So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

[youALREADYknow]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

This is part of your problem.

Too many people breaking the game by looking at numbers and not actually seeing what they do IN. THE. GAME.

A new "roster" doesn't solve everything. So you have a bunch of rosters out there by guys doing whatever the hell they think works and others using them, scratching their head wondering why the game plays as it does.

There's no way the developers can fix that - it's a problem they never created yet they try and find a solution for it.

The logic behind this makes no sense.

They (2K Sports) make the roster that we play wiith. They determine the baseline sliders for Default and Simulation. They determine the playbook configuration.

To say that they never created the problem is just flat out not true. The creation of countless rosters is merely the effect of having terrible rosters in the first place. The CAUSE resides in 2K studios. They are the only ones who can provide the solution and otherwise we're left with a fractured community playing completely different games.

The comments about people "doing whatever they want" or just using numbers is a slap in the face to the few who actually DO spend the time testing every single variable both in the game engine and sim engine. There's a lot of absolute garbage on 2KShare and even in these forums, but it's the job of the consumer to make an educated choice. That choice is power and it's something we should applaud, not put down as consumers of a product that's practically in a monopolistic market.

As for your comments about hex-editing, that's a casual gamer stance on a technical issue. Modding has always been a plus for the gaming community and never a negative. I can't think of one game in any genre, on any platform that was hurt by having an active modding community.

If the tools to edit the game were built-in and not hidden from the customer, then hex-editing wouldn't be required at all. It's hex-editing when done by the customer, but it's a patch or tuning when done on the source code in source control. The only difference is the editor.

[Pared]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

The logic behind this makes no sense.

They (2K Sports) make the roster that we play wiith. They determine the baseline sliders for Default and Simulation. They determine the playbook configuration.

To say that they never created the problem is just flat out not true. The creation of countless rosters is merely the effect of having terrible rosters in the first place. The CAUSE resides in 2K studios. They are the only ones who can provide the solution and otherwise we're left with a fractured community playing completely different games.

The comments about people "doing whatever they want" or just using numbers is a slap in the face to the few who actually DO spend the time testing every single variable both in the game engine and sim engine. There's a lot of absolute garbage on 2KShare and even in these forums, but it's the job of the consumer to make an educated choice. That choice is power and it's something we should applaud, not put down as consumers of a product that's practically in a monopolistic market.

As for your comments about hex-editing, that's a casual gamer stance on a technical issue. Modding has always been a plus for the gaming community and never a negative. I can't think of one game in any genre, on any platform that was hurt by having an active modding community.

If the tools to edit the game were built-in and not hidden from the customer, then hex-editing wouldn't be required at all. It's hex-editing when done by the customer, but it's a patch or tuning when done on the source code in source control. The only difference is the editor.

There's sound logic in my statement: you have people downloading screwed up rosters and blaming it on the game.

You say leave it to the gaming community; The gaming community is more than OS. Guys here know that, and you should too. Most of these guys last year looked for "Roster with all the real rookies!!!!" or "All accessories and other stuff too!" in 2kShare. Your statement actually agrees with me. Spare me the rationalization that roster modifications are the result of poor default rosters - this is the case with ANY game.

If you feel you've "cracked the code" then my comments shouldn't bother you. You know everything there is to know and no one can tell you otherwise.

That still doesn't account for large amount of people out there playing the game and ruining it.

As for hex editing - when you have guys making Kenny Anderson invisible and the basic consumer thinking 2k doesn't bug test... when your association won't load because of a glitched roster then yes - hex editing screws things up... that's when you can't say the "modding community" is always helping the game.

But they can add accurate sneakers. That's something 2k should do, not the community. Leave the "modding" to the PC where screwing up your game doesn't impact others.

[Pared]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

Oh, and THIS game was hurt by people looking to mod it to cheat. There is a reason Crew mode was removed.

I'm sure you can put it all together as to why.

[youALREADYknow]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

Your argument is essentially that ignorant decisions (by ignorant customers) should shape the design and decisions of an entire game or community.

I disagree, but I do agree that the vocal majority of consumers make foolish decisions and place the blame in the wrong place. It's a two-way street though and if you're going to place control and responsibility in the hands of 2K, then you need to hold them to the golden standard that you're holding the modding community to as well.

