ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

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  • Skerik
    Living in this tube
    • Mar 2004
    • 5215

    #16
    Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

    Originally posted by SPTO
    Let's put you in the situation, you're a young guy hoping to make a good impression in the big leagues and you're told to bean Blalock. Are you really going to do that at the risk of getting a reputation?

    Remember Pedro Martinez had a reputation for YEARS as a head hunter. It has only now dissipated slightly. I'd hate for any kid to be given that kind of rep.

    Now if Blalock had hit a HR i'd understand Guillen reaction but Blalock grounded out besides, sometimes putting someone on base like that can come back to haunt you. I think Matt Clement did that to the Jays earlier this year and in that same inning a HR was hit that gave the Jays the lead.
    The only thing he'd get a reputation for is being a team player and a guy who follows orders. You think he's going to get a rep as a headhunter because of one game in which his manager orders him to retaliate for the other team hitting his teammates? C'mon now.

    Your Pedro comparison is way off base. Pedro hit guys because he wanted to and because he had no regard for their safety when he wanted to push them off the plate. He wasn't doing it to retaliate for anything, wasn't doing it because his manager asked him to, that was the way Pedro operated because Pedro wanted to pitch that way. Totally different.

    And as far as having a guy get on base like that and come back to hurt you, is this rookie a pitcher or the manager? I don't think it's up to him to second guess his World-Series-winning manager and say, "You know coach, you may want to rethink this one. I remember when Matt Clement hit someone...."
    Helen: Everyone's special, Dash.
    Dash: [muttering] Which is another way of saying no one is.

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    • Dice
      Sitting by the door
      • Jul 2002
      • 6627

      #17
      Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

      This shows me that Tracey doesn't have the mentality to be in the majors yet. Yes, he's a rookie BUT that's no execuse. I've seen lots of rookie pitchers with an edge BUT this guy should have just refused to come into the game if he decided not to plunk this guy. I would've had more respect for the kid.

      And Tracey not retaliating and not following Ozzie orders probably does not sit well with his teammates. Which is why sending him down was a good move for the team and for Tracey. First of all, majority of the White Sox players are vets and they know the unwritten baseball rule of: "If your player is intentionally beaned, then your pitcher strikes back." Him not following the rule means that his teammates won't look at him as a team player. Secondly, Ozzie is the leader of this team. The whole team supports Ozzie and his decisions. And this team would run into a brick wall for Ozzie. And for them to see Tracey defy Ozzie's orders also brings down his opinion as a teammate with his team.
      I have more respect for a man who let's me know where he stands, even if he's wrong. Than the one who comes up like an angel and is nothing but a devil. - Malcolm X

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      • snepp
        We'll waste him too.
        • Apr 2003
        • 10007

        #18
        Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

        This wouldn't be an issue if the umps weren't so trigger happy with the ultimatum warnings.

        Plunkings weren't a problem until the MLB made them a problem. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Dump the warnings and let the players settle things like men (by acting like children ).
        Member of The OS Baseball Rocket Scientists Association

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        • mjb2124
          Hall Of Fame
          • Aug 2002
          • 13649

          #19
          Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

          Originally posted by Dice
          Yes, he's a rookie BUT that's no execuse. I've seen lots of rookie pitchers with an edge BUT this guy should have just refused to come into the game if he decided not to plunk this guy.
          Hold up a minute. How did he know that's what the order was when he was called upon? I'm sure they didn't tell him that in the bullpen as that's not the way it works.

          He was probably told on the mound by Guillen after he already entered the game or was given a sign by his catcher previous to the first pitch to hit the guy. If he says "No" and storms off the mound at that point, his career is over. This isn't about Tracey's "edge" as much as it's about Guillen's stupidity IMO. This story wouldn't even be a story if Guillen handled the entire situation appropriately.

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          • TarHeelMan
            Th* H*mb*rg*r P*mp
            • Jul 2002
            • 7853

            #20
            Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

            There's probably means of communicating the message... There's a phone linked from the dugout to the bullpen that the manager or pitching coach uses, I believe... So I'd imagine that it was probably made clear somehow... "When you get in, hit this SOB..."

            I understand he was in a rough spot, but he did himself more damage than good, IMO, by not going through with the order. I don't think Ozzie would have gone nutso if he hadn't made it explicitly clear what he expected... I haven't seen the video of the incident, I'm sure it's a doozy...

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            • SPTO
              binging
              • Feb 2003
              • 68046

              #21
              Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

              Originally posted by TarHeelMan
              There's probably means of communicating the message... There's a phone linked from the dugout to the bullpen that the manager or pitching coach uses, I believe... So I'd imagine that it was probably made clear somehow... "When you get in, hit this SOB..."
              .
              I believe they only talk to the bullpen coach and just ask "is he ready?" or say "I want so and so warming up let me know when he's ready".

