Do players regress a lot in franchise again this year?

[Tweeg]

Re: Do players regress a lot in franchise again this year?

This is something that would be irrelevant if we could either hide ratings or have everything on a 2-8 scale.

Imagine the guy above tearing it up with Zobrist and simply enjoying it for what it is. Right now he has to stare at those declining numbers regardless of the performance. Without ratings, or on a 2-8 scale, you would judge on outcomes - planning for a decline in future production.

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[TheWarmWind]

Re: Do players regress a lot in franchise again this year?

I don't disagree with you KBlover. Regression is a tough thing to get right. I guess I just don't appreciate how little influence I as a player can have over it.

How about making curves editable in the player edit screen? I think most players I'd want it to be random but there are a few that I would like to make sure have a long, slow regression. There may even be a few who I would speed up (e.g. fireballers who rely on their velocity).

I know I can simulate that by constantly editing the players in question, but that can get tedious and annoying, and is also tough to balance.

[Unlucky 13]

Re: Do players regress a lot in franchise again this year?

This is something that would be irrelevant if we could either hide ratings or have everything on a 2-8 scale.

Imagine the guy above tearing it up with Zobrist and simply enjoying it for what it is. Right now he has to stare at those declining numbers regardless of the performance. Without ratings, or on a 2-8 scale, you would judge on outcomes - planning for a decline in future production.

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I rarely enjoy anything in the moment

Honestly, I enjoy planning for the future as much or more than what's happening right now. Thats true for video games as much as real life. I'm also not an "outcome based" guy. In real life, I take the long view and look at all of the information, not just the end result.

I want and need to know as much as I can about how a player is trending. While it would be awesome and add a level of intrigue if the quality of our GM and scouts could effect how accurate those ratings are, that's not a system that we have yet.

[Tweeg]

Re: Do players regress a lot in franchise again this year?

I rarely enjoy anything in the moment

Honestly, I enjoy planning for the future as much or more than what's happening right now. Thats true for video games as much as real life. I'm also not an "outcome based" guy. In real life, I take the long view and look at all of the information, not just the end result.

I want and need to know as much as I can about how a player is trending. While it would be awesome and add a level of intrigue if the quality of our GM and scouts could effect how accurate those ratings are, that's not a system that we have yet.

I think all of us franchise guys love planning for the future and looking at long term player curves. What I mean is, without ratings displayed, you would probably be thinking, "I know he has to start regressing at this age, but man he's playing so well." You start to think about another year of good production. But now, you see it everywhere - big red negative numbers and OH NO a lower overall! Once you see all that negative, real production goes out the window.

I just think it would be great to someday have the 2-8 or hidden rating scale. Approaching a 34 year old free agent that still has great production would be at least considered. Now, you just see that overall number and don't even think about it.

[elbomberoloco]

Re: Do players regress a lot in franchise again this year?

It's better than it has been in past years, but this game still hates players over 35.

I'm in the 2017 season and despite being one of the best players in the league performance wise, Jose Bautista's ratings are melting. Two months in and at least a -4 in every category (except drag bunts for some reason he's +4, which is dumb he's never even attempted a drag bunt).

This game is in desperate need of a revamp of the progression/regression system. I'm not sure I have a better solution but as it stands right now there I would be stupid to go after any 34+ year old in free agency. I know that their attributes will drop like flies.

I skimmed 15 years and then jumped in, so far through two FA periods the vast majority of FA's are over 35 with one or two under 30 and demanding max payout. There are maybe 2-3 under 25 guys that are C or better to fill the ranks with. So if you take over a team that has had less than stellar drafts you might be up the creek in meeting the GM goals...

[KBLover]

Re: Do players regress a lot in franchise again this year?

I just think it would be great to someday have the 2-8 or hidden rating scale. Approaching a 34 year old free agent that still has great production would be at least considered. Now, you just see that overall number and don't even think about it.

Eh - I don't care about OVR. I still use Eric Davis, Jr. in my franchise even though he's a 70. He has defense, he has speed, he can still hit for average. Good enough for a bench spot.

Chris Davis' OVR has been in gradual fall for a couple seasons now. He still has 80 Contact and 99 Power vs RHP. That OVR could be 75/A as far as I'm concerned if he keeps those ratings.

[KBLover]

Re: Do players regress a lot in franchise again this year?

I don't disagree with you KBlover. Regression is a tough thing to get right. I guess I just don't appreciate how little influence I as a player can have over it.

IMO, if we franchise folks want realism...I think that's part of the package we need to accept, not having control over what happens to the player abilities.

I bet real teams lament not having control or watching a good player gradually get worse. It's also why like I said earlier that there's a line of thought regarding older players and not going long term with them.

It's easier to keep an Ortiz since he's already yours and you know how he is and he's still killing it. Just like it's easier for me to keep my 35-y/o Chris Davis. If I saw him on the FA pool, I might just offer him one year, but since I know I can hit with him and he's clinging to his Con/Pwr (even to the detriment of everything else, and, like Ortiz, he's a 1B/DH type now, so he doesn't NEED anything but his bat), it's easier for me to say - keep him, even until he's 38, maybe 40.

Editable curves would be fine. Baseball Mogul's system allowed you to edit them. I also agree with editing in general. Because...why not?

I'm just thinking if we're talking about realistic decline phases from players and them happening even if they are currently playing well, then I think less control is part of that bargain because a team really has NO control. Players themselves only have limited control.

To me, what was brought up with the Zobrist example is a realistic dilemma/choice teams have to face, ratings visible or no, not a failing of the progression/decline system or the fact ratings are viewable or on such a fine scale (players can always not care about 4 points, but only about 10-15, etc).

After all, it's not like a team can't see a 36-year-old gamer isn't starting to slow down, isn't having to work harder to do what he's always been able to do, or not doing it quite as well (subtle signs, more slumps, etc). Ratings are just number representations of that anyway.

If Zobrist is 36 and performing well in-spite of his ratings falling, that's like him performing well in-spite of his actual skills/tools degrading.

Now the team can decide to let him go because he's just going to get worse from here, most likely. Hold on to him as long as the stats are fine, maybe just diminish his role some or lessen playing time. You also have the "eye-test", how he's playing in your games. And then you make a judgement over whether it's just "good luck and won't last" or "he can still play for us, let's hold on if the contract number looks right" (which it might if his OVR is dropping since that's a driver in salary demand, imo).

I think that's as realistic a scenario as Zobrist losing very little at 36. He could be like Ortiz, etc. Or he could feel his age but fight through it, or maybe he won't be able to go on.


Edit: Performance is a factor now. Perhaps that's one reason why Davis is still maintaining his hitting ratings, because he's still destroying pitching (.300+ average with 34 HR in August and .900+ OPS). So it seems like it CAN help...just not a sure thing...which is realistic, imo.

[joshopsu]

Re: Do players regress a lot in franchise again this year?

I usually manage it while doing 30-team control. Every 2-3 months in a season, I will look thru and sort each teams' players by age. Let's use Verlander as an example. If he loses about 8 points in each category, I will manually add 4 points back to each category. This helps me slow down the regressions and I don't mind doing it for peace of mind.

[elbomberoloco]

Re: Do players regress a lot in franchise again this year?

Alright thanks guys

It's fine if they slip a little but an age 32 Harper should still be one of the best in the league

I have a 39 yr old Harper, 78 OVR, on the bench coming in and crushing the ball when need be and for relatively cheap, compared to other player with similar batting stats. His speed and fielding attributes have pretty much tanked but he's not collecting a check for that...