New Info From Gamespot!!!

[BezO]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

That's the thing. Favorite shooting wasn't the thing that was on wishlist. It was the differentiation of players who shoot off the dribble (Kobe, Tracy, Vince, Gordon) versus spot up shooters (Bowen, Korver, Barry,).

I remember seeing both, if not in wishlist threads, in various other threads. Folks have definitely asked for specific players being better shooters from certain areas.

[BezO]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

I don't like what I just read. The defense sounds like a computer-controlled gimmick as opposed to giving the user more RESPONSIVE controls.

Depending on how it's implemented, I think it could be good. Getting SOME help from the CPU when controlling a good defender is not a bad thing. Playing 1-on-1 defense in a video game is harder than in real life IMO. In real life, you at least know a player probably wants to get to his strong hand. You know his tendencies. These things don't exist in video games.

The off-ball controls are ********, I will never use that and that's not how sports games are meant to be played. It ruins the free flowing feeling of basketball. This is all just crap because 2K can't figure out how to program good off-ball AI.

It's exactly how basketball is played. Many times a PG will tell a big man to post up if he sees a mismatch, or the big man is hot. Sometimes a big man will just call for the ball in the post. How many times have you seen Shaq signal, "Eff everything! Give me the ball! I'm taking over"?

Same for the Suns and past Jazz teams. How many times have you seen Stockton/Nash signal for a screen/pick?

The off ball controls are to replicate that. I know there were times in 2K7 games where I wanted a screen from a specific player, or wanted a specific player to post or get open. I'll probably use the off ball controls more than the set plays.

[BTB]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

That's true but I guess what I'm saying is that the computer initiated off ball movement should also be improved greatly. For example, if you get double teamed then the computer's guy should make the proper cut, etc.

This would all be greatly improved with better physics and animations, which is what I really want to see.

[lebronze james]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

By being in this forum, it is implied that you are a fan of sports gaming.

I enjoy sports games, but don't feel an obligation to buy them every year no matter what for fear of being labled "unappreciative."

For every game to have the same value, you'd have to give each game an equal budget, time and talent. Part of being a consumer is accepting that regardless of the varying levels of these invested into each game, there is a set range of prices for games in general.

And another part of being a consumer is proving to the content providers that you will not pay full price for something that is not full value.

The only other alternative is to base games on a subjective pricing system. This goes against our established precedent for selling entertainment. Great movies and not so great movies all cost the same ticket price, because that is the standard. The standard set for price has nothing to do with the standard set for production. I figured every consumer who wanted value for their dollar knew this, but your logic says otherwise.

All I'm coming away from this conversation with, is that you are willing to pay full price for every product no matter how "value-packed" it is. Many feel otherwise, and it's certainly not some weird fringe opinion. If a CD has only 25 minutes of music on it, I will not pay $15 for it - or perhaps more appropriately if a new edition of an old cd that I already have has just one alternate take on it, and nothing else of new value, I will not re-buy it. If a movie is filmed on a low budget I generally won't watch it in the theater at all. If a book only has 100 pages in it, I probably won't pay $25 for it.

I can't be the only consumer in the world who is concerned with how much value he gets per dollar spent.

[Vast]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

Depending on how it's implemented, I think it could be good. Getting SOME help from the CPU when controlling a good defender is not a bad thing. Playing 1-on-1 defense in a video game is harder than in real life IMO. In real life, you at least know a player probably wants to get to his strong hand. You know his tendencies. These things don't exist in video games.

It's exactly how basketball is played. Many times a PG will tell a big man to post up if he sees a mismatch, or the big man is hot. Sometimes a big man will just call for the ball in the post. How many times have you seen Shaq signal, "Eff everything! Give me the ball! I'm taking over"?

Same for the Suns and past Jazz teams. How many times have you seen Stockton/Nash signal for a screen/pick?

The off ball controls are to replicate that. I know there were times in 2K7 games where I wanted a screen from a specific player, or wanted a specific player to post or get open. I'll probably use the off ball controls more than the set plays.

Word up. BezO. beautifully put. There has to be a defensive mechanism implemented that takes into account the player your usings defensive attributes. And it has nothing to do with responsive controls. the controls in 2k are responsive, the problem lies in the fact that in basketball all it takes is a first step, a split second and thats it your man beats you to the rim. This new defensive system is NECESSARY, and REVOLUTIONARY. Mark my words.

Now im just keeping my fingers crossed for improved post play, passing, and collision detection.

[TheMax1087]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

Im just hoping the new defensive mechanism allows you to lock on players who dont have the ball.

[luv_mist]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

For those who don't understand where they're coming from with that article, substitute the "Richard Jefferson" with "Richard Hamilton" so it could work like that. Basically saying that instead of going through the play, you could take control of Rip and decide to crash the boards while Chauncey fires it up.

