Werewolf CLXVII - The Wheel of Time - Game Over

[Autumn]

Day 2 Vote Count

Timmae [1] - Vaimes (212)
Britrock88 [2] - Narcizo (226), Grover (232)
Zinto [1] - The Jackal (233)
The Jackal [1] - cheekimonk (242)
cheekimonk [1] - britrock88 (248)

[britrock88]

I moved to EagleFan because it was an odd move to put himself in more danger - eliminating Grover...one of the 2 tied w/ him at the time - to try to jumpstart a run on someone w/ 1 vote (Jackal).

He either knew something about Jackal (not likely on Day 1) or was luring votes off of him and possibly timmae, too. A risky, and peculiar, move.

Yeah, my chasing you with that vote might be treating the situation a bit consequentially. I still think endangering oneself to go after someone else is a strong good play, though (even if a little more confusing by virtue of being the seer).

[cheekimonk]

And, I might add, a dishonorable move to timmae at the last minute. Something the Aiel do not abide.

[Coffee Warlord]

Observations...

- We have to assume that the wolves had no idea EF was the seer. At best, any late movement was simply making sure a villager died. It was easy to nail him based on his somewhat odd late vote.

- We have to assume EF didn't get a night 0 scan. Therefore his vote on Jackal was just a barely educated guess. Day 1 vote.

- 3 people (including EF, a known villager), drop Grover out of the running with what, 10 minutes?

- Grover himself never moved, wasting his vote last night.

- Zinto tried to force a tie at the last second. Which, per the rules, is 'get none or all'. I get the possibility of a last second attempt to save the claimed seer, but he had to know that was a lost cause with the reveal coming at 1 minute left. Odd. Also add in his wham-bam vote on Jackal when EF moved. Double odd.

- Timmae votes to save himself, choosing EF over Grover. Nothing but a coin flip there, unless Grover and Timmae are both wolves.

No, I have no conclusions. Just noting things right now.

[Coffee Warlord]

Honestly, barring some other insights, which I'm perfectly happy to listen to, I presently feel much the same way as last night - we get the most information by offing Grover.

[cheekimonk]

Honestly, barring some other insights, which I'm perfectly happy to listen to, I presently feel much the same way as last night - we get the most information by offing Grover.

I feel this a tad, but while I did take note of Zinto immediately following EF onto Jackal, I had forgotten about his last-second attempt to tie the vote.

[Grover]

Honestly, barring some other insights, which I'm perfectly happy to listen to, I presently feel much the same way as last night - we get the most information by offing Grover.

And I said that I would be away from my computer from around 6pm to deadline.

So my non-movement is simply because I was not able to get to the forums.

[cheekimonk]

Actually, Coffee, that's a good point about Grover not moving at all. Even at the top of the table all day he kept his head down.

unvote Jackal
vote Grover

[MartinD]

VOTE GROVER

Based on an initial feeling from reading through the posts leading up to yesterday's deadline - don't have anything more than this, though, so will come back later on to go over things again.

[Grover]

I've got my bowling league tonight (I know you're jealous), so I may be lurking via my phone, but whether or not I contribute between 6:30 EST - Deadline is hazy.

This is why I did not move.

I don't want to be so defensive about why I didn't change from vaimes, but this is pretty much it.

As far as keeping my head down, why challenge a day one vote? What would I be able to do to prove any innocence as a villager when we have nothing to go on?

[path12]

To clarify Britrock88's point above, yeah, I miscounted and thought I was tying Grover up last night -- was in a hurry.

But that immediate move away from him was odd and I do not know how to process it. Could just as easily be coincidence though. God I hate day 1's, especially when we lose roles.

[Zinto]

Observations...

- We have to assume that the wolves had no idea EF was the seer. At best, any late movement was simply making sure a villager died. It was easy to nail him based on his somewhat odd late vote.

- We have to assume EF didn't get a night 0 scan. Therefore his vote on Jackal was just a barely educated guess. Day 1 vote.

- 3 people (including EF, a known villager), drop Grover out of the running with what, 10 minutes?

- Grover himself never moved, wasting his vote last night.

- Zinto tried to force a tie at the last second. Which, per the rules, is 'get none or all'. I get the possibility of a last second attempt to save the claimed seer, but he had to know that was a lost cause with the reveal coming at 1 minute left. Odd. Also add in his wham-bam vote on Jackal when EF moved. Double odd.

- Timmae votes to save himself, choosing EF over Grover. Nothing but a coin flip there, unless Grover and Timmae are both wolves.

No, I have no conclusions. Just noting things right now.


I probably need to go reread the rules. I didn't know the tie rules until you just posted them but none was better than the result we got and I don't think it made sense not to try and save a claimed seer.

[Zinto]

There were a lot of drive by votes which isn't uncommon in day one especially without Autumn and Jag pushing the vote early and often. It made it so it was pretty easy to place a vote early and feel no pressure in moving as the day progressed.

[Zinto]

I wonder if Eagle's hunch was that even though Jackal was on the block early nothing really materialized for him. He got a couple votes early but was never in any real danger.

[Zinto]

I am probably not going to vote for Grover because I don't see the wolves moving off him to try and save him. It just isn't that great of a play and would easily come back to haunt a baddie.

[path12]

I wonder if Eagle's hunch was that even though Jackal was on the block early nothing really materialized for him. He got a couple votes early but was never in any real danger.

But that happens every game. More I think about it the more it seems just like what he said, a hunch and nothing else.

[Coffee Warlord]

And I said that I would be away from my computer from around 6pm to deadline.

So my non-movement is simply because I was not able to get to the forums.

I got occupied before I added an addendum to that comment of mine - that being I didn't look to see if you were even available.

[Grover]

I got occupied before I added an addendum to that comment of mine - that being I didn't look to see if you were even available.

Fair enough, mate!

[Chief Rum]

I don't think everything is above board on this EF situation.

EF wasn't born yesterday. He's a long time, veteran player. Doesn't anyone else think it is REALLY odd that a veteran veteran WW player chases a player with a vote AND put himself in more danger of being voted out at the same time...when he is also the flippin' seer?

I mean, that's nuts. I don't think enough is being made of that. I don't think EF was just playing a hunch (that's just what he said).

I think he has more on The Jackal, probably from something in his role, then seems clear here in the thread.

I'll also point out that the ruleset includes the moderator directive to not discuss the game after you have been killed, as you may still later impact the game, under IMPORTANT ADDITIONS. That could just be a generic directive, but given where it was added, I think not. Ergo, resurrection or some form of activity is still possible. It may be that setting up his own death was part of EF's role. Perhaps a step to being resurrected as a Dragon? I don't know. I haven't read the series, so I don't know if that sort of circumstance is a possibility in that world. Point is, though, EF made a very weird move for him, and I don't believe it was an accident.

[Chief Rum]

And on that thinking...

VOTE THE JACKAL

[britrock88]

Actually, Coffee, that's a good point about Grover not moving at all. Even at the top of the table all day he kept his head down.

unvote Jackal
vote Grover

This seems opportunistic, especially in light of Grover's rebuttal due to AFKness.

[Raven]

fyi I am catching up now.
May be an hour before I know what's going on, but I am here.

[Zinto]

I don't think everything is above board on this EF situation.

EF wasn't born yesterday. He's a long time, veteran player. Doesn't anyone else think it is REALLY odd that a veteran veteran WW player chases a player with a vote AND put himself in more danger of being voted out at the same time...when he is also the flippin' seer?

I mean, that's nuts. I don't think enough is being made of that. I don't think EF was just playing a hunch (that's just what he said).

