider info on the answers and thus do not believe it is fair to take part in the challenge. I have already told BK this info and he should be responding to this post soon as we've talked about it via PM.

Thanks

You speak English, too? I didn't realize that was a disqualifier.... :p

[Poli]

It doesn't look like you're bad, but it does look like you guys took advantage of GE's mistake. He thought he could edit the post, and told all of you he was the seer, then managed to get his post deleted. It sounds like you guys were privvy to information that you should not have been by the rules of the game, and still tried to hold it over everyone. I wouldn't call that cheating really, just taking advantage of a bending of the rules.

With great power comes great responsibility. I sure didn't ask for what happened to ensue.

[Lathum]

The whole thing seems very strange to me

[Passacaglia]

With great power comes great responsibility. I sure didn't ask for what happened to ensue.

I'm sure you didn't. See my post in the other thread for more thoughts on it. Basically, I think it's wrong to blame ITC about it, when you guys have been talking both ways through this thing for days -- if you had just said "we don't know who the seer is, and we don't know who the wolf is" from the beginning, y'all would have been fine.

[ImTheCrew]

let me be the first ozite to say it, i think there may be another wolf in oz NOW that would be the only way to kill the seer, the only other two things i can think of are maybe just sheer luck, or at worst cheating :-(

[Barkeep49]

All espicially Helsing

I can not participate in today's challenge I have insider info on the answers and thus do not believe it is fair to take part in the challenge. I have already told BK this info and he should be responding to this post soon as we've talked about it via PM.

Thanks
This is true. I appreciate SnDvls' honesty in the matter.

[Lathum]

let me be the first ozite to say it, i think there may be another wolf in oz NOW that would be the only way to kill the seer, the only other two things i can think of are maybe just sheer luck, or at worst cheating :-(

and how long has this other wolf been around for?

[SnDvls]

let me be the first ozite to say it, i think there may be another wolf in oz NOW that would be the only way to kill the seer, the only other two things i can think of are maybe just sheer luck, or at worst cheating :-(

I think the cheating issue has been addressed by BK and thus should be dropped.
now on to the additional wolf.
remember my question was how many wolves were there? and the response was there are 3 wolves now
I was concerned before about the word now in the Helsing thread
and now I'm more concerned.
being that somepeople have the theory that the wolves couldn't kill until the merge (seems to have held true at this point) maybe they could do a conversion at the same time so the conversion happened at the 1st merged teams night.

[Lathum]

and now I'm more concerned.
being that somepeople have the theory that the wolves couldn't kill until the merge (seems to have held true at this point) maybe they could do a conversion at the same time so the conversion happened at the 1st merged teams night.

I agree completley.

[ImTheCrew]

and how long has this other wolf been around for?

my thought, the pm that people say was to help with the merge may not have been for that, maybe BK decied to make the ozite or first person to pm a wolf??

[ImTheCrew]

and i only know ONE person who saw GE's post and PM'ed Barkeep

[KWhit]

I am not sore loser or anything, but I know for a fact there was some serious cheating going on in this game. I really do not understand why people can not play fairly.

Uh... Aren't you the one who broke the rules by editing a post?

[Barkeep49]

Uh... Aren't you the one who broke the rules by editing a post?
Based on an honest misunderstanding.

[Poli]

and i only know ONE person who saw GE's post and PM'ed Barkeep
I know I did.

[SnDvls]

I think the cheating issue has been addressed by BK and thus should be dropped.



let's move on with the game please

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Any other former Oz members want to fess up and admit to knowing that GE was the seer?

[GoldenEagle]

Uh... Aren't you the one who broke the rules by editing a post?


Barkeep has already explained what happened.

[Mr. Wednesday]

If the GE kill is from the wolves learning the seer, the possibilities that I can see include a) the ability of the wolves to try to scan for the seer, b) luck, c) conversion of one of the Ozzites who have admitted to knowing that GE was the seer, d) conversion of one of the Ozzites who knew that GE was the seer but pretended not to.

[Mr. Wednesday]

Dola, oops, b) doesn't qualify as "from the wolves learning the seer".

