How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

Yikes. This thread has taken a turn...

[PrettyT11]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

Let me ask you a question. Where did the term King James originate? The NBA or Nike? Point being, regardless if a campaign is not officially NBA protocol it can be perceived and accepted as such. What Dwight Howard and Kenyon Martin perceived was that the puppet commercial campaign was a back door way of saying Lebron and Kobe were going to be in the finals. The NBA wanted it, the fans (most of them) seem to want it, and David Stern most definitely wanted. What Nike puts forth in their various campaigns more often than not become NBA reality, or desired NBA reality. It was not unreasonable for both Dwight and Kenyon to perceive the Nike commercial as an extension of an NBA want.

Let me ask you another question. Since you said that the commercial was exalting present and former NBA MVP's, now that Lebron won't be meeting Kobe in the finals, do you think that they will continue the campaign? I mean, Lebron is still the MVP right? And if they do show another puppet ad, it will probably be to bring closure to the puppet campaign. I seriously doubt that it will be ongoing. I firmly believe, and most probably would agree that the commercials were done in anticipation of a Lebron and Kobe finals. I don't know why you can't seem to see that.

Actually it was NEITHER the NBA or Nike that started the King James thing. That was a nickname given to him in HIGH SCHOOL by friends and teamates. I saw him refered to that in a Slam magazine when he was in like the 11th grade. So you can throw that argument out the window.

If you, Dwight, Kenyon, or anybody want to go reading way in between the lines and make something extra out of it then thats on you guys. The point is Nike had it's top two endorsers in the playoffs playing at a high level at the same time. On top of that they are the last two MVP's so they wanted to try to capitalize on a marketing opportunity. If you guys can't see it has being a SMART business move over anything else then you guys need to go back and take marketing and business 101. Besides Kenyon ALWAYS is complaining about something lol.

As far as your other question I don't know what Nike is going to do with the Ads now. Neither do you or anybody else. The only people that knows that is NIKE. So we ALL will have to take a wait and see approach. IMO I doubt they stop all together seeing as how Kobe is still playing. If they both would have got beat then probably but one is still playing. Of course Nike was hoping for a LeBron and Kobe finals and was expecting it. Hell most people where. So to say that Nike wanted that or was hoping for that is like saying the sky is blue. EVERYBODY knows that.

The point is if Kenyon, Dwight, or any other player truly thought those commercials where disrespectful to them from a company they have NOTHING to do with. That on them. I think they are over reacting to a marketing plan from a shoe company. I truly wouldn't see it as anything other than business. If they want to use that as motivation then I'm all for it and that's a different story but to say that NIKE disrespected them from a shoe commercial is a lil foolish.

I mean did Dwight feel disrespected by all the Nike Ads during the Olympics in which he WASN'T in a SINGLE one?? Did he feel disrespected by all the chalk commercials during the regular season?? Did LeBron and Kobe feel disrespected by all the Addidas commercials that where going on during the season with Dwight dancing and dunking with kids or all the ones with T-Mac, Duncan, Garnett, and Gilbert?? NO they didn't. So if they didn't get all bent out of shape then there is no reason to be so now.

[JBH3]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

Yikes. This thread has taken a turn...

[PrettyT11]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

First, you know nothing of my wife, and the very struggles she goes through and the good she's tried to do at her school.

She's one of the few teachers who makes herself available anytime of the day when she is not teaching. Countless students come to her w/ their problems, request her for next year because they like her so much, she's bought bras and panties for less fortunate girls who have none. She's tried starting a care-closest to donate used clothing to students, but she was shutdown for fear that some students would ridicule others if they saw "Jimmy" wearing their T-Shirt.

So when I get "SECOND HAND" information, I'm not getting it from a BIASED source. I'm actually getting it from the most honest and reliable source there is, and it's being explained to me w/ out exaggeration.

My wife "vents" daily about what she goes through w/ a lot of these kids, and AGAIN she's always available to help them, yet they refuse to stay after school for extra help when they know they need it.

