The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

[Da_Czar]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

Oh and the biggest gripe? Calling plays - after your guy curls around staggered screens his defender catches up instantly. It's completely a useless system in the sense that its ineffective. I ran 20 plays in a row, none of them had any effect as the other teammates just stand there.


And fanboys who see nothing wrong with the game, don't quote or respond to me.

I don't know what level your playing on but your post on play calling I have not found to be accurate. Maybe you have found a few plays that don't get guys wide open but you appear to be exaggerating some of your points. That really doesn't help.

[fcabanski]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

"Therefore if you practice good passing habits you can in fact get better at passing the basketball in NBA 2k11."

When I go play basketball at the gym tonight and throw a bad pass, I'm going to yell about mis-tuned sliders.

Intercepted passes are a good thing, forcing the gamer to take care with passes, to make good ones, to work at distinguishing between the two.

[Armor and Sword]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

Really? You're not upset that 90% of the time online there is no help defense, there is no defensive switching.

I've had guys stand in the corner not doing anything on defense and the SG would be wide open.

Literally everygame, if I pick up the PG full court and let him pass, my entire team will stay on their guys(with sag off on everypalyer) and not notice the pg drive for a layup. This is elementary stuff..

You're not frustrated when guys catch a ball in the post, pump fake then take 3 seconds to move out of an awkward, momentum, 2P driven animation and by that time the defense regrouped?

The players and their bricks slow the game down, make it impossible to move quickly and smoothly from move to move. I've never moved in one direction smoothly without stuttering or lagging in some way.

Don't get me started on defense in the game. It doesnt exist. All that exists is getting sucked into the guy youre guarding and doing something you didnt want to do even without pressing buttons.

And blocking is the worst blocking system I've seen in a basketball game. Its absolutely impossible to do a timed block. You'll get stuck in an animation, not jump high at all or not come close to the ball despite timing and positioning yourself perfectly.

I could write a 300 page novel on whats wrong with NBA 2K.

What justified $60 was the historic teams, and they always knew that once we got historic teams it would be the best title for that alone.

Oh and the biggest gripe? Calling plays - after your guy curls around staggered screens his defender catches up instantly. It's completely a useless system in the sense that its ineffective. I ran 20 plays in a row, none of them had any effect as the other teammates just stand there.

So much false advertising this year, its insane.

And fanboys who see nothing wrong with the game, don't quote or respond to me. I'm a veteran of the series who is not going to post for the sake of posting. I'm on here because the game is more frustrating than I've endured in the past.

You can debate practice and smart play all you want. The game itself isnt smart, its not smart enough for smart players, this is what I've learned. I played varsity basketball, college university basketball. It's my life. And never has a basketball game been able to keep up with my input commands. My simulation style play.

2K11 needs new logic programmers. New A.I. programmers. Guys who don't take shortcuts.

I don't play online so I can't comment on that aspect at all. I am sorry that the game is not working for you.

We all play different styles and have varying levels of skills. I am by no means a basketball video game expert. I am a rookie to 2K. So this is all new for me. I played and owned 2K9 and found that unplayable due to shoddy AI, bad controls, and just the general feeling for helplesness to elite players driving and dunking on me at will and draining 3's at an insane and totaly unrealistic clip. I lasted 3 months with that game trying to tweak it with sliders to no avail.

Fast forward to NBA2K11.

The defense is stout. The AI smart. My teamates rotate on defense pretty much all the time. You can exploit matchups and the CPU will do the same. I can see the adaptive AI working against me. Last night in my first association game Heat vs Celtics they figured out my weakness at C and fed Shaq all night which finally opened up their premeter game in the 4th quarter when I finally started doubling Shaq they started draning clutch 3's to put the game away.

This game is as close to Sim as I have ever played on any platform or generation since MLB The Show 2009.

I can't tell you how many people hate the Show becuase it is so hard, they can't hit, yada yada. It is a sim. If you don' understand the art of taking pitches working counts, and scouting who is pitching to you....your dead.

NBA2K11 is feeling the same. If you are careless with theball you will pay. I cut my turnovers in half by being mindful of my passing lanes and not thinking I can run and gun all night. This game takes practice, patience, and effort on both ends.

To your points:

Calling plays - I am finding this fantastic. I love seeing Lebron come around a screen on a curl timing my Pass perfectly and watching him jab step and blow by his defender, or step back and drain a jumper. The plays take some time to get the feel for and the timing down. Sometimes they break...like in real life. They will not work every trip down the floor like in real life, so you iso and try to improv a basket. I love it!