              I doubt it goes further then that. That's why the manager is usually waiting at the mound when the new pitcher comes in to give instructions and such.
              Member of the Official OS Bills Backers Club

              "Baseball is the most important thing that doesn't matter at all" - Robert B. Parker

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              • Stu
                All Star
                • Jun 2004
                • 7924

                #22
                Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

                For anybody who saw it, how far inside were the two "inside pitches" before he retired Blalock?
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                • Vince
                  Bow for Bau
                  • Aug 2002
                  • 26017

                  #23
                  Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

                  Oswaldo is becoming a side show.
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                  • mjb2124
                    Hall Of Fame
                    • Aug 2002
                    • 13649

                    #24
                    Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

                    Originally posted by TarHeelMan
                    There's probably means of communicating the message... There's a phone linked from the dugout to the bullpen that the manager or pitching coach uses, I believe... So I'd imagine that it was probably made clear somehow... "When you get in, hit this SOB..."
                    Those phones are monitored (actually read something about that a while ago) so I doubt much was said over them. I don't know why they're monitored and I don't know who's monitoring them or recording the calls or what, but I know I read that. Maybe so they can detect a malfunction early?

                    That's why I believe it had to be said on the mound or through a sign by the catcher.
                    Last edited by mjb2124; 06-15-2006, 12:12 PM.

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                    • aukevin
                      War Eagle, Go Braves!
                      • Dec 2002
                      • 14700

                      #25
                      Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

                      Originally posted by camulos
                      For anybody who saw it, how far inside were the two "inside pitches" before he retired Blalock?
                      only the first one was inside, and it was pretty far in there. The rest were good pitches. If you have MLB.tv it is at the 153 minute mark on the whole game replay.

                      Atlanta Braves
                      - Auburn Tigers - Nashville Predators

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                      • mvb34
                        S**c*d* P**l C*-Ch*mp**n
                        • Jul 2002
                        • 8138

                        #26
                        Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

                        IF the remove the DH from AL would this be an issue?
                        http://www.twitch.tv/mikecharles34

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                        • Psyblast
                          2023 National Champions
                          • Jun 2003
                          • 42584

                          #27
                          Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

                          Originally posted by ExtremeGamer
                          I hate Ozzie Guillen.



                          Ditto. Ozzie Guillen and Ken Williams make it VERY easy to hate the White Sox.

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                          • Stu
                            All Star
                            • Jun 2004
                            • 7924

                            #28
                            Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

                            Originally posted by aukevin
                            only the first one was inside, and it was pretty far in there. The rest were good pitches. If you have MLB.tv it is at the 153 minute mark on the whole game replay.
                            Interesting. A lot of people consider throwing at a guy the same as hitting them in situations like these. Maybe he thought he did what he was supposed to do? Do you think he was throwing at him with the first pitch?
                            Sim Gaming Network

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                            • TheTruth916
                              All Star
                              • Aug 2002
                              • 5991

                              #29
                              Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

                              If I am a rookie pitcher and know the history with AJ...I am not going to defend him even if he's on my team. There was a poll out like last month I believe that was voted among players or something like that and it was "If you could plunk anyone in the league who would it be?" half the votes was for AJ. I would rather take a out than have my pitcher hit another batter when losing as bad as they were, because all your asking for is for everything to get out of hand, because of Ozzie Guillen being a little childish.
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                              • aukevin
                                War Eagle, Go Braves!
                                • Dec 2002
                                • 14700

                                #30
                                Re: ChiSox rookie refuses to hit Blalock

                                Originally posted by camulos
                                Interesting. A lot of people consider throwing at a guy the same as hitting them in situations like these. Maybe he thought he did what he was supposed to do? Do you think he was throwing at him with the first pitch?
                                EDIT: Second pitch almost hit him, It was around the shoulder. Actually, the first pitch wasn't shown on MLB.tv I think. It was around the feet I guess, they showed a replay of it. It showed Guillen yell at the pitcher on the bench, you never see Guillen pull his shirt over his head, but you do see Guillen slam down his water bottle. It was obvious the first pitch was meant for him. Maybe Guillen just said "Deliver a message," and Tracey though he did with grazing him on the first pitch.

                                I still say if Guillen wants a batter hit, he can go out there and do it. Maybe Tracey didn't feel like getting his butt kicked by Blalock after hitting him.
                                Last edited by aukevin; 06-15-2006, 12:42 PM.

                                Atlanta Braves
                                - Auburn Tigers - Nashville Predators

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