Most complete PF today

[Vaporub83]

Re: Most complete PF today

Love is already the best PF in the league.

Blake might end up being better down the road, but right now he is still too raw.

How can Love even be in contention when his team has never had a winning record? In a league where one guy can change everything, it is unacceptable to be below .500.

If Love can make the playoffs we can talk about him being the best PF in the game.

My vote is for Dirk. He was the only constant for the Mavs team that won 50 games a year for 10+ years.

[iLLosophy]

Re: Most complete PF today

In a league where one guy can change everything, it is unacceptable to be below .500.

Name these "one guys" that have changed everything, and brought one of the worse teams in the league to a team above .500 all by themselves.

[dramachild11]

Re: Most complete PF today

well the cleveland team that lost 26 STRAIGHT last year was missing only 2 players from the previous year ilgauskas an that guy who went to miami lol... in fairness to love though minnesota is 8 & 10 so far this year an "4 of their losses have been in the last 60 seconds of their games" (quoting tim legler)

[iLLosophy]

Re: Most complete PF today

well the cleveland team that lost 26 STRAIGHT last year was missing only 2 players from the previous year ilgauskas an that guy who went to miami lol... in fairness to love though minnesota is 8 & 10 so far this year an "4 of their losses have been in the last 60 seconds of their games" (quoting tim legler)

Should've clarified as I do believe the player that facilitates the offense can turn a team around all by themselves. However for a guy who doesn't bring the ball upcourt, I'd say Love is making as big of an impact as anybody can.

anyway sorry to get off topic, this is supposed to be about aldridge...

[Vaporub83]

Re: Most complete PF today

Name these "one guys" that have changed everything, and brought one of the worse teams in the league to a team above .500 all by themselves.

Lebron, MJ, D Wade, Carmelo Anthony,

Guys that don't bring the ball up
Shaq, Kevin Garnett

Love's team record since arriving in Minnesota
08-09 24-58
09-10 15-67
10-11 17-65
11-12 Incomplete

Sorry but by all logic if your the best your team shouldn't get worse

[Vaporub83]

Re: Most complete PF today

well the cleveland team that lost 26 STRAIGHT last year was missing only 2 players from the previous year ilgauskas an that guy who went to miami lol... in fairness to love though minnesota is 8 & 10 so far this year an "4 of their losses have been in the last 60 seconds of their games" (quoting tim legler)

I hate when analyst say that garbage. 3 months from now when the season is over no one says well we are 12-54 but 13 of those losses came in the last minute of the game.

[PrettyT11]

Re: Most complete PF today

Lebron, MJ, D Wade, Carmelo Anthony,

Guys that don't bring the ball up
Shaq, Kevin Garnett

Love's team record since arriving in Minnesota
08-09 24-58
09-10 15-67
10-11 17-65
11-12 Incomplete

Sorry but by all logic if your the best your team shouldn't get worse

You mean the same KG that went 33-49 and 32-50 his last two seasons with the Wolves. That's less than .500 and a long way away from the playoffs. His team also got worse three years in a row as well.

[RedSceptile]

Re: Most complete PF today

You're also not taking into account

a) Kevin Love didn't really start until 1 year ago

b) They had a horrible coach in Kurt Rambis.

[iLLosophy]

Re: Most complete PF today

Lebron, MJ, D Wade, Carmelo Anthony,

Guys that don't bring the ball up
Shaq, Kevin Garnett

Love's team record since arriving in Minnesota
08-09 24-58
09-10 15-67
10-11 17-65
11-12 Incomplete

Sorry but by all logic if your the best your team shouldn't get worse

Garnett's Minny didn't make it over .500 until Starbury arrived. Jordan's bulls never made over .500 until pippen arrived. Melo's first year was the same year the Nuggets added Andre Miller to facilitate their offense. Lebron's Cavs didn't make it over .500 until Varejao and Gooden arrived. Wade came to the heat the same year Odom arrived, and Odom did better than wade did.

Shaq is an exception as he's a physical specimen that only comes along every so often. But for the rest of your list, none of them turned their team around by themselves.


Edit: To be honest though, I do think Love & Blake are getting more hype due to their sparkly new point guards. Guys like Millsap and Bosh should be in the discussion as well.

