NBA2K15 @ E3

**strhsrtjhu** · 06-18-2014, 07:20 AM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Of course, that's just hope on my part though.

**strhsrtjhu** · 06-18-2014, 07:28 AM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Of course, that's just hope on my part though.

**manustyle90** · 06-18-2014, 09:54 AM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

 I truly hope NBA 2k15 will be at E3.

I can’t wait to see how many VCs I have to spend to give my MyPlayer a Youtube account.
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**ricardo.13** · 06-18-2014, 10:22 AM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Originally posted by KyotoCarl

2K normally doesn't show its new NBA game at e3 so there's nothing strange.
2k usually doesn't show much this early in the summer.

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

It's not true, remember Kobe E3 2011.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtPjPvFu06E

**spankdatazz22** · 06-18-2014, 12:18 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Originally posted by RogerBlack

Personally, I have NEVER said I didn't want the 2K marketers on this site.

But you just assumed that I did.

I didn't assume you did. If you read my first post in this thread, I said:

Haven't some of you guys (collectively) been saying you don't want the HYPE since you felt so betrayed by the game last year?

I was speaking to the overall negativity on the board, very little is positive. I didn't mean to misrepresent you but I'm guessing if I'm recalling your posts correctly you seem to be consistently negative re the game also. As such I didn't think it was an issue lumping together those that tend to be negative - just as I'd have no problems being lumped in with those that are overly positive towards the game. So I found it funny when 2K's accused of abandoning everything simulation related/only catering to casuals, or whatever else but they're accused of but still expected to attempt to woo this crowd.

The pre-release information for next-gen 2K14 was almost universally positive regarding the feature list/ what they were upgrading from last gen 2K14, the trailers released, etc. Eight months later the game is an abomination, if those that are vocal on the board are to be believed. So I don't see how there's much that they could say that this forum wouldn't shoot down. Given the negativity I don't get the idea they should be trying to hype you up even though it was likely any information would likely be rejected.

As others have said it's not like 2K's had a strong presence at E3 for a while. You mentioned they had a big presence back with 2K11 but that was 4 years ago. So I don't see how not having a heavy presence this year somehow constitutes a sign for bad things to come.

**fatleg3** · 06-18-2014, 12:58 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Everyone jonesing for some more 2k I see.

Sent from Plant City, Florida

**King_B_Mack** · 06-18-2014, 01:27 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Originally posted by ricardo.13

It's not true, remember Kobe E3 2011.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtPjPvFu06E

No it is true. Nice of you to leave out the fact that they're only there on stage and showing off the game because that was the debut of the Playstation Move technology. Nice work.

**VDusen04** · 06-18-2014, 01:27 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Originally posted by spankdatazz22

I was speaking to the overall negativity on the board, very little is positive. I didn't mean to misrepresent you but I'm guessing if I'm recalling your posts correctly you seem to be consistently negative re the game also. As such I didn't think it was an issue lumping together those that tend to be negative - just as I'd have no problems being lumped in with those that are overly positive towards the game. So I found it funny when 2K's accused of abandoning everything simulation related/only catering to casuals, or whatever else but they're accused of but still expected to attempt to woo this crowd.

With respect, I think lumping an entire group together based upon whether some (or much) of their feedback is positive or negative could be a recipe for broad generalizations and widespread misunderstandings.

For instance, hypothetically, if I have a well-reasoned argument for a shortcoming with NBA 2K, I do not particularly appreciate being blindly lumped together collectively with "you guys", grouping me with many people who might not participate in reasoned discussions. I admit I often attempt to be direct in my enjoyable discussions here but sometimes feel my reasonings are ignored, replaced with what one feels the masses feel collectively. I think that might be what Roger is referencing.

The pre-release information for next-gen 2K14 was almost universally positive regarding the feature list/ what they were upgrading from last gen 2K14, the trailers released, etc. Eight months later the game is an abomination, if those that are vocal on the board are to be believed. So I don't see how there's much that they could say that this forum wouldn't shoot down. Given the negativity I don't get the idea they should be trying to hype you up even though it was likely any information would likely be rejected.

I do not very well recall the reception of pre-release information for next-gen so I shall take your word for it in this particular instance. I think a lot of those feelings evaporated once some folks purchased and began to grasp what 2K14 did and did not do, both in terms of direction and implementation (much of which is referenced in my post here: http://www.operationsports.com/forum...ba-2k15-2.html).

That said, yeah, I think this is maybe the toughest crowd I've seen on the 2K forums. I do not believe the members here will just blindly hate anything brought forth by 2K. Instead, I think 2K just may have lost a lot of the benefit of the doubt. I admit there was a part of me that used to take the stance of, "In NBA 2K I trust." As many of us were originally drawn to 2K for its simulation and authentic concepts (on and off the court), I think the recent alterations (again, mentioned in my post linked above) have added to the skepticism.