Shot Blocking - I love it. The aggresive block from behind...when timed right is a thing of beauty. On the sidelines, baseline etc....you must create space. And spacing is such a hug factor in this game. It works amazing. This game is work. Much like the Show (which after one game I am mentaly exhausted expecially in pitcher duels).


Input commands - you want what I think we will never get on this console. The controls are as good as they can get IMO. I think this team (VC) put lots of sweat, heart and soul into this game. You feel and see the love in this effort. These controls are silky smooth for the average player who has a decent knowledge of the game. To your point though I understand your feelings. With the Show (I have been a baseball player my whole life, still play every Sunday in a over 35 league) the fielding controls stink. They do not do what I input fast enough. I hear you as an athlete. Our brains are reacting qucik and the video game bots are not responding fast enough. I fortunatly have a fix for the Show and that is auto fielding, throwing and baserunning. I just focus on pitching and hitting which are amazing on that game and I let the ratings play out the defense...and it looks and plays great that way. I am sorry NBA2K11 is not repsonsive enough for you.

I love it.

To each his own. We will agree to disagree. But I understand some of your points. You are a hadcore B-Ball guy so your a tough crowd

Peace.

[sohum]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

I think the reason the turnovers have been so highlighted is because the default passing scheme (just the A button on X360) is still not very polished, similar to 2K10. There are a lot of times when I'm just trying to swing the ball around the three point arc but the ball is invariably passed to someone I didn't mean to, resulting in a turnover.

Icon passing definitely takes care of a lot of those issues but sometimes, when running the break, for example, it would be nice if we didn't have to icon pass to prevent a turnover. I haven't used icon lead passing yet, but that'll probably decrease my turnovers a fair bit.

[sparkyiii2k]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

Czar you are so on point I agree 100%. People complained about wanting the game to be more sim now they're complaining about it being to hard to pass I wonder how many people even go to the practice mode to learn the new control and work on improving their game? I haven't even played that many games because most of time is spent in practice mode either learning the plays, iso, post ups & testing them in scrimmages which helps you to work on your passes in game type of mode. I don't scimmage against other teams yet just my own The Knicks so I can examine their strength and weakness its actually quite fun.

[Armor and Sword]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

Czar you are so on point I agree 100%. People complained about wanting the game to be more sim now they're complaining about it being to hard to pass I wonder how many people even go to the practice mode to learn the new control and work on improving their game? I haven't even played that many games because most of time is spent in practice mode either learning the plays, iso, post ups & testing them in scrimmages which helps you to work on your passes in game type of mode. I don't scimmage against other teams yet just my own The Knicks so I can examine their strength and weakness its actually quite fun.

I agree.

Total Control Passing works wonders. Icon passing too.

The stick passing has some flaws but it works most of the time.

The only thing i am trying to figure out and if someone can help me is

1) Bounce passes

2) Flashy passes


I have the full manuel and I don't think I have seen anything on these 2 points.

[Pared]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

I only use icon passing. I have no problems hitting guys inside, creating angles off of movement, etc.

I'm talking about going from inside to outside, kicking it back out to the perimeter. I try using icon lead passing to move my player out from behind the defender and they just stay stationary.

The pass logic on kick outs just needs a bit of work. Guys shouldn't be chest passing back out to the perimeter on resets off offensive boards.

It's not a game killing issue or anything, it just requires dribbling out a bit with bigs and hoping the guys on the perimeter start moving so you can actually lead them somewhere.

It would be much better passing out of the post if you could lead guys left and right on the perimeter even when they're stationary.

I'm not being a smartass when I ask you this... are you sure total control passing is on?

I had it on, saved my settings, went online and once again, that same bug from last year where my settings get all screwed up is back again.

All of these options were off, including icons while on defense.

Go to your controller settings and check again. I can do what you're saying. Also, don't forget, you can use the RB plus icon and RS option to send the player you want on a run towards open space/away from their defender.

[joel0078]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

I'm not being a smartass when I ask you this... are you sure total control passing is on?

I had it on, saved my settings, went online and once again, that same bug from last year where my settings get all screwed up is back again.

All of these options were off, including icons while on defense.

Go to your controller settings and check again. I can do what you're saying. Also, don't forget, you can use the RB plus icon and RS option to send the player you want on a run towards open space/away from their defender.

I could be wrong, but I thought icon lead passing and total control passing two different forms of passing? He didn't say he was using total control, said he was using icon lead, which is likely part of the reason so many of these guys are having issues.

