Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

[The 24th Letter]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

You need momentum in space to make strides, so I can't really agree there...

It’s like what they used to tell John Wall when he first came in the league…you can be the quickest guy on the court….but you won’t succeed just driving into traffic…you have to take angles and pick your spots…

The problem with Live is that you can take those strides regardless of the defenses positioning…you can also launch those strides without momentum…

Bigs on the perimeter can take those same quick moves…from Bogut to Adams…I just can’t call that realistic

[mrprice33]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

There's some stuff we've definitely talked about with adding more risk/reward to defense, stuff like going for verticality or aggressive blocks, more block/charge situations, things like that. I can't really go into detail, but I'll try to grab some good ideas from here and present them.

[striker3771]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

I love this game. But they really need to fix the lack of interior defense.

[coolcras7]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

You need momentum in space to make strides, so I can't really agree there...

It’s like what they used to tell John Wall when he first came in the league…you can be the quickest guy on the court….but you won’t succeed just driving into traffic…you have to take angles and pick your spots…

The problem with Live is that you can take those strides regardless of the defenses positioning…you can also launch those strides without momentum…

Bigs on the perimeter can take those same quick moves…from Bogut to Adams…I just can’t call that realistic

Exactly, anyone trying to claim that the speed of this game represents the real NBA is talking out of there behind, or suggesting the only way to play this game and win is to play off ball defense. The game has 2 speed slow and turbo the offensive players have the ability to go to a gear that the defense can't match and once they get enough separation to start a drive animation its over, its rediculous

[Lancio23]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

Yea defense definitely needs some fixing. Was playing against Portland earlier and Lilard had 12 dunks all posters except for 1, Lilard just run past me every trip down the court and dunks or lay up.


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[VinsanityLives]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

I agree with the strides being a good aspect of it. That is one of my biggest gripes about 'the other game' that they DONT take big strides or get any NBA level first step and jab steps worthless...

The other game is the only sports game I can recall that makes their players LESS athletic than in real life.

The prob with Live, although great and refreshing to see the strides and strong first steps is they are all too quick and any player center or pg is the same speed same quickness same first step.

In time this game can be good long way to go on animations tho.

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[GSW]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

There is just an overall lack of physicality in this game.

[kobethelegend]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

You need momentum in space to make strides, so I can't really agree there...

It’s like what they used to tell John Wall when he first came in the league…you can be the quickest guy on the court….but you won’t succeed just driving into traffic…you have to take angles and pick your spots…

The problem with Live is that you can take those strides regardless of the defenses positioning…you can also launch those strides without momentum…

Bigs on the perimeter can take those same quick moves…from Bogut to Adams…I just can’t call that realistic

you are correct to a degree in that the animations are a bit funky.

but i will say this. this goes back to my point about the camera angles. are you SURE. like 100% sure. that you are in the proper position to stop said drive? cause i'm not sure. i THINK i am. but that angle is shaky. I cant realllly tell if i'm actually cutting that guy off or if he's going THRU me or doing the good old move me without any contact animation thing we all hate in any basketball game. i get mad like the next man. but truth is, i'm not sure if its my fault(and i cant see.aka bad camera angle or not zoomed in enough). or its 100% shaky live animations/lack of physicality.


back to the strides. guys can take those strides without having momentum(as in without running a fast break.). I dont know if you have ever seen these guys train to be in the nba. I have had few buddies who have trained. didnt make it. some played overseas ball. But they showed me drills they were doing where they would literally attempt to make a layup by taking 2 large strides from slightly beyond half court. and we're not talking about 6'9 guys either. i'm talking guards. imagine guys training to do this all the time until its 2nd nature. this is another reason they are so darn fast and its virtually impossible to consistently stop a NBA player in real life.unless you're another nba player with solid defense.

these guys on espn 710 radio in L.A. was talking about how they had a espn league going(these guys can play but they're not nba/semi pro level). but Scalabrine was in their league. old retired scal. was Euro stepping guys and blowing by them. they were astonished. These nba players are the best 300 or so players in the WORLD. do you know how many millions upon millions of players play basketball? do you know there's at least a few million people worldwide that are darn good at it. but these nba dudes are on a level of their own. you cant even tell f it isnt a superstar unless you've had the ability to play against/with some even in a pickup game where you know they are not going all out. They aint like us. i'm telling you. They are that quick. its video game quick. so again.
lets get on john wall and what you said. this is an issue MOST young super quick/fast guys have coming into the league. if they can go 100mph. they go 100mph. when in reality there's no reason to rush all the time. the best method is to use slow to quick to slow to quick type movements(change of speed, while also changing direction). This is very difficult to guard. because you never know when a guy will hit you with that crazy quick first step since he's lulling you to sleep. but to do that. it means you have the ability to go from 0 to 60 in no time flat. it means you dont have to have any momentum in order to make that burst towards the basket. which is opposite of what you've stated above. and its more in line with what i said in my previous post.

