Kershaw and Trout regressing?

[underdog13]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

I don't know, but there have been people saying training on Auto doesn't work properly and causes players to regress.

Training on auto works perfectly fine. If you don't like what the cpu is doing train them yourself.

[24]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

On a somewhat related note, for those who've simmed far ahead, did you see any notable records broken?

[Cavicchi]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

You've been the only one making that claim and yes I've read the whole thread.

The claim was that because you weren't manually training them they were regressing. Not that there was a problem with training.

You have been the only one to make that claim.

From page one with two different posts:

"Sounds to me like this training business is something that needs reworking, can you simply turn it off?"

"You still HAVE to train players and you shouldn't be setting it to Auto because the system will train players in stupid areas like they'll train a 1B in Arm Strength or something, or they'll train a pitcher in arm strength and arm accuracy."

[seanjeezy]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

I've mentioned this before but I think we would be much more understanding of major regression if we were given a plausible reason why. So if I received an email like this:

"Mike Trout suffered a grade 3 hamstring injury, he will be out for a few months and he most likely will be affected by it for the rest of his career."

And the accompanying result was -20 in speed, I wouldn't even bat an eye because the reduction in speed is perfectly understandable.

I'm struggling to find names of superstars who dropped off the map and not because of an injury or old (old) age. Only guys I can think of are Andruw Jones and Tim Lincecum.

[Cavicchi]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

I've mentioned this before but I think we would be much more understanding of major regression if we were given a plausible reason why. So if I received an email like this:

"Mike Trout suffered a grade 3 hamstring injury, he will be out for a few months and he most likely will be affected by it for the rest of his career."

And the accompanying result was -20 in speed, I wouldn't even bat an eye because the reduction in speed is perfectly understandable.

I'm struggling to find names of superstars who dropped off the map and not because of an injury or old (old) age. Only guys I can think of are Andruw Jones and Tim Lincecum.

Looks to me like Jones started to regress when 30 years old. He was not a player hitting for average, power was his forte, and until 2007 he was fairly consistent over 30 home runs a year.

[Knight165]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

I've mentioned this before but I think we would be much more understanding of major regression if we were given a plausible reason why. So if I received an email like this:

"Mike Trout suffered a grade 3 hamstring injury, he will be out for a few months and he most likely will be affected by it for the rest of his career."

And the accompanying result was -20 in speed, I wouldn't even bat an eye because the reduction in speed is perfectly understandable.

I'm struggling to find names of superstars who dropped off the map and not because of an injury or old (old) age. Only guys I can think of are Andruw Jones and Tim Lincecum.

Maybe you're too young.....but since I was a little more "worried" about things like this a while ago....

Howard Johnson....led the league in HR's in '91 and never would hit more than 10 again.....the "hot" 3B of the time.
Brady Anderson...50 HR's in '96....never 25 again after that.
Travis Lee....22 HR's in his rookie year.....#2 pick can't miss...definitely gonna hit 40 HR's per.....meh....

I could go on....but I don't think you're trying hard enough.
...and you brought it up yourself.... if we were saying this 3 years ago when Lincecum was "the beast".....you guys would be all up in arms...!

You need to look no further than that!


M.K.
Knight165

[Cavicchi]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

Maybe you're too young.....but since I was a little more "worried" about things like this a while ago....

Howard Johnson....led the league in HR's in '91 and never would hit more than 10 again.....the "hot" 3B of the time.
Brady Anderson...50 HR's in '96....never 25 again after that.
Travis Lee....22 HR's in his rookie year.....#2 pick can't miss...definitely gonna hit 40 HR's per.....meh....

I could go on....but I don't think you're trying hard enough.
...and you brought it up yourself.... if we were saying this 3 years ago when Lincecum was "the beast".....you guys would be all up in arms...!

You need to look no further than that!


M.K.
Knight165

Except for Lincecum, would you call them superstars comparable to Trout? Baseball analysts calling them best overall player in the game? I don't remember them as superstars and I'm old enough. but maybe my memory has failed me.

Lincecum was a power pitcher who lost speed on his fastball.

[seanjeezy]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

Maybe you're too young.....but since I was a little more "worried" about things like this a while ago....

Howard Johnson....led the league in HR's in '91 and never would hit more than 10 again.....the "hot" 3B of the time.
Brady Anderson...50 HR's in '96....never 25 again after that.
Travis Lee....22 HR's in his rookie year.....#2 pick can't miss...definitely gonna hit 40 HR's per.....meh....

I could go on....but I don't think you're trying hard enough.
...and you brought it up yourself.... if we were saying this 3 years ago when Lincecum was "the beast".....you guys would be all up in arms...!