My main concern with this game is the A.I. playing like it knows the game of basketball. Honestly, I'm tired of tweaking the A.I. to get it agressive enough to take advantage of situations. Still, the players don't exploit mismatches. That's one of the main things I want. I want those power players to be unstoppable. I want to have to send 4 players to Shaq and play a specific zone defense against Kobe to stop him. I want that off the ball movement too and the lockup defense. So far, they seem to be remedying some of these things. I take those as great advances. Just waiting to see what else they have in store.......

[SageInfinite]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

My main concern with this game is the A.I. playing like it knows the game of basketball. Honestly, I'm tired of tweaking the A.I. to get it agressive enough to take advantage of situations. Still, the players don't exploit mismatches. That's one of the main things I want. I want those power players to be unstoppable. I want to have to send 4 players to Shaq and play a specific zone defense against Kobe to stop him. I want that off the ball movement too and the lockup defense. So far, they seem to be remedying some of these things. I take those as great advances. Just waiting to see what else they have in store.......

Amen.

[triplej96]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

Sounds Promising!

[Munkey]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

My main concern with this game is the A.I. playing like it knows the game of basketball. Honestly, I'm tired of tweaking the A.I. to get it agressive enough to take advantage of situations. Still, the players don't exploit mismatches. That's one of the main things I want. I want those power players to be unstoppable. I want to have to send 4 players to Shaq and play a specific zone defense against Kobe to stop him. I want that off the ball movement too and the lockup defense. So far, they seem to be remedying some of these things. I take those as great advances. Just waiting to see what else they have in store.......

this is a must for 2k8

[Bornindamecca]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

I enjoy sports games, but don't feel an obligation to buy them every year no matter what for fear of being labled "unappreciative."
And another part of being a consumer is proving to the content providers that you will not pay full price for something that is not full value.
All I'm coming away from this conversation with, is that you are willing to pay full price for every product no matter how "value-packed" it is. Many feel otherwise, and it's certainly not some weird fringe opinion. If a CD has only 25 minutes of music on it, I will not pay $15 for it - or perhaps more appropriately if a new edition of an old cd that I already have has just one alternate take on it, and nothing else of new value, I will not re-buy it. If a movie is filmed on a low budget I generally won't watch it in the theater at all. If a book only has 100 pages in it, I probably won't pay $25 for it.

I can't be the only consumer in the world who is concerned with how much value he gets per dollar spent.

Your issue with being a sports game fan is either semantics or the product of some sports fanatic dialectic. Either way, I digress.

The subjective end of the deal is decided by the consumer. Again, this is general knowledge of how this particular section of entertainment sales work. You buy what you deem has value and pass on what you don't.

I'm not going to pick apart the specifics of your argument and cite how Aristotle's Poetics(a thin volume) has more value than Dan Brown's DaVinci code(many pages), because that's still subjective and up to you.

And hey, if all you can glean from this conversation is the assumption that I'm willing to pay full price for every product, then I'll leave that failure of deduction between you and your reading comprehension.

[Dalsanto0026]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

The new defensive and off-ball controls do sound promising. It would be nice to get some info regarding Association Mode and Presentation as well.

[versatili3]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

I think the most important thing is to make sure that sliders are in place for us to adjust many aspects of the game especially new features that they will be including. (I'm talking about new gameplay infos that they may be releasing in the future)

Also, there were many sliders lacking in 2k7 that would have fixed many flaws like in defense (separate slider for interception, on-ball steal, etc.), and offense (post offense/defense, layup, passing, etc.). Why these sliders haven't been included still baffles me..

[edubbs]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

I think the most important thing is to make sure that sliders are in place for us to adjust many aspects of the game especially new features that they will be including. (I'm talking about new gameplay infos that they may be releasing in the future)

Also, there were many sliders lacking in 2k7 that would have fixed many flaws like in defense (separate slider for interception, on-ball steal, etc.), and offense (post offense/defense, layup, passing, etc.). Why these sliders haven't been included still baffles me..

I'm all for more sliders but, I hope VC took the time to make sure all of the 'current' sliders do what they are intended to do. There were soo many sliders in 2k7 that either were broke or did absolutely NOTHING when adjusted.

-MPG Slider
-Edit player body type slider
-Play with back to the basket slider (this one really didn't get good results because the CPU fronted post players too much in 2k7 and the post game was broken in general)

There were many more.....

That's probably one of main issues I have with sliders. Developers put them in games and they have minimal effects in some cases because, the issues are often hard coded in the game (see Madden08).

VC has been guilty of this also in the past. No slider tweak in 2k7 could keep the CPU AI from running the "PF pop and clear" play that had guys like Dwight Howard, and Elton Brand shooting 20 footers off of baseline screens last year.

I just hope that whatever sliders are in this years game are actually effective when modified. There are plenty of sliders already in the game, and if they worked as they should there would be very little need for more.

The amount of sliders always 'look' great in those pre release screen shots but, nothing is more frustrating than trying to tweak a game and having most of the sliders do nothing.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: New Info From Gamespot!!!

That pop and clear play was a travesty. Some of the guys that they had making those shots was just absurd.