Why is it "okay" to cheat?

[ILLSmak]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

Only exploits here imo is screening in the paint and maybe corner stepbacks.

Exploiting to me is when u abuse something thats not intended. ex screening in the paint.

zig zag isn't really exploiting imo its cheese but not an exploit and to be clear im talking about zig zag 3 now, someone let me know how to get an open 3 1v1 by not going left then right or right then left by running or dribbling. People can easily say "well with ball movement and screens u can easily get open shots" this stuff doesn't work if u actually play against people who know how to defend and what to do.

Spamming of dribble moves might be cheesy its not exploiting. Ur simply dribbling.

Baseline driving isn't exploiting however its cheesy but only because 2k made it op.

"the online delay seeming to effect all my shots but not on the other side" this part i dont even know why u called it an exploit, myself i've noticed some games i just wont hit even tho i shoot like i always do. ex i had a 3 day period where i was pretty much the splash brothers baby, but after that i couldn't hit at all. they just need to fix the input delay.

Spamming the square/x button as u mentioned earlier is cheesy. however its nothing wrong it since i could be reaching 24/7 irl aswell tho i would be punished for it which 2k has failed to make it so u actually get punished for reaching.

Yeah, the screen in the paint needs to be addressed. I believe 2k needs to take a hard look at it and take out screening in the actual 'circle.' That never happens in the NBA.


Rebounding is generally broken. I am a really good rebounder (brag time) against the computer and online, whatever. I can out rebound almost anyone. I have some trouble with the pick in the paint people.


Anyway, the height of rebounding jumps is still too much. There is still a 'free zone' directly under the basket. I guess I play cheesy because I know this. It's still using the game mechanics, but that's where you wanna be. Even if you have to basically do a loop and come back in from under the basket. I've played against people who stand under the basket without doing a pick, like behind the backboard, and they still rebound well. You can seal them but it's harder than sealing them not in that spot.


If 2k fixed the rebounding ability of players and their hops, making it so that you'd have to think (you know, the whole 'the ball bounces to the other side of the rim statistically') and get into position instead of just fighting for a spot to stand while not getting 3 seconds. That's really the issue.


Zig zag is annoying, but you can stick those people. You can't keep them from making shots, but if you get better shots, you will make more. The illegal screens in park are pretty cheesy, too.


People driving baseline is simple. Let them drive and push into them plus square you will either knock them down for a shooting foul (which is no shot clock reset in park) or get the strip. They may score, but not often enough to win.


The step back 3 is kinda cheesy but generally when you know where people are going, you can stop them. The really good people's games mix all of the exploits together so it's a bit harder, but it's like rock paper scissor, you have to correctly guess what they are gonna throw in each game situation. Most cheesers aren't good enough at D. They are too busy throwing themselves on the ground after scores to taunt.


And there is the stage... the most cheesy place. It's a good place to see what the game is really like. You say why is it OK to cheat? To win. VC = time (or money) invested. If you are betting money, you wanna do it the best way possible. I don't mind being at a disadvantage because when I get people I know we can still destroy almost anyone, but the stage is a different beast. I choose to stay away from there (unless we're just clowning around in 5v5 or 3v3... ) because I refuse to do any of those listed exploits...


However, I've got my own stuff I can do. If it was 1v1, I think I could beat the cheesiest people, even with my C. NEXT YEAR ADD 1v1.


-Smak

[wiserbk]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

You really wanna keep going don't you?

The only one acting like it's so hard to defend is you, saying that we're saying that. In reality we all know how to defend it, but at the end of the day we also know it's overpowered garbage that shouldn't even work, period.

We don't have a problem defending it, you have a problem understanding that.

It's really hard not to insult you with them sneak disses you keep throwing out there, but it's cool I'm the bigger man. It's okay to disagree, that's why people have these things called opinions...
But at the end of the day all this stuff you're posting "counters" to, shouldn't be as effective as it is, or even in the game at all.