[Poli]

*at work*I knew GE was the seer, and I knew about the deleted posts. In fact, one of mine were deleted. When I noticed it, I PMed barkeep as to why.

[path12]

Barkeep, do the words have to be formed in the order they appear, or can they be rearranged within the row/column?

[Lathum]

So was anything discussed in the OZ thread about the seers ability? For example, can the seer only scan his tribe members, etc...

Anything that can help us narrow down who may have been scanned.

I repeat

[Alan T]

Do you have to make a word in every column and row, or can you choose not to make any words in some rows/columns?

[Poli]

I repeat

He said nothing along those lines.

[Barkeep49]

Barkeep, do the words have to be formed in the order they appear, or can they be rearranged within the row/column?
Rearranging within a column or row is fine. Only thing is the letter on the outside must be the first letter used.

Do you have to make a word in every column and row, or can you choose not to make any words in some rows/columns?

The goal is to use the most letters. I count 120. However you wish to do this is fine by me so if some column is blank, that's a strategic decision.

[path12]

One more question for BK: Do we post our lists in thread or PM them to you? And do you need the actual letter numbers in a particular word or just the word itself?

[SnDvls]

and i only know ONE person who saw GE's post and PM'ed BarkeepI know I did.

was the post discussed? like did anyone say they saw it and this is what it said or did they just say "I saw it" and leave it at that?

[Passacaglia]

Who do y'all expect we'll be voting off tonight, anyway?

[Alan T]

Who do y'all expect we'll be voting off tonight, anyway?


I was kind of curious about that myself. Is it a public vote in your thread or a private PM vote? Any desire to share any happenings along that front with us?

[Passacaglia]

We're supposed to PM it with our words, I believe. My thinking was that if we happen to win (how stupid are you guys?), then we would pick Swaggs and path -- makes the most sense. What about you?

[Passacaglia]

Who do y'all expect we'll be voting off tonight, anyway?


Whoops, this post came out wrong. Who do you think Howard will be voting off TOMORROW night? I mean, you guys have to choose two people for us to vote from, right?

[Passacaglia]

I was kind of curious about that myself. Is it a public vote in your thread or a private PM vote? Any desire to share any happenings along that front with us?

So to answer this properly -- we send in our votes via PM. The results will be interesting.

[Grammaticus]

GE and I had a misunderstanding. Based on that misunderstanding he came out as seer. It had been GE's intention to inform his tribe that he was the seer and then edit the post so that if anyone read it later they wouldn't know. Editing posts is still a no-no. In the end, in order to fix the misunderstanding a whole bunch of posts were deleted, to erase the evidence. That's the story

The only way to fix this is to go ahead and out the wolf GE found. Posting his list is the way to go.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

The only way to fix this is to go ahead and out the wolf GE found. Posting his list is the way to go.

What are you talking about?

[Alan T]

We're supposed to PM it with our words, I believe. My thinking was that if we happen to win (how stupid are you guys?), then we would pick Swaggs and path -- makes the most sense. What about you?

We've been debating it somewhat.. Right now there are a few people who share an anti-Oz sentiment due to the way they have played the game. I personally (and I'm not alone) feel that it shoots us in the foot to start trying to vote off Oz players just out of spite or revenge.

I can't say what the team will do yet as I don't think there has been a consensus yet built, but I think personally I hope we go with choosing kwhit and Anxiety as the names we send.



I don't get why people over there are voting ITC though. It feels to me like a new player stumbling over words and becoming the fall guy for more veteran crafty wolves. I would love a show of hands of who here would choose ITC as the person to convert if they were a wolf. Nothing personal with ITC, I just don't really know him as I havent seen much of him this game with most of his posts coming in threads I can't read...

I just think there is some pupeteer here pulling some strings over there.. thats the only explanation I have if ITC ends up being voted out.

[Grammaticus]

What are you talking about?

Somebody cheated and used the knowledge that GE was the seer ans killed him. Obviously the wolf. BTW, This means that a wolf is likely in the Oz faction now or somebody cheated and looked in the thread.

Anyway as offsetting, we should get a wolf in return. Best way to do this is publish GEs scans.

