Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here's why

[BiggestKJ]

Hi...I've noticed a trend here...

(Note: this is gathered from what I've read and what I've heard from others on my messenger who've tested this game at the Madden Challenge. I don't hate LIVE or NBA/ESPN...I own both previous version and have paid close attention to both games in detail)

NBA Live 2003 got some of us pumped up because of the new freestyle feature...however fell short because it didn't really give us the real feel of control over our players. Therefore we we're left with a game that came up short on NBA Live 2k3. Why? That's because that verson of Freestyle was just a testing process tosee how we reacted to it. And they've responded.

This year we get a different, more updated version of Freestyle...one that's more tailored to us controlling our players.

Now comes ESPN with a new feature ISOMotion. I'm not throwing any assumptions at how the gameplay of ESPN is because I haven't tested it out yet. But I believe that this feature will leave us wanting more... Just like NBA Live 2003 did with freestyle...which might put ESPN where LIVE was last year.

That would put NBA Live Freestyle a year ahead of ESPN ISOmotion...score one for NBA Live

Another thing to point out is another feature that NBA Live 2004 will have is 10 Man Motion capture. There's 10 players on the court at all times. One with the ball, the other nine without. Human player controlling the one with the ball (or off the ball). 9 Computer AI's moving the other nine players off the ball. My response...Genious! Of course we might have our grumblings about this new feature, but we have the improved freestyle control to soothe a bit of that pain.

What's ESPN's answer to NBA Live's 10 Man Motion Capture.... ..... ..... exactly that...so far I've seen or heard nothing. There might be something, but we have one more month to go and still yet to see it. Sure, you might say that the improved ESPN presentation is the answer to 10-Man Motion capture. But ever consider this, when do you see the ESPN presentation...after quarters, before games, after games, menus, etc...When do you see 10-Man Motion capture, throughout the game. Does ESPN Presentation affect gameplay... NO!....But 10 Man Motion capture does affect the gameplay...BINGO


Score: NBA Live 2004 - 2, ESPN Basketball - 1

As far as the ESPN movies I've seen so far, I've noticed one thing that made NBA Live less enjoyable last year...the blocks. It seems to me that blocks are numerous in this game. Also, they said they've sped up the pace of the game...why fix it...if it ain't broke!?! I have a few things I like about ESPN basketball but none of them has to do with the gameplay. ESPN Presentation, player detail, nice shooting form...all good...but when it comes to a simulation sports gamer...gameplay is the heart of the game.

Did NBA 2k3 have great gameplay...NO? Why? Consider this, I could easily have done a crossover move every possession and take it to the hole and do a double clutch and get two easy points. I could easily have press the jump button and steal the ball. And I know what you're thinking... 'yeah, well just don't do the easy moves and don't jump for the ball and you'll get realistic stats.'

But you know what? I don't want to have to force myself to do this and that just to make a game realistic...it's not fun that way. Here's what's fun... a challenge. To actually try to win because the computer AI challenges you in a way that you have to force yourself to do anything to make it realistic and try to win.

Now don't get me wrong...but NBA Live 2003 wasn't any good either in gameplay. But when I hear stuff like double teams, defensive trapping, pro hop, two different shooting buttons...I think, 'hey, I might actually get a challenge here..."


The Analysis : ESPN NBA looks better with detail and animations, but right now unless they show me something besides the ISOmotion feature, they haven't made any other big moves towards gameplay as far as I can tell but just put a nice candy coating over something should've been worked on a bit more. NBA Live went to the heart of the game, pumped it, and rejuvinated it by giving us not what we want but what we SHOULD have for a decent CHALLENGE. It's all your choice though not mine...I'm a gamer in need of a game that's more tailored to simulation so I'd take gameplay OVER eye-candy any day. ESPN seems to be taking baby steps this year, and LIVE just took leap frogs to what seems might be a close race this year. THE VERDICT: Try, buy it, do what you want...It depends on you and your taste of sports games...but thanks for listening to me...I'm out...

[CLASSIFIED]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

I can understand some of your post but the title of your post is a stupid assumption. If anything next year will be ESPN's finest with EA playing catch up cuz the ESPN titles this year are all damn near perfect which means more time can be spent tuning and making touchups rather than focusing on areas really lacking next year. I will go out on a lim(guess) and say Live's off ball movement will be portrayed better than ESPN's this year but come next year ESPN will only have to focus on A.I cuz everything else in it destroys the rest unquestionably. Give VC a year to focus strictly on A.I and NBA 2k5 will be totaly dominant in every category. Live 2004 has a lot more to prove than the ESPN series cuz 2001-2003 were full blown arcade games. If you've been enjoying Live for the past years than I have to say you aren't really in touch with how a real game of basketball is or play it seriously anyways. Casual fans of the real sport argue in favor of Live if they enjoyed Live for that type of basketball. True dedicated fans of the real sport most likely argue in favor of ESPN and ID cuz they aren't over the top. Live's track record is arcade reprensentation. ESPN's is much more true to the sport. Live 2004's court movement is impressive but since I didn't like 2001-2003 representation of basketball I'm skeptical about everything in 2004. Animations aside, if it plays offensively heavy, overexaggerates everything i.e dunking BOOM, and is TOO FLASHY with everything from commentary to SFX then it won't feel like true basketball and feel too arcade enfused. I don't have to worry about ESPN enfusing with arcadeness because it's not VC's style and there track record of games doesn't lead me to believe that.