So if you wanna keep acting like you didn't have to post here, maybe take your own advice and leave this thread.

A) I don't see where anything is overpowered, already explained that most of these are not exploits it's jut people defending it wrong by taking the wrong angles or not using intense d and turbo correctly

B) as far as sneak dissing and other stuff you're buggin son. Ego is a helluva drug. You're saying something is easy to defend and advocate banning people for doing the thing that is easy to defend? Bruh you're confused.

I didn't see anything in this thread that is a cheese nor an exploit EXCEPT for screens in the paint. Which is debatable because do we really want 3 second violation in a park game? I'll keep saying it. Zig zag and baseline drives are easy to defend. They are good exploits because they are exploiting your bad defense. If someone doesn't know how to contest post do you start using step backs and isomotion or do you just back him down and get 2 points? Some people can't contest someone going left to right, because they angles they take are wrong and they don't know how to use intense d. Their opposition will use left and right. Simple as that. No cheese or ban able offense. If you want to in your words "insult me" for reiterating this again and again smh. "Really hard not to insult you" gimme a break

[Andreas85]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I'm done posting in this thread cuz it's like beating a dead horse now...

People have this mentality where online has to be this struggle between sim vs. cheese/exploits/cheaters.

For the hundredth time, I've been playing online games since 2004 when I was like 14 years old, I understand what online gaming is all about (winning at all costs as people say). I know what I'm getting myself into when I play a ranked game, or a park game, my team game, etc. But certain communities are beautiful entities compared to 2K. The online community in this game is horrendous.
I've never, ever, played a game where literally the whole game is predicated by someone tailoring their whole playstyle around an exploit or "cheese" because people won't accept the whole exploit thing I've been saying for whatever reason it is.

People change their games to be centered around poor play that rewards them. And again, for the hundredth time since people keep ignoring it, it is 100% on 2K to fix it.
These things are in the game for users to take advantage of because of 2K not fixing them, but you don't see people like me abusing it. I refuse to get cheap wins, it's no fun and no challenge.

So, at the end of the day, people who continually abuse things should not be issued a 24/48 hr ban? That's the consensus here.
You heard it folks, here at OS, people who preach sim gaming, are okay with fake-basketball online because "it should be expected", because it's "not an exploit", and because "we should get better and adapt to the people who abuse it".

-Double dribble, easy patch but I guess it's not on the (VC) agenda.

So what's the alternatives?

-Let it slide, and let us guys who respect the game of basketball and take a sim-mindset online keep losing to this kind of thing?
Make us adjust our games to the point where we're pretty much cheesing back? Where's the fun in that? The whole point is to win playing real ball, that's the most rewarding thing to do.

*It seems this is the route 2K has been taking...and it seems like the vast majority of online players are either:

Or the other alternative:

Start suspending repeat offenders.

Why not? Why do you guys not agree with this? Is it because you are one of them? Otherwise I see no issue to argue against doing that; I'm like at a loss for words why this is even a disagreeable thing..

My squad is great, but against a team of 3 or 5 of them exploiters (if they really know what they're doing), we don't even have a chance to win..nor do we even care enough to try hard to beat them. There's no point, when you got them kind of guys making the game look easy by exploiting that stuff. It's pathetic.

So if 2K/Microsoft/Sony gets enough complaints on a guy's username, maybe they should suspend him for 24 hours...doesn't get the hint? 48. He keeps abusing the game for wins? A week, etc.

But like I said, agree or don't, I'm not arguing anymore; in my mind, if you disagree, you're either ignorant or a cheeser. You lose nothing with this method, but gain the probability of having a cleaner, more fun online time.

How hard it is to understand? Double dribble and Screening in the paint is exploiting, however what you dont seem to understand is that zig-zag, driving baseline isn't exploiting how hard it is to actually understand that? Like you said it's 100% 2Ks fault it exists. Im gonna repeat myself it's the developers job to make sure the best way to play is somewhat close to real basketball.