I think he has more on The Jackal, probably from something in his role, then seems clear here in the thread.

I'll also point out that the ruleset includes the moderator directive to not discuss the game after you have been killed, as you may still later impact the game, under IMPORTANT ADDITIONS. That could just be a generic directive, but given where it was added, I think not. Ergo, resurrection or some form of activity is still possible. It may be that setting up his own death was part of EF's role. Perhaps a step to being resurrected as a Dragon? I don't know. I haven't read the series, so I don't know if that sort of circumstance is a possibility in that world. Point is, though, EF made a very weird move for him, and I don't believe it was an accident.


EF wouldn't come back as the dragon based on book lore. All Aes Sedai are female while the Dragon is male.

[Coffee Warlord]

I don't think everything is above board on this EF situation.

EF wasn't born yesterday. He's a long time, veteran player. Doesn't anyone else think it is REALLY odd that a veteran veteran WW player chases a player with a vote AND put himself in more danger of being voted out at the same time...when he is also the flippin' seer?

I mean, that's nuts. I don't think enough is being made of that. I don't think EF was just playing a hunch (that's just what he said).

I think he has more on The Jackal, probably from something in his role, then seems clear here in the thread.

Believe me, I've thought about that. Here's the thing. Unless the "more" is Jackal is a wolf (in which case if you have concrete info like that, you flat out say it - I don't care if it's Day 1 or not), I'm not sure, given the rules, what that "more" is gonna be that benefits us.

I almost wonder his saying he had a 'hunch' was a subtle attempt to reveal he was the seer that nobody picked up on. He was a lynch candidate at that point anyway, he took a shot at a subtle reveal, and we blew it.

[Zinto]

Believe me, I've thought about that. Here's the thing. Unless the "more" is Jackal is a wolf (in which case if you have concrete info like that, you flat out say it - I don't care if it's Day 1 or not), I'm not sure, given the rules, what that "more" is gonna be that benefits us.

I almost wonder his saying he had a 'hunch' was a subtle attempt to reveal he was the seer that nobody picked up on. He was a lynch candidate at that point anyway, he took a shot at a subtle reveal, and we blew it.


If his move was to subtly reveal by saying he had a hunch than I don't think we would have ever got it. He played very similarly last game and wasn't the seer.

[cheekimonk]

If his move was to subtly reveal by saying he had a hunch than I don't think we would have ever got it. He played very similarly last game and wasn't the seer.

He was the seer last game, wasn't he?

[Zinto]

He was the seer last game, wasn't he?


Nope I just looked back and he was the BG.

[The Jackal]

And on that thinking...

VOTE THE JACKAL

Knowing that we don't have much to go on, I know that it'll be easy to try and connect lines to me from EF since he had an important role - not sure how to dispute from my end. I'm thinking he just saw something weird to him in my voting or style .. kind of set me up for a rough deal since he never expanded on his thinking.

I moved to EF to see what would happen, mostly. I was intending on switching to timmae as I was reading along the thread around 9:15 and then realized I'd screwed up the deadline time.

[The Jackal]

unvote zinto
vote timmae

[Grover]

What about timmae has you voting for him, Jackal?

[The Jackal]

What about timmae has you voting for him, Jackal?

Well, I'm trying to decide if I think we had a wolf on the block between the 3 of you or not yesterday. I think we learn a lot with timmae, but I need to look more closely at the vote movement before I commit to thinking there was a distinct effort to save him.

Gut-wise I feel better about voting Zinto.

[timmae]

EF wouldn't come back as the dragon based on book lore. All Aes Sedai are female while the Dragon is male.

Rereading the game set and this is how I read it as well.

Question on the female and male channelers. Am I correct in thinking that the 4 factions are made up of some combination of female and male channelers? I.e. the Aes Sedai are female channelers while the male channelers are in the other factions? Femail channelers have their power consistently while the male channelers have a one time use or something like it?

The World of the Wheel of Time

Channeling

In this world there are some who have been gifted, or cursed, with the ability to touch the One Source, that power that turns the Wheel of Time and creates all things. Those with this ability can do amazing and unbelievable things. For that they are admired, feared or shunned. The act of weaving the power of the One Source is known as Channeling, and it comes in two distinct varieties.

Female Channelers - Women who can channel touch the female half of the Source, known as Saidar. Any woman with this ability is brought to the White Tower where she learns to use it in the service of the Aes Sedai. These women are the ones who have held back the influence of the Shadow for thousands of years.

Male Channelers - Men who channel touch a separate half of the Source, called Saidin. However, when the Dark One was sealed away he tainted Saidin, so that no man can channel for long without being driven insane. They are a true threat to the world, having Broken it once before. But it is assumed that when the Dragon returns, he will be a channeler, as have been many of the false Dragons in the past. Without the ability to channel will he able to face the Dark One? With it will he go insane and destroy the world before he saves it?

[The Jackal]

Question on the female and male channelers. Am I correct in thinking that the 4 factions are made up of some combination of female and male channelers? I.e. the Aes Sedai are female channelers while the male channelers are in the other factions? Femail channelers have their power consistently while the male channelers have a one time use or something like it?

Hard to speculate how they set up the game, but can speak to the books at least. Male channelers would definitely not be Aes Sedai, and in general channeling as a man was basically a death sentence and/or resulted in you being "gentled" by Aes Sedai and losing your ability to channel.

We might only have one male who can channel, him being the dragon. If there are other male characters who can channel, there could be a "false dragon" who has the ability to channel but isn't the actual dragon. There were lots of those over the years in the books. If the forsaken is a male character, they'd also be able to channel.

Not sure if I'm answering your question here, though. What are you driving at in terms of the separation of factions/channelers?

[The Jackal]

And if we're looking at the four factions - one of them is Aes Sedai so presumably that's where all the Aes Sedai would be. I doubt we have channelers in the other factions other than the Dragon and Forsaken. The other 1-2 (probably 1?) bad guy is likely just a darkfriend with some power that isn't channeling related.

[The Jackal]

Probably at least one warder in the game likely as a BG with something specific in regards to protecting Aes Sedai. The warder/Aes Sedai bond is huge and that might even be a potential lover role.

(For those that don't know, lovers usually have PM rights but often if one of them dies the other one dies too, which actually would make a ton of sense in this game because in the books if one of the Aes Sedai/Warder bond died, the other would go crazy with emotional loss and often end up martyring themselves, etc)

[The Jackal]

And of course there's the chance that one of the Aes Sedai is black ajah masquerading as one of the other ajahs.

[Chief Rum]

Yes, it would appear you guys are right about EF and the possibility he could return as the Dragon.

That said, it doesn't discount him coming back in some other form, nor that it could have been a role-based move to get himself skilled.

[timmae]

Hard to speculate how they set up the game, but can speak to the books at least. Male channelers would definitely not be Aes Sedai, and in general channeling as a man was basically a death sentence and/or resulted in you being "gentled" by Aes Sedai and losing your ability to channel.

We might only have one male who can channel, him being the dragon. If there are other male characters who can channel, there could be a "false dragon" who has the ability to channel but isn't the actual dragon. There were lots of those over the years in the books. If the forsaken is a male character, they'd also be able to channel.

Not sure if I'm answering your question here, though. What are you driving at in terms of the separation of factions/channelers?

That helps... I was wondering if the male channelers were part of the factions generally or whether they needed to be shadow. Not sure that either really makes more sense out of the roles but trying to wrap my mind around it all. I am trying to figure out the roles within the game set to verify why EF would do what he did. I don't have a good explanation... his claim with 1 minute was just so odd.

[The Jackal]

Yes, it would appear you guys are right about EF and the possibility he could return as the Dragon.

