Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

[Eman5805]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

Here's my question.. why give us all these passing options if the game will automatically do it for us randomly? It's like you finding Korver in the corner for a wide open 3 then the game decides to make him stepback for no reason. X/A should always be the best possible straight pass to the guy you're pointing at just like Square/X is always a straight up jumpshot.

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/SG9795tHBvQ" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="560"></iframe>

Not the worst example but one of the few I decided to save.

That pass probably doesn't make it through anyway. Before the ball had even left his hands, TWO defenders had already jumped perfectly into the path the ball would've traveled.

The CPU knows what you're doing the moment you press the button. And it's reaction time is instantaneous and perfect.

[tariq071]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

That pass probably doesn't make it through anyway. Before the ball had even left his hands, TWO defenders had already jumped perfectly into the path the ball would've traveled.

The CPU knows what you're doing the moment you press the button. And it's reaction time is instantaneous and perfect.

I giggle when after i call P&R CPU players position themselves in perfect places before my blocker even try to get in position...or as soon i press button for icon passing, CPU sag off into passing lanes.You can walk easily to the rim unchallenged as long icons are up, while they are waiting for you to press players button.

It would be interesting if someone can show me that happening in real NBA, even once..until then this game has nothing to do with simulation, it became arcade as EA sports games are ,more and more relying on cheese to keep it competitive...at least for me

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

I giggle when after i call P&R CPU players position themselves in perfect places before my blocker even try to get in position...

It would be interesting if someone can show me that happening in real NBA, even once..

Is this a serious question? Go watch any Bulls game and you'll see it every time. It's called anticipation and communication. Watch the first two plays where this communication is considered bad/late. The onball defenders jumps to the side anticipating the screen.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=csxCcRieEAs

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[tariq071]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

Is this a serious question? Go watch any Bulls game and you'll see it every time. It's called anticipation and communication. Watch the first two plays where this communication is considered bad/late. The onball defenders jumps to the side anticipating the

Hey , i have no problem when defensively sound team like Bulls or Grizzlies does that, but not on every call or when every team with any players does it, unless i am keep calling P&R over and over again..it creates uniformed performance, with no variety approach. You don't deal with Bulls defense in same way that you deal with Phoenix one, right?

[madmax52277]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

That's the down side of 2k15...try to run a easy fastbreak, it won't let me..try to make a simple open pass, it won't let me...easy layups no. my point, passes will work if the game decides.

2k needs to stop that BS..give us our freedom and less limitations..fah reel

[The 24th Letter]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

Thread is so weird to me....I just don't have that many issues with passing...I think my biggest complaint would be speed in some situations...but much else.

2K12-2K14 I would've agreed completely...not this year though. Initially my big complaint was pick and roll passing...but I figured out moving the ball handler and creating space was the best way to get passes through....and sometimes there simply isn't a lane to make the pass.

I think this is a lot more realistic....as you could have success with the pick and roll with the ball handler stationary in past years...which made the the P&R automatic. As always though , there are some valid physic CPU complaints once a while to go with this...


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[LorenzoDC]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

Thread is so weird to me....I just don't have that many issues with passing...I think my biggest complaint would be speed in some situations...but much else.

2K12-2K14 I would've agreed completely...not this year though. Initially my big complaint was pick and roll passing...but I figured out moving the ball handler and creating space was the best way to get passes through....and sometimes there simply isn't a lane to make the pass.

I think this is a lot more realistic....as you could have success with the pick and roll with the ball handler stationary in past years...which made the the P&R automatic. As always though , there are some valid physic CPU complaints once a while to go with this...


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I'm part way with you, but I also have adjusted sliders and league wide player tendencies in part to manage these kinds of things. This includes adjustments to Play Passing Lanes, which in my set are both at 40 for user and cpu.

Even with all those adjustments, passing is often unreliable. I play a lot of fast break with success though it's also true the CPU can adjust and start to challenge my passing outlet lanes, with success. So then I have to adjust back. Some of this complaint area is from people, I expect, trying to force actions when they should not. When I was a less experienced player, that was part of my problem. I play solely MyLeague, for context here.

At the same time, the directional passing is very unreliable in some parts of the court. You can't often point the stick at the player you intend and expect it to get there. You may at times, due to how the system is constructed, have to point the stick 90 - 170 degrees away from your intended target.

Icon passing is a part solution in the paint or traffic but it's slower to complete, and the passes are more often floaty. The very situations when icon passing is most needed - in the paint or in traffic - is exactly when you need passes to be instant because the window closes in less than a second. It's a problem and I don't know how to solve it from a design perspective.

I also notice how these passing issues have been addressed in part by the devs in some passing plays in the post or cutting inside. On some of those plays, it turns out any passing action is slaved to the intended play target on the low block or in the paint. This is their workaround to the unreliable directional passing so as to make the play run, and get the ball to the intended target.

The problem with that is you have to know and remember this for those plays. So if the pass target down low dictated by the play is tightly covered and the passing lane blocked, you want to swing the ball up top and find another shot, maybe on the weak side, maybe pick and roll, whatever.