All in All Live looks to be making changes for the better but has too much ground to make up to be better than ESPN.

[CLASSIFIED]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

I can understand some of your post but the title of your post is a stupid assumption. If anything next year will be ESPN's finest with EA playing catch up cuz the ESPN titles this year are all damn near perfect which means more time can be spent tuning and making touchups rather than focusing on areas really lacking next year. I will go out on a lim(guess) and say Live's off ball movement will be portrayed better than ESPN's this year but come next year ESPN will only have to focus on A.I cuz everything else in it destroys the rest unquestionably. Give VC a year to focus strictly on A.I and NBA 2k5 will be totaly dominant in every category. Live 2004 has a lot more to prove than the ESPN series cuz 2001-2003 were full blown arcade games. If you've been enjoying Live for the past years than I have to say you aren't really in touch with how a real game of basketball is or play it seriously anyways. Casual fans of the real sport argue in favor of Live if they enjoyed Live for that type of basketball. True dedicated fans of the real sport most likely argue in favor of ESPN and ID cuz they aren't over the top. Live's track record is arcade reprensentation. ESPN's is much more true to the sport. Live 2004's court movement is impressive but since I didn't like 2001-2003 representation of basketball I'm skeptical about everything in 2004. Animations aside, if it plays offensively heavy, overexaggerates everything i.e dunking BOOM, and is TOO FLASHY with everything from commentary to SFX then it won't feel like true basketball and feel too arcade enfused. I don't have to worry about ESPN enfusing with arcadeness because it's not VC's style and there track record of games doesn't lead me to believe that.

All in All Live looks to be making changes for the better but has too much ground to make up to be better than ESPN.

[CLASSIFIED]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

I can understand some of your post but the title of your post is a stupid assumption. If anything next year will be ESPN's finest with EA playing catch up cuz the ESPN titles this year are all damn near perfect which means more time can be spent tuning and making touchups rather than focusing on areas really lacking next year. I will go out on a lim(guess) and say Live's off ball movement will be portrayed better than ESPN's this year but come next year ESPN will only have to focus on A.I cuz everything else in it destroys the rest unquestionably. Give VC a year to focus strictly on A.I and NBA 2k5 will be totaly dominant in every category. Live 2004 has a lot more to prove than the ESPN series cuz 2001-2003 were full blown arcade games. If you've been enjoying Live for the past years than I have to say you aren't really in touch with how a real game of basketball is or play it seriously anyways. Casual fans of the real sport argue in favor of Live if they enjoyed Live for that type of basketball. True dedicated fans of the real sport most likely argue in favor of ESPN and ID cuz they aren't over the top. Live's track record is arcade reprensentation. ESPN's is much more true to the sport. Live 2004's court movement is impressive but since I didn't like 2001-2003 representation of basketball I'm skeptical about everything in 2004. Animations aside, if it plays offensively heavy, overexaggerates everything i.e dunking BOOM, and is TOO FLASHY with everything from commentary to SFX then it won't feel like true basketball and feel too arcade enfused. I don't have to worry about ESPN enfusing with arcadeness because it's not VC's style and there track record of games doesn't lead me to believe that.

All in All Live looks to be making changes for the better but has too much ground to make up to be better than ESPN.

[CheckMate]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

Once again, the correlation between real life knowledge of a game and preference in a videogame is a weak one. People play videogames to have fun. Which ever game is the most fun for them is the one they will play.

[CheckMate]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

Once again, the correlation between real life knowledge of a game and preference in a videogame is a weak one. People play videogames to have fun. Which ever game is the most fun for them is the one they will play.

[CheckMate]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

Once again, the correlation between real life knowledge of a game and preference in a videogame is a weak one. People play videogames to have fun. Which ever game is the most fun for them is the one they will play.

[adamcz]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

I've been playing Sega for the past two years, but I don't really see how it's an accurate representation of basketball. It's so hard to play a team game, because there is no movement off the ball. Only team you can accurately represent is the Celtics since Walker bricks all his 3's in real life and the game, and you can have Pierce take it by himself while everybody else watches. However there is absolutely no way to simulate the team game that the Kings and Mavs play. When I'm backing my my man down with Webber, it's so frusterating to have nobody cutting to the hoop. When I saw Live's 10 man capture, I decided to switch games this year, because the Sega game is just too slow. It my be realistic, but it's a sim of only one type of basketball, and the Celtics bore me.