That said, it doesn't discount him coming back in some other form, nor that it could have been a role-based move to get himself skilled.

I'd say it's very doubtful he'd come back as the Dragon, since he was an Aes Sedai (female). Dragons are definitely male.

Now, that's not to say he couldn't come back/influence in some other way.

[The Jackal]

That helps... I was wondering if the male channelers were part of the factions generally or whether they needed to be shadow. Not sure that either really makes more sense out of the roles but trying to wrap my mind around it all. I am trying to figure out the roles within the game set to verify why EF would do what he did. I don't have a good explanation... his claim with 1 minute was just so odd.

Yeah I really don't get holding that info back to the very end.

Being a channeler as a male doesn't automatically mean you are evil. The Dragon will be a male channeler but he's supposed to save the world (or go insane). The forsaken in the game, if male, will also be able to channel. Those characters will presumably be spread amongst the factions outside of Aes Sedai.

[The Jackal]

I'm guessing we have, out of 16:

5 aes sedai (possibly 1 of which is black ajah and thereby evil)
1-2 warders
1 dragon
1 forsaken
1-2 dark friends

And then 5-7 people with minor abilities/victory conditions/or some vanillas.

[The Jackal]

Meaning we're down to:
4 Aes Sedai
1-2 warders
1 dragon
1 forsaken
1-2 dark friends

4-6 others

[cheekimonk]

Yeah I really don't get holding that info back to the very end.

Being a channeler as a male doesn't automatically mean you are evil. The Dragon will be a male channeler but he's supposed to save the world (or go insane). The forsaken in the game, if male, will also be able to channel. Those characters will presumably be spread amongst the factions outside of Aes Sedai.

Actually, as I mentioned earlier, I'm not sure the Forsaken(s) is a part of any faction given that all the Forsaken were locked away with the Dark One ages ago.

[The Jackal]

Actually, as I mentioned earlier, I'm not sure the Forsaken(s) is a part of any faction given that all the Forsaken were locked away with the Dark One ages ago.

I've considered that the forsaken might be outside of one of the factions - but a lot of them visibly settled into cities and positions of power in the book. For instance, the leader of Illian was a forsaken who had created the identity of some minor lord and then risen to power in the government. So I wouldn't be surprised if the forsaken is in one of the factions masquerading as a good person.

[The Jackal]

I feel like the mods said there was only going to be one forsaken based on the # of players, so I'm going with that for sure and expecting them to be powerful. At a minimum cunning, especially since EF's role sounds like it was for scanning darkfriends. Not that that matters too much anymore..

Dragon might be able to scan for them outside of a cunning mechanic, or some character with that ability. But I'd expect the Dragon and Forsaken roles are pretty powerful.

[The Jackal]

Actually, as I mentioned earlier, I'm not sure the Forsaken(s) is a part of any faction given that all the Forsaken were locked away with the Dark One ages ago.

To expand on that, in the books the Forsaken were freed because the seals on the prison were starting to fade away. So they easily could immerse themselves in whatever faction they wanted. Especially the ones that were masters of compulsion - type of channeling where you basically make mindslaves out of people.

[Narcizo]

I know mine means nothing except that I an suspicious of Jackal.

I think this post ought to dispell any notion that Eagle had something solid to go off. Or he did and he didn't want to tip off the shadows. :p

[Narcizo]

Probably at least one warder in the game likely as a BG with something specific in regards to protecting Aes Sedai. The warder/Aes Sedai bond is huge and that might even be a potential lover.

I was thinking about that - did Eagle have a lover- link that would result in both dying if he was night killed but not if he's lynched? Ultimately I guess it doesn't matter but it would explain him not revealing.

[Narcizo]

Well, I'm trying to decide if I think we had a wolf on the block between the 3 of you or not yesterday. I think we learn a lot with timmae, but I need to look more closely at the vote movement before I commit to thinking there was a distinct effort to save him.

Gut-wise I feel better about voting Zinto.

I never get wolf gut reads at this stage, only village ones. Of course come day four I get nothing but wolf gut reads.

I don't think chasing our tails with votes to clarify day one is the way forward at this stage. You risk wandering down a blind alley. I tend to think that you want to look elsewhere on day two unless something slaps you round the face.

[The Jackal]

I never get wolf gut reads at this stage, only village ones. Of course come day four I get nothing but wolf gut reads.

I don't think chasing our tails with votes to clarify day one is the way forward at this stage. You risk wandering down a blind alley. I tend to think that you want to look elsewhere on day two unless something slaps you round the face.

More along the lines of gut "hm, that was a fishy vote/reasoning", rather than gut "he must be scum".

[The Jackal]

And my vote for timmae right now is mildly half-hearted, but I was also kind of curious to see if it would spur any other movement. Bit early in the day for that, I guess.

[Glengoyne]

Glen has checked in now but no sign of Raven still
Catching up a bit. This will be an odd day for me. I'll be around for a few hours, but then I'm hosting a gameday so will have limited involvement while folks are here.

Now I'll read on.

[Grover]

UNVOTE britrock

While I am still suspicious of him originally jumping on me because everyome jumped off of me on day one, I'm going to take the placeholder vote away for now.

[Coffee Warlord]

And my vote for timmae right now is mildly half-hearted, but I was also kind of curious to see if it would spur any other movement. Bit early in the day for that, I guess.

Nah, I was already the trendsetter, with my earlier comments generating two quick votes on Grover (neither of them mine).

[Narcizo]

Cuh! fonti's changed the lingo round here with her unnatural Mafia- playing ways? It's wolf and village everybody, not scum and town!

[path12]

Cuh! fonti's changed the lingo round here with her unnatural Mafia- playing ways? It's wolf and village everybody, not scum and town!

Ha, I always do a quick double take with that as well.

[Narcizo]

Welp I'm not fantastically enamoured with my Brit vote at the moment but I'm not sure where else to go. I've got a bit over an hour to go but I won't leave my vote hanging by itself.

[path12]

I don't love reading too much into day 1 votes but am looking at the last three on EF. And of those, the unvote of Grover/vote of EF right after I'd put Grover in the lead is the one that bothers me the most.

VOTE THE JACKAL

Not wedded to this and very well may change as the day progresses......especially since he's been helpful in the story background today.

[Glengoyne]

So by my reading of the thread I'm a bit torn.

I could see voting for Grover because if he's a bad guy we get some info.
Or
voting for The Jackal because EF thought it was a good idea and he was our seer, although he likely didn't have a chance to see anything.
My gut is to Britrock, but in my very limited WW experience, my wild ass hunches have amounted to zero.

I'm going to review the vote tracking once more and then I'll get officially on the voting board.

[timmae]

Ok, read back through from the start and here are my thoughts/reads (my notes to myself in parenthesis):

Slight Good – Chief Rum (asking game set questions, weird vote by default early (-), straight reads about gameplay (ef vote)), Path12 (some gameplay questions, good tone overall), Narc (reviewing ruleset and adding thoughts/feedback, hunting), Coffee (good tone, providing thoughts, reading ruleset)

Neutral – Vaimes (early votes both days on me without any explanation, no game reads or thoughts), Raven (no posts other than his arrival), Cheeki (active, trying to read into action/votes, ok tone), Glen (no posts other than his arrival today)

Slight Evil - Britrock (first vote on EF as meta, no other posts day 1), Grover (D1 meta vote, jackal voting pattern, not much content in posts, tone is off), Jackal (unvoted grover after Path added his vote to LL grover, (slight +) for insight into ruleset and gameplay), Zinto (active posts but odd end of day voting), Martin (vote to consolidate as a reasoning, no reads/thoughts)

vote grover

Need to hear more from vaimes, raven and glen though.

