Why do big men complain about SVG

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

He's not overrated. Dwight is the best rebounding and shotblocking center in the league. He also averages 20+ a game and is elite at putbacks.

No one thinks he is Patrick Ewing on the low block yet. That's why there is still some debate about him vs. Yao. If Dwight had a real offense, he'd easily be way better than Yao because of his other gifts.

As a high caliber player, Dwight has a right to ask for the ball, but Rashad Lewis *should* be their number 1 option down the stretch on offense. If he gets the ball in his comfort zone and doesn't make shots, the Magic just have to live with that until they get a better go to player, or until Dwight develops more of an offense and improves his FT shooting.

[celg35]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

well actually i did yesterday. some of thoe guys do play the power forward/center postion, but skills is skills.

but that topic is over......................

i dont like it when a player blames the coach for his shortcomings.

i didnt think howard was that kind of guy to begin with

[Cebby]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

John Hollinger with a great analysis of this "give me the ball" issue, concluding that not only was this 10 shot performance normal for Dwight and the Magic, but that they actually had been undefeated in the playoffs when he takes 10 or fewer shots until yesterday... http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playof...PERDiem-090513

Those are very misleading stats.

Of Hollinger's regular season stats, 2 of those 16 games were when Howard was out, and 9 of them were when he played 32 or fewer minutes, meaning the game was likely a blowout.

Same with the playoffs. Of the 3 games, Howard missed one, one was when he was 7/8 with 28 minutes played, and the other he played only 30 minutes and went 4/6.

It's the same with the Kobe deal. Any time your best player takes few shots, you're probably going to have a good record because it tends to be from him playing fewer minutes rather than him simply deciding to pass more.

The Cavs were 7-0 when Lebron took 12 or fewer shots. The Heat were 5-2 when DWade took 15 or fewer shots. The Lakers were 15-2 when Kobe took under 15 shots (these numbers might be off by 1 or 2). However, their coaches still have them shoot because you can't go up by 20 every game.

[SpacemanSpiff]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

..and you still can't name 5 centers better than him.

well actually i did yesterday. some of thoe guys do play the power forward/center postion, but skills is skills.

but that topic is over......................

i dont like it when a player blames the coach for his shortcomings.

i didnt think howard was that kind of guy to begin with

Naming Big Z doesn't count as a center better than him and neither does naming Pau Gasol, Garnett, Duncan who are all power forwards. And Dwight's shot blocking and rebounding are by far the best in the league so I don't think Pau Gasol or half the other power forwards you were naming are better than Dwight anyway.

I don't like how Dwight handled this either but I don't think he's wrong. What he said was a valid criticism, I just think that wasn't the right forum for it.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

Thing is, they are paying Rashad like 100 mil just to shoot. Dwight SHOULD be the 2nd option on offense, but Rashad has been inconsistent in the playoffs, which isn't SVG or Dwight's fault.

[celg35]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

Naming Big Z doesn't count as a center better than him and neither does naming Pau Gasol, Garnett, Duncan who are all power forwards. And Dwight's shot blocking and rebounding are by far the best in the league so I don't think Pau Gasol or half the other power forwards you were naming are better than Dwight anyway.

I don't like how Dwight handled this either but I don't think he's wrong. What he said was a valid criticism, I just think that wasn't the right forum for it.

well i agree too. but personally i wouls rather have big Z or yao take the final shot than howard.........its my opinion...............but howard is more defense than offense in his skills

[23]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

Thing is, they are paying Rashad like 100 mil just to shoot. Dwight SHOULD be the 2nd option on offense, but Rashad has been inconsistent in the playoffs, which isn't SVG or Dwight's fault.

He makes 100 million but he's not option 1a talent. He disappeared on Ray Allen and the Sonics back in Seattle during games. One thing he isnt taking advantage of enough is his height and skill in the post. I saw him take Ray with a post up but he avoids that part of his game too much.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

He makes 100 million but he's not option 1a talent. He disappeared on Ray Allen and the Sonics back in Seattle during games. One thing he isnt taking advantage of enough is his height and skill in the post. I saw him take Ray with a post up but he avoids that part of his game too much.

I agree, but if you're the GM of the Magic and you pay players and coaches, you want the coach to figure out how to get your big money guy shots. You don't fire--or even chastise--a coach because the guy you're paying 100mil can't shoot. Then why did you pay him??

Point is, Dwight shouldn't be ignored but he also is not an offensive go to guy. Offensively he is a piece. A piece that can't hit free throws. The Magic's main problem is that they stop playing D and rebounding when they get a lead, not that they have this post up power house that they are ignoring.

Not saying that they shouldn't work inside out, but let's keep this in perspective.

[Kashanova]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

The problem is no Jameer Nelson imo

[23]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

I agree, but if you're the GM of the Magic and you pay players and coaches, you want the coach to figure out how to get your big money guy shots. You don't fire--or even chastise--a coach because the guy you're paying 100mil can't shoot. Then why did you pay him??

Point is, Dwight shouldn't be ignored but he also is not an offensive go to guy. Offensively he is a piece. A piece that can't hit free throws. The Magic's main problem is that they stop playing D and rebounding when they get a lead, not that they have this post up power house that they are ignoring.

Not saying that they shouldn't work inside out, but let's keep this in perspective.

I agree with Kash that Jameer's presence is missed more than people are admitting right now, but it should be played inside out. Thing is, throwing the ball into the post doesn't always = shoot the ball.

It forces double teams and the defense to collapse and opens up better looks for the other players. You no doubt need the guys on the wings to perform, but in perspective had they kicked it in, chances are they would've gotten much better looks than what they got.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

The Magic would love to have Jameer right now, no doubt, but I don't think he is the biggest problem by far. Watch the Magic give up these big leads and you see them stop playing defense. That's their main issue, along with some injury issues and mental breakdowns on the floor.

Whenever a team is getting big leads and giving them up, defense/rebounding is usually the culprit. A while back Dwight started whining about not getting the ball enough and the consensus among coaches was that while he was developing offensively, the Magic are best when he puts shotblocking and reboudning first.

I think the same thing is happening now, except his rebounding and shotblocking are slacking in the fourth. Rather than worrying about scoring, he should raise the intensity of his "not in my house" game when teams are trying to come back on the Magic. That is the number one key to their championship hopes and everything else falls into place.

[HMcCoy]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

Good posts, Born. They also get killed in transition with the long rebounds off the bricks they like to fire up when trying to stop a run. They need to work the ball into the paint whether it's via Howard or not.

Rafer hurts them a bit also...he would be ideal as a bench scoring spark but as your primary floor general, he's not very good. Alston's shortcomings force SVG to let Turk run the point down the stretch which compounds the problem.

[23]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

Good posts, Born. They also get killed in transition with the long rebounds off the bricks they like to fire up when trying to stop a run. They need to work the ball into the paint whether it's via Howard or not.

Rafer hurts them a bit also...he would be ideal as a bench scoring spark but as your primary floor general, he's not very good. Alston's shortcomings force SVG to let Turk run the point down the stretch which compounds the problem.

thank you on rafer. ive been saying that exact thing about him for some time now. ... and any team shooting that many threes are bound to give up tons of transition buckets thats why teams that do it never win it all

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

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[ehh]

Re: Why do big men complain about SVG

After watching those four horrible "post moves" Howard had in the 3rd quarter (couldn't score on Big Baby) I don't blame Orlando for not giving him the ball.