[Passacaglia]

We've been debating it somewhat.. Right now there are a few people who share an anti-Oz sentiment due to the way they have played the game. I personally (and I'm not alone) feel that it shoots us in the foot to start trying to vote off Oz players just out of spite or revenge.

I can't say what the team will do yet as I don't think there has been a consensus yet built, but I think personally I hope we go with choosing kwhit and Anxiety as the names we send.



I don't get why people over there are voting ITC though. It feels to me like a new player stumbling over words and becoming the fall guy for more veteran crafty wolves. I would love a show of hands of who here would choose ITC as the person to convert if they were a wolf. Nothing personal with ITC, I just don't really know him as I havent seen much of him this game with most of his posts coming in threads I can't read...

I just think there is some pupeteer here pulling some strings over there.. thats the only explanation I have if ITC ends up being voted out.

I agree with that sentiment. I think that the fact that he's a newbie makes him an easy scapegoat at this point, when the few remaining Old Howard/Old Lupus members need to make a thrust. I've been trying to help him defend himself, but either way, I think he'll end up being okay.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

I don't get why people over there are voting ITC though. It feels to me like a new player stumbling over words and becoming the fall guy for more veteran crafty wolves. I would love a show of hands of who here would choose ITC as the person to convert if they were a wolf. Nothing personal with ITC, I just don't really know him as I havent seen much of him this game with most of his posts coming in threads I can't read...

I just think there is some pupeteer here pulling some strings over there.. thats the only explanation I have if ITC ends up being voted out.

How do you know who we're voting for?

[Grammaticus]

Honestly, ITC is the one that outed the whole wolves using the GE knowledge. Chances are greater that he is trusted and not a wolf.

If you were converting a member of Oz on the first night you could convert, who would you choose? Chances are you have no knowledge at this point of GE being the seer or who he may have cleared, since at that point all Oz members were villagers.

[Barkeep49]

Grammaticus: I find it highly unlikely that GE was killed because of cheating. Extremely unlikely actually. I'm not sure where you get this idea, beyond what GE said (and frankly that was uninformed) that there was any cheating going on.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

How do you know who we're voting for?

Anyone else in Helsing want to answer this question?

[st.cronin]

Did ITC out GE as the seer before he was killed?

And I think either myself or ardent would make the most sense as a conversion possibility. Probably myself, honestly.

[st.cronin]

Anyone else in Helsing want to answer this question?

somebody made a slip up, forget who

[Passacaglia]

somebody made a slip up, forget who

Dontcha think that's something worth remembering?

[Barkeep49]

One more question for BK: Do we post our lists in thread or PM them to you? And do you need the actual letter numbers in a particular word or just the word itself?
I count two questions :)

PM or posting is fine for this one and just the words will suffice.

[Grammaticus]

Nobody posted in this thread that ITC was getting votes.

[st.cronin]

Dontcha think that's something worth remembering?

not really

I don't really care what goes on in other threads. I figure if I know a little, I'll just get confused.

[Passacaglia]

not really

I don't really care what goes on in other threads. I figure if I know a little, I'll just get confused.

You don't care who knows what's going on in other threads? Really?

[st.cronin]

You don't care who knows what's going on in other threads? Really?

That's not what I said. I said I DON'T CARE WHAT GOES ON IN OTHER THREADS. I obviously care if people are cheating.

[Passacaglia]

That's not what I said. I said I DON'T CARE WHAT GOES ON IN OTHER THREADS. I obviously care if people are cheating.

I'm not talking about cheating. I'm talking about wolves communicating.

[Poli]

Hey cronin, want to know my answers?

[st.cronin]

Hey cronin, want to know my answers?

To the challenge? Sure, if you want to share. But what I really need is an address to send your hat.

[st.cronin]

I'm not talking about cheating. I'm talking about wolves communicating.

I don't think that's whats happening here but if it is somebody in your thread will figure it out.

[Poli]

I'm tired of this game, and I really don't care who wins at this point. I've asked to withdraw.

[Poli]

I'm tempted to just start going around all the threads and then spread the deep secrets.

[st.cronin]

I'm looking forward to reading the "new howard thread" post game.

