MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

[forme95]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I've been re-processing a lot of the information given out last night. A few areas I wanted to touch on...

Stadium Creator
It's a cute little cosmetic addition that many will enjoy. But it doesn't move the needle one iota. Why? Because, just like the rebranding/relocation module added last year, it changes NOTHING about the decisions you (or the CPU) make. SDS could have tied city size/stadium size/other demographics into starting budget expectations (and then actual cash flow as attendance varies). That would have made added actual meaning to having these options in game. Right now, it's pretty much an empty feature; just like re-branding was last year.

Budget "overhaul"
The old budget system was perfectly fine and made a ton of sense; I never understood the crying about it. If they had tied actual attendance figures into your weekly cash flow; it would have been brilliant. The ebbs and flows could have forced you into eating into your bank account during road trips and swoons in attendance. It would have made the financial aspect a lot deeper. In extreme cases, you may have been in a position where you didn't have enough cash banked to make a move...and for small market teams, I can totally see that happening. Instead, we get a shallower model.

#DepthChart
Touting something like this as a big "add", SMH. Could it be useful? Sure. But it really doesn't make the mode better either. Does the CPU utilize these future predictions into ANY of their logic? If not, it's just window-dressing (like Madden's "visual depth chart" that has been in the game for several years). If they DO use the projections, then that could mean something.

Player value re-calcs (trade/budget "enhancements")
There is a MASSIVE unanswered question about this. Does any of it matter for the CPU? If it doesn't...then it doesn't matter one iota. I'm going to err on the positive side and say that SDS indicated that they ran a lot of simulations and "liked what they saw". If you're running sims...that's all CPU...so it should all tie-in. Assuming this is correct, that is a positive development (though I can't wait to see how badly people jack things up using custom rosters with loads of over-potentialed players).

^^^ accurate

Removing morale in-game impact
Sigh...again, just catering to whiners. Instead of actually enhancing this to make it smarter/better, SDS decided to just remove the most meaningful part of its existence in the mode by removing morale's in-game impact. I'm sorry, but this is totally unacceptable to me.

What you said about morale, can not be any more TRUE

Loss of Y2Y Saves for '21
No matter what the reason these were removed, I have to consider this fact when assessing the franchise updates. From my perspective, the loss of this is not offset by anything they've done for this year's game.


I'll be honest, my interest in franchise for this year's game is incredibly lukewarm.

100% agree!!! Very well said!! Most of it is lipstick on a pig.

[CBoller1331]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

This dev team would rather kill franchise mode than expand it (doesn't funnel players to DD, so it's useless to them - hence the creation of MTO, which is actually a good idea but should just be part of franchise mode), but I'll take whatever updates we can get. The UI is definitely better but every year their only franchise updates are "logic" and "UI" so they're just going in circles. I mean their logic update had Max Scherzer taking an $11 million a year contract, so they clearly didn't do anything too accurate. This was better than their slap in the face a couple years ago when their big update was a UI change and an on-screen indicator that the draft is happening.

That said, the stadium creator is such a huge opportunity with custom teams that I'll end up getting it day one this year. That's a big improvement. Gameplay looks good again as well.

Ultimately, though, this dev team seems to either lack the resources or vision of its competitors in a lot of ways. Player models and animations and graphics are way better in NBA 2k, Fifa and Madden and we'll need to see a lot of improvement for MLB22 on next-gen because right now they are falling behind. I'm hopeful next year sees a bigger step up for offline players but the last 2-3 years of the Show have been pretty much staying in neutral with nothing notable to show as improvement.

Even their RTTS upgrades/changes get tossed in and out every year. I didn't bother following the RTTS updates because they'll just change it again next year.

Sorry for quoting the whole post but I cant trim it on my phone. I'm only responding to the first sentence about Devs wanting to kill franchise rather than expanding it.

I dont think that is true at all. Sure the mode hasn't gotten much love in the past few years, and I can understand those who are unimpressed with the upgrades this year....but at least from the feature premiere it seems to me like they put a lot of time into it this year an have some sort of vision for it in the future.

