MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

[canes21]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Maybe YOU do (unless you said this could just be patched in LOL), but if you read some of these comments, some clearly don’t. I want more out of the mode trust me, but these games are more complicated now than ever, tomorrow, it will be more complicated than ever. The yearly cycle is really about 9 months or less of development time. While the first bit is still using resources for the previous game.

If you’re tired of dropping the money for the “same” game, why do you keep buying it? That’s on you man.

Do you think in a world where SCEA had the resources to do it, creating a model where they have a smaller core team working on core foundational level stuff annually while two different teams did more of the work on back of the box type features alternating releases so that each team got 2 cycles to work on their features that things would be different, at least a significant enough amount?

Asking because of your obvious experience in the field. I'm no dev, but try to read up as much as I can so my posts are somewhat informed and it truly seems like the reason all sports games are in limbo right now and not as good as we all wish is because the 9 month cycle every year is severely limiting.

Obviously SCEA doesn't have the resources to pull an Activision and have 3 different developers creating 3 games over 3 years, but I do think they have the resources to explore having a different model than they have now where based off their own words it seems that they had guys working on both the big features (stadium creator) and all of the core stuff and that is partially why this feature has been in development 3-5 years. It seems if they had the resources to do it, had they had a team dedicated solely to stadium creator that the feature may have been created and polished up in half maybe just 2 cycles instead of around 4.

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[canes21]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I suspect that's because the lineup and rotation logic changes are limited to the fix they highlighted in the stream. Both would get reset when a roster move happened, losing all user changes. And since MTO sims ahead to your next game, you would play at least one game with a CPU generated lineup (which can be wonky depending on the team and your preferences).

I don't think it was deeper changes to how the AI constructs batting orders, rotation, or uses the bullpen. Now, the new player metric could impact who is on the roster which obviously impacts those aspects. But I'm skeptical that meaningful changes were made to how the AI uses relievers in game or across games based on the info we have thus far (but really hope I'm wrong).

Based off what we have been told, it seems that unfortunately bullpen logic hasn't been reworked which is a shame. The way CPU teams handle their pitching staffs is my current biggest issue with franchise mode at the moment and it is part of why last year I simmed 2 games to every 1 that I played.

I lost interest in franchise mode trying to play every game and seeing how poorly the CPU would manage their staffs over a series. They basically hand you some free wins some series because they absolutely refuse to use their entire pen and would rather trot out the same exhausted arms 3 straight games. Any injuries occurring to a pitcher in the series near guaranteed you a series win because it would basically break the CPU logic and you'd see wonky things like a LR throwing 200 pitches in one series or the same two MRs throwing 65 pitches in back to back games giving you easy blowout wins.

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[tessl]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Apparently they didn't address the issue of carry over saves during the franchise stream.

Is it possible ps4 to ps4 will still have the carry over save but not ps4 to ps5?

I'm not planning to get the ps5 until and unless EA releases the new college football game.

[Sportsfan28]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Maybe YOU do (unless you said this could just be patched in LOL), but if you read some of these comments, some clearly don’t. I want more out of the mode trust me, but these games are more complicated now than ever, tomorrow, it will be more complicated than ever. The yearly cycle is really about 9 months or less of development time. While the first bit is still using resources for the previous game.

If you’re tired of dropping the money for the “same” game, why do you keep buying it? That’s on you man.

Because I’m a sucker for new releases and falling for the “we made improvements to franchise” every year. So this year I’m waiting for it to go on sale and not buying day one. It will take a few months before anyone creates a good enough roster for ‘21 anyway.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[KingOfLanglade]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I’m excited for the new release. Seems like a lot of setup work was done with the core of this mode, and the game for 22’ and beyond.

[Funkycorm]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Apparently they didn't address the issue of carry over saves during the franchise stream.

Is it possible ps4 to ps4 will still have the carry over save but not ps4 to ps5?

I'm not planning to get the ps5 until and unless EA releases the new college football game.

There is no chance it is there.

If we assume that part of the reason why they took it out is because they reworked the core of the mode it would make no sense it is there.

After the stream last night, I can't see multi platform being the issue with y2y being gone though there probably was a small role.

The good news though is since they know it is popular and they reworked the core of the mode that I can see it coming back in the next few years. But that is just my take on it.

[Funkycorm]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I wasn't impressed but I wasn't disappointed either.

I had planned on sticking to 20 but got the ps5 Jackie Robinson edition preordered as a gift. I am low key excited about seeing what 21 is all about on next gen come April 16.