Should a guy be issued a ban for spamming double dribble? I'd agree to that. However should a guy be issued a ban for driving baseline or zig-zaggin all the time? No, if you really think that, im sorry to say it but your stupid. I agree they should maybe start giving out temp bans for actual exploits i.e. double dribble. But not for things like driving baseline.

[bumpyface]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

Nba2k15 has the worst online play of any game I have every played. Madden online plays 1000X better than this POS.

[YaBoial]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

since they wanna add so many animations. how about one if you hugging the baseline defended u should lose the ball and fall out of bounds

[HowDareI]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

How hard it is to understand? Double dribble and Screening in the paint is exploiting, however what you dont seem to understand is that zig-zag, driving baseline isn't exploiting how hard it is to actually understand that? Like you said it's 100% 2Ks fault it exists. Im gonna repeat myself it's the developers job to make sure the best way to play is somewhat close to real basketball.

Should a guy be issued a ban for spamming double dribble? I'd agree to that. However should a guy be issued a ban for driving baseline or zig-zaggin all the time? No, if you really think that, im sorry to say it but your stupid. I agree they should maybe start giving out temp bans for actual exploits i.e. double dribble. But not for things like driving baseline.

Okay then I'm stupid for thinking teams of 3 guys zig zagging and winning game after game is making the online game a joke. And the more it works, and more people catch onto it, the more it happens.

You keep getting hung up on one thing, when I been saying the people who endlessly abuse all these things together are the problem.

You can't tell me you never played against a bunch of guys who "mastered" how to play and are nearly unbeatable because they implement every cheesy thing into their game...and it's all they do..those are the people who need to be taught a lesson.
If they're winning off this kind of stuff then it's a problem.

[Andreas85]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

Okay then I'm stupid for thinking teams of 3 guys zig zagging and winning game after game is making the online game a joke. And the more it works, and more people catch onto it, the more it happens.

You keep getting hung up on one thing, when I been saying the people who endlessly abuse all these things together are the problem.

You can't tell me you never played against a bunch of guys who "mastered" how to play and are nearly unbeatable because they implement every cheesy thing into their game...and it's all they do..those are the people who need to be taught a lesson.
If they're winning off this kind of stuff then it's a problem.

You still dont understand what im talking about, idc if someone zig-zags for 20 secs every possession then take a 3/drive baseline because ur still not exploiting. It's cheesy as hell but not exploiting thats what im trying to explain to you. Exploiting would be double dribble, or if i somehow found a way to glitch in and out of bounds without calls.

What im saying is pretty much:

A: Even if ur zig-zagging 20 sec every possession then drive baseline/shoot a 3 ur still not exploiting, you're cheesing like hell tho, but not exploiting. = no way in hell that u should get banned for it.

B: What is exploiting is i.e. double dribble or like i said earlier if i somehow found a way to glitch in and out of bounds without calls. = I'd agree on a ban here tho.

They can abuse it all they want because it's still not exploiting. Maybe we see exploiting differently.

Exploiting according to me: Is for example lets say were playing CoD and i somehow manage to glitch on top of a house which ur not supposed to be able to get on top off. Thats exploiting.

Cheese: i.e. Zig-zag ur not exploiting in any way, what ur doing is abusing the lack of defense/bad defense because of input lag(lets be clear zig-zag wouldn't exist if they fixed the input lag)im simply running left to right to try and loose you. Yes it's not even close to Sim, but its not exploiting.

None of these are cheats, nor exploits.

They're all part of why the online experience is abysmal, sure. But they're still just imbalances that are up to the developer of the game to fix.

