Werewolf LXXXVIII: Game Thread

[hoopsguy]

Votes as of Post #747:

Hoops - Heinz (687), Danny (729), Danny (729)
PF - Jackal (665), Pass (724), Pass (724)
Pass - Jackal (665), PF (691)
Heinz - Hoops (695)


Walls - Hoops (655), PackerFan (657), Heinz (686)

[Danny]

Read the last 10 posts, summary is in there.

[Alan T]

Day 2 - I have said that I think the wolves would have wanted to avoid making an attention-raising vote on this day. Double work, or early votes that did not change, seem the easiest way to achieve that goal.

So if we took that same approach with day 3, that would put the leading candidates for suspicion as you and Packerfanatic since you both volunteered early to work on the wall correct?

[KWhit]

work on carprentry

[Danny]

The funny/sad thing so far is all the votes that have been casted are from people I don't particularly trust.

[Barkeep49]

Here's what I've got for a vote count:

PF – Jackal (665), Pass (724), Pass (724)
Pass – Jackal (665), Packer (691)
Heinz – Hoops (695)
Hoops – Danny (729), Danny (729)

Walls – Hoops (655), Packer (657), Heinz (686)

[hoopsguy]

I would like to see the vote move to Heinz because I think he is the most likely demon. Gut based, so take that for what it is worth. But I'm absolutely going to move my vote to the place that affords me the best chance to live, short of putting it on someone who is cleared. None of the three people with votes right now fall in that category.

[Danny]

work on carprentry

Carpentry is done Kwhit

[Barkeep49]

Revised as of 756:

PF – Jackal (665), Pass (724), Pass (724)
Pass – Jackal (665), Packer (691)
Heinz – Hoops (695)
Hoops – Heniz (687), Danny (729), Danny (729)

Walls – Hoops (655), Packer (657), Heinz (686)
Capentry – Kwhit (754)

[Danny]

Bk, now that Kwhit is locked into a repair action, IIRC if he puts into roof and the walls do get finished the roof action will still go through right?

[hoopsguy]

So if we took that same approach with day 3, that would put the leading candidates for suspicion as you and Packerfanatic since you both volunteered early to work on the wall correct?

You do understand that there is a context to each day, based on the way the vote is shaking out, the amount of work to do, etc? I think you do, but you seem to be ignoring it as you rebut my arguments while changing contexts.

If I had any worries at all about protecting myself - and a demon certainly would - then there would be zero reason to put myself out there today as working on the walls and leaving myself unable to have two votes. It is clearly a disadvantage for me at the moment.

[Barkeep49]

Bk, now that Kwhit is locked into a repair action, IIRC if he puts into roof and the walls do get finished the roof action will still go through right?
Danny he is locked into repairing the carpentry today. He cannot change that action.

[Chief Rum]

I'd also love to see more thoughts/posts from CR, Kwhit, and Jonathan, they have all been very quiet this game overall.

Yup, that happens when I have worked 32 of the 72 hours or so since the game started, and that doesn't include 13 hours sleeping, 10 hours driving everywhere and 4 hours working out. ;)

Should be around more tonight. BTW, working overtime sucks (and I work tomorrow both jobs, too, yuck).

[Alan T]

Should be around more tonight. BTW, working overtime sucks (and I work tomorrow both jobs, too, yuck).


Its ok, no weekend WW play in this game. So you'll be able to focus all of your time on celebrating your victory over my Valdosta team in FOOL :)

[Alan T]

You do understand that there is a context to each day, based on the way the vote is shaking out, the amount of work to do, etc? I think you do, but you seem to be ignoring it as you rebut my arguments while changing contexts.

If I had any worries at all about protecting myself - and a demon certainly would - then there would be zero reason to put myself out there today as working on the walls and leaving myself unable to have two votes. It is clearly a disadvantage for me at the moment.


Just playing devil's advocate :devil:

(sorry, that was funny to me since I'm an angel and have the belief that you are a demon)

[Danny]

Danny he is locked into repairing the carpentry today. He cannot change that action.

That sucks.

[Danny]

I just took a drink from something that had been sitting on my desk for a while and it tasted like nasty wine which is odd since it is crystal light. That was disgusting.

[hoopsguy]

I just took a drink from something that had been sitting on my desk for a while and it tasted like nasty wine which is odd since it is crystal light. That was disgusting.

As Lucifer I did that to your drink. I suggest you change your vote to somthing more appropriate or else I'll do worse than that! :devil:

No, this is not a confession. Just trying to have some fun with the theme. Back to the regularly scheduled game.

[KWhit]

bah. This is hard to do on a PDA.
Vote packerfanatic

[Chief Rum]

I am leaning toward jeheinze with both of my votes. He has struck me as off this game, although I am trying to put more of a finger on it than just a "gut feeling". I know I don't like that he has voted for me and tried to trump up a case against me the other day, since I know I am good, and well, I don't like being lynched.

Also, though, he was the first to jump on hoops following Alan's request.

Since I still lean toward hoops not being a demon, it suggests to me that if I were a demon and I knew the angels were gunning for a non-demon, I would be pretty quick and supportive of that move.

In fact, I talked myself into it.

VOTE JEHEINZE
VOTE JEHEINZE

[RendeR]

Where do we need work done still?

Can I work on the roof?

[Chief Rum]

Its ok, no weekend WW play in this game. So you'll be able to focus all of your time on celebrating your victory over my Valdosta team in FOOL :)

See, that's the sad part. I still have a ton of stuff to do to prepare for the sim, and instead I am here reading this thread, lol.

[RendeR]

Ok thats 3 with 3 and 1 with 2....

Fuckit.

VOTE PASSACAGLIA

[Chief Rum]

I am leaning toward jeheinze with both of my votes. He has struck me as off this game, although I am trying to put more of a finger on it than just a "gut feeling". I know I don't like that he has voted for me and tried to trump up a case against me the other day, since I know I am good, and well, I don't like being lynched.

Also, though, he was the first to jump on hoops following Alan's request.

Since I still lean toward hoops not being a demon, it suggests to me that if I were a demon and I knew the angels were gunning for a non-demon, I would be pretty quick and supportive of that move.

In fact, I talked myself into it.

VOTE JEHEINZE
VOTE JEHEINZE

Did it again.

Re-post to bold:

VOTE JEHEINZE
VOTE JEHEINZE

BK, please note this is NOT a new vote, just making sure you saw it.

[DaddyTorgo]

idk what to do. i'm all conflicted.

i'm generally against lynching hoops in most games. particularly because alan and him can both clash as villagers.

heinz is a bastard in my book from last game.

PF i don't really have a read on.

[Alan T]

See, that's the sad part. I still have a ton of stuff to do to prepare for the sim, and instead I am here reading this thread, lol.


It is ok, my impression was that he wasn't going to sim till like 3am or something where none of us will even be around for it. (Well you might with your crazy sleep schedule)

Hopefully your team preparation goes as poorly as that vote preparation does though! :D

[hoopsguy]

Think this is correct:

PF - Jackal (665), Pass (724), Pass (724), KWhit (769)
Pass - Jackal (665), PF (691), RendeR (773)
Hoops - Heinz (687), Danny (729), Danny (729)
Heinz - Hoops (695), Chief (770), Chief (770)

Walls - Hoops (655), PackerFan (657), Heinz (686)
Carpentry - KWhit

[Danny]

I don't think Jeheinz is a bad option either. In fact, I think he or Pass are solid options for today along with Hoops. I'd be more inclined to change my vote if the angels changed their mind about trying to ensure a Hoopsguy lynch.

[DaddyTorgo]

this is fun. since i really have no frigging clue.


VOTE HOOPSGUY
VOTE JEHEINZ

[RendeR]

I will be here until 9:55 at which time BSG will be coming on and I will stop giving a damn about anything else in the universe.

[Barkeep49]

As of 776:

PF – Jackal (665), Pass (724), Pass (724), KWhit (769)
Pass – Jackal (665), Packer (691), Render (773)
Heinz – Hoops (695), CR (770), CR (770)
Hoops – Heniz (687), Danny (729), Danny (729)

Walls – Hoops (655), Packer (657), Heinz (686)
Capentry – Kwhit (754)

[Barkeep49]

I will be here until 9:55 at which time BSG will be coming on and I will stop giving a damn about anything else in the universe.
Ellen Tigh is the final cylon

[RendeR]

WORK ON ROOF

[Alan T]

I don't think Jeheinz is a bad option either. In fact, I think he or Pass are solid options for today along with Hoops. I'd be more inclined to change my vote if the angels changed their mind about trying to ensure a Hoopsguy lynch.


My mind is set on Hoopsguy for today, as if he still lives, the doubt I have about him will continue to be there tomorrow and the next day and the next.

I don't like the jeheinz vote at all personally.

As it is however, the village appears to have decided that they do not wish for us to help continue to safeguard their spiritual health as they are going to force us to vote instead. So if Hoopsguy is indeed bad, not only is he possibly escaping the lynch, he has convinced you all to put your own spiritual health at risk.

