Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

[strawberryshortcake]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

I'm getting the feeling that the AI SEEMS to be smart due to the simplicity of the offenses. There's not a ton of off ball movement occurring so there isn't much for the AI to keep up with.


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I definitely wouldn't say it's due to the simplicity of the offense. When you understand how to get the offense in motion/off ball movement (use the playbook, quick plays (d-pad), set screens, run cuts, etc. ) the cpu defensive AI is still highly active and looks to play things very appropriately.

I would honestly say there is more "clueless teammate defenders (and cpu defenders) being in out of positon" in 2k17 than the current Live 18 demo. Live 18's defenders are always realistically within reach of the personnel they're suppose to be guarding.

As someone who doesn't like doing isomotion mainly because I'm terrible at it, I need to get my teammates in motion and the methods I've been using to get my teammates to move without the ball involve calling plays, quick plays on the d-pad, using the screen, using the screen and roll, partially using the screen button but not actually using the screen, all helps to get my teammates in motion. You don't even have to abide by the called plays, just read your teammates motion and improvise when the plays are called is all that is necessary. And I could use all the above method in one offensive possession.

Bottom line: There is off-ball movement, but you just to have know how to get your teammates to move without the ball. The AI plays appropriate defensive even when I've got my teammates in complete motion. For one entire offensive set, I could literally have up to 8 - 10 passes, massive amount of teammate movement, and the cpu defense still plays appropriately.

[xCoachDx]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

I definitely wouldn't say it's due to the simplicity of the offense. When you understand how to get the offense in motion/off ball movement (use the playbook, quick plays (d-pad), set screens, run cuts, etc. ) the cpu defensive AI is still highly active and looks to play things very appropriately.

I would honestly say there is more "clueless teammate defenders (and cpu defenders) being in out of positon" in 2k17 than the current Live 18 demo. Live 18's defenders are always realistically within reach of the personnel they're suppose to be guarding.

As someone who doesn't like doing isomotion mainly because I'm terrible at it, I need to get my teammates in motion and the methods I've using to get my teammates to move without the ball involve calling plays, quick plays on the d-pad, using the screen, using the screen and roll, partially using the screen button but not actually using the screen, all helps to get my teammates in motion. You don't even have to abide by the called plays, just read your teammates motion and improvise when the plays are called is all that is necessary. And I could use all the above method in one offensive possession.

Bottom line: There is off-ball movement, but you just to have know how to get your teammates to move without the ball. The AI plays appropriate defensive even when I've got my teammates in complete motion. For one entire offensive set, I could literally have up to 8 - 10 passes, massive amount of teammate movement, and the cpu defense still plays appropriately.

I could make 10 passes and nobody on offense moves unless I do. I've said in a previous post, as a basketball coach, the fact that a pass doesn't trigger anything drives me insane. Which is why I will 100% stick to 2K due to freelance motion which accurately reflect real motion offenses. Also dislike the fact that the only real play I can call is whatever the game decides to let me call. Not to mention that these issues are extremely painful in Career Mode when the lack of any motion keeps you hoping that someone sets a screen for you or something. I've seen the CPU dribble out the shot clock and nobody else move. And I'm not one that enjoys the idea that I can have the ball passed to me at any time, another thing that 2K has that I like.

Also, I wouldn't say Live has more intelligent AI considering there is no weakside when defending pick and rolls and I've frequently seen them double Zaza Pachulia off of Klay Thompson which makes absolutely zero sense. It is good in some ways, but painful in others.


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[Tonyattia]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

I could make 10 passes and nobody on offense moves unless I do. I've said in a previous post, as a basketball coach, the fact that a pass doesn't trigger anything drives me insane. Which is why I will 100% stick to 2K due to freelance motion which accurately reflect real motion offenses. Also dislike the fact that the only real play I can call is whatever the game decides to let me call. Not to mention that these issues are extremely painful in Career Mode when the lack of any motion keeps you hoping that someone sets a screen for you or something. I've seen the CPU dribble out the shot clock and nobody else move. And I'm not one that enjoys the idea that I can have the ball passed to me at any time, another thing that 2K has that I like.

Also, I wouldn't say Live has more intelligent AI considering there is no weakside when defending pick and rolls and I've frequently seen them double Zaza Pachulia off of Klay Thompson which makes absolutely zero sense. It is good in some ways, but painful in others.