[Grover]

My tone is off? Hmm..

[Glengoyne]

On the game state, we're down a seer and Aes Sedai(brown Ajah).

I'm gathering that the warders are somewhat like body guards, possibly only for their sister. Also guessing that they would be somehow limited in their protection.

We've also lost a Tairen who was also a Tinker. I'm thinking that the Tinker and Way of the Leaf goal was an alternate path to winning for the Tinker.

What do we know about the items in play?

[Glengoyne]

Also
VOTE The Jackal

[Glengoyne]

I should also add that I was feeling good about throwing a vote to Cheekimonk because of some of the vote movements yesterday. But after looking back, I see the move to EF and sticking there as a push for a day 1 lynch, which I'm seeing as a good positive indicator

[Narcizo]

This day looks like it might boil down to a Jackal-Grover showdown. I don't like either choice at the moment. I guess wolf-Jackal would post lots of book-related stuff to play friendly wolf but I'm not seeing much on either to warrant narrowing things down.

[Grover]

This day looks like it might boil down to a Jackal-Grover showdown. I don't like either choice at the moment. I guess wolf-Jackal would post lots of book-related stuff to play friendly wolf but I'm not seeing much on either to warrant narrowing things down.

I have to agree with you on the second sentence.

[Glengoyne]

I admit that I don't have anything to go on regarding jackal. Just a touch more willing to vote for jackal than Grover.

[The Jackal]

voting for The Jackal because EF thought it was a good idea and he was our seer, although he likely didn't have a chance to see anything.

I'm to the point where I'm not buying this argument at all. If you want to vote for me because my move from Grover to EF doesn't look great, I get it. I can tell you that it was always my intention to move off Grover, and it sucks that it ended up being a seer who waited until the last minute of the day to reveal.

[The Jackal]

That last post was more to indicate, if I do go down, look at the people who are using spurious reasoning to inflate a reasonable candidate based on vote history.

[The Jackal]

Realizing that it could put me at risk, I'm happy to let you know that I'm an Aes Sedai of the Red Ajah. I'm here to ensure that the world does not end, either at the hands of the shadow or a dragon who has gone insane with power.

[Zinto]

I agree that we shouldn't be narrowed in on two at this point in the day so I will....

[Zinto]

Vote Brit

[Zinto]

Realizing that it could put me at risk, I'm happy to let you know that I'm an Aes Sedai of the Red Ajah. I'm here to ensure that the world does not end, either at the hands of the shadow or a dragon who has gone insane with power.

Interesting. Based on the books I had the Red pegged as the most likely to be the place for the black to hide but I doubt Autumn and Shoveler would make it that easy for us.

[Chief Rum]

Realizing that it could put me at risk, I'm happy to let you know that I'm an Aes Sedai of the Red Ajah. I'm here to ensure that the world does not end, either at the hands of the shadow or a dragon who has gone insane with power.

Hrm...

UNVOTE THE JACKAL

[Chief Rum]

Realizing that it could put me at risk, I'm happy to let you know that I'm an Aes Sedai of the Red Ajah. I'm here to ensure that the world does not end, either at the hands of the shadow or a dragon who has gone insane with power.

EF was Aes Sedai, too. Not sure what that means, but interested to know the implications here.

[Zinto]

I don't necessarily think everyone should be jumping off Jackal because of his reveal. There is still a chance he is in the black ajah.

[Narcizo]

Realizing that it could put me at risk, I'm happy to let you know that I'm an Aes Sedai of the Red Ajah. I'm here to ensure that the world does not end, either at the hands of the shadow or a dragon who has gone insane with power.

Isn't that a bit early for a reveal? Not that it would be particularly wolfy to reveal early. Then again my interpretation of the rules is that a reveal doesn't actually mean much, unfortunately - it's perfectly possible for you to be Red Ajah AND of the shadow, right?

Anyway Zinto has saved me having to move my vote so I shan't. Yay!

[Grover]

Anyone have a vote update?

[The Jackal]

I don't necessarily think everyone should be jumping off Jackal because of his reveal. There is still a chance he is in the black ajah.

Then again my interpretation of the rules is that a reveal doesn't actually mean much, unfortunately - it's perfectly possible for you to be Red Ajah AND of the shadow, right?

Correct, for all you know I could be Black Ajah - but we don't know that that's in the game (although I've speculated it is, because it'd be fun and appropriate) - but I'm not. So, end of the day my reveal isn't anything earth shattering. Just wanted to be forthright, because I know my vote yesterday looks shitty.

[Chief Rum]

I don't necessarily think everyone should be jumping off Jackal because of his reveal. There is still a chance he is in the black ajah.

Definitely a possibility. But for now, I'm content to jump off and re-assess.

[The Jackal]

And if any of the Aes Sedai has the ability to scan for Black Ajah, which I kind of feel like is a real possibility, scan away!

[path12]

Realizing that it could put me at risk, I'm happy to let you know that I'm an Aes Sedai of the Red Ajah. I'm here to ensure that the world does not end, either at the hands of the shadow or a dragon who has gone insane with power.

UNVOTE THE JACKAL

[Chief Rum]

So, The Jackal, what powers do you have which would allow you to achieve your goal?

[path12]

I don't necessarily think everyone should be jumping off Jackal because of his reveal. There is still a chance he is in the black ajah.

Maybe, but I can always go back later. I'm giving the benefit of the doubt for now.

[Chief Rum]

And if any of the Aes Sedai has the ability to scan for Black Ajah, which I kind of feel like is a real possibility, scan away!

I believe we might have lynched him yesterday.

[The Jackal]

I believe we might have lynched him yesterday.

I feel like that scan might have been darkfriend specific (all Black Ajah are darkfriends, but not all darkfriends are Black Ajah), but you are probably right.

[Zinto]

I believe we might have lynched him yesterday.


Yeah none of the other Ajah role descriptions stand out to me as being a seer.

[Narcizo]

So, The Jackal, what powers do you have which would allow you to achieve your goal?

Not sure that needs to be answered - I don't see how that knowledge would benefit the side of light.

[The Jackal]

So, The Jackal, what powers do you have which would allow you to achieve your goal?

Channeling. :D

I don't have any specifically called out powers that will help combat the shadow, unfortunately.

[Narcizo]

unvote Brit
Vote cheeki

Just as guilty of taking the easy route and hasn't explained like Brit did.

[The Jackal]

Not sure that needs to be answered - I don't see how that knowledge would benefit the side of light.

The shadow should fear any Aes Sedai.

[path12]

There are 5 Aes Sedai characters in the game. Each has a different ability depending on their Ajah.

There is exactly 1 Forsaken in the game, and a number of Black Ajah and Darkfriends.



So if I read this right there is one each of the color Ajah's but multiple Black Ajah's? Or just some particular number but not necessarily multiple?

Does a Black Ajah have to be Aes Sedai?

[Chief Rum]

Not sure that needs to be answered - I don't see how that knowledge would benefit the side of light.

It might help us determine if he is telling the truth or not, or he might be able to demonstrate one of these powers.

If he is not Shadow, he is likely dead anyway, unless he has some powers that make him hard to kill.

[The Jackal]

So if I read this right there is one each of the color Ajah's but multiple Black Ajah's? Or just some particular number but not necessarily multiple?

Does a Black Ajah have to be Aes Sedai?

The Black Ajah wouldn't be separate - if it was in the game, one of the sisters in the regular Ajah's would also be Black Ajah. Essentially, appearing to be one of the Red/Blue etc, but truthfully serving the shadow behind the scenes.