Maybe that vision is different from yours or mine, but saying that they would rather kill the mode than expand on it right after the stream to show the changes they made seems rude and ignorant.

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[Caulfield]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Dude.....really?

Strongly disagree with you on a lot of levels and we will leave it at that.

I see basically the same franchise mode with some proposed logic improvements to trades.

Let TBarnes do his fine work to know what really was done under the hood.

We did not get:

Rotating inter-league schedules

The much needed and desired expanded rosters

Scouting improvements

Expanded player draft

I am not going to sit here and say whoopee at all based on what they unveiled last night.

For those that follow Mills on Twitch. Go watch his stream from last night and watch the first 30-35 minutes.

Guy tells it straight from the heart.


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I can respect that. I'd like to see all those things in the future too. but where we part ways is I'm not nearly invested in carry-over saves as lot of people.

and not having those wishlist items isn't a dealbreaker for me either. I'm more in the camp my video baseball game needs are few and simple. and the Show provides that much. but it is giving me more in 21 (based on what I saw yesterday) than I got from 20,
sans carry-over obviously

[BA2929]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

March to October is who I blame for Franchise not getting more improvements. I don't like that mode. I won't play that mode. I don't know anyone who plays it but since they came up with it all I've seen it do is take resources away from Franchise. The mode is here to stay but I wish they'd not give me the feeling it is the reason Franchise isn't getting more. Maybe if Franchise was treated like Road to the Show and not being forced to share a stream with a lesser mode (in my opinion) I wouldn't feel that way.

I play it. It's fun for those of us who want a torn down, lazy franchise experience for a season.

I just find franchise too much work, boring and requires too much effort to make it realistic and I refuse to play that mode until they fix it, which they apparently have no desire to do.

That being said, baseball is all about building over multiple seasons. That's the entire point of the professional version of the sport and why each franchise has 4 separate teams growing players. So if there's ONE video game sports franchise that should probably put some effort into Franchise it's an MLB game, yet SDS doesn't do that. They must have just completely ruined the framework for that mode years ago and fixing it is such a monumental task that they just can't fit it in.

[thescoop]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I play it. It's fun for those of us who want a torn down, lazy franchise experience for a season.

I just find franchise too much work, boring and requires too much effort to make it realistic and I refuse to play that mode until they fix it, which they apparently have no desire to do.

That being said, baseball is all about building over multiple seasons. That's the entire point of the professional version of the sport and why each franchise has 4 separate teams growing players. So if there's ONE video game sports franchise that should probably put some effort into Franchise it's an MLB game, yet SDS doesn't do that. They must have just completely ruined the framework for that mode years ago and fixing it is such a monumental task that they just can't fit it in.

Definitely glad you enjoy the mode and that's why it shouldn't be done away with. But I do wish they'd fixed the legacy issues like the interleague scheduling before putting resources into a lesser version of the mode. Issues like the the interleague scheduling year to year shouldn't even be an issue in 2021. Reading your post I tend to think you'll agree with that. I definitely agree with what you were saying as well.

[Therebelyell626]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

The one and only positive I took from this stream....

I am going to have a lot of time to work on my golf swing.

[Armor and Sword]

MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

100% agree!!! Very well said!! Most of it is lipstick on a pig.

I would not say lipstick on a pig. MLB 20 is a freaking gorgeous hot women who seems to be aging and they just gave her a new boob job (new depth chart screen and new budget screen).

Same hot girl just looking older and older.

I still love her....but we will go through a mid life crisis and want a young new babe at some point (serious franchise improvements).

But those serious ones are not huge asks.

Expanded rosters and rotating inter league schedules and this would be a happy party!


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[guinness22]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Not sure why, but I feel the need to say cudos to all in this thread. The discussion has been civil and respectful seemingly without agenda. Rare in this world. I feel smarter reading many of the posts contained herein. Seriously. Seems like this is how OS was “back in the day” when I first signed up.