My dude all that was pointless if you would have read my post. All it took was seeing this one line.

I don't know what your wife's teaching methods are and can't comment on them cause I DON'T KNOW. Just like you DON'T KNOW for fact that they are ignorant. You are taking somebody else's word for it.

So like I said in that post I will leave it at that. No need to continue on with you about this.

[JBH3]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

My dude all that was pointless if you would have read my post. All it took was seeing this one line.



So like I said in that post I will leave it at that. No need to continue on with you about this.

Uh..I read your post, and I'm saying that I CAN take my wife's word for it because I know she isn't being unfair in her assesments.

Given everything I stated you still think that someone trying to do so much good is going to just start calling kids ignorant out of anger or frustration.

But Ok...

[Brankles]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

I will leave it at this cause like somebody has already stated you are coming off with this higher than thou attitude. The whole reason I came with the question is because I have been in the situation as teacher/coach to kids in an area that I'm sure is just as bad if not and probably is worse than that your wife teaches. And some if not most of those kids would just as much fight you or cuss you out than congradulate you after a game. After growing up with thier older brothers and sister and knowing where they come from and thier influences at home I KNEW that they never had the proper direction. But I worked with them, related to them, and tried to show them a different way to handle things. Not saying I am or was the perfect teacher/coach but without the right teaching/coaching it has no effect on them.

But I like how you can just throw everybody into this pre fit boxes and such. You have NO idea what those kids go through at home or see on a day to day basis cause you are NOT WITH them.

NO you don't KNOW them to be ignorant. You don't see them or are with them on a first hand basis. You are getting SECOND HAND info and stories from a VERY biased person that chances are you are going to believe ANYWAY. I have heard teachers/coaches who where there with me say the same thing and be wrong as hell. They weren't teaching anything. They where basically barking orders and leaving it at that. That's not teaching. Not everybody can learn or do things the same way you or I did them so you can't expect for them do the same. I don't know what your wife's teaching methods are and can't comment on them cause I DON'T KNOW. Just like you DON'T KNOW for fact that they are ignorant. You are taking somebody else's word for it.

So until you are in that classroom YOURSELF or are trying to teach them YOURSELF then you don't know. But nice try trying to put everybody into your preconceived boxes.

The whole thing about the kids acting out, not handling situations the right way, and cussing out their teachers and coaches... it's all because they are immature and unable to handle the situation. They're kids, they're supposed to be immature. Many don't have role models to show them right. Luckily for the kids you teach and coach, you're doing your part to play somewhat of a role model, even though you can't be there all the time.

But because someone doesn't know any better or doesn't have anyone to tell them how to act doesn't mean that their actions are right. Not understanding how to do certain things, such as sportsmanship, doesn't come from their innate desire to win, it comes from not knowing how to handle losing and not understanding certain things about respect. I feel like the situation with LeBron, he's trying to justify his actions because he couldn't emotionally handle shaking his opponent's hand after losing to him.

However important you judge LeBron's walk off to be... it is not a sign of strength and focus. It is a sign of emotional weakness. I truly believe as he matures, this won't happen again. LeBron needs some better influences around him, that's all. He may have one of the biggest egos in the league, but he isn't truly a bad person. He just needs someone to bring him down to earth every now and again.

or maybe he knew they had no chance to beat that team... and he really thought they could beat the magic, therefore when the team lost he was extremly upset.

If he really believed that, that is a huge sign of disrespect and makes it that much more unsportsmanlike.

[Kully]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

Stern is in on it now

"I'm in the process of making a phone call or two now to talk to LeBron ... so I don't want to speak to that at this moment," Stern said.

"So you're not happy?" Cowherd asked.

"I think that's fair to say," Stern replied.

When further asked about James' storming off the court without postgame handshakes with the Magic -- and whether one action was more troubling than the other -- Stern said both were important. "One goes to rules, another goes to values," he said. "I think both of them should be followed."

"Everything's big when you follow the NBA, so I'm going to step back and ask not to be pushed too hard right now [on the incident]," Stern added. "I've got a few irons in the fire."