[RendeR]

Ellen Tigh is the final cylon


Knew that before the last episode aired ;)

[Alan T]

And a further note, all of the people trying their hardest to keep it a 2-3-4 way tie, all you are doing is sentencing someone else to death. As it is, Hoopsguy will move his vote to Packerfanatic to ensure Packerfanatic dies.

So you may think it is tied, or you may be wanting to play it as keeping it tied, but you're votes aren't really tying it.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

VOTE HOOPSGUY

VOTE HOOPSGUY

[RendeR]

My mind is set on Hoopsguy for today, as if he still lives, the doubt I have about him will continue to be there tomorrow and the next day and the next.

I don't like the jeheinz vote at all personally.

As it is however, the village appears to have decided that they do not wish for us to help continue to safeguard their spiritual health as they are going to force us to vote instead. So if Hoopsguy is indeed bad, not only is he possibly escaping the lynch, he has convinced you all to put your own spiritual health at risk.


See now that last bit just sounds like grandstanding, its meaningless since we have no clue what that might mean for us as a village. Stop flapping your wings and DO something, one way or the other.

[Tyrith]

vote count?

[Danny]

Also keep in mind that any tie will result in a PF lynch.

[hoopsguy]

My mind is set on Hoopsguy for today, as if he still lives, the doubt I have about him will continue to be there tomorrow and the next day and the next.

I don't like the jeheinz vote at all personally.

As it is however, the village appears to have decided that they do not wish for us to help continue to safeguard their spiritual health as they are going to force us to vote instead. So if Hoopsguy is indeed bad, not only is he possibly escaping the lynch, he has convinced you all to put your own spiritual health at risk.

Then hopefully we get at least one demon along the way to help compensate. Not that I don't care about our spiritual health, but I'm not willing to lay down my own life needlessly for a benefit that has not been explained in the thread.

Who knows, maybe this will turn out like BK's last game we were in together, where I live by your mercy for a couple of days (oh Captain, my Captain) and it works out well for both of us in the end. But you probably won't like that comparison either ...

[Chief Rum]

As of 776:

PF – Jackal (665), Pass (724), Pass (724), KWhit (769)
Pass – Jackal (665), Packer (691), Render (773)
Heinz – Hoops (695), CR (770), CR (770), DT (775)
Hoops – Heniz (687), Danny (729), Danny (729), DT (775)

Walls – Hoops (655), Packer (657), Heinz (686)
Capentry – Kwhit (754)

Mean vote (I added DT's votes to BK's voting record, bolded above):

PF == 720.5
Heinz == 752.5
Hoops == 730

FYI, Pass with three votes is at 709.7

[Tyrith]

Sorry, see it now.

[RendeR]

And a further note, all of the people trying their hardest to keep it a 2-3-4 way tie, all you are doing is sentencing someone else to death. As it is, Hoopsguy will move his vote to Packerfanatic to ensure Packerfanatic dies.

So you may think it is tied, or you may be wanting to play it as keeping it tied, but you're votes aren't really tying it.



See my previous post. You of all people should know how terribly that style of play goes over around here.

[DaddyTorgo]

See now that last bit just sounds like grandstanding, its meaningless since we have no clue what that might mean for us as a village. Stop flapping your wings and DO something, one way or the other.

+1

[Chief Rum]

And JE makes a tie moot.

I hope the Angels are right, even if it means i have gotten in bed with a demon by voting with hoops on heinz.

[hoopsguy]

And a further note, all of the people trying their hardest to keep it a 2-3-4 way tie, all you are doing is sentencing someone else to death. As it is, Hoopsguy will move his vote to Packerfanatic to ensure Packerfanatic dies.

So you may think it is tied, or you may be wanting to play it as keeping it tied, but you're votes aren't really tying it.

Yes, I will move it to an uncleared person to keep myself alive.

Also, I'm done providing vote count updates because I now need to keep locked in on the clock in order to maximize my switch.

Note - I would not advertise this as a demon. I'm trying to still be a good teammate for my remaining moments as a villager.

[Alan T]

See my previous post. You of all people should know how terribly that style of play goes over around here.


Considering you never see my side on anything even when I am good and am right (which may or may not be the case here), I don't really consider I'll ever convince you of anything, even if it was to tell you that you were on fire when your pantsleg was burning.

I am not grandstanding, I just don't think the cute tie-game play is really cute, I think it is counterproductive and not helpful actually.

[Alan T]

Someone will have to go way out of their way to save him if they would like to put themselves on the spot to do so here.

Vote Hoopsguy
Vote Hooopsguy

[RealDeal]

Can't risk it. Voting is really strange and suspicious so far:

Vote Hoopsguy

Vote Hoopsguy

[DaddyTorgo]

Considering you never see my side on anything even when I am good and am right (which may or may not be the case here), I don't really consider I'll ever convince you of anything, even if it was to tell you that you were on fire when your pantsleg was burning.

I am not grandstanding, I just don't think the cute tie-game play is really cute, I think it is counterproductive and not helpful actually.

well it's not like you all have a smoking gun or anything. frankly regardless of whether you are angels or not you ought to be thankful people are voting with you.

[Danny]

Dont think the double up was really necessary ugg

[Tyrith]

Efficiency at work.

WORK ON WALLS
WORK ON WALLS

[Chief Rum]

Considering you never see my side on anything even when I am good and am right (which may or may not be the case here), I don't really consider I'll ever convince you of anything, even if it was to tell you that you were on fire when your pantsleg was burning.

I am not grandstanding, I just don't think the cute tie-game play is really cute, I think it is counterproductive and not helpful actually.

But he's right. You and Real Deal pretty much remove any possibility of a tie. Your presence that is. And that was before JE's votes.

There would have to be a concerted effort to save hoops now, and I just don't see enough evidence to fight that, even if I chose to put my vote elsewhere.

[Danny]

And now two more points on the walls? I think there are some misplays in actions here.

[RendeR]

Considering you never see my side on anything even when I am good and am right (which may or may not be the case here), I don't really consider I'll ever convince you of anything, even if it was to tell you that you were on fire when your pantsleg was burning.

I am not grandstanding, I just don't think the cute tie-game play is really cute, I think it is counterproductive and not helpful actually.


ANd of course your high and mighty do this or you're spirit suffers line is so much more appealing. Damnit alan stop being a fuckwit and at least try and give us a real valid reason to listen to you. You're holier than thou (no pun intended here) attitude in these last few pages is enough to make me vomit, wether your right or not.

[Chief Rum]

Efficiency at work.

WORK ON WALLS
WORK ON WALLS

Thank you. Color me paranoid, but three was not enough, IMO, when all three are uncleared. You're not cleared either, but no way in heck five actions somehow "disappear".

[Alan T]

well it's not like you all have a smoking gun or anything. frankly regardless of whether you are angels or not you ought to be thankful people are voting with you.


If people don't want to vote with me, fine so be it. They should at least give a reason why other than the random comments people have made of ugh, umph, igh, oogh and then votes just to keep it close or tie it without a reason.

I partially feel sad that Hoops will be lynched because he was participating in the conversation at least and giving reasons for stuff (whether or not he was honest about them I guess we will see)..

If anything, I think over the last hour I have become more convinced that this is the right play. So I guess I'll either go down in flames (literally) or I'll be right here.

[Danny]

No reason to put two more points on the walls. If you feel like all 3 people were going to fake, why not just put 1 point and then a point on the roof?

[hoopsguy]

UNVOTE JEHEINZ
VOTE PACKERFANATIC

[hoopsguy]

I think that move was futile, but I would certainly welcome a bail out.

[Chief Rum]

ANd of course your high and mighty do this or you're spirit suffers line is so much more appealing. Damnit alan stop being a fuckwit and at least try and give us a real valid reason to listen to you. You're holier than thou (no pun intended here) attitude in these last few pages is enough to make me vomit, wether your right or not.

Now, be fair. Alan laid out some reasoning for his votes. Frankly, he has a lot more to back his hoops' vote, IMO, then you did on RD yesterday, and you locked on RD just as bad.

[Alan T]

ANd of course your high and mighty do this or you're spirit suffers line is so much more appealing. Damnit alan stop being a fuckwit and at least try and give us a real valid reason to listen to you. You're holier than thou (no pun intended here) attitude in these last few pages is enough to make me vomit, wether your right or not.


I'm done talking with you. This whole coming out cussing at me thing just because you never agree with me is what caused me to quit playing before. (Not just you doing it, but you, Goldeneagle and LSG). I'm not insulting you or DT or anyone else, I don't need the same back at me. I said what I feel, that this is a game that requires people to provide reasons for doing stuff. I have gone on way too much on my reasons for things.

[Chief Rum]

Oh, yeah, and the personal attack on Alan == really not cool, dude (I know you get emotional, though--is this the return of the Render original? ;) ).

[hoopsguy]

Boom goes the dynamite?

[hoopsguy]

Short of a duke, I think I'm done.

Chalk up #2.