[Poli]

I'm looking forward to when barkeep removes me from the game.

[Poli]

Oh, to post my answers here...

[Poli]

Oh to do to do...

[Poli]

You know what, screw it. I'm going to.

[Poli]

Abhor
empyema
islet
mantra
quean
snugged
optimal
knights
gouramis
cheeped

balk
feasting
jaconet
rape, rave...letters left are R A P E E V
tarts
paisan
land
hilted
dig

That leaves 2 letters

[Grammaticus]

That is not a good idea AE

[Poli]

Sorry Gramm. Tired of JE.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Seriously, what is your problem? You say that you'll take care of the challenge today and win it for us, we pressure you because we want to win, and you flip out like this? Real mature, man. Go ahead and curse me, I don't care. I'm sick of this childish behavior. If I wanted that, I'd go play with my five-year old nephews.

[Poli]

Go play with them. I'm not helping you anymore just to draw votes anyway.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Sorry Gramm. Tired of JE.

Me? You're going to blame this on me? That's funny. Sorry to have called you out on acting like a child. Glad to see you proved me wrong.

[Poli]

You and Pass, technically.

[Poli]

And screw color, I don't care about color anymore.

[Abe Sargent]

I just remember an earlier hissy fight between Tyrith and AE and people backed AE in that spat. I wonder if they'll be regretting their words after reading, at hte end of the game, what just happened in our thread and out here....

[st.cronin]

You and Pass, technically.

This cracks me up. I just suggested these two as possible names to submit if we win the challenge.

[Poli]

This cracks me up. I just suggested these two as possible names to submit if we win the challenge.
Ooh, I really hope you guys win.

[Poli]

I just remember an earlier hissy fight between Tyrith and AE and people backed AE in that spat. I wonder if they'll be regretting their words after reading, at hte end of the game, what just happened in our thread and out here....
Just tired of it all, anxiety, no offense. There's no reason Pass and JE had to go on a power trip for to prove I knew what I was doing.

[Poli]

Posting in other threads is fun.

[Abe Sargent]

I suspect that this will go down as one of the great meltdowns in WW history

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Just tired of it all, anxiety, no offense. There's no reason Pass and JE had to go on a power trip for to prove I knew what I was doing.

I wish I knew what the hell you were talking about. What power trip? Have you been playing the same game as the rest of us?

[st.cronin]

I suspect that this will go down as one of the great meltdowns in WW history

It's already legend. I'm dying to know what happened.

[Raiders Army]

Gah.

[Alan T]

I'm pretty dissapointed. I know Barkeep has spent alot of time and effort on this game. To see it going like this makes me sad for him.

[st.cronin]

I'm pretty dissapointed. I know Barkeep has spent alot of time and effort on this game. To see it going like this makes me sad for him.

agreed

[Poli]

I wish I knew what the hell you were talking about. What power trip? Have you been playing the same game as the rest of us?

Okay, JE -- you should just send in the one we've got.

Do *one* thing to prove it.

Let's see it, then.

No. Screw this. If you're not going to give us your list now, then I'm sending in the one we already have and I'm voting for you.

You'd better give him AT LEAST 15 minutes to verify that you don't have any errors, and to look up all the words, otherwise he's sending in what we have.

You mean you don't remember this?

[Poli]

Gah.
Why did you have to be a wolf, RA?

[Jonathan Ezarik]

You mean you don't remember this?

Oh my god! Someone actually put pressure on you to produce what you promised in a GAME OF WEREWOLF? The horror. Sorry if we wanted to win the challenge and we didn't trust you to follow through with your promise. Thanks for being such a good sport about everything.

[Poli]

Well, I produced, and all would have been well.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

If you had had it your way, none of us would have seen the list. We wouldn't have gotten credit for one of the words because you messed up, and we would have had less letters than the list we already had worked up.

[Poli]

No, you would have seen the list with 15 minutes to go.

[Raiders Army]

Why did you have to be a wolf, RA?

Why'd you have to vote me out? Don't respond. I'll save it for after the game. :)

[Poli]

I'd like to apologize if I've ruined the game for anyone. I've sent out a few personal apologies as well.