[The Jackal]

If he is not Shadow, he is likely dead anyway, unless he has some powers that make him hard to kill.

:cool:

[Chief Rum]

So if I read this right there is one each of the color Ajah's but multiple Black Ajah's? Or just some particular number but not necessarily multiple?

Does a Black Ajah have to be Aes Sedai?

I think a Black Ajah is an Aes Sedai who has chosen to follow the Shadow. They will have another "good" color as well, though. So being a Sedai of a particular color isn't necessarily proof they are not Shadow.

[The Jackal]

I probably should have held off on the reveal because it puts a target on me, but hey, lynching me is a waste of time and I don't exactly see other strong candidates based on what little history we have. Wanted to get discussion going on others as early as I could.

[The Jackal]

Plus, as you can see, nothing in my reveal would be earth shattering enough to convince a bunch of people to change close to deadline, if I ended up finding myself in that situation.

[path12]

I think a Black Ajah is an Aes Sedai who has chosen to follow the Shadow. They will have another "good" color as well, though. So being a Sedai of a particular color isn't necessarily proof they are not Shadow.

OK. So if that is the case if there isn't a counter to his Red Ajah claim that doesn't mean he can't be Black as well. That helps me, thanks.

[The Jackal]

unvote timmae
vote cheeki

[path12]

Now I'm rethinking my strategy of a wolf on the back end of the EF vote. timmae's vote makes sense as defensive and cheekimonk hasn't said anything that strikes me as off.

[Coffee Warlord]

I need to get a vote in within the hour. Not entirely sure where the value is right now.

[path12]

Just because I'd like to hear more from them:

VOTE VAIMES

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote

cheekimonk [3] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), The Jackal (350)
Grover [3] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310)
The Jackal [1] -Glengoyne {313)
Timmae [1] - Vaimes (212)
Britrock88 [1] - Zinto (322)
Vaimes [1] - path12 (353)

[The Jackal]

I saw Raven lurking before, curious to hear some input there. Vaimes too.

[Coffee Warlord]

Hey Autumn, you're missing a timmae vote for Grover in there. Last page.

[Zinto]

Well since Narcizo left and I thought that Grover was still voting for him but isn't I will....

[Zinto]

Unvote Brit

[Grover]

Hey Autumn, you're missing a timmae vote for Grover in there. Last page.

Shh.

[Grover]

Not a huge deal, but I will be away from roughly 4:30 EST to 7:00 EST.

I'll be back then to make a final vote, read through, banter, etc etc

[Coffee Warlord]

Shh.

We live by the law, we die by the law!

[Coffee Warlord]

I'd like to see a third candidate go up here.

[timmae]

Not having a single cast vote from Raven is worrisome. Not sure why he wouldn't have been replaced by now if he hasn't been checking in. I haven't seen this type of play go so late into day 2 but some of the vets may have better takes on this than I.

[Coffee Warlord]

Has he checked in at all?

[Glengoyne]

I'd like to see a third candidate go up here.


This is where I am now. I'm guessing, willing to risk rather, that Jackal isn't both Red and Black, but I'm not sure where to move the vote at this point.

I too will need to get a useful vote in in the next hour or hour and a half. I'm hoping to hear from some of the quieter folks in that time frame.

[Coffee Warlord]

And...since my availability becomes spotty until very close to deadline in about 30 minutes...

I still sort of feel Grover is a good candidate to lynch. That said, we can save that for later, maybe. We don't need a two horse race in day 2, and that's where we are headed. Thusly...I bring you Plan B.

Timmae [4] - vaimes (83), Chief Rum (135), MartinD (151), EagleFan (190)
The Jackal [2] - Zinto (160), fontisian (182)

That's the ending tally yesterday. I'm throwing out the EF vote from yesterday - there's no way all the wolves piled onto one person. I like looking at the Also Rans, particularly on day 1.

If we take a very VERY liberal assumption that Jackal is good. We have one confirmed villager voting for Jackal in font.

We have one confirmed villager in EF voting for Timmae, and a guy I thus far feel okay about in Rum. Vaimes has been too idle to know anything about right now.

That brings me to Martin and Zinto. Neither of them have (in our whole 1 day of incredibly useful information!) made me feel remotely warm and fuzzy, but then, nobody really does. They're both in nicely easy places for a wolf to dump a day 1 vote. That said...

Vote MartinD

[timmae]

fyi I am catching up now.
May be an hour before I know what's going on, but I am here.

This is Raven's only post... I am neutral on him right now but we need to hear more. Raven, please post your thoughts on the first 2 days when possible.

[timmae]

I'll be afk for a bit while I commute home... I'll be back on before lynch.

[Chief Rum]

Has he checked in at all?

He checked in earlier today. He's around. I think he's catching up, as I don't think he noticed the game start yesterday.

[Raven]

Sorry guys, I checked on this every day last week and Sunday night, and it hadn't started yet. Of course the game starts on the day I don't check (yesterday), so I am a day behind. I've read all the posts and am caught up, but work has been extremely busy today, so I haven't been able to really put time into any analysis yet. I'll have some input shortly.

[Chief Rum]

I'm going to piggyback on CW's look at the secondary candidates, and some assumptions we often make about wolves splitting votes and what not, but instead of going with the timmae voters, I will look at The Jackal voters.

Besides, while I get CW's reasoning, I don't view the MartinD vote as a good one to start up, given he is like Narcizo (in Europe) and unlikely to be around until after the deadline.

So looking at The Jackal's Day 1 voters, font was a villager, which leaves Zinto as the possible "wolf" in that scenario. I don't get a bad vibe from Zinto, but I'm not really getting a bad vibe from hardly anyone, so that doesn't really matter.

VOTE ZINTO

[Vaimes]

Sorry, project deadlines are approaching. You know how college life is.

Commencing catch-up.

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote

cheekimonk [3] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), The Jackal (350)
Grover [3] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310)
The Jackal [1] - Glengoyne {313)
Timmae [1] - Vaimes (212)
Vaimes [1] - path12 (353)
MartinD [1] - Coffee warlord (366)
Zinto [1] - Chief Rum (371)

[Glengoyne]

UNVOTE Jackal


So I'm backing off of the Jackal because the reveal seems genuine, and I'm following CW's lead here

Vote MartinD

[Glengoyne]

Hey a lot can happen when you take 15 minutes to type a three line post.

[Raven]

Just wanted to point out the voting changes once the voting got established...

Timmae [4] - vaimes (83), fontisian (84), Chief Rum (135), MartinD (151)
EagleFan [4] - britrock88 (96), Narcizo (113), The Jackal (148), timmae (153)
Grover [3] - Zinto (106), path12 (147), cheekimonk (155)
The Jackal [2] - Coffee Warlord (94), EagleFan (158)
Vaimes [1] - Grover (110)

Zinto unvote Grover, vote The Jackal

Timmae [4] - vaimes (83), fontisian (84), Chief Rum (135), MartinD (151)
EagleFan [4] - britrock88 (96), Narcizo (113), The Jackal (148), timmae (153)
The Jackal [3] - Coffee Warlord (94), EagleFan (158), Zinto(160)
Grover [2] - path12 (147), cheekimonk (155)
Vaimes [1] - Grover (110)

cheekimonk unvote Grover, Vote EagleFan

EagleFan [5] - britrock88 (96), Narcizo (113), The Jackal (148), timmae (153), cheekimonk(163)
Timmae [4] - vaimes (83), fontisian (84), Chief Rum (135), MartinD (151)
The Jackal [3] - Coffee Warlord (94), EagleFan (158), Zinto(160)
Grover [1] - path12 (147)
Vaimes [1] - Grover (110)

Coffee Warlod unvote The Jackal, vote Grover

EagleFan [5] - britrock88 (96), Narcizo (113), The Jackal (148), timmae (153), cheekimonk(163)
Timmae [4] - vaimes (83), fontisian (84), Chief Rum (135), MartinD (151)
Grover [3] - path12 (147), Coffee Warlord (170), Coffee Warlord
The Jackal [2] - EagleFan (158), Zinto(160)
Vaimes [1] - Grover (110)

font unvote Timmae, Vote The Jackal
EagleFan unvote The Jackal, vote Timmae

Both font and EF were good, so their votes don't mean much here. But they simply swapped votes anyway, so the counts remained the same.