You need to look no further than that!


M.K.
Knight165

I would never consider HoJo a superstar though Knight, he had one MVP caliber season and a decent run for 5 years. Same thing with Brady Anderson (roids) and I'm not sure why you brought up Travis Lee because this isn't about potential, its about established superstars heavily regressing during what is supposed to be their prime. Its not about one year wonders because there are plenty of those, I specifically looked for established names with sustained success and Jones and Lincecum are the results.

The funny thing though is that the more I look into it, the more I see a rational explanation for Jones' and Lincecum's declines. Apparently Jones was dealing with nagging injuries all through the mid to late 2000's and they eventually took away his greatest asset (defense). Lincecum has lost a significant amount of velocity and never learned to adjust like Felix did.

So to reiterate: Give me an explanation for the decline and I couldn't care less. No explanation and I start to wonder why it is happening.

This post is basically turning into a franchise whishlist at this point but I really want to see these things incorporated:

- Nagging injuries
- Proper aging curves based on player type
- Injuries affecting ratings
- Notifications/explanations for progression/regression, with real world scenarios

Add these and I'll never question regression/progression again.

[tabarnes19_SDS]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

My question is everyone is stating trout is regressing. How many sims have you seen this?

I have seen him start to decline at age 26 ONCE! Every other sim has been when he was much older.

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[geisterhome]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

Regression is much different than last year. Last year it was predictable trout would regress in 6 years. I have run sims where he is a 99 10 years later, others where he regresses at different ages. It is very dynamic this year.

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I asked Luis if any changes were made to regression from the ps3 to the ps4 and he says there were not. I have simmed about 20 different seasons and have seen different career paths of players.

I have a few saves where trout is 31 and still a 99, one where he started to regress at 26, most the regression starts later.

It is so fluid, I don't really know what it is tied to, could be streaks, but I do like it, like knight posted above, that is one test comparison and you can see there are differences in where players end up. Before we knew player x would regress to 71 after the first season and player y would progress to a 98 after 3,seasons. That is no longer true.


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Ok it is more fluid but it wasn't quite as static as you are claiming it was last year either, definitely not.

[Knight165]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

I would never consider HoJo a superstar though Knight, he had one MVP caliber season and a decent run for 5 years. Same thing with Brady Anderson (roids) and I'm not sure why you brought up Travis Lee because this isn't about potential, its about established superstars heavily regressing during what is supposed to be their prime. Its not about one year wonders because there are plenty of those, I specifically looked for established names with sustained success and Jones and Lincecum are the results.

The funny thing though is that the more I look into it, the more I see a rational explanation for Jones' and Lincecum's declines. Apparently Jones was dealing with nagging injuries all through the mid to late 2000's and they eventually took away his greatest asset (defense). Lincecum has lost a significant amount of velocity and never learned to adjust like Felix did.

So to reiterate: Give me an explanation for the decline and I couldn't care less. No explanation and I start to wonder why it is happening.

This post is basically turning into a franchise whishlist at this point but I really want to see these things incorporated:

- Nagging injuries
- Proper aging curves based on player type
- Injuries affecting ratings
- Notifications/explanations for progression/regression, with real world scenarios

Add these and I'll never question regression/progression again.

So just to reiterate....

You only care about that info on SUPERSTARS right?....because I just showed you it could happen without reason on "regular" players(I still don't consider Trout an ESTABLISHED superstar.....hyped?...probable?...but established?..not yet..but I digress

...and I don't care that the reason that Lincecum is struggling IRL is because he lost a little off his fastball...
The fact that he HAS lost something...w/o injury and is struggling is proof that it can indeed happen.
Or are we just going to ignore it?

I say....if this thread was put in a time machine to a few years ago...and we replaced the name Trout or Kershaw with Lincecum.....the same arguments would be happening.
What would you then be saying if I drudged the thread up today?

....also giester...it wasn't static. It was RIGID.

M.K.
Knight165

[geisterhome]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

....also giester...it wasn't static. It was RIGID.

M.K.
Knight165

Hehe, well knight it was not totally rigid. but maybe we define the word differently

[Chetballard]

Re: Kershaw and Trout regressing?

So instead of making other post, I will ask here. So Bronson Arroyo is 37 but 4-2 with a 3.79 era in my season. In late May in my season, did not sim any games.

I know Arroyo is 37 and that's old for MLB. But his ratings droped fast and droped his overall to a 71 . I do know for sure he has droped about -9 -10 points in two months of baseball. I just want to know I know he is old, but is that too high of a drop in two months. He has a 2 yr contract, and I got no use for him anymore after ratings drop.He is still going down and will be low to mid 60's by end of season or worse