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4224350

I'll have to echo what others have said, getting a bit far out there now.

[PrettyT11]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

The whole thing about the kids acting out, not handling situations the right way, and cussing out their teachers and coaches... it's all because they are immature and unable to handle the situation. They're kids, they're supposed to be immature. Many don't have role models to show them right. Luckily for the kids you teach and coach, you're doing your part to play somewhat of a role model, even though you can't be there all the time.

But because someone doesn't know any better or doesn't have anyone to tell them how to act doesn't mean that their actions are right. Not understanding how to do certain things, such as sportsmanship, doesn't come from their innate desire to win, it comes from not knowing how to handle losing and not understanding certain things about respect. I feel like the situation with LeBron, he's trying to justify his actions because he couldn't emotionally handle shaking his opponent's hand after losing to him.

However important you judge LeBron's walk off to be... it is not a sign of strength and focus. It is a sign of emotional weakness. I truly believe as he matures, this won't happen again. LeBron needs some better influences around him, that's all. He may have one of the biggest egos in the league, but he isn't truly a bad person. He just needs someone to bring him down to earth every now and again.

I agree with pretty much all of this. We are pretty much saying the same things about the kids and that's what I was trying to get JBH to see. You can't throw all those kids into the same box and they are this and that when you DON'T KNOW them.

As far as the LeBron thing goes I don't and will not try to dig all deep into his head and figure the root reasons for why he did what he did lol. It was a mistake and I will take him at his word for why he did it. He says he was pissed off about losing and that's how he reacted. Was it the right thing to do?? No. But I'm not going to try and proclaim him to be some type of classless punk.I mean the dude is still young and not a SINGLE ONE of us know what it's like to walk a mile in his shoes. I will give him the benefit of the doubt seeing as how this is his FIRST mistake and see how re responds to it and acts in the future. Which is what I think we ALL should do before jumping to conclusions on his character and him as a person.

[GSW]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

I agree with pretty much all of this. We are pretty much saying the same things about the kids and that's what I was trying to get JBH to see. You can't throw all those kids into the same box and they are this and that when you DON'T KNOW them.

As far as the LeBron thing goes I don't and will not try to dig all deep into his head and figure the root reasons for why he did what he did lol. It was a mistake and I will take him at his word for why he did it. He says he was pissed off about losing and that's how he reacted. Was it the right thing to do?? No. But I'm not going to try and proclaim him to be some type of classless punk.I mean the dude is still young and not a SINGLE ONE of us know what it's like to walk a mile in his shoes. I will give him the benefit of the doubt seeing as how this is his FIRST mistake and see how re responds to it and acts in the future. Which is what I think we ALL should do before jumping to conclusions on his character and him as a person.

No.. we have to crucify him on the interwebs.

Resistance is Futile.

[Brankles]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

No.. we have to crucify him on the interwebs.

Resistance is Futile.

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Bring it

[JBH3]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

The whole thing about the kids acting out, not handling situations the right way, and cussing out their teachers and coaches... it's all because they are immature and unable to handle the situation. They're kids, they're supposed to be immature. Many don't have role models to show them right. Luckily for the kids you teach and coach, you're doing your part to play somewhat of a role model, even though you can't be there all the time.

But because someone doesn't know any better or doesn't have anyone to tell them how to act doesn't mean that their actions are right. Not understanding how to do certain things, such as sportsmanship, doesn't come from their innate desire to win, it comes from not knowing how to handle losing and not understanding certain things about respect. I feel like the situation with LeBron, he's trying to justify his actions because he couldn't emotionally handle shaking his opponent's hand after losing to him.

However important you judge LeBron's walk off to be... it is not a sign of strength and focus. It is a sign of emotional weakness. I truly believe as he matures, this won't happen again. LeBron needs some better influences around him, that's all. He may have one of the biggest egos in the league, but he isn't truly a bad person. He just needs someone to bring him down to earth every now and again.



If he really believed that, that is a huge sign of disrespect and makes it that much more unsportsmanlike.