I won’t quote the posts but Armor and Josh have summed up my feelings exactly. No ‘21 til late in the cycle (if at all) for this 53 year old sports gamer.

I am enjoying this discussion. It really underscores to me how different our wants and priorities can be even as we are all franchise gamers. Interesting stuff. Carry on.

g22


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[JoshC1977]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Not sure why, but I feel the need to say cudos to all in this thread. The discussion has been civil and respectful seemingly without agenda. Rare in this world. I feel smarter reading many of the posts contained herein. Seriously. Seems like this is how OS was “back in the day” when I first signed up.

I won’t quote the posts but Armor and Josh have summed up my feelings exactly. No ‘21 til late in the cycle (if at all) for this 53 year old sports gamer.

I am enjoying this discussion. It really underscores to me how different our wants and priorities can be even as we are all franchise gamers. Interesting stuff. Carry on.

g22

Not just rare in the world, but rare for this subforum, lol.

I agree though; I think people are focusing on what they're doing here vs "wishlisting" or bashing or the normal crap we see all year.

What they're doing works for some, and not for others....

End of the day, it goes back to something I always say to myself, "Play what you enjoy and enjoy what you play"

[Therebelyell626]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Dude.....really?

Strongly disagree with you on a lot of levels and we will leave it at that.

I see basically the same franchise mode with some proposed logic improvements to trades.

Let TBarnes do his fine work to know what really was done under the hood.

We did not get:

Rotating inter-league schedules

The much needed and desired expanded rosters

Scouting improvements

Expanded player draft

I am not going to sit here and say whoopee at all based on what they unveiled last night.

For those that follow Mills on Twitch. Go watch his stream from last night and watch the first 30-35 minutes.

Guy tells it straight from the heart.


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Do you have a link to the stream? I’d really like to watch it. I always felt like he was kind of a shill, but if he’s even pissed off id like to hear what he has to say

[MetsFan16]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Didn’t have any expectations for this stream.

I get what I get from franchise each year and that is fine by me. I know it won’t be the deepest simulation of being an MLB GM.

with the Gameplay improvements, the way I play franchise (162 with the Mets + random matchups & player lock games) I’m still looking forward to this years edition.

I don’t do Y2Y saves because I Ike getting the most realistic rosters each year.

Created stadium is also a huge addition.
I’m so looking forward to making new stadiums for teams I’ve grown bored with their current ones and teams who legitimately need a new one. It’ll freshen up the mode for me personally.

I also want to run a franchise where I design a stadium for a specific team style. Build a team of pitching and defense and build a stadium with huge outfield vs a heavy hitting team and give them a bandbox and see what happens.

Obviously much needs to be done to this mode but it’s still going to provide me a lot of entertainment for the next 12 months


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[canes21]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I would not say lipstick on a pig. MLB 20 is a freaking gorgeous hit women who seems to be aging and they just gave her a new boob job (new depth chart screen and new budget screen).

Same hot girl just looking older and older.

I still love her....but we will go through a mid life crisis and want a young new babe at some point (serious franchise improvements).

But those serious ones are not huge asks.

Expanded rosters and rotation inter league schedules and this would be a happy party!


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Add completely redone scouting and progression to those asks along with fixed pitching staff logic and SCEA will have me completely.

I can live with a lot of the issues the game has. I could really even live without the rotating schedules, though it is a bit annoying, but as someone who loves the GM side of sports, I cannot live with paying full price for a game that has a poor progression system. Being a GM is all about building a good team. Building a team isn't that fun when the progression system is done poorly.

The potential rating is too powerful and there is almost zero fog of war. I'd rather see a ceiling/floor for each player and it be a combination of things that dictate if a player hits their full potential at their peaks or not. And don't make it quantifiable. That makes roster moves too easy. In real life we never know if a kid will progress until he does. We can only project. If real life had ratings and a progression system that made it easy to know who would blossom and who wouldn't, well then it would be really boring.