[Barkeep49]

I have as a final count:

PF – Jackal (665), Pass (724), Pass (724), KWhit (769), Hoops (810)
Pass – Jackal (665), Packer (691), Render (773)
Heinz – CR (770), CR (770), DT (779)
Hoops – Heniz (687), Danny (729), Danny (729), JE (787), JE (787), DT (779), Alan (799), Alan (799), Real (800), Real (800)

Walls – Hoops (655), Packer (657), Heinz (686), Tyrith (803), Tyrith (803)
Capentry – Kwhit (754)
Roof – Render (783)

[Chief Rum]

Hmm, getting a gut vibe on something. Doesn't affect this vote, and I won't get the information I need from BK. And I can't speak of it right now. But if it turns out right, I'll point to this post as evidence of my greatness.

[RendeR]

I'm done talking with you. This whole coming out cussing at me thing just because you never agree with me is what caused me to quit playing before. (Not just you doing it, but you, Goldeneagle and LSG). I'm not insulting you or DT or anyone else, I don't need the same back at me. I said what I feel, that this is a game that requires people to provide reasons for doing stuff. I have gone on way too much on my reasons for things.

*sigh* thank you for finally doing what you should have shut up and done long ago, put your votes where your mouth is.

why did it take a screaming match to get that to happen?

[Danny]

*sigh* thank you for finally doing what you should have shut up and done long ago, put your votes where your mouth is.

why did it take a screaming match to get that to happen?

Seemed to be obvious reasons for why they wanted to wait. They probably shouldn't have put it the way they did, but there were advantages if they didn't have to vote.

[Chief Rum]

*sigh* thank you for finally doing what you should have shut up and done long ago, put your votes where your mouth is.

why did it take a screaming match to get that to happen?

The spiritual help thing, ya know? We don't know what it really is, but I don't think it's bull.

[RendeR]

Oh, yeah, and the personal attack on Alan == really not cool, dude (I know you get emotional, though--is this the return of the Render original? ;) ).


SOrry cheif, if you don't liike me, put me on ignore. I'm not going to sit by and read the tripe Alan posts which I find insulting in general because he feels he's right and anyone who says otherwise is "causing problems".

Its not his factsI disagree with, its the way he comes across on the posts. Its like listening to (for lack of a better example) a born again bible thumping overzealous preacher. "I'm telling you this is how it is and you must do this or you'll burn in hell"

Its ridiculous, especially when he tries to blame everyone else for forcing him to put his votes where his mouth is. Which he finally did. Would have saved a lot of bad feelings if he;d just done that to begin with.

[Barkeep49]

GAH! Accidently just deleted teh lynch post. Sorry.

[Danny]

GAH! Accidently just deleted teh lynch post. Sorry.

Keep doing it until we get a good result!

[RendeR]

Seemed to be obvious reasons for why they wanted to wait. They probably shouldn't have put it the way they did, but there were advantages if they didn't have to vote.

The spiritual help thing, ya know? We don't know what it really is, but I don't think it's bull.


Sorry guys, this is werewolf not sunday morning prayers. I don't give anyone blind faith. You want cooperationfrom me you best have an open book of reasons.

[RealDeal]

Seriously, Render, if you turn out to be a villager at the end of this game, I'm going to wonder what on earth you've been trying to do this entire game.

If you believe we are angels, then why would you be so insistent we burn our votes, when we've given as much explanation as we possibly could as to why we preferred to not have to vote this round?

[hoopsguy]

Keep doing it until we get a good result!

Sorry, you would need to change it to another player to get what most of us would consider a good result.

[RendeR]

Seemed to be obvious reasons for why they wanted to wait. They probably shouldn't have put it the way they did, but there were advantages if they didn't have to vote.



Please note that THIS is indeed the reason for this whole confrontation. I can't help it if other people are just like me and screw up HOW they deliver a message.

[Danny]

I'll be disappointed if my primary reason for making the vote I did (angels going elsewhere) is wasted and we lynched a villager.

[Chief Rum]

SOrry cheif, if you don't liike me, put me on ignore. I'm not going to sit by and read the tripe Alan posts which I find insulting in general because he feels he's right and anyone who says otherwise is "causing problems".

Its not his factsI disagree with, its the way he comes across on the posts. Its like listening to (for lack of a better example) a born again bible thumping overzealous preacher. "I'm telling you this is how it is and you must do this or you'll burn in hell"

Its ridiculous, especially when he tries to blame everyone else for forcing him to put his votes where his mouth is. Which he finally did. Would have saved a lot of bad feelings if he;d just done that to begin with.

Has nothing to do with like, it has to do with being more respectful. Okay, you don't like his posting style or how he sometimes locks into whatever his opinion of a situation is. Not a reason to call someone a fuckwit.

I don't ignore people. I think babies ignore people, hiding their heads in the sand. I do challenge people, especially when they're being insulting.

Alan stated his reasons for his call for votes on hoops publically, and also stated why he didn't put his votes down himself right away. Whether you agree or disagree with those reasons, he DOES have his reasons, which he has given, and they are legitimate and logical (even if I lean toward him being wrong).

[hoopsguy]

You would be disappointed? Hmm ...

[Barkeep49]

The voices of those who claim to be from above, tell you not to trust the Shepard. At first people aren't sure what to do. But after some debate and thought, they decide to trust those voices. As though that weren't enough there are some extra weight given to the voices against the shepard.

"I will go quietly," the Shepard says as he makes his way to the noose. "But I think you," and here hoops points at Pass, "want to vote for me." Pass stands there enraptured and can only nod his head in agreement. "Good. With that done, I hope you enjoy the final gift from my friend Alastor."

And at that moment, not only does hoop drop dead, but so does your merchant, Pass, and minstrel, Alan.

The Shepard was such a good sort, until you corrupted him. He would have even had been able to perform extra work on the cathedral. Too bad for him.

As Lucifer you may freely communicate with your counterpart, Gabriel (aka redacted), though please copy me. You may not vote for Gabriel until at least 2 non-demons have done so and the Rules state you may not reveal who Gabriel is to anyone either directly or indirectly. As Lucifer you have the ultimate power in deciding who shall perform the kill and who the kill shall be and must PM me with the decision. Since, it may not be Gabriel, the PM, as long as you’re alive, must come from you. You may use your evil influence to sway people. Four times during the game you may cause a person to change either the area they are working on or the person they are voting for. You can only change a vote to a different vote or work area to a different area. Finally, if the Duke attempts to kill you, it will backfire and cause the Duke to die instead.

You may also freely communicate with your fellow demons, redacted.

You travel from town to town. But you would never have dreamed of missing this Bonanza. So many people converging on one place is a dream come true. Plus they should have money to spend, which means you can charge twice your normal rate. Ahh it’s good to be you. But that isn’t always true. Carrying around supplies and money from town to town has meant that you’ve had to learn how to protect yourself. You have become so good at it you may also protect others.

As the bodyguard you may choose one person each night to keep safe from demonic attack. You may not guard the same person a second time until you have guarded until at least half the people who were alive when you first guarded that person are dead (so if there were 12 players in the game at the time you guarded you may not guard that person until there are 6 or fewer players in the game). Finally, if you are one of the final two players alive along with a Demon, you will kill the demon.

As the angel Seraph you have always been a fan of music and so you choose the body of the minstrel to occupy. He is so alive with song. You just love it. Upon occupying his body you are confident that he would have been able to use his way with words to avoid death by lynching or night kill one time. You are not sure you have quite mastered this ability, yet so you cannot count on it saving you. Though with time you might come to be able to use the words as well as the minstrel.

redacted

Your fellow angels are redacted. You may communicate freely with them, though you are asked to copy me on the communication.

redacted

As Seraph twice during the game if you work on one thing (may be either the Cathedral or the Spirtual Health) you will accomplish a bonus unit of work, e.g. 3 shifts of work rather than 2. You may not use this power in consecutive days.

PF – Jackal (665), KWhit (769), Hoops (810)
Pass – Jackal (665), Packer (691), Render (773)
Heinz – CR (770), CR (770), DT (779)
Hoops – Heniz (687), Danny (729), Danny (729), JE (787), JE (787), DT (779), Alan (799), Alan (799), Real (800), Real (800), Pass, Pass, Unknown 1, Unknown 2

Walls – Hoops (655), Packer (657), Heinz (686), Tyrith (803), Tyrith (803)
Capentry – Kwhit (754)
Roof – Render (783)

Walls - Repaired
Roof - 6 shifts
Windows - 7 shifts
Artwork - Repaired
Carpentry - Repaired

[Chief Rum]

Sorry guys, this is werewolf not sunday morning prayers. I don't give anyone blind faith. You want cooperationfrom me you best have an open book of reasons.

Yesterday, you argued Occam's Razor in your attempt to lynch Real Deal, but today, you want us to buy the most unlikely of massive conspiracy theories that Alan and Real Deal are demons who are lying?

Got it.

[Danny]

Sweet, we did get the demon. Why did we lose two people though?

[RendeR]

Seriously, Render, if you turn out to be a villager at the end of this game, I'm going to wonder what on earth you've been trying to do this entire game.