EagleFan [5] - britrock88 (96), Narcizo (113), The Jackal (148), timmae (153), cheekimonk (163)
Timmae [4] - vaimes (83), Chief Rum (135), MartinD (151), EagleFan (190)
The Jackal [2] - Zinto (160), fontisian (182)
Grover [2] - path12 (147), Coffee Warlord (170)
Vaimes [1] - Grover (110)


9:00 on the nose
Zinto unvote Jackal vote timmae
This would have made it a tie. In some games it seems that posting on the nose counts, but in this game it does not. So Zinto's vote did not count.

Which would have made it ...
EagleFan [5] - britrock88 (96), Narcizo (113), The Jackal (148), timmae (153), cheekimonk (163)
Timmae [5] - vaimes (83), Chief Rum (135), MartinD (151), EagleFan (190), Zinto
Grover [2] - path12 (147), Coffee Warlord (170)
The Jackal [1] - fontisian (182)
Vaimes [1] - Grover (110)

[britrock88]

(Caught up to here, taxiing for takeoff. See you folks in a couple hours--if my phone battery holds out.)

[Chief Rum]

Really uncomfortable with the MartinD run on so little.

Remember, he's not around until after the deadline. If he is going to be a candidate, I think we should wait until tomorrow when he can chime in and defend himself. I don't want to risk that he might have an important role and not be around to reveal to save himself.

[Chief Rum]

Well, just to clarify, all of our guesses have very little evidence to back them up. I'm just saying maybe we should consider people who will be around these last few hours if we're going to consider third candidates.

[Glengoyne]

And I'm out for a while as well. I've got folks coming over for boardgames today. So I'll be spotty through the end of the night. I'll check back between games.

Tomorrow will be bad as well, we're taking the kids on a train ride up to Sacramento. So It will be inconvenient all day.

[Coffee Warlord]

Ah, I never remember that Martin isn't around in evenings.

With that in mind, I'd be okay with moving on Zinto as well.

[Coffee Warlord]

Though, there he is!

[Raven]

Day 1 Vote

Timmae [4] - vaimes (83), fontisian (84), Chief Rum (135), MartinD (151)
EagleFan [4] - britrock88 (96), Narcizo (113), The Jackal (148), timmae (153)
Grover [4] - Zinto (106), EagleFan (141), path12 (147), cheekimonk (155)
The Jackal [1] - Coffee Warlord (94)
Vaimes [1] - Grover (110)

Yet to Vote: Glengoyne, Raven

EagleFan unvote Grover, vote The Jackal "Going with a hunch here"
Chief points out that he is "putting himself in danger here". Which he is because he is pitting himself vs Timmae and undoing the 3 way tie.

Zinto unvote Grover, vote jackal says "he will follow EF's hunch"
Cheeki unvote Grover, vote EagleFan "I've heard this tune before"

Day 1 Vote

EagleFan [5] - britrock88 (96), Narcizo (113), The Jackal (148), timmae (153), cheekimonk (163)
Timmae [4] - vaimes (83), fontisian (84), Chief Rum (135), MartinD (151)
The Jackal [3] - Coffee Warlord (94), EagleFan (158), Zinto (160)
Grover [1] - path12 (147)
Vaimes [1] - Grover (110)

Yet to Vote: Glengoyne, Raven

Coffee Warlord "Well, this ain't disturbing at all"
"Well, easy way to find out if that means anything. We got enough for a late run?"

Coffee Warlord Unvote Jackal, Vote Grover



I'm skeptical of Coffee Warlord at this point. Yesterday after Zinto and cheeki unvoted Grover and moved to someone else, he says "Well, easy way to find out if that means anything. We got enough for a late run?" and votes for Grover. Today he says "I still sort of feel Grover is a good candidate to lynch. That said, we can save that for later, maybe. We don't need a two horse race in day 2, and that's where we are headed. " and votes MartinD. Leaving things at...

cheekimonk [3] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), The Jackal (350)
Grover [3] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310)
The Jackal [1] - Glengoyne {313)
Timmae [1] - Vaimes (212)
Vaimes [1] - path12 (353)
MartinD [1] - Coffee warlord (366)

Anyone else find this odd?

[Coffee Warlord]

I find it to be completely in line with my lines of thinking. :)

[Raven]

Why? If you suspect him, why wait? What's the point?
You seem to be wasting your vote on MartinD when you already suspect Grover and Grover was at the time tied for the lead.

[Coffee Warlord]

Because I don't believe cementing a 2 horse race on Day 2 is a great idea. I figure it's better to try and get a 3rd person going and see what happens.

Yes, I stll think we get good info in killing Grover. But if we go that route, I'd rather it came with 2 other candidates, not just 1.

[Raven]

vote Grover

[Vaimes]

So Jackal claims that he happens to be in the same clan/group-thing as the dead Seer, and everyone suddenly backs off. Hm.

A Seer typically doesn't get a N0 check, yes? I see people speculating about that but no one knowing for sure, though it sounds like you've played with the role before. So that's a thing.

I think cheekimonk is town, I can go back and find the post that pinged me if anyone wants to see it but right now I can't be bothered.

Unvote
Vote Grover

[Raven]

btw, while I'm confused by CW's actions, if he is indeed protecting Grover then my vote for Grover is just as effective as voting for CW.

[Coffee Warlord]

Dance, puppets, dance!

[Zinto]

I probably don't move off Grover if I am a wolf. What is the point? It is much easier to stay put and draw no attention to myself.

[cheekimonk]

unvote Brit
Vote cheeki

Just as guilty of taking the easy route and hasn't explained like Brit did.

I made sure to explain all of my votes yesterday and have been analyzing the game since. If you mean today, I parked my vote this morning and have had meetings this afternoon, but I was very active analyzing the game this morning. I even claimed my faction for whatever that's worth. Maybe I'm misunderstanding "easy route"? Still feeling my way through this...

[Zinto]

I am about to vote for Cheeki but I am going to reread his posts first. It is turning into a mini runaway on Grover and I don't see any reason for that to be the case

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote

Grover [5] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310), Raven (387), Vaimes (388)
cheekimonk [3] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), The Jackal (350)
MartinD [2] - Coffee warlord (366), Glengoyne (374)
Vaimes [1] - path12 (353)
Zinto [1] - Chief Rum (371)

[Zinto]

It is closer than I thought it was. For some reason I thought Vaimes was on Cheeki before switching to Grover

[Zinto]

Vote cheekimonk

[Zinto]

Nothing about cheekimonk's posts swing me one way or another. I would rather make this close heading down the stretch and see where the chips fall.

[cheekimonk]

Well, I wasn't 100% sold on Grover but I'm blocked onto him now.

[Zinto]

For meta reasons Martin and Vaimes get a pass from me today. This is the first game I have played with them(their first games?) and as much as I would like to see more posts from both of them I am willing to give them today as they get into the swing of things.