Some of my observations:

1. Roster importing is not there. That's confirmed. It wasn't an option.
2. The assignment of stadiums is pretty cool.
3. I think the organizational depth chart is a neat feature. Like others I wonder how progression impacts this and if there were any changes to that. Not holding my breath but I do wonder.
4. The small improvements in logic will be a nice touch.
5. The updated menus do make the game pop a bit.
6. I would have liked to see some more AI improvements in roster management for the CPU.
7. Clearly franchise is not going away and it does feel like they recognize that it is an important mode. I know everyone is tired of hearing next year so I won't say it. What I will say is that if there is not continued improvements in franchise, I will not be moving on past 21.


Overall, it was not a bad stream and I am looking forward to starting a new journey on 21 even though I will miss my current carryover franchise.

[Houston]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

You guys are not fully understanding how y2y saves work. I have done plenty of carrying over franchises, rosters and players since 14.

You can not carry over with skipping a year (a mlb the show game since when it was added on 14)

Let me explain it this way, if there was someone picking up let's say mlb the show 16 and wanted to get there carry over to 20 but don't own 18, they own 16, 17, 19 you are going to need all of them to get to 20.

So again without carry over at all on 21 you are not getting your long carry over saves to 22, 23 whenever it comes back those saves are dead at 20.

So let's say it returns on 22 you could carry over a franchise from 21 but nothing before it y2y were not in 21 only regular franchise no previous saves.

I talk with devs quiet a bit 1 of them on a daily basis, and just like when online franchise got removed it takes them at least 2 good years to add something like that back.

Y2y saves coming back just can't pick up where you left off with a missing carry over in between. When and if it returns carry over will only work from that moment not previous years or saves. You just can't expect it to work with a missing year it will not happen.

[tyler289]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

This dev team would rather kill franchise mode than expand it (doesn't funnel players to DD, so it's useless to them - hence the creation of MTO, which is actually a good idea but should just be part of franchise mode), but I'll take whatever updates we can get. The UI is definitely better but every year their only franchise updates are "logic" and "UI" so they're just going in circles. I mean their logic update had Max Scherzer taking an $11 million a year contract, so they clearly didn't do anything too accurate. This was better than their slap in the face a couple years ago when their big update was a UI change and an on-screen indicator that the draft is happening.

That said, the stadium creator is such a huge opportunity with custom teams that I'll end up getting it day one this year. That's a big improvement. Gameplay looks good again as well.

Ultimately, though, this dev team seems to either lack the resources or vision of its competitors in a lot of ways. Player models and animations and graphics are way better in NBA 2k, Fifa and Madden and we'll need to see a lot of improvement for MLB22 on next-gen because right now they are falling behind. I'm hopeful next year sees a bigger step up for offline players but the last 2-3 years of the Show have been pretty much staying in neutral with nothing notable to show as improvement.

Even their RTTS upgrades/changes get tossed in and out every year. I didn't bother following the RTTS updates because they'll just change it again next year.

[Armor and Sword]

MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

after the last 5+ years, it looks to me like the big change has finally happened. personally I don't even know why they scaled back on the ''revamped'' description. definitely looks revamped to me. I'm anxious for April 16 to get here so I can get acclimated to all the newness. as for the last few years, does it play exactly like you'd run an IRL franchise? no, but for a video game it has been plenty deep enough. of course I do realise those last few years aren't going to be kosher for a ton of people. that's why if I weren't happy with the Show I definitely wouldn't be spending good money on it every year and being miserable in the process. that's sheer lunacy IMO

Dude.....really?

Strongly disagree with you on a lot of levels and we will leave it at that.

I see basically the same franchise mode with some proposed logic improvements to trades.

Let TBarnes do his fine work to know what really was done under the hood.

We did not get:

Rotating inter-league schedules

The much needed and desired expanded rosters

Scouting improvements

Expanded player draft

I am not going to sit here and say whoopee at all based on what they unveiled last night.

For those that follow Mills on Twitch. Go watch his stream from last night and watch the first 30-35 minutes.

Guy tells it straight from the heart.


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[JoshC1977]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I've been re-processing a lot of the information given out last night. A few areas I wanted to touch on...

Stadium Creator
It's a cute little cosmetic addition that many will enjoy. But it doesn't move the needle one iota. Why? Because, just like the rebranding/relocation module added last year, it changes NOTHING about the decisions you (or the CPU) make. SDS could have tied city size/stadium size/other demographics into starting budget expectations (and then actual cash flow as attendance varies). That would have made added actual meaning to having these options in game. Right now, it's pretty much an empty feature; just like re-branding was last year.