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[tyler289]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Sorry for quoting the whole post but I cant trim it on my phone. I'm only responding to the first sentence about Devs wanting to kill franchise rather than expanding it.

I dont think that is true at all. Sure the mode hasn't gotten much love in the past few years, and I can understand those who are unimpressed with the upgrades this year....but at least from the feature premiere it seems to me like they put a lot of time into it this year an have some sort of vision for it in the future.

Maybe that vision is different from yours or mine, but saying that they would rather kill the mode than expand on it right after the stream to show the changes they made seems rude and ignorant.

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They literally created a separate mode - March to October - rather than simply fold things like storylines into franchise mode. That mode is tied into Diamond Dynasty and they continue to improve on it every year and build onto it. It's a good mode that has a ton of value. Why couldn't you just fold that effort/work into franchise mode and make generated storylines/momentum/etc. part of franchise? (The answer is diamond dynasty) It'd be awesome to have a prospect call-up storyline generated for you. MTO is a good idea and a good mode and it's incredibly telling to me that they invest so much in it compared to franchise mode. They want MTO to replace franchise mode eventually, I just hope they merge and franchise isn't just left behind because those MTO features would be excellent in franchise mode and make me want to play longer.

They haven't added anything meaningful to franchise mode in years and basically just spin around the UI to match that year's game and tell us logic is better. They don't build on a single thing they add. Scouting? untouched in years, nonsensical. Training? At this point just filler. Remember the morale system? they just decided it is meaningless now. Their big franchise mode feature last year was that they were using a better roster set. Like, come on.

They are light years behind their competitors in franchise mode and have consistently said they don't believe players want more franchise mode, but also have done nothing to try to draw players to it. It's a chicken/egg situation. I enjoy the game and buy it every year but it's really clear to me they don't value the offline franchise mode player, which is all I am (I enjoy RTTS but don't play it a whole lot). So when I follow news for new releases I can't help but think they're talking squarely at someone else and don't have anything to encourage me to buy the game.

Tiny dev teams like NHL have found ways to cater to the online crowd AND add on significant franchise mode updates consistently but SDS hasn't done that.

But, like I said, even their DD-focused additions like stadium creator is a welcome addition to franchise mode so I believe they will continue to slowly add things here as they improve the game overall. I just don't see them doing anything big like expanded rosters, overhauled scouting, etc. (really anything that OOTP does) anytime soon. Every other mode gets a major addition every year or two, except franchise mode. That says it all.

[tabarnes19_SDS]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

I've watched the stream a few times and have gone through frame by frame to see if I catch any underhood things. We obviously will not know the extent of the changes until really testing, but a few things concern me.

One of the biggest issues to trade logic was budget logic. Since teams valued players based on salaries that they determine to be of value based on age, potential and salary. They hit on that, but looking at the trades completed in July, the players that headlined the trades were minimum salaried young stars. There were no vets for prospect trades.

Players in the past would earn less in free agency that arbitration. If you look Lindor Is asking the same amount he earned in arbitration.

Trevor Story, who ironically on MLB today, was stated should get the largest contract amongst this years free agent ss crop was offered and had a high interest at 6 years 65 mil.

If salary logic was not addressed to match real Contracts then all the logic discuson means little.

Hopefully they look to continue to patch and tune, but it has been years since they even address any tuning.


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[Dolenz]

Re: MLB The Show 21 Franchise Mode and March to October Details From Feature Premiere

Sometimes I feel like the franchise fans are Charlie Brown to SDS's Lucy.

Every time you are hopeful that she will not pull that football away at the last minute and every time she does exactly that. Yes, I dated myself with that reference.

If I had to make a guess then I would say that SDS considers these major additions to franchise to the point where next year we will see tweaks on these systems (they are bound to need tweaks) but no new major features.

I don't know the status of Year to Year saves but remember everybody was convinced that they would bring back Online Franchise too.