If you believe we are angels, then why would you be so insistent we burn our votes, when we've given as much explanation as we possibly could as to why we preferred to not have to vote this round?


THere is enough BS floating around in the game without you two adding to it. If you're angels and you expect everyone to believe it (as I do for the most part) then stop with the cloak and dagger bullshit and state your case.

Neither of you made a REAL case against hoops today, why are you even moderatly surprised people are reacting badly to your unwillingness to take action on your own suspicions?

[Chief Rum]

Awesome. Down goes Lucifer. Never happier I was wrong. Sorry I didn't buy in, Alan. Completely understand if the lynch mob comes after me next.

[RealDeal]

Whew. So relieved we were right.

[Danny]

Hoops, you are a heck of a wolf btw. I'm glad I relied solely on logic and not on my gut.

[RendeR]

Yesterday, you argued Occam's Razor in your attempt to lynch Real Deal, but today, you want us to buy the most unlikely of massive conspiracy theories that Alan and Real Deal are demons who are lying?

Got it.


Stop twisting my words, I never said ANYTHING like that CR. Why are you trying to create more problems?

[RealDeal]

And the answer to the people dropping dead issue is that Alastor is one of the demons.

[Danny]

I still don't understand why two people died, was that the night action?

[Chief Rum]

Aw, crap, just read the hoops PM mostly at first. Now, re-reading it, I am thinking we're fooked.

[Chief Rum]

Stop twisting my words, I never said ANYTHING like that CR. Why are you trying to create more problems?

Why would Alan and Real Deal have lied about that unless they were demons?

And, now, of course, Alan is proven to be an Angel. Well done, Mr. Cleared Villager.

[RendeR]

ALan and RD were right, good. Ifthey'd simply taken the stand themselves right away there wouldn't have been an issue at all.

its the self defeating "I won't tell you anything I don't want to" crap that keeps alan and I from ever seeing eye to eye. It doesn't have to be james fucking bond scenes in this game, its not that damned convoluted.

[hoopsguy]

Hoops, you are a heck of a wolf btw. I'm glad I relied solely on logic and not on my gut.

Clearly bummed by the result, but had fun playing and hope to enjoy reading along with the rest of the game.

Thanks for the kind words, btw.

[Danny]

Hmm, I think we are ok actually.

11 players, 2 demons, 2 angels and 7 villagers most likely. we're ok there. And I think tomorrow I would have gone after Pass, so I am glad he is at least one of the two that was killed.

[Danny]

ALan and RD were right, good. Ifthey'd simply taken the stand themselves right away there wouldn't have been an issue at all.

its the self defeating "I won't tell you anything I don't want to" crap that keeps alan and I from ever seeing eye to eye. It doesn't have to be james fucking bond scenes in this game, its not that damned convoluted.


Let's drop it and actually you know play the game?

[RealDeal]

I'm probably dead tonight, so I will give you my final words on who I think is suspicious in a few minutes.

[Danny]

I feel better about Kwhit now. I was pretty sure one wolf was between the two of them, but I don't think two wolves make that mid-late vote on Telle.

[Chief Rum]

Hmm, I think we are ok actually.

11 players, 2 demons, 2 angels and 7 villagers most likely. we're ok there. And I think tomorrow I would have gone after Pass, so I am glad he is at least one of the two that was killed.

But we have lost both the BG and the Seer, and RD is almost certainly dead tonight. And we still don't really have a clue who the demons are.

I can make some educated guesses. I am on the short list, actually, among those uncleared who are left.

[Danny]

And Good job Alan, sucks you had to go, but you nabbed us Lucifer in the process

[Chief Rum]

I feel better about Kwhit now. I was pretty sure one wolf was between the two of them, but I don't think two wolves make that mid-late vote on Telle.

I never really felt KWhit was that strong of a candidate (yet, at least).

[RendeR]

Why would Alan and Real Deal have lied about that unless they were demons?

And, now, of course, Alan is proven to be an Angel. Well done, Mr. Cleared Villager.

yes of course alan's death is my fault. Please. He was dead either way in this scenario.
How is anything I did or said changing the outcome? hm?? its not. based on what I read nothing we did would have changed it even IF they'd have voted right away.

the only thing that would have changed is this argument, since if they'd just fucking voted ahead of time it never would have happened.

[Chief Rum]

Not MY shortlist, of course. But no one else will ignore me on theirs, I think.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

So Alastor selected both Alan (angel) and Pass (BG) at the start of the game and that's why they're both dead? Man, talk about some horrible luck.

[Danny]

But we have lost both the BG and the Seer, and RD is almost certainly dead tonight. And we still don't really have a clue who the demons are.

I can make some educated guesses. I am on the short list, actually, among those uncleared who are left.


Did we lose the BG, I thought he was a guard, but his ability was to kill a player. I think we still have the BG.

And we still have likely 9 players right now on the good side with one remaining demon having their power used up. And while we hopefully can find the demons, we still have the added pressure of the cathedral.

[Chief Rum]

yes of course alan's death is my fault. Please. He was dead either way in this scenario.
How is anything I did or said changing the outcome? hm?? its not. based on what I read nothing we did would have changed it even IF they'd have voted right away.

the only thing that would have changed is this argument, since if they'd just fucking voted ahead of time it never would have happened.

I didn't blame his death on you. Re-read what you quoted.

[Barkeep49]

We're at the weekend. Everyone needs to take a deep breath. A deep deep breath.

[Danny]

Nevermind, I only scanned Pass' pm, he was the BG.

[RealDeal]

1. Suspicious List (in order)

Packerfan
Jheinz
Jackal

2. Semi Suspicious list

Kwhit
Chief Rum

Note: based on the choices made by Alastor, I suspect Alastor is at least a fairly experienced player

[DaddyTorgo]

I prescribe for everyone a nice WW-free weekend so everyone can take a chill pill.

[RealDeal]

Ok you guys have my last will and testament.

[Danny]

I prescribe for everyone a nice WW-free weekend so everyone can take a chill pill.

I think most of us stayed pretty calm :).

[Danny]

Ok you guys have my last will and testament.

Next deadline is monday morning, so you'll at least have a couple days in the hospital.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

So Alastor selected both Alan (angel) and Pass (BG) at the start of the game and that's why they're both dead? Man, talk about some horrible luck.

Reading BK's post again, it looks like only Pass was selected by Alastor, leaving Alan to fall victim to hoops' brutal kill.

[RendeR]

I didn't blame his death on you. Re-read what you quoted.


I know what I quoted. The "well done" bit was a real polite "up yours" chief. Nice.

The fact is I DID believe them, I simply wanted them to support their own position, not sit back and say "go do this so we can play in our own sandbox" It isn't enough to give some unsubstantiated reasoning and expect people to do the dirty work for you.

I'm done with this argument. If you can't see why Alan pissed me off in this situation you never will. So be it.

[Chief Rum]

Wait a sec, I think we were just handed a big prize by the demons, unintentionally. Well, nothing certain, but it's more gristle for the mill.

Here is Alastor's description, per the game rules.

Alastor – At the start of the game may designate 3 players. If those players vote for a demon on the day that demon is lynched, those players will automatically die, except if that player is St. Gabriel or a particular player on the villager side.

Alan died because he was one of the three picked. This makes sense. Alastor already knew who the demons were, and it's logical he would have picked Alan as one of his three, since Alan is a dangerous villager (and already known by Alastor to not be a demon).

There were a lot of votes on hoops. And those three selected would die when hoops was lynched. Alan was the only one. hoops had to use his action changing ability (the one he also used on hoops to change his work action on Day One, see my reasoning late last night that that action could only be one of Lucifer's abilities).

I am trying to work this around in my mind to see if this gives us clues as to the identities of the other two they picked, who would then also not be demons (or they're dead). I haven't finished my thought process on it, but I wanted to toss it out there for public consumption to see if anyone else has any thoughts.

One thing muddying the waters--I am pretty sure the other demons are not on hoops currently. No way they vote for hoops. This vote was too close (which would also put weight to clearing people who did vote for hoops, at least when it was still up in the air).

And this clears JE and Render in my mind for sure. JE made the vote that really got hoops lynched, double-voting to really put him in the lead. No way JE is a wolf. You're thinking "well, duh, of course he's not a wolf, Render and he, lovers, etc.", but really we had no real serious evidence until now that they were being honest, and with the "helpful villager" Render has been playing, it seemed reasonable before now to consider that JE and Render were playing an elaborate ploy as demons to garner trust.

Now that JE, in my mind, is pretty much cleared, that for sure clears Render, too.

There is a TON to analyze in this game. And I am very good at that.

I will put some more thought into this before the demons come after me (and I have all weekend, ha ha).

[RealDeal]

Two things just for the record with Hoops.

I haven't played WW in a while, but the last game I was in, I was a wolf with Hoops. Having played on that side with him was really the biggest factor in sniffing out that he was a wolf. Particularly when he started doing all the posts earlier today that were sort of categorizing information. It reminded me of exactly what he did when he was a wolf with me.