So, naturally, you hit the pass button and use the left stick to direct the pass 180 degrees from the target down low to the guard up top. What happens? The pass goes down low anyway to the intercepting defender because the play has disabled directional passing. If you remember to icon pass up top, you're fine. But in the heat of a fast game, I admit sometimes I forget. Or for some of these slow developing plays the short shot clock makes you automatically avoid icon passing, and then you're stuck with the turnover instead.

None of this would be necessary if directional passing were not such an unreliable thing. On top of all this, as others have said, passes (not flashy passes) often move more slowly than players, which is bonked. So while it's true that working on learning all the passing controls, when to use them, and learning on a higher level how to play the game and when to stop forcing some things is important, there are still real issues with passing above and beyond player skill, play style and experience.

[YaBoial]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

hopefully in 2k16 they make people who go for steals choose a direction on stealing passes. cause in previous games on a 3-on-1 people would try and make the simple pass but the game auto reads it for you and not to mention strip animations so all that was left to be effective are alley-oops. main problems are court being too small and passing is weird sometimes in this game period. pick n roll rarely work

[blingballa333]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

My two biggest complaints about the passing game are:

1. Speed of passes. It is so slow at times and ruins scoring opportunities around the perimeter and down under the rim quite often.

2. This is by far, without a doubt, the MOST infuriating part of the passing game in 2k15. Lead passing on accident. I can't even begin to fathom the amount of times I am on the perimeter with my PG and am at the top of the key moving left to right from that spot and see an open shooter at the wing or corner setting up for three. I try to use analog passing to hit the open man, only to see him begin to sprint forward, into the defense, ruining any chance of an open shot and often leading to a turnover.

I usually turn off my PS4 shortly after stuff like this happens.

But passing isn't the only thing this game needs to work on...

[madmax52277]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

I'm part way with you, but I also have adjusted sliders and league wide player tendencies in part to manage these kinds of things. This includes adjustments to Play Passing Lanes, which in my set are both at 40 for user and cpu.

Even with all those adjustments, passing is often unreliable. I play a lot of fast break with success though it's also true the CPU can adjust and start to challenge my passing outlet lanes, with success. So then I have to adjust back. Some of this complaint area is from people, I expect, trying to force actions when they should not. When I was a less experienced player, that was part of my problem. I play solely MyLeague, for context here.

At the same time, the directional passing is very unreliable in some parts of the court. You can't often point the stick at the player you intend and expect it to get there. You may at times, due to how the system is constructed, have to point the stick 90 - 170 degrees away from your intended target.

Icon passing is a part solution in the paint or traffic but it's slower to complete, and the passes are more often floaty. The very situations when icon passing is most needed - in the paint or in traffic - is exactly when you need passes to be instant because the window closes in less than a second. It's a problem and I don't know how to solve it from a design perspective.

I also notice how these passing issues have been addressed in part by the devs in some passing plays in the post or cutting inside. On some of those plays, it turns out any passing action is slaved to the intended play target on the low block or in the paint. This is their workaround to the unreliable directional passing so as to make the play run, and get the ball to the intended target.

The problem with that is you have to know and remember this for those plays. So if the pass target down low dictated by the play is tightly covered and the passing lane blocked, you want to swing the ball up top and find another shot, maybe on the weak side, maybe pick and roll, whatever.

So, naturally, you hit the pass button and use the left stick to direct the pass 180 degrees from the target down low to the guard up top. What happens? The pass goes down low anyway to the intercepting defender because the pay has disabled directional passing. If you remember to icon pass up top, you're fine. But in the heat of a fast game, I admit sometimes I forget.

None of this would be necessary if directional passing were not such an unreliable thing. On top of all this, as others have said, passes (not flashy passes) often move more slowly than players, which is bonked. So while it's true that working on learning all the passing controls, when to use them, and learning on a higher level how to play the game and when to stop forcing some things is important, there are still real issues with passing above and beyond player skill, play style and experience.

Agree 100%...I would like to add HANDS attributes are so unrealistic and the higher the levels the less response from your controller that's were passing gets ugly.

I'm judging from Mylegue game play experience also.

[KyotoCarl]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

We're not supposed to discuss gameplay during certain months? lol. There have been some massive, multi-year threads over the years on OS for various games.

It's never too early or a bad time to start a discussion, who cares of it doesn't lead to anything until 2K17 or if it never leads to anything? OP has good points and isn't trolling, why not get it off his chest now?

It's nearly a guarantee that the same old passing issues from the last several years will still be in 2K16 so they'll all be valid and current concerns. This could turn into a big thread that leads to some nice improvements in 2K17 for all we know. No point in the oppressive reaction.

I didn't say that. I was wondering why and what the point was.

[ehh]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

The biggest issue remains that the ball travels too slowly and that many passing animations are still too slow and drawn out. Chest passes need more zip and catching animations need to improve as well.