Budget "overhaul"
The old budget system was perfectly fine and made a ton of sense; I never understood the crying about it. If they had tied actual attendance figures into your weekly cash flow; it would have been brilliant. The ebbs and flows could have forced you into eating into your bank account during road trips and swoons in attendance. It would have made the financial aspect a lot deeper. In extreme cases, you may have been in a position where you didn't have enough cash banked to make a move...and for small market teams, I can totally see that happening. Instead, we get a shallower model.

#DepthChart
Touting something like this as a big "add", SMH. Could it be useful? Sure. But it really doesn't make the mode better either. Does the CPU utilize these future predictions into ANY of their logic? If not, it's just window-dressing (like Madden's "visual depth chart" that has been in the game for several years). If they DO use the projections, then that could mean something.

Player value re-calcs (trade/budget "enhancements")
There is a MASSIVE unanswered question about this. Does any of it matter for the CPU? If it doesn't...then it doesn't matter one iota. I'm going to err on the positive side and say that SDS indicated that they ran a lot of simulations and "liked what they saw". If you're running sims...that's all CPU...so it should all tie-in. Assuming this is correct, that is a positive development (though I can't wait to see how badly people jack things up using custom rosters with loads of over-potentialed players).

Removing morale in-game impact
Sigh...again, just catering to whiners. Instead of actually enhancing this to make it smarter/better, SDS decided to just remove the most meaningful part of its existence in the mode by removing morale's in-game impact. I'm sorry, but this is totally unacceptable to me.

Loss of Y2Y Saves for '21
No matter what the reason these were removed, I have to consider this fact when assessing the franchise updates. From my perspective, the loss of this is not offset by anything they've done for this year's game.


I'll be honest, my interest in franchise for this year's game is incredibly lukewarm.

[Armor and Sword]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I've been re-processing a lot of the information given out last night. A few areas I wanted to touch on...



Stadium Creator

It's a cute little cosmetic addition that many will enjoy. But it doesn't move the needle one iota. Why? Because, just like the rebranding/relocation module added last year, it changes NOTHING about the decisions you (or the CPU) make. SDS could have tied city size/stadium size/other demographics into starting budget expectations (and then actual cash flow as attendance varies). That would have made added actual meaning to having these options in game. Right now, it's pretty much an empty feature; just like re-branding was last year.



Budget "overhaul"

The old budget system was perfectly fine and made a ton of sense; I never understood the crying about it. If they had tied actual attendance figures into your weekly cash flow; it would have been brilliant. The ebbs and flows could have forced you into eating into your bank account during road trips and swoons in attendance. It would have made the financial aspect a lot deeper. In extreme cases, you may have been in a position where you didn't have enough cash banked to make a move...and for small market teams, I can totally see that happening. Instead, we get a shallower model.



#DepthChart

Touting something like this as a big "add", SMH. Could it be useful? Sure. But it really doesn't make the mode better either. Does the CPU utilize these future predictions into ANY of their logic? If not, it's just window-dressing (like Madden's "visual depth chart" that has been in the game for several years). If they DO use the projections, then that could mean something.



Player value re-calcs (trade/budget "enhancements")

There is a MASSIVE unanswered question about this. Does any of it matter for the CPU? If it doesn't...then it doesn't matter one iota. I'm going to err on the positive side and say that SDS indicated that they ran a lot of simulations and "liked what they saw". If you're running sims...that's all CPU...so it should all tie-in. Assuming this is correct, that is a positive development (though I can't wait to see how badly people jack things up using custom rosters with loads of over-potentialed players).



Removing morale in-game impact

Sigh...again, just catering to whiners. Instead of actually enhancing this to make it smarter/better, SDS decided to just remove the most meaningful part of its existence in the mode by removing morale's in-game impact. I'm sorry, but this is totally unacceptable to me.



Loss of Y2Y Saves for '21

No matter what the reason these were removed, I have to consider this fact when assessing the franchise updates. From my perspective, the loss of this is not offset by anything they've done for this year's game.





I'll be honest, my interest in franchise for this year's game is incredibly lukewarm.

Well said Josh and exactly my feelings as well.

Big deal. The needle was not moved at all for me.

We lost a ton more than we gained. And you know what it is my opinion. Some will agree....some will not.

But this was a big empty. And I expected it. Again I had zero expectations and I am glad I did.




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[Caulfield]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

You guys are not fully understanding how y2y saves work. I have done plenty of carrying over franchises, rosters and players since 14.

You can not carry over with skipping a year (a mlb the show game since when it was added on 14)

Let me explain it this way, if there was someone picking up let's say mlb the show 16 and wanted to get there carry over to 20 but don't own 18, they own 16, 17, 19 you are going to need all of them to get to 20.