I said in an earlier post here (that seemed to be breezed over for some reason) that there was an article a few months ago where the developers stressed the fact that total control passing was going to be necessary this year. I've been using TCP and am not having to many turnover issues, although on occasion there are a few more than I'd like to see.

[TeeDogg]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

My bigest problem with passing was I was palying like it was 2k10. after getting use to the game My turnovers are WAY down. No more passing to a guy who is getting fronted or beeing denied the ball. This game is SWEET!!!!!

[Pared]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

I could be wrong, but I thought icon lead passing and total control passing two different forms of passing? He didn't say he was using total control, said he was using icon lead, which is likely part of the reason so many of these guys are having issues.

I said in an earlier post here (that seemed to be breezed over for some reason) that there was an article a few months ago where the developers stressed the fact that total control passing was going to be necessary this year. I've been using TCP and am not having to many turnover issues, although on occasion there are a few more than I'd like to see.

Even though they're related, you are right in what you are saying. The problem is the bug I mentioned screws all of it. I'm not quite sure which one would alleviate his problem, which is why I (edit: whoops, meant to) mentioned both.

Haven't had as much time to test the in's and out's of this game as I normally do each year. Damn life gets in the way...

But it certainly is one of them. I'm pretty sure it's icon lead passing may be off, but again, I noticed these off when I had the same exact problems as the post I quoted expressed.

[jlbrown143]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

I could be wrong, but I thought icon lead passing and total control passing two different forms of passing? He didn't say he was using total control, said he was using icon lead, which is likely part of the reason so many of these guys are having issues.

I said in an earlier post here (that seemed to be breezed over for some reason) that there was an article a few months ago where the developers stressed the fact that total control passing was going to be necessary this year. I've been using TCP and am not having to many turnover issues, although on occasion there are a few more than I'd like to see.

speaking of TCP

Have anyone been able to figure out how to do the wrap around passes on demand...most of my passes pretty much happen by chance mostly..I still just mostly pass chest passes and over head, it does pass behind the back and underneath sometimes, but I can not call a specific pass type to save my life and I do have TCP switched on......

[Pared]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

It's contextual. Turbo plus pass if you use the regular pass button.

[jlbrown143]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

speaking of TCP

Have anyone been able to figure out how to do the wrap around passes on demand...most of my passes pretty much happen by chance mostly..I still just mostly pass chest passes and over head, it does pass behind the back and underneath sometimes, but I can not call a specific pass type to save my life and I do have TCP switched on......

I was reading this from the Dev Insight concerning passing....

The type of fake pass chosen is based on the logic of regular passing. For example, a situation that would have yielded an overhead pass will also yield an overhead fake. Same goes for bounce, lob and chest passes.

here is something else that is puzzling to me....

While either standing or on the move, a fake pass can be pulled off by pressing the (B) button on the 360 (circle on PS3).

I saw this also ....Drive & Dish Wraps..... When you pull one off, they look incredible, but keep in mind, only good passers have the ability to do this.

for those of us who are having a tuff time trying to hit the right people without getting our pass intercepted check this out....

Pass targeting now relies almost solely on one thing and that is the direction your stick is pressed.
Now, there are a couple of reasons your pass may not have reached the player you intended it for. 99% of the time it’s going to be because you’re not correctly aiming your stick at the right player or there’s a teammate in the same direct line of the player you were hoping to hit. (wow..)

one more thing about passing......We’ve greatly improved the pass lane code for 2K11 to allow for more chest and bounce passes in situations where our safest pass, the overhead, is not necessarily needed. maybe it's me but I haven't been able to do it on demand ...anybody else been able to ...?

[Sam Marlowe]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

This is mostly a non issue offline. But with the lag online its really hit or miss there. The responsiveness deficit makes the timing windows difficlut to gauge. Epecially when you're used to a totally different experience offline.

[Da_Czar]

Re: The turnovers are a bit ridiculous

I think the reason the turnovers have been so highlighted is because the default passing scheme (just the A button on X360) is still not very polished, similar to 2K10. There are a lot of times when I'm just trying to swing the ball around the three point arc but the ball is invariably passed to someone I didn't mean to, resulting in a turnover.

Icon passing definitely takes care of a lot of those issues but sometimes, when running the break, for example, it would be nice if we didn't have to icon pass to prevent a turnover. I haven't used icon lead passing yet, but that'll probably decrease my turnovers a fair bit.

sohum completely understandable point. See that is something we can take back to the devs and request further tuning. I know they said they worked on it but it could still use more work. I ICON almost exclusively now adays so I don't even think about it but I clearly see your point. Unintended turnovers sting worse than ones you intended to make.