[RodionMaZ]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I think these changes would fix 90% of the issues in mypark and rec and I don’t see why these changes would be hard to put into NBA 2k15

Good points! It's like my thought being put to words in a fashionable manner (:

I want to add just a bit: they must allow people to cheese (because to some of them it is a fun way to play), but they should separate "sim" (MyPark ) and "arcade" (MyCheese, lol) experience. So people, who want to play BASKETBALL, not a VIDEOGAME will be able to to into a park where cheese moves are fixed like you proposed.

[RodionMaZ]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I think these changes would fix 90% of the issues in mypark and rec and I don’t see why these changes would be hard to put into NBA 2k15

Good points! It's like my thoughts but they are put to words in a fashionable manner (:

I want to add just a bit: they must allow people to cheese (because to some of them it is a fun way to play), but they should separate "sim" (MyPark ) and "arcade" (MyCheese, lol) experience. So people, who want to play BASKETBALL, not a VIDEOGAME will be able to to into a park where cheese moves are fixed like you proposed.

[RodionMaZ]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I think these changes would fix 90% of the issues in mypark and rec and I don’t see why these changes would be hard to put into NBA 2k15

Good points! It's like my thoughts but they are put to words in a fashionable manner (:

I want to add just a bit: they must allow people to cheese (because to some of them it is a fun way to play), but they should separate "sim" (MyPark ) and "arcade" (MyCheese, lol) experience. So people, who want to play BASKETBALL, not a VIDEOGAME will be able to go online where cheese moves are fixed like you proposed.

[HowDareI]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

They're all part of why the online experience is abysmal, sure. But they're still just imbalances that are up to the developer of the game to fix.

Which is why I said if 2K's not taking the time to improve them issues then temporary ban people who do it..that's the point.

Exploits are subjective; to me it's just abusing things not meant to be abused.

The real person who determines it is 2K tho, and they always wanna come here talking about cutting down on the cheese and all that...well then prove it.

Your past patches fixed some of the stuff but not all of it, so before people ruin the online completely take a stand.

[Qbeezy24]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I think in this day in age developers are getting lazy with updates because they are making to much money from people who basically cheat the system which they created VC dummest but smartest thing they came up with. Ever since, what was it 2k12 or 2k11 where people glitched their player to 99 and played online well they planned to stop that with the always online mycareer so now you have to work for it but NO those sneaky devs say hey we should charge for VC so we can make money on those who want to cheat. More money to them and good frontend game but back end updates are a NONO with laziness.

[JerzeyReign]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I think in this day in age developers are getting lazy with updates because they are making to much money from people who basically cheat the system which they created VC dummest but smartest thing they came up with. Ever since, what was it 2k12 or 2k11 where people glitched their player to 99 and played online well they planned to stop that with the always online mycareer so now you have to work for it but NO those sneaky devs say hey we should charge for VC so we can make money on those who want to cheat. More money to them and good frontend game but back end updates are a NONO with laziness.

VC isn't cheating. I don't care how many times its griped about on here, it isn't cheating.

[Andreas85]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

Which is why I said if 2K's not taking the time to improve them issues then temporary ban people who do it..that's the point.

Exploits are subjective; to me it's just abusing things not meant to be abused.

To me that's not a valid point, you cant simply ban someone for not doing anything wrong. That's how they enjoy playing the game. Some people enjoy playing a certain way i.e. Sim style, Some people likes playing sim but also like to cheese. Some people enjoy cheesing out of their minds and they dislike playing Sim. Should they get banned for cheesing? No. But like i said earlier people who double dribble frequently should be isssued a temporary ban.

[Andreas85]

Re: Why is it "okay" to cheat?

I think in this day in age developers are getting lazy with updates because they are making to much money from people who basically cheat the system which they created VC dummest but smartest thing they came up with. Ever since, what was it 2k12 or 2k11 where people glitched their player to 99 and played online well they planned to stop that with the always online mycareer so now you have to work for it but NO those sneaky devs say hey we should charge for VC so we can make money on those who want to cheat. More money to them and good frontend game but back end updates are a NONO with laziness.

Did you just say that buying vc is cheating?