Nice posts Brankles.

Stern is in on it now


http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4224350

I'll have to echo what others have said, getting a bit far out there now.

Gotta give Stern a hand this time around...

I agree with pretty much all of this. We are pretty much saying the same things about the kids and that's what I was trying to get JBH to see. You can't throw all those kids into the same box and they are this and that when you DON'T KNOW them.

As far as the LeBron thing goes I don't and will not try to dig all deep into his head and figure the root reasons for why he did what he did lol. It was a mistake and I will take him at his word for why he did it. He says he was pissed off about losing and that's how he reacted. Was it the right thing to do?? No. But I'm not going to try and proclaim him to be some type of classless punk.I mean the dude is still young and not a SINGLE ONE of us know what it's like to walk a mile in his shoes. I will give him the benefit of the doubt seeing as how this is his FIRST mistake and see how re responds to it and acts in the future. Which is what I think we ALL should do before jumping to conclusions on his character and him as a person.

T11 - The thing is you made your point, and I provided evidence which is enough in my opinion to confirm a good amount of these kids are ignorant. Everything I said about my wife and what she's done, sees, and goes through is true.

If she says she has some ignorant kids, the very ones who think Lebron did nothing wrong, or would act the same way as he did, and she says they're ignorant, I believe her. You can fault me for that all you want, but my wife is a pretty damn good judge of character and I can count on one hand in 6 yrs how many times she's been wrong.

It was Once...and that was regarding a caregiver at our son's daycare (leave it to a mom to be over-reactive/protective of her son). She thought the lady was mean and wasn't right and turns out she's her favorite teacher at his daycare.

I understood the point you made and disagreed. My wife's word/assesment is as good as first hand knowledge IMO. So fault me for that all you want.

[JBH3]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

No.. we have to crucify him on the interwebs.

Resistance is Futile.

lol. Your just as much responsible at this point. Say nothing and the thread goes away...

[NovaStar]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

Actually it was NEITHER the NBA or Nike that started the King James thing. That was a nickname given to him in HIGH SCHOOL by friends and teamates. I saw him refered to that in a Slam magazine when he was in like the 11th grade. So you can throw that argument out the window.

If you, Dwight, Kenyon, or anybody want to go reading way in between the lines and make something extra out of it then thats on you guys. The point is Nike had it's top two endorsers in the playoffs playing at a high level at the same time. On top of that they are the last two MVP's so they wanted to try to capitalize on a marketing opportunity. If you guys can't see it has being a SMART business move over anything else then you guys need to go back and take marketing and business 101. Besides Kenyon ALWAYS is complaining about something lol.

As far as your other question I don't know what Nike is going to do with the Ads now. Neither do you or anybody else. The only people that knows that is NIKE. So we ALL will have to take a wait and see approach. IMO I doubt they stop all together seeing as how Kobe is still playing. If they both would have got beat then probably but one is still playing. Of course Nike was hoping for a LeBron and Kobe finals and was expecting it. Hell most people where. So to say that Nike wanted that or was hoping for that is like saying the sky is blue. EVERYBODY knows that.

The point is if Kenyon, Dwight, or any other player truly thought those commercials where disrespectful to them from a company they have NOTHING to do with. That on them. I think they are over reacting to a marketing plan from a shoe company. I truly wouldn't see it as anything other than business. If they want to use that as motivation then I'm all for it and that's a different story but to say that NIKE disrespected them from a shoe commercial is a lil foolish.

I mean did Dwight feel disrespected by all the Nike Ads during the Olympics in which he WASN'T in a SINGLE one?? Did he feel disrespected by all the chalk commercials during the regular season?? Did LeBron and Kobe feel disrespected by all the Addidas commercials that where going on during the season with Dwight dancing and dunking with kids or all the ones with T-Mac, Duncan, Garnett, and Gilbert?? NO they didn't. So if they didn't get all bent out of shape then there is no reason to be so now.