[adamcz]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

I've been playing Sega for the past two years, but I don't really see how it's an accurate representation of basketball. It's so hard to play a team game, because there is no movement off the ball. Only team you can accurately represent is the Celtics since Walker bricks all his 3's in real life and the game, and you can have Pierce take it by himself while everybody else watches. However there is absolutely no way to simulate the team game that the Kings and Mavs play. When I'm backing my my man down with Webber, it's so frusterating to have nobody cutting to the hoop. When I saw Live's 10 man capture, I decided to switch games this year, because the Sega game is just too slow. It my be realistic, but it's a sim of only one type of basketball, and the Celtics bore me.

[adamcz]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

I've been playing Sega for the past two years, but I don't really see how it's an accurate representation of basketball. It's so hard to play a team game, because there is no movement off the ball. Only team you can accurately represent is the Celtics since Walker bricks all his 3's in real life and the game, and you can have Pierce take it by himself while everybody else watches. However there is absolutely no way to simulate the team game that the Kings and Mavs play. When I'm backing my my man down with Webber, it's so frusterating to have nobody cutting to the hoop. When I saw Live's 10 man capture, I decided to switch games this year, because the Sega game is just too slow. It my be realistic, but it's a sim of only one type of basketball, and the Celtics bore me.

[JayH1285]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
I've been playing Sega for the past two years, but I don't really see how it's an accurate representation of basketball. It's so hard to play a team game, because there is no movement off the ball. Only team you can accurately represent is the Celtics since Walker bricks all his 3's in real life and the game, and you can have Pierce take it by himself while everybody else watches. However there is absolutely no way to simulate the team game that the Kings and Mavs play. When I'm backing my my man down with Webber, it's so frusterating to have nobody cutting to the hoop. When I saw Live's 10 man capture, I decided to switch games this year, because the Sega game is just too slow. It my be realistic, but it's a sim of only one type of basketball, and the Celtics bore me.

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

so true. What happened to Sega Sports?? NBA 2K3 's AI is horrendous. No help D, off the ball movement, NOTHING. ESPN has to be improved 100x fold if it wants to compete with the other basketball games.

[JayH1285]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
I've been playing Sega for the past two years, but I don't really see how it's an accurate representation of basketball. It's so hard to play a team game, because there is no movement off the ball. Only team you can accurately represent is the Celtics since Walker bricks all his 3's in real life and the game, and you can have Pierce take it by himself while everybody else watches. However there is absolutely no way to simulate the team game that the Kings and Mavs play. When I'm backing my my man down with Webber, it's so frusterating to have nobody cutting to the hoop. When I saw Live's 10 man capture, I decided to switch games this year, because the Sega game is just too slow. It my be realistic, but it's a sim of only one type of basketball, and the Celtics bore me.

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

so true. What happened to Sega Sports?? NBA 2K3 's AI is horrendous. No help D, off the ball movement, NOTHING. ESPN has to be improved 100x fold if it wants to compete with the other basketball games.

[JayH1285]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
I've been playing Sega for the past two years, but I don't really see how it's an accurate representation of basketball. It's so hard to play a team game, because there is no movement off the ball. Only team you can accurately represent is the Celtics since Walker bricks all his 3's in real life and the game, and you can have Pierce take it by himself while everybody else watches. However there is absolutely no way to simulate the team game that the Kings and Mavs play. When I'm backing my my man down with Webber, it's so frusterating to have nobody cutting to the hoop. When I saw Live's 10 man capture, I decided to switch games this year, because the Sega game is just too slow. It my be realistic, but it's a sim of only one type of basketball, and the Celtics bore me.

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

so true. What happened to Sega Sports?? NBA 2K3 's AI is horrendous. No help D, off the ball movement, NOTHING. ESPN has to be improved 100x fold if it wants to compete with the other basketball games.

[LarryBird]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

You say that 2K will never go "arcadey", but what about the new "passing" system, with the behing the back and off the backboard passes and all that? What the hell is that? I know, the most "arcadey" thing to happen to basketball games since NBA Street.

Live learned their lesson last year and switched back to a Sim style of play. VC, stupidly, decided to fix what wasn't broke and now speed up and arcadify their game.... Last year I would never have thought I'd hear myself say that (or read myself type it, for that matter) but I will not buy NBA 2K this year.... Live appears to be where it's at.

[LarryBird]

Re: Live will be better than ESPN next year, if not this year...here\'s why

You say that 2K will never go "arcadey", but what about the new "passing" system, with the behing the back and off the backboard passes and all that? What the hell is that? I know, the most "arcadey" thing to happen to basketball games since NBA Street.

Live learned their lesson last year and switched back to a Sim style of play. VC, stupidly, decided to fix what wasn't broke and now speed up and arcadify their game.... Last year I would never have thought I'd hear myself say that (or read myself type it, for that matter) but I will not buy NBA 2K this year.... Live appears to be where it's at.