AE

[Alan T]

I'd like to apologize if I've ruined the game for anyone. I've sent out a few personal apologies as well.

AE

We had sent our answers in already prior to that anyways. I purposely chose to ignore the posts that I should not be seeing. (not sure if others did or not).

I doubt it will ruin the game, but I really don't know what happened in that thread to cause this.. but I think the best thing at this point is for everyone to drop it and try to continue with this game. Lets sort out the personal stuff between people on the side or after its over.

[st.cronin]

We had sent our answers in already prior to that anyways. I purposely chose to ignore the posts that I should not be seeing. (not sure if others did or not).

I doubt it will ruin the game, but I really don't know what happened in that thread to cause this.. but I think the best thing at this point is for everyone to drop it and try to continue with this game. Lets sort out the personal stuff between people on the side or after its over.

+1

[KWhit]

I'd like to apologize if I've ruined the game for anyone. I've sent out a few personal apologies as well.

AE

You ruined it for everyone.

2 meltdowns in one game. That's impressive.

[KWhit]

It's already legend. I'm dying to know what happened.

Nothing happened.

AE just went batshit crazy for no reason.

[LoneStarGirl]

I'm pretty dissapointed. I know Barkeep has spent alot of time and effort on this game. To see it going like this makes me sad for him.

I totally agree. Its a pity that we have asses in this game that make it unfun for the rest of us and make us think about quitting WW.

[Barkeep49]

Working on scoring the challenge now. There was some catching up to do, obviously. My apologies for those with night actions. If you want to send in something conditional, I'll understand.

Also, there was no tribal vote today. AE was removed from the game for his actions today, nullifying Howard's need to vote somebody off.

[Lathum]

I'd like to apologize if I've ruined the game for anyone. I've sent out a few personal apologies as well.

AE

It's easy to apologize after the fact. I kept my mouth shut when you and Tyrith want crazy because I thought there was blame on both parties but this is bullshit. Barkeep has put alot of time and effort into this game and so have the people playing it. If you have a problem with one or two people in the game then by all means hash it out, curse each other out, do whatever. I have been guilty of this in the past, but when you purposly set out to destroy the game that ruins it for everyone and is way below the line. I have no idea what happened in the other thread and I don't care. I realize it is just a game but the shit you pulled today is way below the line and uncalled for.

[Barkeep49]

Ok from Howard I have:

ABHOR - A (8/6/10/1)
EMPYEMA - E (15/13/16/18/20/11)
ISLET - I (24/22/30/21)
MANTRA - M (35/37/34/36/40)
QUEAN - Q (47/41/48/44)
SNUGGED - S (58/59/53/55/56/60)
OPTIMAL - O (66/64/69/70/67)
KNIGHTS - K (73/78/71/77/80/79)
GOURAMIS - G (90/82/83/85/81/89/88)
CHEEPED - C (99/95/96/91/92)

BALK - B (51/61/31)
FEASTING - F (62/72/2/12/42/52/32)
JACONET - J (43/23/3/63/33/93)
NASTIES - N (84/94/4/14/54/74)
RAPE - R (75/45/5)
TARTS - T (76/86/26/46)
PAISAN - P (27/87/17/57/37)
LAND - L (38/98/28)
HILTED - H (29/19/49/39/9)
DIG - D (100/50)

I made a note to myself as I was going that it appears that one of the letters in Islet is used twice. Can someone double check this, while I work on Howard's?

[SnDvls]

Ok from Howard I have:


I made a note to myself as I was going that it appears that one of the letters in Islet is used twice. Can someone double check this, while I work on Howard's?

it checks out okay for me...no double letter usage in my checks

[SnDvls]

dola - you are however missing some #'s in two of the across words double check that.

the words are correct, but the number using it isn't there

[Barkeep49]

dola - you are however missing some #'s in two of the across words double check that.

the words are correct, but the number using it isn't there
Which words?

[SnDvls]

double dola -
mantra (across) and Paisan (down) say they are using the same # 37

solution says you use #7 in Paisan

[SnDvls]

optimal #68 is missing

[SnDvls]

cheeped # 97 is missing

[Jonathan Ezarik]

dola - you are however missing some #'s in two of the across words double check that.

the words are correct, but the number using it isn't there

You're right. I left off the M in 'optimal' and the D in 'cheeped'. That's what I get for hurrying through it.