[kobethelegend]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

I agree with the strides being a good aspect of it. That is one of my biggest gripes about 'the other game' that they DONT take big strides or get any NBA level first step and jab steps worthless...

The other game is the only sports game I can recall that makes their players LESS athletic than in real life.

The prob with Live, although great and refreshing to see the strides and strong first steps is they are all too quick and any player center or pg is the same speed same quickness same first step.

In time this game can be good long way to go on animations tho.

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this could be the case, with them not correctly tuning the players speeds in regards to the speed of the actual animation.

and thats if what you're saying is true. here's the thing. we dont really have any way of knowing if thats true. you know why? because we have no way(that i can think of, maybe you guys can come up with something). where you can run a test with a small guy and a Center. that are say both at the half court line. and you take off running to see what happens with that animation. are they truly moving AS quick as each other. OR are they both moving quick in relation to what we're use to seeing in a basketball video game.

what i'm saying is this. to see the true speed of a nba player no matter what position he plays. you need to see them up close in person. like right up close or have the luxury to play with/or against some. even in a pickup game. they have an uncanny quickness to them. even if they are technically slow(big guys). since i'm a lakers fan, i'll use the white guy lol Ryan Kelly from Duke. that guy is not nba quick. but i've seen him make a quick move and get by someone. eventually his defender can catch up to him(speed vs quicks). but his first step is still that of the nba. and if he made that same move on me. even though i'm a smaller guy, even if when i was younger and at my athletic peak. he possibly could still catch me off guard with that first quick step. and its much quicker than we think it is from watching them on TV play vs other super quick people. perhaps live has gone with a look that is trying to replicate what you would see if you actually had floor seats, vs say the other game that has made it known they want it to look like if you were WATCHING the game on TV.

but i would like to run a test, if that is possible. because if it is. then we could prove to the EA devs hey, look this giant 7 foot guy named pekovic is literally moving as quick as Teague from the hawks. now we know that aint real. lol. so fix it. vs "it seems like the bigs and smalls are the same speed when they go to the rack off the dribble."

[kobethelegend]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

Exactly, anyone trying to claim that the speed of this game represents the real NBA is talking out of there behind, or suggesting the only way to play this game and win is to play off ball defense. The game has 2 speed slow and turbo the offensive players have the ability to go to a gear that the defense can't match and once they get enough separation to start a drive animation its over, its rediculous

you do realize what you said is exactly what lebron does to people right?

It's the same reason he at times trys to beat his man off the dribble in the halfcourt but cant. so he backs up even further. why do you think he does this?

well to my knowledge, he does it to create more space. so he can start running and Blow by his guy. so actually its not ridiculous. its actually real life. now to the point someone made above. it may end up being ridiculous if a slower center can do this to a small fast guy. thats not real.

and again. no one addressed what i said about not being able to clearly see where your defenders feet are planted. to know if that offensive animation made your guy float backwards and out of the way like a turnstile, OR it the offensive player goes partially thru your defenders body, OR does said offensive player end up taking a legit or unrealistic angle to get by you.

[The 24th Letter]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

Spoiler

you are correct to a degree in that the animations are a bit funky.



but i will say this. this goes back to my point about the camera angles. are you SURE. like 100% sure. that you are in the proper position to stop said drive? cause i'm not sure. i THINK i am. but that angle is shaky. I cant realllly tell if i'm actually cutting that guy off or if he's going THRU me or doing the good old move me without any contact animation thing we all hate in any basketball game. i get mad like the next man. but truth is, i'm not sure if its my fault(and i cant see.aka bad camera angle or not zoomed in enough). or its 100% shaky live animations/lack of physicality.





back to the strides. guys can take those strides without having momentum(as in without running a fast break.). I dont know if you have ever seen these guys train to be in the nba. I have had few buddies who have trained. didnt make it. some played overseas ball. But they showed me drills they were doing where they would literally attempt to make a layup by taking 2 large strides from slightly beyond half court. and we're not talking about 6'9 guys either. i'm talking guards. imagine guys training to do this all the time until its 2nd nature. this is another reason they are so darn fast and its virtually impossible to consistently stop a NBA player in real life.unless you're another nba player with solid defense.



these guys on espn 710 radio in L.A. was talking about how they had a espn league going(these guys can play but they're not nba/semi pro level). but Scalabrine was in their league. old retired scal. was Euro stepping guys and blowing by them. they were astonished. These nba players are the best 300 or so players in the WORLD. do you know how many millions upon millions of players play basketball? do you know there's at least a few million people worldwide that are darn good at it. but these nba dudes are on a level of their own. you cant even tell f it isnt a superstar unless you've had the ability to play against/with some even in a pickup game where you know they are not going all out. They aint like us. i'm telling you. They are that quick. its video game quick. so again.