[ballsohard]

Re: Most complete PF today

Lebron, MJ, D Wade, Carmelo Anthony,

Guys that don't bring the ball up
Shaq, Kevin Garnett

Love's team record since arriving in Minnesota
08-09 24-58
09-10 15-67
10-11 17-65
11-12 Incomplete

Sorry but by all logic if your the best your team shouldn't get worse

Hahaha, well your "logic" is flawed.

BTW, Melo has completely turned around the Knicks, I'll give you that. He turned a not great yet solid team into the laughing stock of the league.

[Vaporub83]

Re: Most complete PF today

You mean the same KG that went 33-49 and 32-50 his last two seasons with the Wolves. That's less than .500 and a long way away from the playoffs. His team also got worse three years in a row as well.

No I mean the KG that went 40-42 then 45-37

Garnett's Minny didn't make it over .500 until Starbury arrived. Jordan's bulls never made over .500 until pippen arrived. Melo's first year was the same year the Nuggets added Andre Miller to facilitate their offense. Lebron's Cavs didn't make it over .500 until Varejao and Gooden arrived. Wade came to the heat the same year Odom arrived, and Odom did better than wade did.

Shaq is an exception as he's a physical specimen that only comes along every so often. But for the rest of your list, none of them turned their team around by themselves.

Edit: To be honest though, I do think Love & Blake are getting more hype due to their sparkly new point guards. Guys like Millsap and Bosh should be in the discussion as well.

By this statement how is anyone the best if everyone has a robin. Does Shaq lose credit for Penny, Nick Anderson, Dennis Scott? Every great player had a side kick either by talent or making someone else better than they really were.

Hahaha, well your "logic" is flawed.

BTW, Melo has completely turned around the Knicks, I'll give you that. He turned a not great yet solid team into the laughing stock of the league.

Nah I'm talking about the Melo that went 43-39 then 49-33

[iLLosophy]

Re: Most complete PF today

By this statement how is anyone the best if everyone has a robin. Does Shaq lose credit for Penny, Nick Anderson, Dennis Scott? Every great player had a side kick either by talent or making someone else better than they really were.

I never said they weren't the best...well except for Carmelo..not sure how he got included. But all the rest of those guys you listed ARE considered the best. And all of them still needed legitimate help in order to get their team over .500. Where is Love's help this year? The closest thing kevin love has to a Pippen has been sitting on the bench in street clothes for more than half their season....unless you want to count the flashy point guard who turns the ball over every 4th time he brings the ball down the court

[Rawdeal28]

Re: Most complete PF today

Pau Gasol is the most complete PF today.

[Vaporub83]

Re: Most complete PF today

I never said they weren't the best...well except for Carmelo..not sure how he got included. But all the rest of those guys you listed ARE considered the best. And all of them still needed legitimate help in order to get their team over .500. Where is Love's help this year? The closest thing kevin love has to a Pippen has been sitting on the bench in street clothes for more than half their season....unless you want to count the flashy point guard who turns the ball over every 4th time he brings the ball down the court

I apologize I didn't really make my 1st post clear. I was saying good to great players can at least get their team to near .500. As far as Carmelo goes the teams record improved drastically after he was drafted. Andre Miller is a serviceable player but he is not a Scottie Pippen. Love has had 3 lottery pick players drafted since he has been there. At some point if you are considered the best player on your team you are responsible for making everyone else better.

Why are we even discussing Love? You like Lamarcus I like Dirk.

[PrettyT11]

Re: Most complete PF today

No I mean the KG that went 40-42 then 45-37

So that's how we are doing it?? So you just hand pick a season or two that wants to fit your argument and yet completely ignore the ones that crush it?? But just for kicks though let's talk about those two years you mentioned.

In 96-97 when they went 40-42 it was Garnett's second season and he wasn't even the best player or go to guy on his team. Tom Gugliotta was an all star that year and was the teams leading scorer and rebounder. He also lead the team in steals and was second in assists. They also has a rookie Marbury who played good ball.

The next year they went 45 and 37 but yet again he still had those two guys on the team. They do get credit for playing good ball after Gugliotta went down.

Now let's fast forward to the years i mentioned. There is no question that Garnett was a far better player in those years then the ones you named. I mean the man did just come off winning the MVP and was the first year of four straight leading the league in rebounding. Yet in still his teams record dropped three straight years and finished 14th and 13th in west those last two. So if he is one of the best like you mentioned then why was his team so far away from the playoffs?? You did say there is no excuse for not being .500 or better so what is the excuse for those years??