Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

[snepp]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

But they tell you the most important parts of the story

More like the misused and often misleading parts.

Wins are an unimportant stat as far as foresight goes, but as far as hindsight goes, it's a great stat IMO.

Wins suck in hindsight too.

[Blzer]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

Wins suck in hindsight too.

No one stat tells the whole story. Wins definitely do not either (much less than others), but in the end, if your pitcher gets the win, they were good enough for that game. Period.

If Felix Hernandez loses a game 1-0 and that run was from a batter scoring because two outfielders collided into each other and went unconscious, Felix still wasn't good enough to win that game. It doesn't say a thing about the pitcher's ability, but he did not get the win. In hindsight, it's all relative. Of course, in foresight (as this thread is asking about), you want the best pitchers out there that you can get. Felix, Roy, Timmy, and Justin would be atop those lists.

Let me put it bluntly: if I knew, in foresight, that I could choose between pitchers A & B, where A gives up one run per complete game and pitcher B gives up one run less than their offense's final score every complete game, I would always choose pitcher B. Why relinquish wins? Of course, we can't ever see this in foresight, and we can in hindsight. That's why it's a valuable hindsight statistic.

[55]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

If Felix Hernandez loses a game 1-0 and that run was from a batter scoring because two outfielders collided into each other and went unconscious, Felix still wasn't good enough to win that game.

And neither was his offense.

[OSUFan_88]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

And neither was his offense.

Or his defense.

Additionally, how does Felix fix that problem? Strike out 27 hitters so he can be "good enough"? Field every baseball?

Wins and losses is a stupid stat that could be completely eradicated and we'd lose nothing in being able to quantify how good a pitcher is or not.

[bkrich83]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

Angels announced their rotation today. CJ Wilson will be the #4 guy in their rotation.

[ThePhillyPhanatic]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

Angels announced their rotation today. CJ Wilson will be the #4 guy in their rotation.

So Ervin Santana is the 3rd starter?

[ThePhillyPhanatic]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

So Ervin Santana is the 3rd starter?

That is pretty sick. The Phillies also did that. They put Hamels as the 4 starter and Vance Worley as the three starter because they wanted Cole to start the home-opener.

[ThePhillyPhanatic]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

This is a pole/discussion talking about which team has the bast pitching rotation?
These ranking are based off of
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...itching-staffs

10) Rangers:

1. RHP Yu Darvish
2. RHP Colby Lewis
3. RHP Derek Holland
4. RHP Neftali Feliz
5. LHP Matt Harrison

9) Cardinals:

1. RHP Chris Carpenter*
2. RHP Adam Wainwright
3. LHP Jaime Garcia
4. RHP Kyle Lohse
5. RHP Jake Westbrook

8) Yankees:

1. LHP CC Sabathia
2. RHP Ivan Nova
3. RHP Hiroki Kuroda
4. RHP Michael Pineda
5. RHP Phil Hughes

7) D-Backs:

1. RHP Ian Kennedy
2. RHP Daniel Hudson
3. LHP Joe Saunders
4. RHP Trevor Cahill
5. RHP Josh Collmenter

6) Rays:

1. LHP David Price
2. RHP James Shields
3. RHP Jeremy Hellickson
4. LHP Matt Moore
5. RHP Jeff Niemann

5) Brewers:

1. RH Yovani Gallardo
2. RH Zach Greinke
3. RH Shaun Marcum
4. LH Randy Wolf
5. LH Chris Narveson

4) Giants:

1. RHP Tim Lincecum
2. RHP Matt Cain
3. LHP Madison Bumgarner
4. RHP Ryan Vogelsong
5. LHP Barry Zito

3) Tigers:

1. RHP Justin Verlander
2. RHP Max Scherzer
3. RHP Doug Fister
4. RHP Rick Porcello
5. LHP Andrew Oliver

2) Angels:

1. RHP Jered Weaver
2. RHP Dan Haren
3. LHP C.J. Wilson
4. RHP Ervin Satana
5. RHP Jerome Williams

1) Phillies:

1. RHP Roy Halladay
2. LHP Cliff Lee
3. LHP Cole Hamels
4. RHP Vance Worley
5. RHP Joe Blanton

My observation: The Tigers are too high... All they got is JV and then the rest are avg. I like in Michigan and I watch them on TV, they definatley are not the 3rd best.

Now, what do you guys think?
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Also, all the Tigers have is JV. Scherzer and Fister have some talent, but they haven't been using some of it. They should be ranked around 6th or 7th. Just my opinion though.

[55]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

Angels announced their rotation today. CJ Wilson will be the #4 guy in their rotation.

They play KC (a right handed heavy lineup) for the first three games before heading to face Minnesota (a left handed heavy lineup in a pitcher's park) next. I'm sure that somewhat factored into Scioscia's decision.

[ThePhillyPhanatic]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

They play KC (a right handed heavy lineup) for the first three games before heading to face Minnesota (a left handed heavy lineup in a pitcher's park) next. I'm sure that somewhat factored into Scioscia's decision.

Oh, okay. That's probably why.

[ThePhillyPhanatic]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

Roy Halladay gave up hits to the first 2 batters, then retired 24 straight batters! Just another day at work for Doc... (2 Hits, 0 ER, 0 R, 0 BB, 5 K's!)

[AutoMG]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

I agree that the Tigers are far too high even though they have in my homer opinion the best pitcher in the league in Verlander, Fister is solid but the rest is just average. Scherzer and Porcello can either be great or flat out suck and no idea about Oliver.

Verlander was just dominant like usual today, love watching him pitch. (2 Hits, 0 ER, 0 R, 1 BB, 7 K's)

[bkrich83]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

They play KC (a right handed heavy lineup) for the first three games before heading to face Minnesota (a left handed heavy lineup in a pitcher's park) next. I'm sure that somewhat factored into Scioscia's decision.

Maybe. Scioscia has never really operated like that in the past.

[CabreraMVP]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

Also, all the Tigers have is JV. Scherzer and Fister have some talent, but they haven't been using some of it. They should be ranked around 6th or 7th. Just my opinion though.

If Fister can put up a 2.83 without using his talent, I can only imagine what he's capable of when he uses his talent. Hmm.

The only way the Tigers are this high is if Scherzer pitches like he did the 2nd half of 2010/first half of 2011. And Porcello has to pitch like he is capable of. Both of these guys, with some consistency, are great 3-4 starters and would make Detroit a top 5 rotation. But we will see how they do this year. They were up and down literally every single month last year.

[BatsareBugs]

Re: Best Pitching Rotation Discussion

The Padres have the best pitching rotation in ALL of baseball

Spoiler

if you remove the other 29 teams in the league and ignore all the minor league ballclubs.