Alan and I started discussing it and noticed that Gabriel was completely silent. So I asked Gabriel point blank "What do you think about Hoops". Gabriel took forever to respond, and then the answer we got was incredibly clunky and non-commital. (Note: I think the Gabriel and Lucifer know each other mechnism is unnecessary and very clunky. Puts those two people in some impossible situations.)

Alan and I were intending to lay low this round and build spiritual health, but when we felt strongly we had Lucifer, we decided to go for it. As soon as we named Hoops and he didn't reveal a role, we were 99.9% sure we were right. Also, if he had been a human, we were expecting the demons to pile on him pretty quickly and that didnt happen. It felt like the demons were scrambling for a bit trying to figure out what to do.

[Chief Rum]

I know what I quoted. The "well done" bit was a real polite "up yours" chief. Nice.

The fact is I DID believe them, I simply wanted them to support their own position, not sit back and say "go do this so we can play in our own sandbox" It isn't enough to give some unsubstantiated reasoning and expect people to do the dirty work for you.

I'm done with this argument. If you can't see why Alan pissed me off in this situation you never will. So be it.

Glad you can read through my Chief speak. I thought maybe I was being too subtle.

This is about your ego, about being challenged. That sucks. I understand not liking being told what to do. But, really, it had nothing to do with that, but some macho pissing match you got into, where you fell into your M.O., seeing some "slight" no one else does, going off the handle as you often have, and then being too proud and stubborn to calm yourself down and return to the logic that told you to believe them in the first place.

You rip Alan for his doggedness and tunnel vision, but you regularly do exactly the same thing, and on top of that, you're insulting to people, too.

Being done with the argument doesn't much matter now. I wish you had been "done" with the argument hours ago--it would have caused a lot less damage to this thread and this game.

I will do what you did not. I will not say anything more about this. Take your shot if you want. I won't address it further, and my apologies to BK for deciding to take this one last post before desisting.

[Danny]

Chief, you said AlanT was Alastor and Pass was brutal kill. But Jonathan said the opposite, which one is right?

[Danny]

You know, it would have been hysterical if AlanT was St. Gabriel, the PM's between the two would have been something Im sure.

[Danny]

I'm pretty sure Pass was killed by Alastor. On BK's writeup I just noticed Pass' attacks were switched to Hoopsguy. I'm assuming Hoops did this knowing Pass was on Alastor's list. There is also no mention of brutal powers for Hoops, so both kills were from Alastor.

[Chief Rum]

Chief, you said AlanT was Alastor and Pass was brutal kill. But Jonathan said the opposite, which one is right?

No, I think I was unclear. Sorry about that.

Alastor is still in the game, and we don't know his identity (yet).

He had the ability to name three players, presumeably non-demons, who would die if they voted for a demon on the day that demon was lynched. Alan was one of those players selected, which is why he died when hoops died. Pass was also selected, but he did not vote for hoops. So hoops, as Lucifer, used his ability to change Pass's vote from wherever it was (I forget) to hoops.

So Pass and Alan were two of the three players Alastor selected. There is a third, and whoever it is, it is a villager who is potentially cleared and who did not vote for hoops today--or that person is dead.

It will be a veteran, experienced wolf. Frankly, I am probably a strong candidate to be that third player, which means I could die if I vote for a demon who is lynched that same day. It could be a player who was dead before (Lathum would be a good choice), but I would tend to discount wolf kills as the last Alastor choice, since it's likely a demon would be outed and all three players would end up on the demon. Why would the wolves throw away free kills? They would kill people not chosen by Alastor and hope that the three vote for a demon on their own. They would only go after one of Alastor's three if that person clearly demonstrated he was an Angel or a villager with a significant role.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

Chief, you said AlanT was Alastor and Pass was brutal kill. But Jonathan said the opposite, which one is right?

Sorry, I'm confusing even myself. Upon further review (i.e. reading Page One more carefully), Alan and Pass were both killed by Alastor's power.

[RendeR]

Yup, its just my asshole quality screaming out into the universe. Simple enough to look at that than consider there might be an issue with anyone else. Good one. Run with that logic. Blinders make horses calmer too.


/End topic.

[Chief Rum]

I'm pretty sure Pass was killed by Alastor. On BK's writeup I just noticed Pass' attacks were switched to Hoopsguy. I'm assuming Hoops did this knowing Pass was on Alastor's list. There is also no mention of brutal powers for Hoops, so both kills were from Alastor.

Yup, you posted this while I was pointing it out in a much longer post, lol.

I earlier was thinking one Alastor choice died tonight, until I thought on it some more and realized Pass had to have been on the list, too.

[Chief Rum]

Sorry, I'm confusing even myself. Upon further review (i.e. reading Page One more carefully), Alan and Pass were both killed by Alastor's power.

Don't be confused. You and Danny (and myself) are all correct.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

It will be a veteran, experienced wolf.

This is assuming that Alastor was not able to speak to the other demons before he had to put in that list.

[The Jackal]

Lucifer dying = good day in my book.

[Chief Rum]

PF – Jackal (665), KWhit (769), Hoops (810)
Pass – Jackal (665), Packer (691), Render (773)
Heinz – CR (770), CR (770), DT (779)
Hoops – Heniz (687), Danny (729), Danny (729), JE (787), JE (787), DT (779), Alan (799), Alan (799), Real (800), Real (800), Pass, Pass, Unknown 1, Unknown 2

Walls – Hoops (655), Packer (657), Heinz (686), Tyrith (803), Tyrith (803)
Capentry – Kwhit (754)
Roof – Render (783)

Walls - Repaired
Roof - 6 shifts
Windows - 7 shifts
Artwork - Repaired
Carpentry - Repaired

Here's the final vote count without the color commentary.

Here are the surviving voters on hoops: heinz, Danny, JE, DT and Real.

None of these three were selected by Alastor as the third choice. I am also of the strong opinion none of them are demons, except maybe DT, who could have reasonably figured hoops was a goner at the time that he voted. RD was cleared anyway, and I am pretty certain JE is cleared.

That means the third choice by Alastor is either dead or one of the following:

Jackal, KWhit, PackerFanatic, Render, Chief Rum, Tyrith

Lathum and PB were killed by the wolves. I don't think they were selected. If Lathum were still alive, he would be a strong candidate to be the third choice.

Not trying to toot my own horn, because the above list has some WW vets, but my guess is, having just played a game with hoops as a wolf, that he would have strongly recommended I be one of the three picked. If not me, KWhit would probably be a good guess. But, really, there's nothing here to hang your hat on, because any of the above six might have been chosen, since all of them are proven WW vets with strong histories.

I am pretty certain there is at least one demon in this group, and quite likely two, depending on how everyone feels about DaddyTorgo. Render is already cleared.

For me personally, I take myself out, and my gut says Tyrith is okay. That leaves me with a choice of KWhit, The Jackal and PackerFanatic (two of them) as likely demons. Everyone else will no doubt (and rightly) include me as a possible demon (I am just a butcher, though, with no abilities, unfortunately, you would think my skill with knives would make a candidate to get a free demon kill, for shame...).

Interestingly enough, PF had a lot of attention on him, and KWhit and The Jackal both drew votes and interest as well.

[Chief Rum]

This is assuming that Alastor was not able to speak to the other demons before he had to put in that list.

Why would you assume this? Maybe Real Deal can confirm if he was able to converse with the other Angels right away. If so, it stands to reason the demons were, too.

Actually, even if Alastor couldn't speak to other demons, but only knew their identities, he would still likely pick experienced veteran non-demons. There aren't any newbies in this game. Everyone knows the various reps of the other players in this game. He wouldn't need to communicate with the other demons to pick dangerous villagers.

[Danny]

Here's the final vote count without the color commentary.

Here are the surviving voters on hoops: heinz, Danny, JE, DT and Real.

None of these three were selected by Alastor as the third choice. I am also of the strong opinion none of them are demons, except maybe DT, who could have reasonably figured hoops was a goner at the time that he voted. RD was cleared anyway, and I am pretty certain JE is cleared.

That means the third choice by Alastor is either dead or one of the following:

Jackal, KWhit, PackerFanatic, Render, Chief Rum, Tyrith

Lathum and PB were killed by the wolves. I don't think they were selected. If Lathum were still alive, he would be a strong candidate to be the third choice.

Not trying to toot my own horn, because the above list has some WW vets, but my guess is, having just played a game with hoops as a wolf, that he would have strongly recommended I be one of the three picked. If not me, KWhit would probably be a good guess. But, really, there's nothing here to hang your hat on, because any of the above six might have been chosen, since all of them are proven WW vets with strong histories.

I am pretty certain there is at least one demon in this group, and quite likely two, depending on how everyone feels about DaddyTorgo. Render is already cleared.

For me personally, I take myself out, and my gut says Tyrith is okay. That leaves me with a choice of KWhit, The Jackal and PackerFanatic (two of them) as likely demons. Everyone else will no doubt (and rightly) include me as a possible demon (I am just a butcher, though, with no abilities, unfortunately, you would think my skill with knives would make a candidate to get a free demon kill, for shame...).

