Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

[Freelance]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

So it took steroids to finally end the Red Sox 86-year championship drought?

How tainted are those titles now?

[Skerik]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

David Ortiz, February 2009:

"I think you clean up the game by the testing," Ortiz said. "I test you, you test positive, you're going to be out. Serious. I know that if I test positive for using any kind of substance, I know that I'm going to disrespect my family, the game, the fans, and everybody. I don't want to be facing that situation, so what I will do, I won't use."

Hahaha. These guys all thought they were totally in the clear, so they all quit using, feigned such tremendous indignation at the thought of using, and said they never used at all. They must be mad as hell that their names are actually connected to these tests and being leaked to the public.

Release all the names. Out them all.

[Blzer]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

So it took steroids to finally end the Red Sox 86-year championship drought?

How tainted are those titles now?

I was thinking the same thing. Ortiz was a big reason for that ALCS to turn in their favor.

[DrJones]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

I've said it before...baseball isn't the only sport doing this, yet it seems it's the only sport people care about it in (well, cycling...but it's not mainstream). I'd bet that the NFL/NHL/NBA has had just as many PED users, and yet NO ONE seems to care.

It's because a lot of baseball's popularity is tied to history and numbers. If some gigantic NFL lineman uses roids and gets even more gigantic, well, he's better able to push other big people around. If an MLB slugger uses roids and becomes a better slugger, he's challenging decades-old records held by American icons.

[Freelance]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

It's because a lot of baseball's popularity is tied to history and numbers. If some gigantic NFL lineman uses roids and gets even more gigantic, well, he's better able to push other big people around. If an MLB slugger uses roids and becomes a better slugger, he's challenging decades-old records held by American icons.

Also, steroids can make you more prone to injury ironically. So NFL players that roid out often do so to the quick end of their career.

[Checmate101]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

blah..Who cares

[DrJones]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

I've said it before...baseball isn't the only sport doing this, yet it seems it's the only sport people care about it in (well, cycling...but it's not mainstream). I'd bet that the NFL/NHL/NBA has had just as many PED users, and yet NO ONE seems to care.

To follow up on my previous post, the only "cheating" athletes who I somewhat feel for are Olympians (track-and-field, etc.). Their ONLY chance at fame-and-fortune is to be at the very top of their sport, and they have exactly one chance every 4 years. If an elite baseball or football player is caught cheating, they face minor penalties, still have all their millions, and have legions of fans claiming "everybody did it" and are willing to forgive them. If an Olympian (even an elite one) is caught cheating, you're banned for 2 years, your records are taken away, your earning power is zero, and you're basically thrown away like trash.

[ryanm1058123]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

It's almost like Christmas has come early.

[Kearnzo]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

LMAO at anyone saying the Sox championships are tainted. So, if you look at it that way, the last god knows how many World Series titles are tainted as well. Face it, the majority of the league is on PED's, so if you are going to taint one team, you need to taint them all.

I'm not condoning this at all, as being a Sox fan, this is a sad, yet expected day. It just frustrates me that people immediately say "taint the titles!" when it's blatantly clear that you'd also have to taint damn near every other title from the past 20 years, at least.

[Cebby]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

It's because a lot of baseball's popularity is tied to history and numbers. If some gigantic NFL lineman uses roids and gets even more gigantic, well, he's better able to push other big people around. If an MLB slugger uses roids and becomes a better slugger, he's challenging decades-old records held by American icons.

Not only that but you can actually tell when a MLB player took steroids.

Bonds, Sosa, and Ortiz made huge jumps in over the course of 1-2 seasons.

I doubt the NBA has more than 2-3 big men roiding. Rapid strength gaining throws off your shot something awful, and being overly strong isn't nearly worth that to most players.

The NFL has steroid users, but it also has far and away the most intense weight training of all major sports and (on average) starts earlier than the other sports so people can be legitimately jacked and as said, there's no way to tell if someone's juicing like in baseball (unless they start punching out car windows to get a "place at the table").

[DrJones]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

It's almost like Christmas has come early.

Would everyone's head explode if Derek Jeter's name were on the list? Or just Tim McCarver's?

[Freelance]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

blah..Who cares

Pujols is next.

[SPTO]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

Not surprised at all and I agree with Skerik 100%. These guys all thought they were in the clear and became all sanctimonious about it but now the crow comes home to roost.

release all the names!

I'll be so vindicated to see Pujols on there as everybody seems to clamor to him as the last clean guy in MLB.

[ryanm1058123]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

Would everyone's head explode if Derek Jeter's name were on the list? Or just Tim McCarver's?

We'll get to that discussion if Jeter's name is on the list.

That being said, the moral highground that the Red Sox fans were on before this after steroids has now crumbled. It's hilarious.

[Kashanova]

Re: Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz on "The List"

LMAO at anyone saying the Sox championships are tainted. So, if you look at it that way, the last god knows how many World Series titles are tainted as well. Face it, the majority of the league is on PED's, so if you are going to taint one team, you need to taint them all.

I'm not condoning this at all, as being a Sox fan, this is a sad, yet expected day. It just frustrates me that people immediately say "taint the titles!" when it's blatantly clear that you'd also have to taint damn near every other title from the past 20 years, at least.

ortiz probably doesn't get by mariano in 2004 clean....