Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

[SPTO]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

Re-read my posts in this thread.

Yes I know you acknowledge him as HOFer if he does the 200+ hits for a few more years thing but the first part of my post relates to if he retired today.

Unless maybe i'm misunderstanding then my bad.

[DrJones]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

So how do you think he compares to Wade Boggs? He's also racked up a ton of steals and runs (of course).

Ichiro is a far superior baserunner and defender, of course. Strictly as a hitter, if you compare Boggs' first nine years to Ichiro's, I'll take Pitt the Elder. Boggs would regularly rack up 200+ hits AND 100 walks (as opposed to Ichiro's 50 walks) in addition to hitting 40-50 doubles per year (as opposed to Ichiro's 25). Advantage, Boggs.

Again, nowhere am I saying that Ichiro doesn't deserve to be a Hall-of-Famer. I'm just saying that if his career ended RIGHT NOW, his first 9 years of offensive production wouldn't be good enough on their own, but his speed and defence put him over the top.

[thaima1shu]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

Yes I know you acknowledge him as HOFer if he does the 200+ hits for a few more years thing but the first part of my post relates to if he retired today.

Unless maybe i'm misunderstanding then my bad.

DrJones' first post acknowledges that given Ichiro's baserunning and defense, he is a HOFer. His argument is strictly based off hitting alone.

[SPTO]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

DrJones' first post acknowledges that given Ichiro's baserunning and defense, he is a HOFer. His argument is strictly based off hitting alone.

Oh okay thanks. Slow moment there. I can see that point for sure. If Ichiro was just a slap hitter with nothing else to bring to the table he'd just be a better version of Juan Pierre and I think most would agree Pierre is no HOFer.

[fugazi]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

So strictly as a hitter, Ichiro has had a better career than Manny Ramirez? 2001-09 Ichiro would be a better DH than 1998-06 Manny? LOL

you're right...you could even stretch Manny's production back to '95...

[Jasong7777]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

Yes

[wwharton]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

Ichiro is a far superior baserunner and defender, of course. Strictly as a hitter, if you compare Boggs' first nine years to Ichiro's, I'll take Pitt the Elder. Boggs would regularly rack up 200+ hits AND 100 walks (as opposed to Ichiro's 50 walks) in addition to hitting 40-50 doubles per year (as opposed to Ichiro's 25). Advantage, Boggs.

Again, nowhere am I saying that Ichiro doesn't deserve to be a Hall-of-Famer. I'm just saying that if his career ended RIGHT NOW, his first 9 years of offensive production wouldn't be good enough on their own, but his speed and defence put him over the top.

Yeah I got what you were saying, I was wondering how he compared to Boggs to you if we only considered hitting. Good points though, so I guess Boggs would win.

[rsox]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

Interstingly Ichiro already has more 200 hit seasons (10) than Tony Gwynn (5) or Wade Boggs (7) had in their careers, and has as many as Pete Rose had in his career.

Ichiro is a sure fire first ballot HoF'er.

[WazzuRC]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

Interstingly Ichiro already has more 200 hit seasons (10) than Tony Gwynn (5) or Wade Boggs (7) had in their careers, and has as many as Pete Rose had in his career.

Ichiro is a sure fire first ballot HoF'er.

Not sure how much this has to do with it, but to be fair he also hits leadoff so he has more AB's.

I love Ichiro but I'd take Tony Gwynn as a pure hitter over him in a heartbeat.

[daflyboys]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

Non-question. Non-thread.

[fugazi]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

Not sure how much this has to do with it, but to be fair he also hits leadoff so he has more AB's.

? seriously ?

you might as well argue it is unfair for Aaron to have more HRs than Ruth because he played longer.

[WazzuRC]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

? seriously ?

you might as well argue it is unfair for Aaron to have more HRs than Ruth because he played longer.

Do you honestly think Pete Rose is the greatest hitter of all-time?

When did I ever say it was unfair to Boggs or Gwynn or that they weren't as good of hitters?

[rsox]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

Not sure how much this has to do with it, but to be fair he also hits leadoff so he has more AB's.

I love Ichiro but I'd take Tony Gwynn as a pure hitter over him in a heartbeat.

Wade Boggs batted leadoff in the lineup more times than any other spot in the batting order (927 games). Gwynn was primarily a number 3 hitter with the Padres but also hit 1 or 2 in their lineup in more than 1000 games.

How much does it help? not really sure but i imagine he does not get that many more AB's than the 2 or 3 hitters..

[Dice]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

I share the same opinions most people share and that is he's a first ballot HOFer. BUT with the way the committee has their heads up their asses, you never know.

I assumed that Roberto Alomar(the best 2nd baseman I seen play) was a first ballot HOFer.

[wwharton]

Re: Ichiro. Hall of Famer?

I share the same opinions most people share and that is he's a first ballot HOFer. BUT with the way the committee has their heads up their asses, you never know.

I assumed that Roberto Alomar(the best 2nd baseman I seen play) was a first ballot HOFer.

I think Alomar is having the spitting thing held against him but he'll get in. Ichiro's impact off the field will trump what he's done on it, and what he's done on it is amazing. They may put him in before he retires (exaggerating of course).