I believe folks here would be hyped if given proper reason to be. Though surely, I still think 2K's earned themselves a "Wait-and-see" approach amongst many. It's like when they revealed the Dream Team in 2K13. I was hyped because it sounded like incredible news (even acquiring Scottie Pippen after the fact). Alas, upon release it was revealed that the two Dream Teams were self-contained, forced to wear generic shoes, and were not at all editable, basically relegating them to one tiny controlled matchup with one another.

Basically, Dream Team sounded great in theory, but ultimately ended up having unforeseen shortcomings. I think people worry about that with 2K now more than they used to, particularly with a slightly limited amount of transparency from 2K's camp. Many of us are growing to learn that silence on a particular topic (in lieu of clarity) may often be cause for concern.

TL;DR - If 2K builds it, they will come. But it'll have to be legit.

As others have said it's not like 2K's had a strong presence at E3 for a while. You mentioned they had a big presence back with 2K11 but that was 4 years ago. So I don't see how not having a heavy presence this year somehow constitutes a sign for bad things to come.

Right with ya on that one. I have very little memory of 2K ever showing much at E3. From what I recall, June is a very funny time in their production cycle, usually late enough to have their plans in order, but still much too early for anything to be implemented into a build ready to be shown at a convention.

**El_Poopador** · 06-18-2014, 02:41 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Originally posted by spankdatazz22

I didn't assume you did. If you read my first post in this thread, I said:

I was speaking to the overall negativity on the board, very little is positive. I didn't mean to misrepresent you but I'm guessing if I'm recalling your posts correctly you seem to be consistently negative re the game also. As such I didn't think it was an issue lumping together those that tend to be negative - just as I'd have no problems being lumped in with those that are overly positive towards the game. So I found it funny when 2K's accused of abandoning everything simulation related/only catering to casuals, or whatever else but they're accused of but still expected to attempt to woo this crowd.

The pre-release information for next-gen 2K14 was almost universally positive regarding the feature list/ what they were upgrading from last gen 2K14, the trailers released, etc. Eight months later the game is an abomination, if those that are vocal on the board are to be believed. So I don't see how there's much that they could say that this forum wouldn't shoot down. Given the negativity I don't get the idea they should be trying to hype you up even though it was likely any information would likely be rejected.

As others have said it's not like 2K's had a strong presence at E3 for a while. You mentioned they had a big presence back with 2K11 but that was 4 years ago. So I don't see how not having a heavy presence this year somehow constitutes a sign for bad things to come.

Personally, I'm not looking for hype. Just the opposite; I hate marketing. The product is well-known. Enough so that it doesn't need hype. I don't want to see misleading trailers with spliced together footage that looks better in motion than the actual game will. I don't want to hear about what color I can make my leg sleeves if I preorder. What I DO want is transparency. I want to know what they're working on to make the game more like the NBA. I want to know what they are fixing in relation to the debacle that is NBA 2k14 (VC implementation, missing features, free agency in My Career, game-breaking glitches, etc.). I want to know what they are addressing in terms of legacy issues. I want to know if they're going to make their AI more human-like, and how.

And if they are unable to do something, I want to know why. An explanation can go a long way if something can't be implemented.

**d11king** · 06-18-2014, 02:54 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

For the past month, I've been coming to the 2K section in hopes of seeing Steve_OS post something in red that's brand new for me to lose my marbles over, only to have my heart broken each time. I even avoid coming here for days just to try and surprise myself but

What the hell is wrong with me people?

**spankdatazz22** · 06-18-2014, 09:03 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Originally posted by El_Poopador

Personally, I'm not looking for hype. Just the opposite; I hate marketing. The product is well-known. Enough so that it doesn't need hype. I don't want to see misleading trailers with spliced together footage that looks better in motion than the actual game will. I don't want to hear about what color I can make my leg sleeves if I preorder. What I DO want is transparency. I want to know what they're working on to make the game more like the NBA. I want to know what they are fixing in relation to the debacle that is NBA 2k14 (VC implementation, missing features, free agency in My Career, game-breaking glitches, etc.). I want to know what they are addressing in terms of legacy issues. I want to know if they're going to make their AI more human-like, and how.

And if they are unable to do something, I want to know why. An explanation can go a long way if something can't be implemented.

Everything gets hyped, whether it's a new game, a tv show, a new movie, the Super Bowl, etc. There's no sense trying to set the expectation that the product is well known enough that it doesn't need to be marketed. As to the game's issues, I'm sure it'll be like any other year - some things will be fixed to people's satisfaction, other things won't. Hopefully they'll be a little more forthcoming with what's being done behind the scenes, but at the end of the day it's a videogame. These guys aren't NASA scientists so making the AI more "human-like" at some point will come down to what an individual's perspective is of what's a practical expectation to have for a videogame. I'd still give them credit for what they delivered as a launch game, good along with the bad.