[Barkeep49]

SnDvls: I have optimal, mantra, and paisan, all working. Are you saying he gave the wrong letters when he spelled out the word in numbers or that those solutions don't work?

[Jonathan Ezarik]

double dola -
mantra (across) and Paisan (down) say they are using the same # 37

solution says you use #7 in Paisan

Yep. Messed this one up, too.

[Barkeep49]

Cheeped as well. Ok it sounds like it's a transcribing error as opposed to an invalid entry.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

SnDvls: I have optimal, mantra, and paisan, all working. Are you saying he gave the wrong letters when he spelled out the word in numbers or that those solutions don't work?

I used #37 in both mantra and paisan, when I should have used #7 for paisan.

[SnDvls]

The words are all valid the number usage is either missing which one is used or isn't listed. But all words are good and valid.

[SnDvls]

dola - I guess it depends on what you are judging the words or the #'s to get the words. or a combo of both

[SnDvls]

double dola -
challenge says words so it's all valid

[Barkeep49]

Wow. What a day. We had a death. A disqualification. Lots of intense word usage. From Helsing we had the following solution:


Across words:
ANOTHER
ELM
ITALIC
MAGNET
QUAG
SAGGED
OPINE
KING
GRIS
CITED

Down words:
BLAME
FINEST
JAR
NASTINESS
REVAMP
TRYST
PAILS
LAMBED
HUSHED
DATA
Gris was disallowed as it is a proper noun (evidentially the name of a Spanish painter).

From Howard we had:

ABHOR - A (8/6/10/1)
EMPYEMA - E (15/13/16/18/20/11)
ISLET - I (24/22/30/21)
MANTRA - M (35/37/34/36/40)
QUEAN - Q (47/41/48/44)
SNUGGED - S (58/59/53/55/56/60)
OPTIMAL - O (66/64/69/70/67)
KNIGHTS - K (73/78/71/77/80/79)
GOURAMIS - G (90/82/83/85/81/89/88)
CHEEPED - C (99/95/96/91/92)

BALK - B (51/61/31)
FEASTING - F (62/72/2/12/42/52/32)
JACONET - J (43/23/3/63/33/93)
NASTIES - N (84/94/4/14/54/74)
RAPE - R (75/45/5)
TARTS - T (76/86/26/46)
PAISAN - P (27/87/17/57/37)
LAND - L (38/98/28)
HILTED - H (29/19/49/39/9)
DIG - D (100/50)

This solution left 3 unusued letters by my count giving them a landslide victory. Congratulations to Howard on their achievement.

As part of their reward they have nominated Alan and Cronin for tribal council, so one of those two people will be going home tomorrow. Sleep well and don't let the WWs bite.

[SnDvls]

As part of their reward they have nominated Alan and Cronin for tribal council, so one of those two people will be going home tomorrow. Sleep well and don't let the WWs bite.

Wow is right. an interesting choice of people

[Passacaglia]

So SnDvls -- what was your inside info? Can I ask about that?

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Congratulations to Howard on their achievement.

All honor goes to AE. He said he'd win it for us, and he came through.

[Barkeep49]

So SnDvls -- what was your inside info? Can I ask about that?
I "borrowed" this challenge from the Survivor game for which I got inspiration. SnDvls had seen the answers to that.

[Barkeep49]

Let me hasten to add that Yekrats, from BGG, deserves 95% of the credit for the good things about this game. I would never have been able to put this game together the way he did. It's really an innovative concept and I've shamelessly used it because he did such an amazing job with it.

[Passacaglia]

I don't think that's whats happening here but if it is somebody in your thread will figure it out.