Interestingly enough, PF had a lot of attention on him, and KWhit and The Jackal both drew votes and interest as well.

I pretty much feel the same way as Chief except I would put Jeheinz in the there with PF, Kwhit and The Jackal.

I'm really hoping CR is good this game

[PackerFanatic]

Wow - I missed a lot on Friday night. Almost got chopped and wasn't around to defend myself. And the fact I voted for Pass (another cleared villager) hurts my chances even more. Should be interesting to see what happens tonight (well, tomorrow morning, but you know what i mean)

[Danny]

Wow - I missed a lot on Friday night. Almost got chopped and wasn't around to defend myself. And the fact I voted for Pass (another cleared villager) hurts my chances even more. Should be interesting to see what happens tonight (well, tomorrow morning, but you know what i mean)

Just get yourself ready, you're likely to be one of the people on the chopping block Monday :).

[RealDeal]

Packerfan seems like a good choice to me right now, as far as lynching. Jheinz the other: why would he split his vote on a close race like that? Casting two votes but splitting them is as good as not voting at all. Looked to me like one cover your ass vote on Hoops and the other two ensure that Hoops didn't get too far ahead.

One thing to keep in mind, the vote on Hoops probably has all the information we need to find the other demons. Their goal was to keep the vote close so Alan T would have to cast his vote, since they knew Alan T's vote would kill him.

Think about it, you had two confirmed angels telling everyone they were confident that Hoops was a demon, probably Lucifer. Anyone who didn't vote for Hoops in light of that fact is suspicious. Why would someone vote for Pass or whoever else, when two confirmed angels said to vote for someone else? In this case, there was a reason. It was no accident that the voting was muddled and close between multiple people, that was the demons' plan. But the price was that they had to give us a lot of information.

I want to get this out because I think i will be dead soon. So don't forget my suspicion list and don't forget the Hoops vote. I think your answers will be there.

[Danny]

RealDeal, Jackal is the one who split his vote. Jeheinz actually put one vote on hoops and worked with his other vote.

[Danny]

One thing I am surprised about is why the wolves didn't jump more on my initial vote of Kwhit. I mentioned I felt strongly there was a wolf between he and Hoopsguy and I think it would have made some sense to go after Kwhit had he not been a wolf.

I'd put my list suspect list as
PackerFanatic
Jackal
Jeheinz
Kwhit

Not necessarily in that order btw.

I'd have CR, Tyrith and DT a notch lower.

[Tyrith]

One thing to keep in mind, the vote on Hoops probably has all the information we need to find the other demons. Their goal was to keep the vote close so Alan T would have to cast his vote, since they knew Alan T's vote would kill him.

This is the absolute key to us figuring out this puzzle.

[Chief Rum]

UNVOTE JEHEINZ
VOTE PACKERFANATIC

I think that move was futile, but I would certainly welcome a bail out.

These were two of hoops' last posts before the lynch, and includes his final vote. They were two minutes before deadline and three minutes after the AT and RD votes that pretty much put him out of reach.

My guess is the early heinz vote by hoops (which I followed him with two of my own) was a real attempt to keep from getting lynched, or allowing a fellow demon to get lynched. Even as he stuck with his heinz vote, with no support (I hadn't voted yet) as late as Post #751, just a half hour before the lynch, PF was sitting there with an equal three votes against him to hoops' three votes.

Given the above move, a futile move made when hoops knew he was a goner, his unwillingness to move to PF earlier when a run could have been made against another very real lynch candidate, and my own analysis above that shows PF as a highly likely suspect based on where his voting was in the hoops vote, I have to think PF is a demon. This last vote above was an attempt to give PF some space.

I was going to do further vote and work shift analysis, but, frankly, I am as concerned with revealing Gabriel, as I am finding demons. So I am going to stick with the analysis above, and let that speak for me.

The night shift has not yet come to pass, but I need to vote now, as tomorrow is a two-job day. So I will not be back until late Monday night.

Happy hunting, folks. And don't forget to continue to work on the cathedral.

VOTE PACKERFANATIC
VOTE PACKERFANATIC

[Barkeep49]

Everyone gathers in the morning. This is met with some momentary happiness until the crew enters the Cathedral and sees that the artwork which had been done yesterday is sitting in tatters today.

Walls - Repaired
Roof - 6 shifts
Windows - 7 shifts
Artwork - 12 shifts
Carpentry - Repaired

[jeheinz72]

Heinz can always fall back on the "my schedule didn't allow me to get back and change" when it shows up wrong. So I've now convinced myself that he is a more likely demon than The Jackal.

UNVOTE THE JACKAL
VOTE JEHEINZ72

Oh hush hoops. That's a weak argument if there ever was one. It's not like my schedule is any different if I am/am not a bad guy in any WW game.

(catching up now)

[Danny]

Hmm, seems like an odd choice for the wolves to go after the cathedral.

[Danny]

I'm off to work, will be back around 6 eastern.

[jeheinz72]

1. Suspicious List (in order)

Packerfan
Jheinz
Jackal



I'd like to know why I'm on here. I mean I say I trust you guys, you guys say vote for hoops, I vote for hoops, hoops is a demon and I'm the bad guy here?

Don't get me wrong, I mean it's about as legit as death and taxes that you're an angel, but I don't see how I get flack for doing what you asked and then being gone over the weekend (as always, not that you'd know, this is I think the first time we've played in the same game)

[DaddyTorgo]

Hmm, seems like an odd choice for the wolves to go after the cathedral.

The Demons cannot do the same night action more than two days in a row.

I think that explains it. I had to go look for it myself in the first post, but i thought i had remembered something about it.

[RealDeal]

I just scrubbed the thread and I'm going back and forth between packerfan and kwhit now as the folks most likely to be a demon.

[PackerFanatic]

I am not really sure if I have anything to say that is going to save me today. I haven't gotten very lucky on my voting at all.

[PackerFanatic]

I would like to work on the Cathedral today, since it does need a lot of work, but I will likely save my two votes to try to save my own ass.

[Tyrith]

I think CR's logic for PF is correct, and I suspect we should off him today. That said, I'm hoping we can do it with about half the actions available voting, as we do need to work as much as possible as quick as possible...12 units of damage is a lot more than I expected the wolves to be able to do in one night.

[jeheinz72]

As far as work, is it also wise to focus on the wall-dependent sections now while we can? Artwork we can do any day, right?

So maybe it's wise to get working on roof and windows a good amount today.

I plan on working once and voting once, as I've done I think every day.

[RealDeal]

I think CR's logic for PF is correct, and I suspect we should off him today. That said, I'm hoping we can do it with about half the actions available voting, as we do need to work as much as possible as quick as possible...12 units of damage is a lot more than I expected the wolves to be able to do in one night.

Leviathan?

[KWhit]

I just scrubbed the thread and I'm going back and forth between packerfan and kwhit now as the folks most likely to be a demon.

Why me?

[DaddyTorgo]

As far as work, is it also wise to focus on the wall-dependent sections now while we can? Artwork we can do any day, right?

why would this be? is there some bit in the rules that I missed about what has to be built in what order?

[Tyrith]

why would this be? is there some bit in the rules that I missed about what has to be built in what order?

If they bust the walls again we have to stop working on the roof/windows. If we finish those now and they do break the walls again then we can fix the walls and put any extra cycles on the artwork. But if we finish the artwork and the wolves break the walls then we have to fix the walls and then wait a day before we can do anything else.

[DaddyTorgo]

If they bust the walls again we have to stop working on the roof/windows. If we finish those now and they do break the walls again then we can fix the walls and put any extra cycles on the artwork. But if we finish the artwork and the wolves break the walls then we have to fix the walls and then wait a day before we can do anything else.


my head hurts a little. i think i get what you're saying, but i think i need my afternoon coffee. :D

[jeheinz72]

Yeah, Tyrith has it. Basically we've been waiting on the walls to even start on the other two. I think it's wise for us to work on those now while we can. We can always do artwork later.

[jeheinz72]

WORK ROOF

[jeheinz72]

I'm a bit leery of trusting CR one bit (I always am when someone posts that I'm certainly bad then certainly good that quickly, smells of someone aiming to gain trust), but, with that said, his logic for PF does make a lot of sense.

[RendeR]

I intend to place one vote and do one unit of work.

I will work on the roof. Are we pretty much agreeing to play the packerfanatic lynch today?

[PackerFanatic]

No :(

[jeheinz72]

Well, make a case PF! I'm in another 2 hours and need to make my vote.

[PackerFanatic]

I honestly have really no case to make. I am not seeing the connection between hoops and me that CR is making, but going off of my voting record alone, I haven't looked good at all. The only upside is that I have no role that you will be losing.

VOTE CHIEF RUM
VOTE CHIEF RUM

Might as well try and go down with a blaze of glory. It just sounds a little too far fetched what he is trying to pull.

