Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

[strosdood]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

Czar just had a q and a on YouTube and regarding the main issue in this thread, he said it's a pace issue with certain players.

Based on that im Not sure if he means this will be fixed as it seems like an imbalance in the game with quick players in offense and slow players in defense. I guess the only real way to fix this would be to edit a roster and reduce the speed of all players for a more balanced game. Or perhaps do as eccentric meat advised and change all the sliders. Although that is something I tried and still could get the same results.

He also said pick and roll is a work in progress.

Where did u see czar on any platform recently talking about the game? He’s went completely awol as far as I can tell


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[Lagoa]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

This pick n roll problem just destroys the game for me.....

[EccentricMeat]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

Czar just had a q and a on YouTube and regarding the main issue in this thread, he said it's a pace issue with certain players.

Based on that im Not sure if he means this will be fixed as it seems like an imbalance in the game with quick players in offense and slow players in defense. I guess the only real way to fix this would be to edit a roster and reduce the speed of all players for a more balanced game. Or perhaps do as eccentric meat advised and change all the sliders. Although that is something I tried and still could get the same results.

He also said pick and roll is a work in progress.

Of course it's a pace issue. Athletic forwards are too fast with the ball and 2K recently broke the ability to slow them down via sliders. Last week the movement sliders were all working as intended and you could easily fix the speed imbalance by increasing the Speed/Accel without Ball (Min) sliders to somewhere between 50 and 55, while decreasing the with Ball (Max) sliders to 55. You can still fix half the problem because the Without Ball sliders still work.

To fix the pace issue right now, just edit the roster and mass-edit the Speed with Ball value down by about 10 to 15. Players will still move realistically fast, but the broken athletic forwards won't be The Flash anymore.

For the rest of the issues with PnR and help defense, use the sliders I've posted. Preferably on 48 or 49 game speed to make the game look and feel less jittery, but they'll work at 50 no problem.

[jfsolo]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

Where did u see czar on any platform recently talking about the game? He’s went completely awol as far as I can tell


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

https://<iframe width="560" height="...reen></iframe>

Here's the video.

[CujoMatty]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

Well that video was discouraging.

He honestly doesnt even know what the biggest issue is with the pick and roll. He describes every problem there is but none of them are actually the game breaker. Fast players are blowing by the screen before they can switch or come off the screen for easy lay ups. Hes talking about pulling this guy or that guy for rotations when none of that is necessary. Just make the big quicker to get in position under the rim or at least add a contact animation.

He basically said it is what it is and I warned you all before you bought. That's pretty not ideal. lol

The thing I liked about Czar is how he was meticulous in holding 2k accountable for basketball systems and authenticity. Now it sounds like he doesnt even have time to play his own game.

[EccentricMeat]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

Well that video was discouraging.

He honestly doesnt even know what the biggest issue is with the pick and roll. He describes every problem there is but none of them are actually the game breaker. Fast players are blowing by the screen before they can switch or come off the screen for easy lay ups. Hes talking about pulling this guy or that guy for rotations when none of that is necessary. Just make the big quicker to get in position under the rim or at least add a contact animation.

He basically said it is what it is and I warned you all before you bought. That's pretty not ideal. lol

The thing I liked about Czar is how he was meticulous in holding 2k accountable for basketball systems and authenticity. Now it sounds like he doesnt even have time to play his own game.

The thing I don't get is that I played 2K20 the other night (on default Superstar and Hall of Fame settings, no tweaks, no custom rosters) and the defense was TOUGH. If you ran the PnR with a good shooter on the ball, the hedge defender would immediately slide over and pressure you at the 3PT line, then cut back to cover the roll man in time. If you were using a slasher, the hedge defender would cover the lane until the on-ball defender was able to come help.

How did they go so far in the wrong direction with defense this year? If you use any half-decent shooter and call for a screen, you'll be wide open 90+ percent of the time for an easy 3 after running your defender into the screener. The only way to stop that is to decrease USER strength so that your screens suck and the defender is able to immediately fight through to stay on top of you at the 3pt line, but the Hedge defender will provide no assistance.

[alabamarob]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

Just make the defensive settings work, and we can run whatever pick and roll defense we choose. If I can put a player to “leave them” and he is hanging around the paint it will discourage drives and the roll man.

[strosdood]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

Just make the defensive settings work, and we can run whatever pick and roll defense we choose. If I can put a player to “leave them” and he is hanging around the paint it will discourage drives and the roll man.