All I'm saying is that if Alan knew that the vote was on ITC at that time, someone from our thread must have mentioned it in your thread. If that happened, that someone is either path (which is doubtful, since JE said he didn't tell him), or a wolf. If no one said anything about that, then Alan knew it because he is a wolf. This is dependent ono the wolves communicating with each other, but I figure they must be able to -- otherwise no one in your thread (besides the unlikely possibility of path) would know that.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Let me hasten to add that Yekrats, from BGG, deserves 95% of the credit for the good things about this game. I would never have been able to put this game together the way he did. It's really an innovative concept and I've shamelessly used it because he did such an amazing job with it.

Who gets the blame for all the bad crap in this game? :)

[Passacaglia]

someone from our thread must have mentioned it in your thread.

Obviously I don't mean someone from our thread was posting in your thread -- I mean that someone with knowledge of our thread posted it in your thread.

[Lathum]

the choices for tribal council seem odd

[st.cronin]

the choices for tribal council seem odd

indefensibly odd ... it's like they wanted to make sure a wolf didn't get voted off

[Mr. Wednesday]

Alan I can understand why they did it, although I think it was due to a misunderstanding. cronin I don't get at all.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Simple. We think there's a converted wolf in the former Oz tribe, and cronin makes the perfect conversion target.

[Lathum]

Simple. We think there's a converted wolf in the former Oz tribe, and cronin makes the perfect conversion target.

why alan and not path?

[Mr. Wednesday]

From my perspective, Howard has made a very good survivor play and a subpar werewolf play.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

why alan and not path?

Because of the mention of the votes against ITC. I didn't mention that to path, so I don't know where Alan got that from.

[st.cronin]

Because of the mention of the votes against ITC. I didn't mention that to path, so I don't know where Alan got that from.

It's not easy to keep track of all those lies, is it.

[Mr. Wednesday]

Because of the mention of the votes against ITC. I didn't mention that to path, so I don't know where Alan got that from.
Since you're raising what you mentioned to path... what did you mention to path?

[st.cronin]

Both path and Alan confirmed in our thread that the ITC votes were mentioned in the old Howard thread. So, JE, you are a big fat liar.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

It's not easy to keep track of all those lies, is it.

What are you talking about? I never mentioned to path that ITC was getting votes in our tribe.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Both path and Alan confirmed in our thread that the ITC votes were mentioned in the old Howard thread. So, JE, you are a big fat liar.

How would Alan know what was going on in the old Howard thread?

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Since you're raising what you mentioned to path... what did you mention to path?

He asked if I felt safe in regards to our tribal council vote, and I explained to him that I was under pressure earlier, but I felt reasonably safe as the day went on. I never felt completely safe because I had absolutely no idea who was voting for whom.

[st.cronin]

Ok, I was confused. You may be telling the truth - but if you are, then path is lying. What Alan posted here in this thread came directly from path in our thread. So one of you two is lying.

[st.cronin]

I even told you in this thread that Alan's post was totally innocent. So, I really don't get why you guys pushed him. I can kind of understand naming me, but Alan just makes no sense.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Ok, I was confused. You may be telling the truth - but if you are, then path is lying. What Alan posted here in this thread came directly from path in our thread. So one of you two is lying.

So Alan's mention of ITC's votes comes from path?

[Jonathan Ezarik]

I even told you in this thread that Alan's post was totally innocent. So, I really don't get why you guys pushed him. I can kind of understand naming me, but Alan just makes no sense.

If we don't trust you, why should we trust what you say?

[st.cronin]

So Alan's mention of ITC's votes comes from path?

yep

[st.cronin]

If we don't trust you, why should we trust what you say?

I don't care if you don't trust me. I agree that somebody from oz was most likely converted. But if you were the one who pushed for Alan, that was a very serious misunderstanding on your part. I TOLD YOU IT WAS NOT A BIG DEAL. Nobody from my tribe thought it was worth talking about. We're not all wolves, you know.

[st.cronin]

This is path's exact quote in our thread:

In talking with JE it looks like ITC is coming under a lot of heat in their tribal thread. There seems to be a general consensus that there is a converted wolf in Oz.

My feeling on it is that may well be the case. However, we know there's one in Lupus. I'd probably lean toward the kwhit and anxiety, but I can certainly could see the appeal in tossing in at least one Oz person. The stonewalling and conflicting stories we've gotten from them makes me feel that something important is being hidden, though I have no idea what.