[Tyrith]

Well, with the level of inactivity right now, I don't see how we're going to get a lynch other than PackerFanatic, to be quite frank. I certainly don't have anything productive to say - CR's case it the best one I know of. And at this point I am pretty sure that either PF or CR is bad.

[RealDeal]

Lynching PF is a fine course of action. Hope we're right.

WORK WALLS

WORK WALLS

WORK WALLS

Just so people understand this. First, I have three turns due to my second and last use of my baker ability of an additional turn.

This is all fake work. Do not count this toward anything. All of this will actually be dedicated to spiritual health.

[jeheinz72]

Well a busy afternoon left me 2 minutes to vote before I hit the road.

I'd agree that we're likely looking at a 50/50 shot on PF and CR. I'm going with CR since while I agree with what he's saying logically, I think there is a nefarious counter-action to it.

Vote Chief Rum

[Danny]

I think that explains it. I had to go look for it myself in the first post, but i thought i had remembered something about it.

Oh, makes sense now

[Danny]

Not much action going on. I agree pretty much with the CR/PackerFanatic showdown. So far I've trusted CR over PF, but will do some more thinking before making my vote. If PF is the lynch and comes up good, then CR should be the lynch candidate the following day. The fact that there is this vote splitting tells me there is a likely wolf among the two.

[RendeR]

CR makes a good case, tons of analysis, pages of posts. Reminds me a bit too much of someone else I know....

[The Jackal]

Wow. I forgot it was Monday. I'll try and make a decision between CR and PF now.

[The Jackal]

Hmm. On second thought, I think my actions are best placed in helping finish the roof.

WORK ON ROOF
WORK ON ROOF

[DaddyTorgo]

alright. back from work and done with dinner. doesn't look like there's much debate going on - seems that we have a clear course of action, and either PF has been abandoned or the wolves are busy planning how to get CR free of a lynch tomorrow.

seems like based on how things are going down that i might need to lay 2 on PF though.

[DaddyTorgo]

(continuation) in order to make sure the lynch goes down the way we seem to be in agreement we want it to (on PF). i haven't seen a recent vote count, but the votes on this page are all for CR.

[RendeR]

So you're saying you believe CR is good and his analysis has been for the greater good?

I keep getting confliting vibes from people's posts. I am as yet undecided.

[DaddyTorgo]

i don't know. i had a pretty busy day, but i thought from the times i managed to peek in that that was the consensus?

[DaddyTorgo]

hey tyrith - you've been pretty quiet this game - what's up?

[Tyrith]

I've been really busy with different stuff. And, to be honest, I wanted no part with the brawl that started on Friday. And I don't know anything. I'm not really in it, in this case.

[DaddyTorgo]

Seems to me that there's a lot of evidence against PF (laid out by people like CR). I'm not going to sit here and summarize, but it seems like it's solid reasoning. And if it's not, we can start to wonder why Chief Rum would push us in that direction so enthusiastically, so in a sense we learn potentially 2 things from one lynch I guess?

[DaddyTorgo]

and i know that RealDeal only has one little bit of insight (that PF is a "safe" target), but from an emotional sense, his "okaying" of a vote for PF is reassuring. there's no logic behind it, but you know?

[RealDeal]

Yes, DT, if I were putting a vote down this round, it would be for PF. I have a pretty good feeling about it, although not as strong as on Hoops. With Hoops, I felt comfortable because of some behavior of Hoops that seemed consistent with a prior time he had been a wolf and we had gotten strange vibes from Gabriel when discussing him.

With PF, it's really about the votes. Pretty much all of his votes have been wrong and often suspiciously. He doesn't have a role (as far as we know). Plus I remember one point where he was really insistent on doing wall work to prove he was good. Seemed a little much to me.

I'd say 80% chance he's a demon, which is higher odds than I would assign to anyone else.

[DaddyTorgo]

i see 3 votes for CR and no votes for PF yet by my unofficial count

[DaddyTorgo]

whoops i missed chief's votes (they were before BK posted the start of the day)

CR - 3
PF - 2

[KWhit]

Vote Packerfan
Work on Windows

[RendeR]

Sounds good then


Vote PackerFanatic

[DaddyTorgo]

was hoping i'd be able to only vote once and do some work with my other action, but i guess someone else can do work on my behalf? doesn't really matter as long as the work gets done

VOTE PACKERFANATIC
VOTE PACKERFANATIC

[DaddyTorgo]

aargh!

assholes!

i didn't refresh after I typed it out and then hopped up to run to the bathroom.

well - looks like now we have

CR - 3
PF - 6

[RendeR]

Thats ok DT, better safe than sorry.

[DaddyTorgo]

seems like there's not much going on here - i may just go off and wargame.

i'm kicking ass as the confederacy - doing so well that in my last raising of funds i raised over a million dollars in 1862 - so I'm going to bulk shit up and invade the North!

[Barkeep49]

Seeing as how it has had no impact on today in terms of discussion and such, I am going to fix a mistake from last night.

Several people complain today of grogginess. Complain of having heard loud drunken noises outside last night. Definitely someone getting a little too drunk for their own good and roaming the streets.

Revised status of the Cathedral as of the start of the day:

Walls - Repaired
Roof - 6 shifts
Windows - 7 shifts
Artwork - 4 shifts
Carpentry - Repaired

[Tyrith]

Vote seems pretty fait accompli at this point.

WORK ON ROOF
WORK ON ROOF

[DaddyTorgo]

awesome news on the revision!

[Danny]

So we have 5 work done on roof and 1 on windows so far right?

[Barkeep49]

Here's what I have through 941:

Packer – CR (879), CR (879), KWhit (932), Render (933), DT (934), DT (934)
Chief – Packer (912), Packer (912), JH (915)

Roof – JH (907), Jackal (920), Jackal (920), Tyrith (Roof), Tyrith (Roof)
Walls – Real (914), Real (914), Real (914)
Windows – Kwhit (932)

[Jonathan Ezarik]

I'm not so sure about these votes on PF. I could be wrong, but it seems like a lot of people are willing to go with CR without really questioning his reasoning. Either way, I don't think my votes are going to switch the lynch results, so I'm going to focus entirely on building the cathedral.

WORK ON ROOF

WORK ON ROOF

[Danny]

Work on Roof
Work on Windows

[Danny]

Eh, I posted same time as Jonathan. If it is allowed, I would like to switch my Roof work to Windows.

[Barkeep49]

Not in this case, sorry.

[Danny]

Ok, well at least the roof better be fixed now :P

[Barkeep49]

Oh and we're past deadline. Writeup shortly.

[hoopsguy]

I think I know the ending ...

[PackerFanatic]

*sigh* Oh well. Good luck villagers. I guess I should start waiting longer in the day on votes...

[Barkeep49]

You all do hate such riff-raff running around your town. Such vileness. So you find the guy wearing Gold and Green (doesn't he know how ugly that looks?) and take him to the gallows. When you find his stash you find nothing except evidence that he was one stinking filthy drunk. Which you already knew.

Beer, ale, whiskey, you don’t care. As long as it’s a drink you like it. Who needs a house? Not you. You just need something good to drink. Due to your homelessness once per game you may block all night actions as you roam the city creating a ruckus. You may not use this ability until Night 3 at the earliest.

Walls - Repaired
Roof - Reapired
Windows - 5 shifts
Artwork - 4 shifts
Carpentry - Repaired

Packer – CR (879), CR (879), KWhit (932), Render (933), DT (934), DT (934)
Chief – Packer (912), Packer (912), JH (915)

Roof – JH (907), Jackal (920), Jackal (920), Tyrith (Roof), Tyrith (Roof), JE (943), JE (943), Danny (944)
Walls – Real (914), Real (914), Real (914)
Windows – Kwhit (932), Danny (944)

[Danny]

Is that Windows number accurate Barkeep?

[Barkeep49]

Is that Windows number accurate Barkeep?
It is now.

[Tyrith]

Well, this will probably make tomorrow pretty simple.

[Danny]

I'm not sure if it is time for us villagers to consider a minor victory, but the wolves have now used one night to cause damage. They can only do this one more consecutive night.

I think we should consider using all of our actions tomorrow for repair to make sure all of the work gets done. This will force the wolves to cause damage and we won't lose anyone. Then the following night we again go full on repairs and as long as we get them done, we secure a victory, albeit a minor one.

[RealDeal]

So if Packer had a role, why didn't he reveal it, considering he was on the chopping block? Makes no sense at all. That would seem to be pretty useful information to tell people when they are deciding to kill you.

[Danny]

Yeah, especially since it wouldn't have made him a primary target anyway.

[RealDeal]

For future reference, if you are about to die, reveal whatever role you have, be it important or not. It might save your life.

[Danny]

I really think we should consider going for the minor victory (or major if you're an angel?) for tomorrow. We need 9 repair actions and and should have 16 total actions for tomorrow, so if we mandate that everyone split their work 1/1 on windows/artwork, we will finish even if wolves fake it.

[RendeR]

He didn't have a role, he was just a vagrant who could cause a ruckus.