So you are saying that the term King james is universally used to describe Lebron because he was called that in high school? I would put forth to you that the King James name is universally known because of Nike. I never heard of that phrase until Nike used it in the ad. And I am sure most of the world didn't know lebron back in Akron.

Again, if you can't see that the puppet commercials were made in anticipation of Lebron and Kobe being in the finals, then I would have to say that you are very short sighted.

By the way the sky isn't blue that is illusion like most of your argument. How you can on one hand acknowledge that everyone not only wanted a Kobe, lebron matchup including, nike and the nba, but pretty much had written Orlando off (most thought that cleveland would not lose a game until the finals), then turn around and say that the puppet commercial was not made to insinuate that Kobe and lebron would meet in the finals, makes no logical sense. You have a blue sky argument, I know that is what you think you see, but it aint really there. It was more than reasonable for both Orlando and Denver to feel disrespected.

[PrettyT11]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

T11 - The thing is you made your point, and I provided evidence which is enough in my opinion to confirm a good amount of these kids are ignorant. Everything I said about my wife and what she's done, sees, and goes through is true.

If she says she has some ignorant kids, the very ones who think Lebron did nothing wrong, or would act the same way as he did, and she says they're ignorant, I believe her. You can fault me for that all you want, but my wife is a pretty damn good judge of character and I can count on one hand in 6 yrs how many times she's been wrong.

It was Once...and that was regarding a caregiver at our son's daycare (leave it to a mom to be over-reactive/protective of her son). She thought the lady was mean and wasn't right and turns out she's her favorite teacher at his daycare.

I understood the point you made and disagreed. My wife's word/assesment is as good as first hand knowledge IMO. So fault me for that all you want.

I'm not faulting you for believing or not believing her. I'm not saying she does or doesn't do all that you say she does. I said in my post I don't know how she approaches or handles the kids so I wouldn't and won't comment on her teaching. If she does do all of that then I commend her for the efforts and there should be more like that. There are alot of teachers who are just there to go through the day and get a check just like there are people like that on every job.

My problem and argument came from how you talked about the kids in the post responding to mine. It made no comments or stated anything about what your wife does for kids. All it said was those kids are ignorant and so is LeBron. He is the idiot leading the idiots. I believe that is very unfair to the KIDS without knowing thier situations. Yes there are some kids that just don't give a damn and there are some that actually don't know and all they need to be is taught the right way but I would never just write off a KID cause you never know what could come of them if given the right type of guidance.I'm pretty sure your wife has had experiences with both types. If you stated all of this then or before hand then the whole convo probably would have went a different way. No big deal.

[JBH3]

Re: How do you feel about congratulating your opponent after a loss?

I'm not faulting you for believing or not believing her. I'm not saying she does or doesn't do all that you say she does. I said in my post I don't know how she approaches or handles the kids so I wouldn't and won't comment on her teaching. If she does do all of that then I commend her for the efforts and there should be more like that. There are alot of teachers who are just there to go through the day and get a check just like there are people like that on every job.

My problem and argument came from how you talked about the kids in the post responding to mine. It made no comments or stated anything about what your wife does for kids. All it said was those kids are ignorant and so is LeBron. He is the idiot leading the idiots. I believe that is very unfair to the KIDS without knowing thier situations. Yes there are some kids that just don't give a damn and there are some that actually don't know and all they need to be is taught the right way but I would never just write off a KID cause you never know what could come of them if given the right type of guidance.I'm pretty sure your wife has had experiences with both types. If you stated all of this then or before hand then the whole convo probably would have went a different way. No big deal.

Well I just assumed that w/o having to go onto a huge tangent justifying my previous statements it would just be accepted, and we could move on from there.

So, in life, must YOU experience everything/everyone first hand
to garner your own assesment. If your wife/cousin/mother/brother/sister told you, don't mess w/ "X" because they'll screw you up, would you still have to experience whatever hardship they did to believe their statement?

I mean c'mon...we sat here and took this argument way off course because you assumed I wasn't given some kid, who my wife teaches and would say is ignorant, a fair shake.