[timmae]

I made sure to explain all of my votes yesterday and have been analyzing the game since. If you mean today, I parked my vote this morning and have had meetings this afternoon, but I was very active analyzing the game this morning. I even claimed my faction for whatever that's worth. Maybe I'm misunderstanding "easy route"? Still feeling my way through this...

Cheeks... I missed this. What did you claim? Working off of smartphone at the moment.

[timmae]

Raven, no worries about being out yesterday... Hoping for your thoughts here on out.

[Chief Rum]

I am going to be at the second job shortly after 4 p.m. PDT here, and I don't want to be on a candidate who is not in the race (at least as of right now).

UNVOTE ZINTO
VOTE CHEEKIMONK

[Chief Rum]

I don't really have a feel for cheeki or Grover just yet. I actually feel a little bit better about cheeki but not enough to take that too much into consideration. So I went with evening up the vote count.

[cheekimonk]

Cheeks... I missed this. What did you claim? Working off of smartphone at the moment.

Aiel. I made the comment that EF jumping to you at the last minute was dishonorable which, as Aiel, I can't abide.

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote

Grover [5] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310), Raven (387), Vaimes (388)
cheekimonk [5] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), The Jackal (350), Zinto (396), Chief Rum (402)
MartinD [2] - Coffee warlord (366), Glengoyne (374)
Vaimes [1] - path12 (353)

[The Jackal]

Dance, puppets, dance!

Eh?

[The Jackal]

And, I might add, a dishonorable move to timmae at the last minute. Something the Aiel do not abide.

Didn't realize this was a faction reveal - but that isn't necessarily a point in your favor, we've all got a faction.

[Glengoyne]

Ok. I now see that Martin isn't around. So I've got to jump into the fire with both feet.

UNVOTE MARTIND

VOTE GROVER

Sorry those arent bold. Using my tablet.

[Coffee Warlord]

Eh?

Me being me.

[The Jackal]

Use [ B ] and [ /B ] without the spaces to bold stuff manually.

[cheekimonk]

Didn't realize this was a faction reveal - but that isn't necessarily a point in your favor, we've all got a faction.

That's why I said "for whatever it's worth." If I had a role I might claim it at this point, but I'm vanilla.

[The Jackal]

'cause, I don't think they'll accept non-bolded votes.

[The Jackal]

That's why I said "for whatever it's worth." If I had a role I might claim it at this point, but I'm vanilla.

Fair enough - I certainly don't disparage the forthrightness.

[The Jackal]

Curious to hear what Grover has to say when he gets back to the thread

[cheekimonk]

Got to step away and may not be back by deadline. My vote is pinned on Grover due to my situation, but he's one of 2 I suspect anyway so it'll do.

[Autumn]

Ok. I now see that Martin isn't around. So I've got to jump into the fire with both feet.

UNVOTE MARTIND

VOTE GROVER

Sorry those arent bold. Using my tablet.

If you can't bold on the tablet, we'll accept that. I know it's a pain typing on those things.

[The Jackal]

unvote cheeki
vote grover

[The Jackal]

If you can't bold on the tablet, we'll accept that. I know it's a pain typing on those things.

Wise, benevolent rulers.

[The Jackal]

Believe that makes it 7-4 for grover

[The Jackal]

I keep thinking that off topic post getting bumped says WW Buffs, but alas

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote

Grover [7] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310), Raven (387), Vaimes (388), Glengoyne (408), The Jackal (417)
cheekimonk [4] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), Zinto (396), Chief Rum (402)
MartinD [1] - Coffee warlord (366)
Vaimes [1] - path12 (353)

[Coffee Warlord]

To answer you again Raven. What you see happening here is why I wanted another candidate.

[EagleFan]

:popcorn:

[Grover]

I would really like some solid evidence on why the voting is going this way? What exactly have I done to raise such suspicions?

[Grover]

Is the deadline 9PM once again?

[The Jackal]

Is the deadline 9PM once again?

Yeah, it's in the title.

[Grover]

I see five votes on me with ONLY timmae making a statement that I could possibly be a wolf. It was a hunch. Not one of the rest of you have made a point against me.

I'm curious to see why it's okay for glen to take his vote off Martin because he's not around, when I didn't change my vote yesterday when I wasn't around and people tried to turn that into an issue today.

Is absence guilt? Then why aren't we also considering Martin as a potential wolf.

Raven has said nothing all game. He's somewhat active and his silence in this game is speaking volumes to me. Not to mention some piling on to past me cheekimonk. Who also seems to be piling on in here.

I can promise you that I am a village and I will fight this attempted witchunt with the ferocity and flame of one of our supposed dragons.

[Grover]

Seven votes, not five.

[The Jackal]

unvote Jackal
vote tim

Has anyone asked why you tried to pull this vote right at the deadline? Have you explained it?

[The Jackal]

unvote grover
vote zinto

[The Jackal]

This is partially why I revealed early, seems like it's been a bit of a dead crowd as it gets closer to deadline. I know we've got a couple people who are asleep and now CR at his job and yesterday Grover was out and I was stupid.. adds up.

[britrock88]

It's true that we can be hindered as people go away around deadline. (I wouldn't be on now if it weren't for public transit.)

[britrock88]

Not exactly a deep observation, but I would agree that this seems to be a fairly lazy day of hunting.

[Grover]

This is partially why I revealed early, seems like it's been a bit of a dead crowd as it gets closer to deadline. I know we've got a couple people who are asleep and now CR at his job and yesterday Grover was out and I was stupid.. adds up.

Which is making it hard to make my case.

Thank you for your faith in me, however.

[britrock88]

If Grover turns up good, we should look at stuck early votes (implicating myself again :p ) tomorrow.

[britrock88]

And Grover, if you have an important part to play in this universe, now's the time to tell us what it is.

[Grover]

I've already told you...

[The Jackal]

Which is making it hard to make my case.

Thank you for your faith in me, however.

I don't necessarily have faith, but I'm not sold on you by any means. Personal problem is that if you end up being bad and I'm not on you, plus moved an early D1 vote off of you people are going to make an even stronger case that we're on a wolf team. So you better be good.

I don't think there's much of a case for you, that said. Not much of a case for anyone on D2 but the votes for you seem easy.

[Grover]

Like I said, I'm just a villager. I may not be all that important in the long run, but I can certainly help win this game if left alive after tonight.

[The Jackal]

but I can certainly help win this game if left alive after tonight.

With analysis? Or are you contradicting that you are vanilla?

[The Jackal]

Nevermind, I thought you said vanilla in your earlier post but you said "village" - so sounds like you're saying you aren't vanilla.

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote

Grover [6] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310), Raven (387), Vaimes (388), Glengoyne (408)
cheekimonk [4] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), Zinto (396), Chief Rum (402)
MartinD [1] - Coffee warlord (366)
Vaimes [1] - path12 (353)
Zinto [1] - The Jackal (430)

[Raven]

Raven has said nothing all game. He's somewhat active and his silence in this game is speaking volumes to me. Not to mention some piling on to past me cheekimonk. Who also seems to be piling on in here.

I've explained why I wasn't around. I didn't even know the game started until early afternoon today. I've added some input to try and make up for that.

My vote for you isn't about anything you did, but more about what others did involving you. The late vote changes last night off of you and my suspicion of CW- all are centered around you. I won't know if any of that is solid evidence unless we find out about you first.

[The Jackal]

unvote zinto

[The Jackal]

vote cheeki

[The Jackal]

Hm, do you not have a vote out Grover?

[Grover]

I do not.

[The Jackal]

Looks like it, in which case staying on cheeki would be risky as you could create a tie.