So again without carry over at all on 21 you are not getting your long carry over saves to 22, 23 whenever it comes back those saves are dead at 20.

So let's say it returns on 22 you could carry over a franchise from 21 but nothing before it y2y were not in 21 only regular franchise no previous saves.

I talk with devs quiet a bit 1 of them on a daily basis, and just like when online franchise got removed it takes them at least 2 good years to add something like that back.

Y2y saves coming back just can't pick up where you left off with a missing carry over in between. When and if it returns carry over will only work from that moment not previous years or saves. You just can't expect it to work with a missing year it will not happen.

I don't think I've seen where anyone expects to carry-over from 20 to 22 skipping 21

[thescoop]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I liked a lot of the changes but I have to say I'm still underwhelmed. Why? I wanted more stated and discussed. They sold us last year that this year Franchise would be a huge upgrade but it doesn't feel like that.

I still want custom draft classes. And we can pretty much rule this one out of another year. Maybe it was too much to expect this year but just seems so simple.

I wanted rain outs with re-scheduled double headers. This was done back in MVP 05 so long over due.

I wanted Single A teams. Again, this was another thing done back in MVP 05 but they still can't give us that.

I wanted rotating inter-league schedule in New Years. The lack of mention of this makes me think we won't get that again. And that should have happened years ago.

Now that I've gotten my complains out of the way, there was a lot to like. I do like the changes in budgets, progression and stuff. Definitely looking forward to trying this out.

Really love the fact I can change stadiums for 30 teams. I know some teams will either move or at least finally get a new stadium in my Franchise. Really excited for this.

No expansion mode is another missed opportunity especially with the new stadium creator. While I wasn't expecting it to come through I was hoping to be wrong. I'm not too down about it because I can at least move a Franchise and have them play in a new created park.

New menus look cool but not really what I call a "Franchise upgrade." Still look forward to trying them out and judging them once in play but seems to be a weak thing to feature as an upgrade to the mode.

March to October is who I blame for Franchise not getting more improvements. I don't like that mode. I won't play that mode. I don't know anyone who plays it but since they came up with it all I've seen it do is take resources away from Franchise. The mode is here to stay but I wish they'd not give me the feeling it is the reason Franchise isn't getting more. Maybe if Franchise was treated like Road to the Show and not being forced to share a stream with a lesser mode (in my opinion) I wouldn't feel that way.

Now we can also hope that maybe some of what we want (rotating interleague, rain outs, etc.) are actually in but they just didn't feel they were big enough to mention in the stream. I doubt that but who knows.

Bottom line is that feed isn't really going to get those of us Franchise gamers who have felt ignored that few years to feel differently about this years game. It seems once again we got the fewest improvements and they should have figured out how to get us more. Maybe adding the much wanted create a stadium (although next gen only) is to blame. That was a major undertaking that I'm very excited about. But sadly we were sold last year on what a big update this would be. And the info given I just don't feel this proved the "hey, we really care about Franchise" point the way they thought it would.

And those are my thoughts on Franchise.

[MrArlingtonBeach]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I used to follow the MLB The Show streams and pre-launch info with excitement and anticipation. I'd get ready to hear about the improvements in RTTS, Franchise, gameplay, etc. each February and March.

Maybe I'm just getting older, and becoming a bit more cynical, but those days for me are long gone. Between how games like Madden, PGA TOUR, and MLB The Show view their offline single-player modes, I'm pretty disappointed in the world of sports gaming now.

For The Show, it's been basically 10 years or so of "under the hood" updates, setting up Franchise Mode for "the future". And yet, there's no rotating interleague schedule, no 3-team trades, no owner-mode features that allow you to set prices for tickets, no single-A teams, no rain-outs, etc. These have been requested things, or even things that were once in Franchise Mode, and are still missing.

And on top of that, things get removed - year-to-year saves, Season Mode (which they didn't tell anyone it was gone until after the game released), Online Franchise, setting ticket/concession prices in Franchise Mode, etc. But they're sure to give you more info about a Diamond Dynasty program in a Franchise/March to October stream!

I get it...make that money, SDS, EA, 2K. Get people to buy packs and stubs, and VC. But they're totally abandoning a core segment of the fanbase, while still saying there are "updates" to these single player modes. And as a current-gen PS4 user, the appeal is even less, as the stadium creator and such are next-gen only features.

I only acquired MLB The Show 19 because it became PS Plus free game, I waited to buy The Show 20 until it was $10 (and mostly just because El Mago was on the cover), and it looks like The Show 21 will be either a budget purchase or none at all.

Times they are a-changing...