MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

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  • countryboy
    Growing pains
    • Sep 2003
    • 52723

    #1

    MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

    First and foremost, let's please keep this thread civil. I don't want this turning into a thread where issues with '17 are brought in and harped upon. They have their own threads for discussion.

    Next, I want it to be known that I am thoroughly enjoying '17. This is in no way an attempt to bash the game nor the devs. It's just an observation.

    Last night I was having a discussion with a friend about '17 and some of the "issues" that were present in the game so far. Some I've experienced and others that I haven't. But we were just talking about how this year's game felt different than '16. Granted a lot of that probably has to do with the new ball physics and new player quirks, and so on, but still something just felt different about this year's game. He made a mention that he was becoming frustrated with '17 and thought about going back to '16 for the time being.

    After hearing that and our discussion, I thought, I'm going to pop in '16 and play a game or two, just to do a little experiment if you will. Just see if our feelings were "correct/justified".

    Well, after playing two games of '16 last night, I have to admit that there is a difference between the two. What that difference is, or translates to, I'm not sure. But whether correct or not, '16 just felt more "natural" to me. Now this could be very well because '16 is very similar to the baseball games that I have played my entire life, and didn't consist of the new ball physics which have undoubtedly changed baseball games. Maybe I'm just not used to the impact that the new ball physics have on the game. And that very well could be. But to say that '16 didn't feel "better" to me than '17 would be a lie.

    As I said, it felt "natural". Nothing felt forced, which sometimes I feel happens in '17. Playing '16 I felt that hits were earned whereas in '17 it feels that hits just happen at times to happen. '17 feels more offensive, whereas '16 feels more balanced. Again, this all may be due to me having to get used to something different (ball physics) which didn't exist in this magnitude in the 30+ years that I've been playing baseball games.

    But after playing '16 for again 2 games last night after playing 50 or so of '17, I came away with the feeling that '17 needs a bit more fine tuning to accommodate the new ball physics and player quirks. '17 just feels, well a bit unbalanced. Again, I'm not saying this to slam '17 or call it a horrible baseball game, or anything of the like, just pointing out an opinion as to the different feels between the two games in a year's time.

    Please note that all games played on '17 and '16 were played with the exact same settings, HOF across the board with no slider changes.

    And yes I know that I can adjust sliders on '17 to try and "balance" the game to my liking, but to be honest, I hate adjusting sliders. I feel that once you start changing them, you are continuously playing the game to see that your sliders are providing the outcome that you desire instead of playing the game to play the game.

    Now what does all this mean? I don't know. Am I giving up on '17 and going back to '16? I don't think so, but again I don't know. But this was an interesting experiment. I was generally surprised that I was able to enjoy '16 as much as I did after having played '17, and even more surprised that it seemed to play a better game of baseball at this point in time.

    Some other takeaways:

    * Commentary definitely better in '17
    * PCI seems to be a bit smaller in '16 vs '17
    * Less meatballs thrown in '16 vs '17
    * And of course, the intro in '17 is far superior to that of '16

    I would be curious if anyone was to try this out and play '16 on the same exact settings that you're playing '17 on and see how you feel.
    I can't shave with my eyes closed, meaning each day I have to look at myself in the mirror and respect who I see.

    I miss the old days of Operation Sports :(


    Louisville Cardinals/St.Louis Cardinals
  • Councilmann_Jamm
    Pro
    • Feb 2016
    • 745

    #2
    Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

    I feel like the PCI is huge on every swing. I strike out alot and don't get alot of hits (I've played like 7 games) but every time I look at the PCI it's covering the batting zone

    Comment

    • Armor and Sword
      The Lama
      • Sep 2010
      • 21789

      #3
      MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

      The sheer amount of natural new fielding animations and the the ball physics of 17 make 16 obsolete for me.

      And I played 16 till the day before I got 17.

      This was a huge leap in gameplay for me this year.

      A good gameplay patch and I guarantee you will put 16 back on the shelf for a permanent vacation.

      The game needs some fine tuning. No doubt.

      But it is miles ahead of any previous iteration in terms of gameplay.

      Miles ahead.

      Sometimes change is difficult to process at first. We all wanted that leap in gameplay and we certainly got it.

      It is going to have growing pains and that is what patch 1.04 will address.

      Some growing pains in coding and logic for certain options that are used to play (QC/QM). And obvious major server issues that will be addressed.

      But overall in franchise mode, I have had a robust gameplay experience and far above any version before it.

      Nothing has felt forced. In fact quite the opposite.

      Far more organic, far more unpredictable.

      Just far more better. I am seeing different things in terms of hit variety, fielding animations, humanity AI decisions on fielding.

      It has been incredible.


      Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
      Now Playing on PS5:
      CFB 26 Hurricanes/Fresno State Year 2
      MLB The Show 25 - 2025 Yankees Year 1
      MLB The Show 25 1985 Yankees Year 1
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      Comment

      • countryboy
        Growing pains
        • Sep 2003
        • 52723

        #4
        Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

        Originally posted by Councilmann_Jamm
        I feel like the PCI is huge on every swing. I strike out alot and don't get alot of hits (I've played like 7 games) but every time I look at the PCI it's covering the batting zone
        Yes playing '17 and then '16, it appears that the PCI is bigger in '17 thus allowing more contact, and by association, more solid contact.
        I can't shave with my eyes closed, meaning each day I have to look at myself in the mirror and respect who I see.

        I miss the old days of Operation Sports :(


        Louisville Cardinals/St.Louis Cardinals

        Comment

        • bredfan
          Rookie
          • Aug 2007
          • 92

          #5
          Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

          To be honest, other than the "hard changes" like the commentary, I don't see much difference at all between the two. If you put the games side by side and muted them, I'd have a hard time telling which is which.

          That's not a knock, just my personal observation.

          Comment

          • countryboy
            Growing pains
            • Sep 2003
            • 52723

            #6
            Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

            Originally posted by Armor and Sword
            The sheer amount of natural new fielding animations and the the ball physics of 17 make 16 obsolete for me.

            And I played 16 till the day before I got 17.

            This was a huge leap in gameplay for me this year.

            A good gameplay patch and I guarantee you will put 16 back on the shelf for a permanent vacation.

            The game needs some fine tuning. No doubt.

            But it is miles ahead of any previous iteration in terms of gameplay.

            Miles ahead.

            Sometimes change is difficult to process at first. We all wanted that leap in gameplay and we certainly got it.

            It is going to have growing pains and that is what patch 1.04 will address.

            Some growing pains in coding and logic for certain options that are used to play (QC/QM). And obvious major server issues that will be addressed.

            But overall in franchise mode, I have had a robust gameplay experience and far above any version before it.

            Nothing has felt forced. In fact quite the opposite.

            Far more organic, far more unpredictable.

            Just far more better. I am seeing different things in terms of hit variety, fielding animations, humanity AI decisions on fielding.

            It has been incredible.


            Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
            Again, I want to make it clear that I'm really enjoying '17. And in a lot of ways it is far better than '16. And I don't disagree that a gameplay patch will cure some of the issues that '17 is having.

            It was just something I did after a conversation with a friend and I was surprised at how '16 felt in comparison.
            I can't shave with my eyes closed, meaning each day I have to look at myself in the mirror and respect who I see.

            I miss the old days of Operation Sports :(


            Louisville Cardinals/St.Louis Cardinals

            Comment

            • Armor and Sword
              The Lama
              • Sep 2010
              • 21789

              #7
              Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

              16 was a great game. It was the best version of this game to this point.

              I have been happy with every new release since I started playing this game. I think the only 2 that after looking back were nothing really new for me were 13 and 14.

              12 was a new level and a breakthrough and 15 and 16 were jumps, but 17 has been a giant leap in every aspect.


              Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
              Now Playing on PS5:
              CFB 26 Hurricanes/Fresno State Year 2
              MLB The Show 25 - 2025 Yankees Year 1
              MLB The Show 25 1985 Yankees Year 1
              Oblivion Remaster



              Follow me on Twitch
              https://www.twitch.tv/armorandsword

              Comment

              • KnightTemplar
                MVP
                • Feb 2017
                • 3282

                #8
                Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

                Good objective observations.

                When I first popped in '17 I was disappointed. It did lose something and gained something I thought was odd. I couldn't hit on my usually settings, but then I'd blast these long home runs. I perused the boards for answers, but, I've always felt that using other peoples sliders was never the answer as we all have our own abilities playing this game (that's why SDS loaded the game with options/settings/sliders).

                On my own, I have now entered a comfort zone and there's no way I could go back to '16 (just the create-a-player would stop that). The more I play, the more I see hit variety. I see threads that start "I never see.......", "anybody else have this problem......", etc. and tend to ignore them because I DO see balls hit over outfielders heads, I don't see outfielders tracking down every fly ball, etc.

                '17 has grown on me, but I do understand when you talk about a certain difference in feel. It was there for me.

                Comment

                • Dice
                  Sitting by the door
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 6627

                  #9
                  Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

                  This is why I'm still playing 16 and probably won't be purchasing 17 until May or June when game tuning patches and some balanced sliders come out.
                  I have more respect for a man who let's me know where he stands, even if he's wrong. Than the one who comes up like an angel and is nothing but a devil. - Malcolm X

                  Comment

                  • My993C2
                    MVP
                    • Sep 2012
                    • 1588

                    #10
                    Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

                    Originally posted by bredfan
                    To be honest, other than the "hard changes" like the commentary, I don't see much difference at all between the two. If you put the games side by side and muted them, I'd have a hard time telling which is which.

                    That's not a knock, just my personal observation.
                    You don't notice the new round bat hitting a round ball physics plus the new human AI fielding changes? For me the games in MLB 17 are a lot more organic and dynamic than in past years as it seems like every day I am witnessing some sort of new hit never seen before.