[Grover]

It's a chance I'm probably going to have to take.

[The Jackal]

Well, I wouldn't let that happen. Possibly lynching neither of you is probably worse than the risk of lynching a person without reveal-worthy powers to gain voting info.

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote

Grover [6] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310), Raven (387), Vaimes (388), Glengoyne (408)
cheekimonk [5] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), Zinto (396), Chief Rum (402), The Jackal (445)
MartinD [1] - Coffee warlord (366)
Vaimes [1] - path12 (353)

[Grover]

Are you suggesting that if I vote for cheek, you'll switch to me?

[Coffee Warlord]

Unvote Martin
Vote Grover

[Coffee Warlord]

If it's between you and cheek, I pick you. Sorry.

[The Jackal]

Are you suggesting that if I vote for cheek, you'll switch to me?

If it had come to close to the deadline and no one else voted for cheek/another candidate didn't get raised. I wouldn't do it as an automatic response to you voting for cheek, I assume you'll vote for cheek in self-defense.

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote

Grover [7] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310), Raven (387), Vaimes (388), Glengoyne (408), Coffee Warlord (453)
cheekimonk [5] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), Zinto (396), Chief Rum (402), The Jackal (445)
Vaimes [1] - path12 (353)

[Grover]

vote cheekimonk

What else can I do?

I feel the light flickering out in this world. First the Seer. I feel like young Thomas watching Roland from behind the eyes of Roland's pride. Helpless. I am who those eyes belong to.

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote

Grover [7] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310), Raven (387), Vaimes (388), Glengoyne (408), Coffee Warlord (453)
cheekimonk [6] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), Zinto (396), Chief Rum (402), The Jackal (445), Grover (457)
Vaimes [1] - path12 (353)

[path12]

Shit. I don't like either of them as bad. But need to prevent a tie possibility.

UNVOTE VAIMES
VOTE GROVER

Sorry dude. Have to play the numbers.

[Grover]

I have the potential to be the dragon if I can find the horn. I am part of the light.

Do not lose the Seer and myself in two nights. It would be catastrophic.

[The Jackal]

vote cheekimonk

What else can I do?

I feel the light flickering out in this world. First the Seer. I feel like young Thomas watching Roland from behind the eyes of Roland's pride. Helpless. I am who those eyes belong to.

Hmm. This is a dragon reference. It's from the Stephen King book Eyes of the Dragon, where Thomas who's the son of the King Roland, watches him hidden in a corridor behind the eyes/skull of a dragon.

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote

Grover [8] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310), Raven (387), Vaimes (388), Glengoyne (408), Coffee Warlord (453), path12 (459)
cheekimonk [6] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), Zinto (396), Chief Rum (402), The Jackal (445), Grover (457)

[Grover]

Jackal's reference is correct. You must shift your votes off of me, even if cheeki ends up being vanilla.

[The Jackal]

I have the potential to be the dragon if I can find the horn. I am part of the light.

Do not lose the Seer and myself in two nights. It would be catastrophic.

In the book, both the light and shadow sought the horn of valere. And in the book, it does not make anyone the dragon, but instead summons dead heroes to fight in the last battle.

[The Jackal]

He could be lying, but I wouldn't be surprised if the Dragon started out dormant. It's a risk we probably shouldn't take..

[Coffee Warlord]

I find it moderately hard to believe that a specific person has to get one specific item to become a major character in the game, to be honest.

[Grover]

If I'm lying my self-preservation would save me for one day. It would not be worth it.

[The Jackal]

I find it moderately hard to believe that a specific person has to get one specific item to become a major character in the game, to be honest.

I agree. Also it seems weird, mechanic-wise, based on the actual story. I'm not sure they would have taken liberties like that.

[Grover]

Then I'm sorry for all of you. The wolves have won if I get hung tonight.

[The Jackal]

In fact, if any item would make someone the Dragon, I would think it is Callandor - the sword which only he is said can remove from the Stone (fortress, basically) of Tear.

[timmae]

Is cheeki telling the truth? The aeil are dragon fighters also it seems... Gonna stay on Grover.

[The Jackal]

If anyone else is around and would care to comment that'd be super

[Coffee Warlord]

In fact, if any item would make someone the Dragon, I would think it is Callandor - the sword which only he is said can remove from the Stone (fortress, basically) of Tear.

Yep. Even the description in the rules make that far more likely than the Horn, even ignoring book canon.

[The Jackal]

Is cheeki telling the truth? The aeil are dragon fighters also it seems... Gonna stay on Grover.

Cheek's Aiel reveal has no real bearing. But that brings up a good point.. what faction are you, Grover?

[Grover]

I am Illian. I am seeking the horn of valere and I can become the dragon reborn. I am for the light.

[Grover]

Do not lynch me.

[The Jackal]

I could see there being multiple people with the potential to become the Dragon, as a rule twist, certainly.

[Grover]

There's nothing else I can say to defend myself. I have laid it bare.

The wolves have won.

[The Jackal]

There's nothing else I can say to defend myself. I have laid it bare.

The wolves have won.

I kind of doubt the game would be over with a D2 lynch

[path12]

If anyone else is around and would care to comment that'd be super

I don't know the lore so feel I can't contribute much but


Callandor

This crystal sword is not meant for sword fighting, but instead is a type of angreal, made in the time of legend and of amazing power. It could be quite a boon to a male channeler who holds it, but it is locked away and guarded with many wards in the hands of the people of Tear. It is said only the Dragon can take it from there, but it could be of great use to any male channeler come the Last Battle.


Makes me think no.

[Grover]

Not over, but insurmountable after today.

[Grover]

Good luck.

[Shoveler]

DEADLINE

[Coffee Warlord]

Be a wolf, be a wolf, be a wolf.

[Shoveler]

Day 2 Vote (Final)


Grover [7] - cheekimonk (258), MartinD (259), timmae (310), Raven (387), Vaimes (388), Glengoyne (408), Coffee Warlord (453), path12 (459)
cheekimonk [7] - britrock88 (248), Narcizo (340), Zinto (396), Chief Rum (402), The Jackal (445), Grover (457)

[Coffee Warlord]

Please tell me the 7/7 is a typo.

[path12]

I feel like I spend so much time wandering around blindly in these games.

[timmae]

Voting mechanic maybe???!

[path12]

Please tell me the 7/7 is a typo.

Uh oh.

[Autumn]

You have erred in your search for the Shadow before, and innocent people have paid the price. You hesitate to make the same mistake again, and it shows, with the calls for Grover’s head nearly identical with those who call for Cheekimonk to be lynched. But in the end it is Grover who must face judgement--or is it? Instead it seems the vote is a tie, the nations divided and unable to come to a decision. It is decided that if the decision is not clear, it is safer to make no decision at all. There is no lynch.

[timmae]

We broke shoveler...

[Autumn]

Night 2 will end at 9:59 PM EST. Put any night actions in before then.

[Grover]

Holy crap. Thank you to whoever somehow saved my ass.

[The Jackal]

Interesting.

[timmae]

If both at truthful then we dodged a bad lynch there!!

[Coffee Warlord]

For fuck's sake.

[The Jackal]

Holy crap. Thank you to whoever somehow saved my ass.

Hm. My initial thought was this was a wolf play designed to either take down two villagers or have a no lynch, either of which could theoretically benefit.

With the tie mechanic unknown it would've been a curious move for a good person to make.

[Coffee Warlord]

How are we supposed to find wolves without murdering innocents? HOW?!!?

[timmae]

Yep, rule set points to a 50/50 I think on ties.

[The Jackal]

Any book related questions anyone wants to ask in case I get offed? ;)