There are still bugs in 2K12 with all defaults that have not been corrected. The default configuration of 2K12 is still in an embarrassing state. These things have not changed for 10 months and given your feelings about customization, people like yourself should be the ones placing even more stress on 2K's attention to detail than any of us who do support customization.

Lastly, none of us know everything about any video game because we don't access to the source code. That's why the responsibility for accuracy should be squarely in the hands of those who DO have that access. It takes 10-100x the effort to reverse engineer the formulas and logic that is easily accessible to those in that studio. That's time and effort that the community could spend enjoying the game instead of helping to fix it.

[youALREADYknow]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

Oh, and THIS game was hurt by people looking to mod it to cheat. There is a reason Crew mode was removed.

I'm sure you can put it all together as to why.

That's a valid point, but there's cheating in every single online PvP game. Most dedicated sports gamers are just catching up to this reality because it's been going on for over a decade in PC shooters.

Play online against a stranger at your own risk.

[AgentDobby]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

idk how 2k dosnt belivve in the shot clock cheese. especiallly on HOF

[Kese86]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

When I think of the CPU with the shot clock winding down this is what I see...

[jersez]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

I'm 50/50. I can remember the ball being knocked away from kobe then he picks the ball up, damn near halfcourt with seconds left on the shot clock and drained it. This was earlier, when the game just came out.

But like jerzyreign said I've been able to get blocks and steals from the cpu rushing now, so maybe it's me improving my defense, but I think that is due to me turning clutch factore off.

[Gatorfan Frank]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

But they give us sliders/options to allow us to make the game play the way we like? If you sit on default and not use all the 'glory' guys come up with around the various forums to make the game a better experience for yourself then its your fault IMO.

Talk to me when they add sliders to online play, My Player, and Online Associations.

[Goffs]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

Talk to me when they add sliders to online play, My Player, and Online Associations.

Thank you!

I have ZERO issues messing with sliders to my liking when it comes to offline play BUT if you don't have that option for the ones GF mentioned then you will SEE this "so called" shot clock cheese.

I already mentioned this earlier about me playing on an online league!

[KyotoCarl]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

There is NO shot clock "cheese" in 2K12. I'll explain this as briefly as possible.

1. CLUTCH ratings are too high for non-clutch players in default rosters.
2. CLUTCH sliders are set to an absurdly high baseline at the default level (50).

Solutions (BOTH are required):
1. Use a roster where Clutch ratings are set to more reasonable levels.
2. Set the Clutch slider to 1 or 2, preferably 1 to lower the baseline.

That's all that is required to eliminate what some of you are calling "cheese". If that's all it takes, then there's nothing built-in on the code end and therefore there is no cheese.

2K12 remains one of the most misunderstood video games in history for it's userbase and most of that is 2K/VC's fault for terrible communication and post-release support to it's customer base. Having said that, don't make up boogie men and ghosts when you can't otherwise explain why some things happen in the game.

What was explained in the videos is that 2K decided to remove Clutch from the game (bad decision) simply because their own threshold was set too high in 2K12. Replacing the Clutch rating with some Signature Skill was a lazy response to an easily fixed problem. If the Clutch effect was minimized in default sliders (and therefore online) in 2K12 then this would be a non-discussion going into 2K13.

I quoted this cause I think it should be read by people who aren't reading the full thread.

I agreed that there were some awkward shots that went in late but after using modified rosters and sliders, and just by modifying sliders by myself, I eliminated that problem.

[stlpimpmonsta]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

Proof that if you keep tell ppl something, they are bound to belive you. Smh shot clock cheese? Really?

[yungmeaks]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

So some of you are telling me that you've never seen the CPU teleport to the hoop right through your good defense when the shot clock was about to go out?

As someone stated before, play Online Associations and play the CPU. It's disgustingly horrible.

[Colts18]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

Pared, do you feel 2K needs to pay closer attention to the official rosters that they release?

Also, do you only play with default rosters?

How can you blame some people for never wanting to play with default rosters?

[sword1986]

Re: So, 2k doesn't believe in 'shot clock cheese'...your thoughts?

The Clutch Factor set to 1 makes this game VERY easy. I am shooting 73%, beating the Hawks with the Nets right now 21-9 with 5:33 in the 1st.

I am going to continue to play to surmise my clutch factor slider adjustment

Edit-
I am playing on Superstar, game speed at 35