**spankdatazz22** · 06-18-2014, 09:59 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Originally posted by VDusen04

That said, yeah, I think this is maybe the toughest crowd I've seen on the 2K forums. I do not believe the members here will just blindly hate anything brought forth by 2K. Instead, I think 2K just may have lost a lot of the benefit of the doubt.

This is kind of what I don't understand, at least to the degree that those that are more vocal on the board have taken it. For all the goodwill 2K supposedly brought with years of everything-including-the-kitchen sink game releases, according to some it was all undone in some people's eyes with this next gen release. A system launch game that released on the heels of a fully efforted last gen release - a game which most people seem satisfied with. And a game that got kudos for it's gameplay - which OS used to say was the most cherished aspect of a game - but that gets tossed aside mostly because of what it lacked in features and it's VC implementation.

**VDusen04** · 06-18-2014, 10:28 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Originally posted by spankdatazz22

This is kind of what I don't understand, at least to the degree that those that are more vocal on the board have taken it. For all the goodwill 2K supposedly brought with years of everything-including-the-kitchen sink game releases, according to some it was all undone in some people's eyes with this next gen release. A system launch game that released on the heels of a fully efforted last gen release - a game which most people seem satisfied with. And a game that got kudos for it's gameplay - which OS used to say was the most cherished aspect of a game - but that gets tossed aside mostly because of what it lacked in features and it's VC implementation.

As I mentioned above, I can really only speak for myself. I have an inkling of why some people feel one way or another and I can speculate, but it seems you are broadly referencing folks other than myself, so it's tough to know exactly who and what for which you may be referring.

Personally, as I bet I've alluded previously, 2K's goodwill led me into a 2K13 purchase even as some reservations began to pile up. Again, for me personally, the Jay-Z push, the introduction of virtual currency, and the revelation that manual save was removed (tough one to take for a guy who loves customizing classic rosters and experimenting) all seemed a little unusual, but on 2K's good faith, I threw caution to the wind. I still enjoyed 2K13, but perhaps not as much as previous 2K's and as I've said many times, that product kind of put me on guard for 2K14.

As a result, I paid close attention to current gen 2K14 information and while it seemed like gameplay was spruced up, the rest of the game hit me as being much too similar to 2K13. Folks could claim it was a full effort, but 2K14 seemed more similar to 2K13 than any other year-to-year transition of the series. The reasons as to why this was so (or whether it is true) can be debated, but that is how I felt. Many seemed to like current gen 2K14, but it did not provide enough for me to warrant a purchase.

From there, next-gen 2K14 seemed to have its own set of issues and direction disputes, all documented heavily here on this forum. Again, I think much of this was referenced in my linked post above. So for me, the faith was not lost in an instance with next-gen. Rather, it stood strong as I purchased 2K13 on goodwill. Then it wavered as I found myself a little worried. Then 2K14 current gen raised some more flags for me and next-gen added on. I'm guessing I'm not the only person for whom this has been a multi-step process.

Also, perhaps it's asking a lot, but I desire an authentic NBA basketball experience both on and off the floor, or at least an honest attempt at conveying as such. I really like good gameplay, but it's a tough mix when the on-court gameplay's real but then off-the-court is filled with gold coins, mimes, linear storylines, and the removal of numerous realistic aspects and controls.

Similarly, I thought NBA Live's little "Day After" mode looked really cool this year (where they'd create challenges the day after real life games, mimicking what happened in real life). Unfortunately, NBA Live's gameplay was a mess. Soooo, again, maybe it's asking for a lot, but the on-court and off-court kind of need to be hand-in-hand for me. Quick Games get old for me, good sir.

**spankdatazz22** · 06-18-2014, 11:09 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Originally posted by VDusen04

Personally, as I bet I've alluded previously, 2K's goodwill led me into a 2K13 purchase even as some reservations began to pile up. Again, for me personally, the Jay-Z push, the introduction of virtual currency, and the revelation that manual save was removed (tough one to take for a guy who loves customizing classic rosters and experimenting) all seemed a little unusual, but on 2K's good faith, I threw caution to the wind. I still enjoyed 2K13, but perhaps not as much as previous 2K's and as I've said many times, that product kind of put me on guard for 2K14.

