What exactly is real-time physics?

[P-Dub]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

Gotcha, OK. So if you're talking about the right stick to the left/right when playing defense that will likely be me. Haven't done much on it since you guys saw it though. My main focus will be on getting proper contest supported, like what we talked about after you guys played it.

The block/steal aspect of it belongs to another guy on the team.

The reason I was asking was because of an idea I have about possibly using that technology in other areas.

One example would be to have backboard tracking so during a layup a player could automatically try to reach or lean in front of the backboard if he were behind it so layups would never hit the back of the backboard.

You could also add rim tracking and blend the arms and hands so they always look like they grab the rim when dunking.

Another example would be to track a defender or his arm during a shot contest and have a layup animation change in mid-air to avoid the shot block, based on right stick input. You could press down to bring the ball down or press to the side to either switch hands or stretch the arm at a different angle to avoid a block. Bringing the ball down on a baseline layup could result in a nice double clutch reverse layup.

Can you show the producer who worked on the stealing and blocking and see what he thinks?

[NoTiCe_O]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

Yes to both videos.

O_o .. I gotta see that

[mharlem]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

Next-gen basketball could finally arrive if Elite 11 live up to the hype.

[SacKings1999]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

Next-gen basketball could finally arrive if Elite 11 live up to the hype.

Agreed I'm hoping Elite 11 makes me happy I bought a 360. Because so far, I've got to say that I had a lot more fun with last gen basketball. Sounds like Elite 11 might actually put the current gen's power to use!

[Admiral50]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

I'd love to be proven wrong but from the (very) early videos it doesn't look like any type of physics at all. More like an advanced motion capture and animation system.

I think we all hoped for Backbreaker type, 'anything can happen' animation when we heard the word physics...

[rEAnimator]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

I'd love to be proven wrong but from the (very) early videos it doesn't look like any type of physics at all. More like an advanced motion capture and animation system.

I think we all hoped for Backbreaker type, 'anything can happen' animation when we heard the word physics...

As you can tell by the variety of questions in this thread, people can take the term physics to mean any number of things.

In an earlier post I tried to paint a picture of exactly what the player physics in Elite will mean for gameplay. That was just one example, there are many more.

I'm happy to answer any more questions (technical or high level) that you may have or give more examples like the one I gave previously.

I really want people to understand what we're doing and why we're doing it, and not come away with false expectations.

What we're doing with physics is focused on changing how the game is played and how it feels more so that how it looks, although it will make the look much more dynamic and less predictable than before.

I don't think any of the videos released so far really give you an idea of what to expect as they have been focused more on the controls.

I expect more to be released between now and demo time, and maybe that will be a better time to answer questions.

[Admiral50]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

I understand what you're saying but the general term 'physics' and even moreso the way in which this term is used in the gaming world describes natural and automatic (not programmed) reactions and animations.

From what I have seen and now read, Elite seems to have added more interactive animations with better collision detection and control over the actions but not really physics.

Don't get me wrong, I loved Live 10 and will buy Elite day 1 but like I said, I'd love to be proved wrong when some more in depth info and clips surface.

[DaWolf]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

We still have the same problem with gathers that you saw at the community day, but I think we still have enough time to address it. I really don't want them to become an exploit so this is important for me.

You can take a look at NBA Live 06 for the PC. When you jump into another defensive player with the gather you loose the ball in that game.

[dexvex]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

I understand what you're saying but the general term 'physics' and even moreso the way in which this term is used in the gaming world describes natural and automatic (not programmed) reactions and animations.

From what I have seen and now read, Elite seems to have added more interactive animations with better collision detection and control over the actions but not really physics.

Don't get me wrong, I loved Live 10 and will buy Elite day 1 but like I said, I'd love to be proved wrong when some more in depth info and clips surface.

There are a couple of things you have wrong in your post. First off physics are programmed Idk where you got the idea that they weren't. 2nd off while backbreaker incorporates real-time-physics thats only half the package, euphoria uses procedural animation which means they are generated on the fly by the cpu. Thats what make it special. I think there is a bit of confusion on here about what ea has been promoting or what physics actually are but I can definitely see the physics on some things....

rEAnimator since you said you would answer some technical/high-level questions what exactly are you running physics on in the game .