I thought Czar said that was fixed? But u have to do it while on defense for it to work or something


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[TheEmperor2001]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

The thing I don't get is that I played 2K20 the other night (on default Superstar and Hall of Fame settings, no tweaks, no custom rosters) and the defense was TOUGH. If you ran the PnR with a good shooter on the ball, the hedge defender would immediately slide over and pressure you at the 3PT line, then cut back to cover the roll man in time. If you were using a slasher, the hedge defender would cover the lane until the on-ball defender was able to come help.

How did they go so far in the wrong direction with defense this year? If you use any half-decent shooter and call for a screen, you'll be wide open 90+ percent of the time for an easy 3 after running your defender into the screener. The only way to stop that is to decrease USER strength so that your screens suck and the defender is able to immediately fight through to stay on top of you at the 3pt line, but the Hedge defender will provide no assistance.

I didn't play 2K20, so this is interesting. If this is the case (and I believe you), then why did Czar say that 2K20's defense was broken? What do you think he was referring to?

[The 24th Letter]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

2K20 had issues- I think the tendency of the CPU not leaving their man in any circumstance gives the appearance of better p&r D IMO...

https://forums.operationsports.com/forums/showthread.php?t=959330

but I liked what Czar said about the game feeling "easy" from a gamer standpoint. A lot of the older 2K's had artifical things in them to increase difficulty.

I rather him rebuild with basketball elements, even if that means the game is "easy"....because you can make the AI more difficult with sliders, but I prefer starting on the basis of being "fair" We haven't been able to make the CPU pick up the damn ball in how long? Lol


Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk

[alabamarob]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

I thought Czar said that was fixed? But u have to do it while on defense for it to work or something


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

Nah. He said that they stick. It used to go back to default. Now if you set pre-rotate or leave them it will stick. But, it never worked to begin with. So they still don’t do either of those 2. Which are the 2 main ways to control the help defense on this game.

[TheEmperor2001]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

2K20 had issues- I think the tendency of the CPU not leaving their man in any circumstance gives the appearance of better p&r D IMO...

https://forums.operationsports.com/forums/showthread.php?t=959330

but I liked what Czar said about the game feeling "easy" from a gamer standpoint. A lot of the older 2K's had artifical things in them to increase difficulty.

I rather him rebuild with basketball elements, even if that means the game is "easy"....because you can make the AI more difficult with sliders, but I prefer starting on the basis of being "fair" We haven't been able to make the CPU pick up the damn ball in how long? Lol


Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk

I feel that, but those of us (like me) who play HOF default sliders want a challenge. I recognize that the CPU may have to do some unrealistic stuff to make that happen. But the efficiency with which I, as a user, can run my offense is unrealistic too. He said the CPU can't handle multiple offensive actions in the same possession designed to bend the defense. That makes sense. But I don't need multiple actions to break the defense - I need one spread pick and roll. That is, in fact, unrealistic. So - in attempting to make the CPU more realistic, he made it unrealistic for those of us that are pretty good at the game.

I'm downloading NBA 2K20 now to see what it's like. I may just play that one if the CPU is more challenging.

[The 24th Letter]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

I feel that, but those of us (like me) who play HOF default sliders want a challenge. I recognize that the CPU may have to do some unrealistic stuff to make that happen. But the efficiency with which I, as a user, can run my offense is unrealistic too. He said the CPU can't handle multiple offensive actions in the same possession designed to bend the defense. That makes sense. But I don't need multiple actions to break the defense - I need one spread pick and roll. That is, in fact, unrealistic. So - in attempting to make the CPU more realistic, he made it unrealistic for those of us that are pretty good at the game.

I'm downloading NBA 2K20 now to see what it's like. I may just play that one if the CPU is more challenging.

I think 2K20 will definitely be more of a challenge in that regard for you.

I played on HOF too, I'm honestly not into changing a bunch of sliders, because you can get stuck in that loop all season... but moving up a couple for the CPU has helped and I roll with that.

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk

[alabamarob]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

I think 2K20 will definitely be more of a challenge in that regard for you.

I played on HOF too, I'm honestly not into changing a bunch of sliders, because you can get stuck in that loop all season... but moving up a couple for the CPU has helped and I roll with that.

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk

Yea. I am generally against sliders if the game is good. This 2k is the best one yet to me. I wouldn’t dare touch any slider on this game. The glitches are the only negative as far as this game is concerned. I hope he can fix that defensive setting issue in a roster update, since it didn’t get patched.

[EccentricMeat]

Re: Evidence why next gen pick and roll and help defense needs lots of work still

When you guys bring up the defense settings, are you saying that you switch to the CPU team and set up their defense, then switch back? Or are you just referring to changing your own defensive settings?

Because I honestly just want to control what the CPU team does.