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If you tap L1 the play wheel will come up and you can select from a variety of play types


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[xCoachDx]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

If you tap L1 the play wheel will come up and you can select from a variety of play types


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Whoa what? For real? Will have to try this. How has nobody brought this up yet??


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[Tonyattia]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

Whoa what? For real? Will have to try this. How has nobody brought this up yet??


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Yeah it was introduced in Live 16. You tap L1 and then flick the right stick down and to the right where it says "full playbook", then you can cycle through pages of off ball screen, pick and roll, and post up plays.


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[xCoachDx]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

Yeah it was introduced in Live 16. You tap L1 and then flick the right stick down and to the right where it says "full playbook", then you can cycle through pages of off ball screen, pick and roll, and post up plays.


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Well that changes a lot. Why couldn't you have said something this weekend bro?? Lol thanks for the info.


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[Vinsanity115]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

Well that changes a lot. Why couldn't you have said something this weekend bro?? Lol thanks for the info.


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For some reason Live felt the need to not discuss a lot of their features and stick to the One hype.

I'm finding out a lot of stuff in Shootaround..

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[Quentin32]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

AI is terrible in this game. I'm not sugarcoating this. It's awful not just for basketball it's terrible for videogames. Some of the stuff is see makes no sense at all.

[Schwall]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

The off-ball movement option was omitted from the Live 15 demo but available in the full game and that made a noticeable difference when enabled. Not sure if its integrated or stand alone this year. Perhaps Schwall or WTF can answer that question for the community.

There is auto motion still in the game. If you wait/idle at certain parts of the court with the ball, they will do some off ball actions.

We hear the feedback and will look into ways to improve this if possible.

[The 24th Letter]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

There is auto motion still in the game. If you wait/idle at certain parts of the court with the ball, they will do some off ball actions.

We hear the feedback and will look into ways to improve this if possible.

I've kind of caught on to this, slowing the game down and letting the floor develop.

Quick question while we are on the subject. Sometimes I will see a guy flashing right under the rim on one of these cuts, but the catch animation takes him a couple feet away from the goal....turning a lay up to a jumper.

Is there a way I should be passing for a quicker pass reciept and finish? Am I possibly passing too late on these and need to anticipate more?

[Vinsanity115]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

I've noticed quick screen is a good way to get things in motion. Could be because I'm idle waiting for the screens to play out, I do like how quickly they go into the quick plays

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[Schwall]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

I've kind of caught on to this, slowing the game down and letting the floor develop.

Quick question while we are on the subject. Sometimes I will see a guy flashing right under the rim on one of these cuts, but the catch animation takes him a couple feet away from the goal....turning a lay up to a jumper.

Is there a way I should be passing for a quicker pass reciept and finish? Am I possibly passing too late on these and need to anticipate more?

Yea, try anticipating it a bit more if possible.

[El_Poopador]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

AI is terrible in this game. I'm not sugarcoating this. It's awful not just for basketball it's terrible for videogames. Some of the stuff is see makes no sense at all.

Examples? I've seen some bad decisions, but I've also seen some great AI.


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[dasunsrule32]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

Yea, try anticipating it a bit more if possible.

Talking about passing, I know you have a ton in your plate, but it would be cool to allow for a way to button pass and pick the type of pass, bounce, lob, etc. Thank you!

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[Quentin32]

Re: Let's talk about the AI (it's Awesome)

Examples? I've seen some bad decisions, but I've also seen some great AI.


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Played a whole game with scoring with just Kyrie and only when I scored 40 did the GS start to double me. That only lasted for like 3 possessions. Then they went right back to single coverage. I shot every shot with him. The only other score on my team was a TT tip dunk from a free throw miss. I'm was playing on superstar btw with no settings changed. Another thing fatigue was on but he never slowed down even though I mashed turbo the whole game.


It so much more nonsense I see than I can type. Tbh i think my demo was broke. Because I'm hearing some people say this game has the best AI ever. I deleted the demo after Lebron took 6 steps to dunk the ball and the next possession KD just stop playing defense/offense. He literally made a 3pt shot then basically stood at the same spot for a quarter. And that wasn't the 1st time it happened.