I'm not going to go through the merits of purchasing any 2K iteration the past few years. But imo it does show just how fickle some can be. It would seem 2K's on a "What have you done for me lately/prove it to me every year" standing with you if it only took one iteration of the game (2K13) for you to question what they were doing. Since most don't question 2K11, I think it's safe to say 2K delivered with that game. 2K12 was supposedly what you said you wanted - the focus was on delivering more Legend content, and delivering content only old school NBA fans would be able to appreciate in having era-specific presentation. You say you didn't like 2K13 so that gets thrown out. 2K14 last gen by most accounts delivered from a gameplay standpoint, has Association and most of the gameplay features/modes one would expect from a 2K game, but it didn't merit a purchase with you. I guess because it was missing some practice modes, and the presence of the My-whatever features. You even mention you would've gotten NBA Live, and that was their first attempt at releasing a product in years. Geez.

Again, you're VERY particular as to what you want - and there's nothing wrong with that, it's your prerogative. But I don't see how 2K could be expected to place a huge focus on gamers that are that specific in what they want, or they just outright choose the game's not worthy of a purchase.

**VDusen04** · 06-18-2014, 11:43 PM

Re: NBA2K15 @ E3

Originally posted by spankdatazz22

I'm not going to go through the merits of purchasing any 2K iteration the past few years. But imo it does show just how fickle some can be. It would seem 2K's on a "What have you done for me lately/prove it to me every year" standing with you if it only took one iteration of the game (2K13) for you to question what they were doing.

2K12 was supposedly what you said you wanted - the focus was on delivering more Legend content, and delivering content only old school NBA fans would be able to appreciate in having era-specific presentation. You say you didn't like 2K13 so that gets thrown out. 2K14 last gen by most accounts delivered from a gameplay standpoint, has Association and most of the gameplay features/modes one would expect from a 2K game, but it didn't merit a purchase with you. I guess because it was missing some practice modes, and the presence of the My-whatever features.

I think it is quite common for folks to question things when they see questionable things happening. I am interested in paying for products when I feel they are worth their price. And to pay $60 each year, I absolutely believe 2K has to prove themselves to me over and over. From 2K2 through 2K12 (minus 2K4), 2K was habitually in line enough with my desires that I could count on them to prove their product worthy year in and year out.

But again, once 2K13 was a little shaky to me (just like 2K4 was), being a vaguely frugal consumer, I was put on alert. In 2K4's case, I felt 2K5 attempted to right the ship, so I was back on board (even though it took them a few years to fully return to form). In 2K14's case (current gen), I just didn't see enough difference from one year to the next to warrant another purchase. Having felt so-so about 2K13, I wasn't really looking forward to what felt like a super patch in 2K14.

Regarding 2K12, I liked a lot about that game. The classic content was outstanding, but I also still felt the off-court direction seemed mostly in line with the realistic and mature angle I desired. It was not a perfect game (I was not in favor of the magic recovering defense and the elbow blocks) but I understand those sorts of issues are always bound to pop up. It's when their apparent off-court philosophy change seemed to begin to creep up in 2K13 that things began to get a little funny.

You even mention you would've gotten NBA Live, and that was their first attempt at releasing a product in years. Geez.

I am afraid I do not believe I said that. If that is in reference to my previous post, my quote was:

"Similarly, I thought NBA Live's little "Day After" mode looked really cool this year (where they'd create challenges the day after real life games, mimicking what happened in real life). Unfortunately, NBA Live's gameplay was a mess. Soooo, again, maybe it's asking for a lot, but the on-court and off-court kind of need to be hand-in-hand for me."

The point was to illustrate how I felt many sports gamers prefer games that provide a compelling product both on and off the court. I was compelled by a small portion of Live's off-court but not at all with their on-court. On the other hand, I was compelled by 2K's gameplay but not the bizarre turns their Association and MyPlayer modes took off the court. I am uncertain as to how that may have suggested to you that I "would've gotten NBA Live... Geez."

Again, you're VERY particular as to what you want - and there's nothing wrong with that, it's your prerogative. But I don't see how 2K could be expected to place a huge focus on gamers that are that specific in what they want, or they just outright choose the game's not worthy of a purchase.

I believe we all have very specific requests for our games. 2K's never given me everything I've wanted. But buying their game in the past has never been an issue for me because they had the big things I was looking for. In its simplest form, I own over 10 NBA 2K products because their former mission statement seemed to be in line with what I wanted - a realistic, authentic, and customizable attempt of creating a true-to-life NBA product, both on and off the court. Once that goal seemed to waver (particularly off the court), things began to get a little shaky for me, just as they did in 2004.

I'd have to do a little more research but from the outside looking in, MLB: The Show's crew most remind me of what NBA 2K used to convey. They seem committed to a fully authentic product from all angles (not just on-the-field gameplay) while being forthright in their development and executing what they feel would be best for their product. Their business plan seems to be "Make the most authentic baseball game possible and the people will come."

NBA2K15 @ E3

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