[rEAnimator]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

You can take a look at NBA Live 06 for the PC. When you jump into another defensive player with the gather you loose the ball in that game.

That's definitely an option, but for me I ask myself what's the reason to perform a pro hop or gather in the first place?

I don't want it to be something you do just because it needs to be in a basketball game. It has to have a real purpose and impact on gameplay.

The pro hop causes you to pick up your dribble, so that is a disadvantage. The running gather takes away options and forces you to get rid of the ball on the second step.

So what's the advantage?

In my mind the advantage should be that it's more difficult to strip the ball from the player because he has two hands on it. So you can slice through traffic or hop past someone with confidence that you'll keep the ball.

So losing the ball if you get into a collision situation might be too much of a punishment with no real reward.

So I'm leaning more towards having the collisions impede your forward progress, but you'd still keep a handle on the ball.

And no, I'm not saying you'll never get the ball stripped, but I think it should be harder.

I'm not the be all and end all on this design either, but that's my take on it and what I'll be arguing for.

[23]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

That's definitely an option, but for me I ask myself what's the reason to perform a pro hop or gather in the first place?

I don't want it to be something you do just because it needs to be in a basketball game. It has to have a real purpose and impact on gameplay.

The pro hop causes you to pick up your dribble, so that is a disadvantage. The running gather takes away options and forces you to get rid of the ball on the second step.

So what's the advantage?

In my mind the advantage should be that it's more difficult to strip the ball from the player because he has two hands on it. So you can slice through traffic or hop past someone with confidence that you'll keep the ball.

So losing the ball if you get into a collision situation might be too much of a punishment with no real reward.

So I'm leaning more towards having the collisions impede your forward progress, but you'd still keep a handle on the ball.

And no, I'm not saying you'll never get the ball stripped, but I think it should be harder.

I'm not the be all and end all on this design either, but that's my take on it and what I'll be arguing for.

Well where does a charge or blocking foul come into play? That should be taken into consideration as well with corresponding animations. That's one thing Live 09 had the right idea with when overdoing it trying to get to the basket.

[rEAnimator]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

Well where does a charge or blocking foul come into play? That should be taken into consideration as well with corresponding animations. That's one thing Live 09 had the right idea with when overdoing it trying to get to the basket.

Definitely, take charge is a weapon to defend against any drive to the lane, whether or not you're gathering, doing a pro hop or dribbling.

I think we've done a pretty good job of balancing that this year. It will be a very consistent control mechanic with a predictable outcome.

But going back to my previous point, that's another reason why gathers and pro hops are risky. They put you in a state where you can't stop and are more vulnerable to committing a charge.

I think that just adds to the argument that it should be harder to strip the ball when you perform these moves.

BTW, I think it's awesome that we're discussing actual basketball and game design topics. I'll be honest, I wasn't sure what to expect on the forums but you guys have proven to be very knowledgeable about both.

I can't wait until you get your hands on it and the debates get even more in depth and intense

[FearlessKaz]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

Do the physics being used affect ALL the interactions between players?

For example, if I'm just casually running around and bump into a guy, will he react realistically because of this?

I know in years past if you bumped into someone(didn't matter if they were taking a shot or not) they would just slide or float out of the way.

I'm just thinking of all the possibilities this could add with having to acutally avoid every player on the court or risk getting caught up with them.

[ajknows]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

rEAnimator, with rtf and not getting stuck in animations how responsive is the jump now. Before in all bball games if you jump to block or rebound recovery was slow. Will you be able to jump and not have this long gather before you can jump again.

[rEAnimator]

Re: What exactly is real-time physics?

rEAnimator, with rtf and not getting stuck in animations how responsive is the jump now. Before in all bball games if you jump to block or rebound recovery was slow. Will you be able to jump and not have this long gather before you can jump again.

That's a tuning issue for sure. You don't want it to be too fast or else players will be able to jump over and over again too fast. You want to user to really have to think about when to jump.

But as you say, you don't want it so slow that it's frustrating.

It's something we're aware of and will be tuning to get the best balance.