                    It's just unfortunate that there are some short comings of the game this year that worked fine in past years.

                    1) Biggest problem has been the online servers. This does not effect me much since I am an offline player. But I did lose the results of a game when exiting the game and the rewards screen hung because my console was not able to interact with the server.

                    2) Second biggest problem is likely the balls in the dirt at the catcher's feet and base runners are advancing on these events. Yes these things do happen in the real world, so I definitely want them to happen in my games. But they happen too much in MLB 17, to the point where I don't dare attempt to throw a low pitch when there are base runners which is a problem because often I want to throw low to try and induce ground balls and possible double plays.

                    3) The starting pitchers are being yanked too soon. Yes some times they are being yanked from the games when they are being rocked for base hits and runs, or yanked for high pitch counts. But I have also seen a starting pitcher doing well, with a reasonably low pitch count being yanked in the 4th or 5th inning for no reason.

                    MLB 17 is a great game, I am having tons of fun with it. But it does have a few bugs which prevents it from being an epic game.
                    Last edited by My993C2; 04-18-2017, 10:02 AM.

                    Comment

                    • bredfan
                      Rookie
                      • Aug 2007
                      • 92

                      #11
                      Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

                      Originally posted by My993C2
                      You don't notice the new round bat hitting a round ball physics plus the new human AI fielding changes? For me the games in MLB 17 are a lot more organic and dynamic than in past years as it seems like every day I am witnessing some sort of new hit never seen before.
                      Not really. I mean, I do see some hit types that "feel" new but nothing that makes me feel like 17 is leaps and bounds ahead of 16.

                      The new physics seem like Fifa's old physics to me. Where there weren't actually physics, just animations disguised as physics. To me, Super Mega Baseball has a much better and more organic physics engine.

                      Either way, I still love the game and would if it were just a roster update.

                      Comment

                      • BDrizz
                        Banned
                        • Apr 2013
                        • 198

                        #12
                        Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

                        While there is no doubt in my mind 17 is the better version and I will not be going back to 16, there are some issues that are quite perplexing to me:

                        1. What the hell happened to bunting? I am yet to see a bunt within a 4-5 feet arc around the plate. They are always (100% always) rocketed to a corner infielder.
                        2. What the hell happened to hitting? There are hiccups and animation freezes and clipping issues and the infamous ball through the bat crap that has made the transition to this years game quite frustrating at times. Hell, I hit more line drives trying to sacrifice bunt than I do with a full swing!
                        3. What the hell happened to pitching? I tried an experiment with a CAF with fully maxed out ratings, 99s at every single rating. I still could not consistently throw strikes and get people out. I have tried on buttons, on analog, tried them all. Cannot figure out what I am doing. Also, I have seen quite a few deliveries that are bugged or glitched.
                        4. The commentary is arguably worse this season than in season past. HR is great but Plesac annoys me and the content got stale day 1. Hope this gets updated.

                        I hate to say it, because I love love love LOVE this game and this series, but it is becoming quite apparent that this game has out grown SDS and its time to grow the team to accommodate the issues this game is generating. Every year we bitch about the commentary and these little weird issues. They never get resolved. The answer is always that they are a small team and must prioritize what they work on each game cycle. Why not try to grow and prioritize MORE issues...

                        Comment

                        • Ghost Of The Year
                          Life's been good so far.
                          • Mar 2014
                          • 6352

                          #13
                          Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

                          16 was great & if I was broke I would have continued to play for another year. 17 is also very good as is right now and I have not had the surge in offense other have enjoyed. There is a difference between 16 & 17 but it's my opinion each year should have it's own unique feel. But do not go over board with that, please, SCEA. No need to reinvent the wheel. As for a final judgement I'll wait for a couple more patches to see how things play out.
                          T-BONE.

                          Talking about things nobody cares.

                          Comment

                          • KnightTemplar
                            MVP
                            • Feb 2017
                            • 3282

                            #14
                            Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

                            Originally posted by BDrizz
                            While there is no doubt in my mind 17 is the better version and I will not be going back to 16, there are some issues that are quite perplexing to me:

                            1. What the hell happened to bunting? I am yet to see a bunt within a 4-5 feet arc around the plate. They are always (100% always) rocketed to a corner infielder.
                            This was definitely an issue last year. This is not just '17.

                            Comment

                            • HypoLuxa13
                              MVP
                              • Feb 2007
                              • 1156

                              #15
                              Re: MLB '16 & '17: An Experiment and Observation

                              I think it is a fair description that 16 can feel more natural than 17, or that some things in 17 can feel forced. All of the things that initially feel "forced" like the gold glove fielding animations for players regardless of ratings, the automatic runner advancement for balls in the dirt, or even the online bunting logic being applied to offline gameplay... I think a lot of the "forced" feel of things like these could certainly be cleaned up via patches and gameplay tuning. I uninstalled 16 So I am certainly enjoying 17 despite these issues.

                              Sent from my SM-G930V using Operation Sports mobile app

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