Too often the contextual awareness is poor, like in the CP3 video above. That passing animation should never be triggered in that scenario. Too often your passer is ignorant of the defense, both the help D and the defender guarding your intended recipient. There are too many passes thrown right at a defender in an unrealistic manner when a slight lead/lob pass would happen in real life or the recipient of the pass would use his body to shield the defender in order to catch the pass. The moves and tricks that offensive players use to get open or catch a pass when closely guarded are nowhere to be found in 2K15. Basically guys need to be wide open or it's a crapshoot. How often do you say "wow, that was a NICE pass" when playing 2K15? I'm not talking about making the extra pass either.

Obviously the analog stick passing has been inaccurate for ages. Too many wild, unintentional skip passes to a guarded defender when you're trying to hit a man near the rim. I wish that skip passes were only available via icon passing. In the half court set all L-stick passing would be limited to realistic/logical areas on the floor - say "one pass away". How many times have we all run a PnR and tried to hit the open roll man with an L-stick pass but instead we fire it to the covered corner shooter and it results in a turnover?

I've had countless times where I'll run a high PnR with my ball handler coming off to his left and when I try to hit the roll man it triggers an animation where my ball handler stops and does the same animation as the CP3 video above with his right hand - going completely against his momentum and the flow of the play and throwing it into traffic. The slow and poorly chosen animations always lead to a pass thrown behind my roll man or it allows the defense to recover because it's so slow. Essentially the speed of the passing game and the rest of the movement on the floor is out of whack too often. Slow passing animations and slow ball speed. I see it often since I use the Knicks and the Triangle - when you need precision, quick passing you had better cross your fingers.

Transition threes are a problem too because too often players cut to the hoop when a pass is made even when they are initially spotting up behind the arc.

They also need to address the 2K4-ish tips and deflections where a defender jumps straight up with one hand straight in the air like he has a stick for arm and deflects the pass, then it's a slow loose ball battle that the CPU wins 90% of the time where most players on the court have the awareness of a toddler in a ball pit at Chuck E Cheese. That doesn't happen in the NBA. I know it's a battle to eliminate PnR cheese and teams scoring a vast majority of their points in the paint but it's time for some major improvements to the passing game. I'd rather have the defense intercept all the bad/forced passes like it's 2K3 than have goofy tips.

[ehh]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

I didn't say that. I was wondering why and what the point was.

You implied it, strongly.

[The 24th Letter]

Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

Usual well thought out Lorenzo post.

Thanks for your explanation LDC

Anyway you can post an example of your issues in the second half of your post next time it happens?

Not that I'm doubting you (or anyone else), just want to see an example of exactly what you mean...

EDIT: or anyone else who wants to....I'll post some of my issues/ non issues too.


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[madmax52277]

Re: Passing is AWFUL in 2k at the moment!

The biggest issue remains that the ball travels too slowly and that many passing animations are still too slow and drawn out. Chest passes need more zip and catching animations need to improve as well.

Too often the contextual awareness is poor, like in the CP3 video above. That passing animation should never be triggered in that scenario. Too often your passer is ignorant of the defense, both the help D and the defender guarding your intended recipient. There are too many passes thrown right at a defender in an unrealistic manner when a slight lead/lob pass would happen in real life or the recipient of the pass would use his body to shield the defender in order to catch the pass. The moves and tricks that offensive players use to get open or catch a pass when closely guarded are nowhere to be found in 2K15. Basically guys need to be wide open or it's a crapshoot. How often do you say "wow, that was a NICE pass" when playing 2K15? I'm not talking about making the extra pass either.

Obviously the analog stick passing has been inaccurate for ages. Too many wild, unintentional skip passes to a guarded defender when you're trying to hit a man near the rim. I wish that skip passes were only available via icon passing. In the half court set all L-stick passing would be limited to realistic/logical areas on the floor - say "one pass away". How many times have we all run a PnR and tried to hit the open roll man with an L-stick pass but instead we fire it to the covered corner shooter and it results in a turnover?

I've had countless times where I'll run a high PnR with my ball handler coming off to his left and when I try to hit the roll man it triggers an animation where my ball handler stops and does the same animation as the CP3 video above with his right hand - going completely against his momentum and the flow of the play and throwing it into traffic. The slow and poorly chosen animations always lead to a pass thrown behind my roll man or it allows the defense to recover because it's so slow. Essentially the speed of the passing game and the rest of the movement on the floor is out of whack too often. Slow passing animations and slow ball speed. I see it often since I use the Knicks and the Triangle - when you need precision, quick passing you had better cross your fingers.

Transition threes are a problem too because too often players cut to the hoop when a pass is made even when they are initially spotting up behind the arc.

They also need to address the 2K4-ish tips and deflections where a defender jumps straight up with one hand straight in the air like he has a stick for arm and deflects the pass, then it's a slow loose ball battle that the CPU wins 90% of the time where most players on the court have the awareness of a toddler in a ball pit at Chuck E Cheese. That doesn't happen in the NBA. I know it's a battle to eliminate PnR cheese and teams scoring a vast majority of their points in the paint but it's time for some major improvements to the passing game. I'd rather have the defense intercept all the bad/forced passes like it's 2K3 than have goofy tips.

Well said and spot on...a sim guy like myself, hopes 2k gets this right.

Glad you still around.