[Lathum]

I think it is obvious that if JE didn't push hard for Path then JE is a wolf. Can a member of Howard shed some light on JE's ans who he wanted to go after.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

I don't care if you don't trust me. I agree that somebody from oz was most likely converted. But if you were the one who pushed for Alan, that was a very serious misunderstanding on your part. I TOLD YOU IT WAS NOT A BIG DEAL. Nobody from my tribe thought it was worth talking about. We're not all wolves, you know.

But you were the only one to respond to the question of how Alan learned of ours votes against ITC. If no one else in Helsing thought Alan's actions were suspicious, why didn't they speak up to defend him? You were the only one to defend him, and since we doubted you, it was clear to us to link you and Alan together.

Remember, all we have to go off of is this common thread.

And I wasn't the one pushing for Alan. I just happened to agree with that sentiment.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

I think it is obvious that if JE didn't push hard for Path then JE is a wolf. Can a member of Howard shed some light on JE's ans who he wanted to go after.

Why would I push for path? Especially since I didn't think path was how Alan got the info regarding ITC. If I thought path had lied about what I had said, I would definitely have pushed for path.

[st.cronin]

But you were the only one to respond to the question of how Alan learned of ours votes against ITC. If no one else in Helsing thought Alan's actions were suspicious, why didn't they speak up to defend him? You were the only one to defend him, and since we doubted you, it was clear to us to link you and Alan together.

Remember, all we have to go off of is this common thread.

And I wasn't the one pushing for Alan. I just happened to agree with that sentiment.

Because path also told us he was going to tell you back off. Plus, I don't know, we had other stuff to worry about. To us it was no big deal - we had no idea your whole tribe thought he was suspicious.

[st.cronin]

dola

We can't really figure out why your tribe made this play, JE. It's really going to be up to your tribe to figure out what happened. I mean, for all I know, Alan actually is a wolf. I don't know that he's not, I'm just saying that either you or path has lied to our tribe.

[Lathum]

Why would I push for path? Especially since I didn't think path was how Alan got the info regarding ITC. If I thought path had lied about what I had said, I would definitely have pushed for path.

because you are the only 2 howard members left. If you aren't a wolf then Path obviously is so why wouldn't you push for him?

[Jonathan Ezarik]

because you are the only 2 howard members left. If you aren't a wolf then Path obviously is so why wouldn't you push for him?

Don't forget the other two members of Howard that have been voted off since it was announced that the old Howard had a wolf.

And I wouldn't push for path just because he was a Howard member when at the same time I'm defending myself from my tribe for the very same reasons. If he did something to raise my suspicion, then yes, I would push him. Like now, for instance. If I had known that he was the person responsible for telling you all that ITC was getting votes, I would have pushed for path because I know what I did and did not tell him.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

dola

We can't really figure out why your tribe made this play, JE. It's really going to be up to your tribe to figure out what happened. I mean, for all I know, Alan actually is a wolf. I don't know that he's not, I'm just saying that either you or path has lied to our tribe.

I know the answer to that (and so does path), but unfortunately, it doesn't do us any good right now. That's why I was pushing earlier for Alan to answer how he knew about what was going on in our tribe.

[Alan T]

So jonathan slides path inside info on what is going on in their tribe, path tells us.. I accidentally slip up and talk about it because I forgot who it came from. I tell path in the thread that I slipped up and didn't mean to tell everyone what Jonathan had been saying and for him to tell you it was an accident and not to push the issue unless you wanted me to tell everyone in your tribe that you were feeding us info.

So because I try to protect you in that, you vote me off. Nice.

Well you all didn't get a wolf in me, in fact this is one of the games I've not lied at all in, and I feel I've worked harder than perhaps anyone in. But I guess its what i get, this is survivor at all.

Well I will be back when the game is over (I know I'm not technically voted off till later tonight, but nothing left for me to contibute today.

[Alan T]

I know the answer to that (and so does path), but unfortunately, it doesn't do us any good right now. That's why I was pushing earlier for Alan to answer how he knew about what was going on in our tribe.

Its pretty obvious from this move that one of you two is still the wolf.