lets get on john wall and what you said. this is an issue MOST young super quick/fast guys have coming into the league. if they can go 100mph. they go 100mph. when in reality there's no reason to rush all the time. the best method is to use slow to quick to slow to quick type movements(change of speed, while also changing direction). This is very difficult to guard. because you never know when a guy will hit you with that crazy quick first step since he's lulling you to sleep. but to do that. it means you have the ability to go from 0 to 60 in no time flat. it means you dont have to have any momentum in order to make that burst towards the basket. which is opposite of what you've stated above. and its more in line with what i said in my previous post.

A shifting of my player occurs, so yes, in most cases I am in position and that's being acknowledged, but isn't always wielding realistic results...no matter how fast a player is....they have to respect that there is someone standing right in front them...

I've played ball and scrimmaged with guys at every level...I'm aware of the difference between a regular joe and a world class athletes...even with that, they aren't out there phasing through people....being a professional athlete doesn't exempt you from the laws of physics


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[VinsanityLives]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

I think you are over analyzing the fact the game speed is just too fast. Even if players move this quick in real life, it's not working for this game. Even if pau gasol CAN run that fast, he doesn't, ever, especially at point guard level handles and changing direction.

And it's pretty clear if you start running around with a center and play with the dribble stick, there's no way a center, no matter what you tell me, can sprint full court and do 3 Gs on a spin move to blow by Jimmy Butler with ease.

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[Roger_Black]

Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

The game is good, but defense needs some tweaking.

The BIGGEST problem is see is that guys are constantly 'slingshotting' to the rim.

If you are playing defense (while turbo-running up the court) you could be running step-for-step with your assignment... But if they catch the ball they get an extra 'burst of speed' when attacking the rim (regardless if there is heavy traffic blocking their path)... Which causes the 'sling-shot' effect and makes the gameplay feel very arcade-like at times.

Basketball is about split-second timing. So most of the time... you only need to beat your defender by a single step or so, to score.

So if another player is faster than you, that's one thing... They should only beat you by a half-a-step or 2 all the way to the rim - which is acceptable.

But if they are beating you because the animation hits some 'extra gear' that is way faster than the 'turbo' button... then they end up taking unrealistically looong strides and leave you in the dust, with absolutely no way to defend against it - which is unacceptable.

Player momentum should get penalized a little bit more with defenders nearby. You cannot just 'blow thru' traffic from a jog... with unrealistic acceleration.

Also EA needs to include ALOT more defensive sliding 'side to side' and 'body-up' animations. Especially on the perimeter.

And give us the ability to move / slide / or shuffle a few steps with our arms 'straight up' in the air... plus give us the ability to put our 'arms out' at our sides, or allow us to 'guide' an offensive player in a certain direction (towards the help defenders) with one arm out and the other bent at the elbow, for leverage... to slow down these crossovers that INSTANTLY transition into a 'sling-shot' animation.

Too many players are accelerating from 0 to 100 with only a single step - which is unrealistic.

[coolcras7]

Re: Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

you do realize what you said is exactly what lebron does to people right?

It's the same reason he at times trys to beat his man off the dribble in the halfcourt but cant. so he backs up even further. why do you think he does this?

well to my knowledge, he does it to create more space. so he can start running and Blow by his guy. so actually its not ridiculous. its actually real life. now to the point someone made above. it may end up being ridiculous if a slower center can do this to a small fast guy. thats not real.

and again. no one addressed what i said about not being able to clearly see where your defenders feet are planted. to know if that offensive animation made your guy float backwards and out of the way like a turnstile, OR it the offensive player goes partially thru your defenders body, OR does said offensive player end up taking a legit or unrealistic angle to get by you.

I don't believe I mentioned Lebron in my post, and even if i did the point still remains defense is broken in this game, once a drive animation is triggered which happens around the free throw line its over. Sam just posted a video where he was able to score 123 point with Curry, so it just not driving to the basket.

[Roger_Black]

Defense in NBA Live 16 and beyond

Sidenote: What happened to shooting 'bank shots' off the glass?

Has anyone ever taken / or hit a mid-range jumper............. OFF THE GLASS???

I been playing (Pro Am) for a few days and have never seen ANYONE take a bank shot, or use the glass... except on 'put backs' & layups directly under / or in front of the rim.

(Not even the CPU. smh.)

Is it just my imagination? lol

If anyone knows how to (intentionally) shoot a bank shot... Lemme know. Thanks in advance. Lol.