After CR's analysis who would have listened to PF had he revealed that was his sole ability? I doubt any of us would.

Sorry PF.

[RealDeal]

This may be the night during which I die, so let me get my last word out (again).

Kwhit is top of my list now. Jheinz is second.

Also, thanks to angels being able to accomplish a significant portion of spiritual health maintenance last night, there is a new angel. I don't want to reveal who it is or what powers they have, and I ask at this time that you not do what you did to Alan and ferret him out, but I did want to say it in advance, so that if this person needs to come out, you will not think it is total bs.

[Chief Rum]

Sorry, PF. The reasoning was sound, but nothing was certain. Wish you would have come out with your role (not that I could have changed, but others could have).

I understand the desire now to do some counter-lynch on me because of this, and if that's what people choose to do, so be it. That said, it gains you nothing--I don't even have a role to announce. I wish someone had bothered to question my analysis or come up with theories of their own. We're a village, people, not just one guy, and I am out all day as it is.

I still think the reasoning I put up is sound--it just ended up on the wrong guy. The other two suspects on my list based on that reasoning were KWhit and The Jackal.

I should be able to get back on before deadline tomorrow, so I won't have to vote or do work now. I am open to doing all work to finish the cathedral, [articularly since we have another new angel (way to go, angels).

[Danny]

I think finishing the work shifts the power back to the village. It basically puts us in the same position we are in tonight, but with work finished and a lot of pressure on the demons.

As of the next morning, we will have 8 people alive, so 16 units of available work to fill 9 units.

5 units on windows, 4 on artwork.

I believe we should divide the work up using the following (assuming RealDeal is the night kill at this point)

Jackal works on Windows
Jackal works on Artwork

Kwhit works on Windows
Kwhit works on Artwork

Tyrith works on Windows
Tyrith works on Artwork

Chief Rum works on Windows
Chief Rum works on Artwork

Jonathan works on Windows
Jonathan works on Artwork

Danny works on Windows
Danny works on Artwork

Render works on Windows
Render works on Artwork

DaddyTorgo works on Windows
DaddyTorgo works on Artwork

This way, no matter whether there are the likely two demons or a possible 3rd, our work will be done.

I know this might cause the village to only get a normal victory, but right now we are on dangerous ground. If there are 2 demons and now 3 angels. that puts us at only 3 or 4 (depending if Real Deal is the one to go) remaining villagers and a possible end game scenario if we get the lynch wrong tomorrow.

[Danny]

I think the above play is by far our strongest strategy at this point and I think any quick votes in the morning instead of doing work would only be done by a demon. So if you're a villager or angel lets stick to this strategy unless as a group we decide to do something else.

[Danny]

I just realized I forgot Jeheinz, so we will have 18 units of work actually. I still think this strategy is our best bet, but it does put more doubt whether or not a bad lynch tomorrow is end game

[Barkeep49]

This morning the damage is more spread out than what you saw yesterday, and is somewhat substantial. You're so close you can taste it, but you're not quite there yet.

Walls - Repaired
Roof - 6 Shifts
Windows - 5 shifts
Artwork - 4 shifts
Carpentry - 3 shifts

[Danny]

That last strategy is thrown out now. Obviously we should go for a combo of repairs and votes today. Today is a very important lynch.

[jeheinz72]

I think finishing the work shifts the power back to the village. It basically puts us in the same position we are in tonight, but with work finished and a lot of pressure on the demons.

As of the next morning, we will have 8 people alive, so 16 units of available work to fill 9 units.

5 units on windows, 4 on artwork.

I believe we should divide the work up using the following (assuming RealDeal is the night kill at this point)

Jackal works on Windows
Jackal works on Artwork

Kwhit works on Windows
Kwhit works on Artwork

Tyrith works on Windows
Tyrith works on Artwork

Chief Rum works on Windows
Chief Rum works on Artwork

Jonathan works on Windows
Jonathan works on Artwork

Danny works on Windows
Danny works on Artwork

Render works on Windows
Render works on Artwork

DaddyTorgo works on Windows
DaddyTorgo works on Artwork

This way, no matter whether there are the likely two demons or a possible 3rd, our work will be done.

I know this might cause the village to only get a normal victory, but right now we are on dangerous ground. If there are 2 demons and now 3 angels. that puts us at only 3 or 4 (depending if Real Deal is the one to go) remaining villagers and a possible end game scenario if we get the lynch wrong tomorrow.

I haven't caught up yet, but am I dead or sumpin?

[Danny]

Keep reading :P.

I'm off to work, will be on around 5:30eastern.

[jeheinz72]

Haha, yeah, my bad!

[The Jackal]

Hmm. So are we thinking of pursuing CR here? I'll abstain on actions till later in the day so that we have a proper spread, but we're thinking most people should work on the cathedral, and we'll have just enough votes to lynch someone?

[Tyrith]

Eh, I don't know anymore. I'm hesitant to lynch CR just for the sake of it at this point, even though I know I advertised that way previously. RD's instincts have been pretty good so far in the game - I'd be interested to hear why he thinks we should lynch KWhit.

[KWhit]

Me too.

:)

I'm totally in the dark on where to go with my vote next, but I'm no demon.

[hoopsguy]

This is riveting.

[Hannibal Lecter]

Yeah no kidding! you alls are LAME!

[jeheinz72]

Haha, shush dead people!

Seriously though, I don't have a great read on this entire game.

If we have 18 units left to do though, and 9 people, why wouldn't we just knock out all 18 on work and get the minor win?

I'm thinking for the first time I may just work twice.

[Tyrith]

Keeping one in reserve.

WORK ON CARPENTRY

[RendeR]

I am the Baron and as the prosecutor, judge and jury in this land I will be voting for SOMEONE tonight.

I have but one unit of work to give to the cathedral tonight.

[Passacaglia]

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Danny]

Wow nothing happened today

[Danny]

Haha, shush dead people!

Seriously though, I don't have a great read on this entire game.

If we have 18 units left to do though, and 9 people, why wouldn't we just knock out all 18 on work and get the minor win?

I'm thinking for the first time I may just work twice.

At least one wolf would be sure to fake.

[jeheinz72]

At least one wolf would be sure to fake.

True, there is that. But the balance would be that we wouldn't lynch anyone. Considering we're not overflowing with great leads...

[Tyrith]

Because, if nothing else, it makes the game end faster.

VOTE KWHIT

[Danny]

True, there is that. But the balance would be that we wouldn't lynch anyone. Considering we're not overflowing with great leads...

It gives the wolves a free night kill though, I think we should lynch someone.

[Danny]

WORK IN WINDOWS
VOTE KWHIT

I'd rather there not be funny business, so now someone besides Kwhit would have to throw their vote on someone besides him. If you're a villager, you should using the rest of your points to do work. If we can try and finish the windows and roof. It's going to look real bad if someone go with Kwhit and the person you lynch turns up villager.

[Danny]

Poorly typed, but I was saying is it will look really bad if someone votes along with Kwhit and that lynch choice turns up to be someone good.

[Danny]

Off to class. Again, it would be best for the village if every villager puts in work and we either lynch Kwhit or force the last wolf to reveal if they try to save him. If he does turn up good, we are still in decent shape with an almost completed cathedral heading into tomorrow.

I think priority is on the windows and roof.

[RendeR]

WORK on WINDOWS

[The Jackal]

WORK ON ROOF

[DaddyTorgo]

home and around. hell of a crazy day kept me away

[DaddyTorgo]

wow - i can see i missed nothing

[DaddyTorgo]

WORK ON ROOF
WORK ON ARTWORK

[Barkeep49]

I apologize, but I am not feeling well and simply can't muster the energy to stay-up until deadline. I therefore will be running the night and day tomorrow morning around 7 AM, as usual. If you have a night action and would like to send in conditionals based on the results of the lynch and/or progress of the cathedral, send them my way.

[RendeR]

Feel better BK.

[KWhit]

Not much of a reveal, but here goes, since it looks like I'm target #1.

I'm the Master Carpenter, and NOT a demon. My role states that of the things that I work on, I can choose one per night to make extra strong. Meaning if a demon attacks it, it only takes half damage.

[Chief Rum]

What have you been choosing to reinforce? I haven't really seen much evidence of the presence of your abilities in the game to this point. Of course, never saw any evidence of PF's powers either, but he had them.

Speaking of which, BK (and hope you feel better), was I the only player who didn't get any powers? Sheesh!

Back to KWhit:

Even demons get the powers of their roles, so just being Master Carpenter doesn't mean you're not a demon. Just sayin', you know.

[Jonathan Ezarik]

WORK ON ROOF

WORK ON ROOF

[The Jackal]

WORK ON ROOF

[Chief Rum]

Not sure if the deadline is now, and the sim is just run tomorrow, or if we can keep voting. So I will get my work in now.

VOTE WINDOWS
VOTE ARTWORK

[DaddyTorgo]

deadline is now i assume.

i've been wondering where the heck everyone is - dreaming up scenarios where i'm the only villager left (with the angels) and all the rest of you are demons