Official Barry Bonds Thread

[snepp]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

Did MLB celebrate when Bonds hit his 62nd homerun in '01?

No, because that only put him in 5th.

[jfsolo]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

And let us not forget that Bowie Kuhn, who was the commissioner in 1974, wasn't even in attendance when Aaron broke Ruth's record.

Wow!, I didn't know that. Without knowing any infomation about why he wasn't there, the fact that he wasn't says a lot about how things different things were in sports and society back then.

[countryboy]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

Did anyone watch the Sportscenter Sunday Conversation between Hershiser and Schilling?

All I seen was Schiling saying how he doesn't see how everyone else involved with BALCO can be guilty but Bonds be innocent.

He also stated that Bonds is "reaping what he sowed"

Interesting

[Gibbz]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

Yes, I heard that as well. I think Bonds should just come clean, since it couldn't hurt him any since everyone knows he was on the juice anyways.

[Heelfan71]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

There is ZERO chance he will come clean. He would be in some serious legal trouble if he did. R. Maris still holds the single season HR record in my mind. Bonds, Mcgwire and Sosa are all cheaters.

[Knight165]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

There is ZERO chance he will come clean. He would be in some serious legal trouble if he did. R. Maris still holds the single season HR record in my mind. Bonds, Mcgwire and Sosa are all cheaters.

Agreed. Big time.

M.K.
Knight165

[Scottdau]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

Agreed. Big time.

M.K.
Knight165

lmao, actually Ruth has the record in my mind, they played less game back then.

[Diadem]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

lmao, actually Ruth has the record in my mind, they played less game back then.

Ruth should never hold the record, He never had to play against black or latin players.

[bravosfan]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

Barroid just hit #712...

[Knight165]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

lmao, actually Ruth has the record in my mind, they played less game back then.

I'm not sure why you quoted me in this response.
and the reply about not having to play against black or latin players....what does that have to do with anything?
Are you saying that Ruth wouldn't have hit 714 because he did not have to face them. Maybe you're right...maybe he would have hit 725...

M.K.
Knight165


Edit...okay... I see why you are saying this....you're referring to Maris. I was actually agreeing with him because those three guys are dirty as far as I'm concerned. Maris had nothing to do with the schedule....that was out of his control. Can't blame him for that....but I see where you're coming from.

[Diadem]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

I'm not sure why you quoted me in this response.
and the reply about not having to play against black or latin players....what does that have to do with anything?
Are you saying that Ruth wouldn't have hit 714 because he did not have to face them. Maybe you're right...maybe he would have hit 725...

M.K.
Knight165


Edit...okay... I see why you are saying this....you're referring to Maris. I was actually agreeing with him because those three guys are dirty as far as I'm concerned. Maris had nothing to do with the schedule....that was out of his control. Can't blame him for that....but I see where you're coming from.

My point is Ruth played in a league that did not have people of color, the Negro leagues were a different style of baseball than the major leagues at the time. Negro leagues had the speed game, and had the better players.

[Knight165]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

My point is Ruth played in a league that did not have people of color, the Negro leagues were a different style of baseball than the major leagues at the time. Negro leagues had the speed game, and had the better players.

I know what you're driving at...I just don't see what you are saying in terms of Ruth's record. Are you alluding that he would NOT have hit 714?....I say he might have hit 725. We'll never know.
I don't see how you are so definitive about something that is impossible to actually compare.

M.K.
Knight165

[Diadem]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

I know what you're driving at...I just don't see what you are saying in terms of Ruth's record. Are you alluding that he would NOT have hit 714?....I say he might have hit 725. We'll never know.
I don't see how you are so definitive about something that is impossible to actually compare.

M.K.
Knight165

That is the sad part of it all, due to a racist running the league (commisioner Landis) denying people of color jobs during the depression and wartime. We will never know just how good the Negro league players would have been by displaying their talents against the big leagues, or we could have seen many of the so called greats exposed as frauds.

[mjb2124]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

we could have seen many of the so called greats exposed as frauds.

It goes both ways. Maybe some of the great negro league players would be exposed as frauds as well. Josh Gibson, Cool Papa Bell, Oscar Charleston, Buck Leonard etc.... Who knows what type of numbers they'd REALLY put up in a non-segregated league that keeps stats.

Negro leagues had the speed game, and had the better players.

Again, it goes both ways. No one can emphatically state that either league had the better players because neither league was playing against the best the other had to offer. They were both "watered down" leagues.

Pittsburgh has a VERY deep and storied tradition with the Negro Leagues. Most of these guys played here for the Homestead Grays or Pittsburgh Crawfords and there are many museums dedicated to them. I've been to most of these museums because I enjoy learning about baseball from every angle. My grandfather SAW Josh Gibson, Satchel Paige and many others play live (as one of the ballparks is close to his home). I trust his judgement. He's stated that these guys were good. No doubt about that. However, like I stated above, it was watered down. Gibson was hitting HR's off guys who had no business playing baseball. Paige was striking out guys who looked like they had never swung a bat before. That's not to say they weren't good.....they were....they were very good. However, it's very tough to judge.

A large problem is that records were either not kept or were incomplete and not accurate. Many were passed down by word of mouth. We all know how that goes in terms of accuracy.

So I guess in my long winded rambling, all I'm saying is that neither league was better than the other and it's really quite difficult to judge the talent from either league.

[Diadem]

Re: Official Barry Bonds Thread

It goes both ways. Maybe some of the great negro league players would be exposed as frauds as well. Josh Gibson, Cool Papa Bell, Oscar Charleston, Buck Leonard etc.... Who knows what type of numbers they'd REALLY put up in a non-segregated league that keeps stats.



Again, it goes both ways. No one can emphatically state that either league had the better players because neither league was playing against the best the other had to offer. They were both "watered down" leagues.

Pittsburgh has a VERY deep and storied tradition with the Negro Leagues. Most of these guys played here for the Homestead Grays or Pittsburgh Crawfords and there are many museums dedicated to them. I've been to most of these museums because I enjoy learning about baseball from every angle. My grandfather SAW Josh Gibson, Satchel Paige and many others play live (as one of the ballparks is close to his home). I trust his judgement. He's stated that these guys were good. No doubt about that. However, like I stated above, it was watered down. Gibson was hitting HR's off guys who had no business playing baseball. Paige was striking out guys who looked like they had never swung a bat before. That's not to say they weren't good.....they were....they were very good. However, it's very tough to judge.

A large problem is that records were either not kept or were incomplete and not accurate. Many were passed down by word of mouth. We all know how that goes in terms of accuracy.

So I guess in my long winded rambling, all I'm saying is that neither league was better than the other and it's really quite difficult to judge the talent from either league.

I understand and agree with you, but as far as keeping accurate stats that was a problem in the Major Leagues as well. As I said before it really is a sad situation though racism has cheated all of us.