Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

[DonWuan]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

His heart and monkey arms makes him top 5 in my book.

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[AlexBrady]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

Not exactly a ball hog when you consistently finish at the top of the assist list for shooting guards each season.. He's no more of a ball hog than any of the other great scorers were.

And idk why the practice thing is so overblown. Is it really a big deal to miss a few practices when you've technically been playing and practicing every single day for like 10 years? lol I know it was a big media thing and all, and his attitude didn't help it any... But in reality who cares. If it was anybody else we wouldn't even say anything about.

There wasn't a shooting guard in the league who controlled the ball nearly as much as Iverson. Credit his assist totals to his incredible ability to penetrate a defense. Those were the only passes Iverson made though. When the defense collapsed on his penetration he would make an out pass to a shooter. Basically, the only passes he made were ones where he could be credited with an assist.

Even when Iverson did attend practice he was lackadaisical. This was a major problem because ballgames are won and lost in practice.

[JA Money14]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

There wasn't a shooting guard in the league who controlled the ball nearly as much as Iverson. Credit his assist totals to his incredible ability to penetrate a defense. Those were the only passes Iverson made though. When the defense collapsed on his penetration he would make an out pass to a shooter. Basically, the only passes he made were ones where he could be credited with an assist.

Even when Iverson did attend practice he was lackadaisical. This was a major problem because ballgames are won and lost in practice.

You act like Iverson was the most selfish unbelievable player ever. You don't make it that far without working hard and being a team guy. Don't even try the no championship argument. He had trash 6er teams go much farther than they should've because of Iverson.

As I said, you don't make the NBA without working your butt off. Act like he just walked in and messed around his entire career in practice. It happened one time and everyone blew it ot of proportion. There have been a LOT of great NBA shooting guards so I would have to sit and think about his all time placement. But he loved the game just as much if not more than the guys on the list

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

True. But I would still give the edge to that 2002 Nets team has having a better supporting cast than the 2001 Sixers or the 2007 Cavs. The Nets did have size, which is always a plus. They also had a young Richard Jefferson as well.

Iverson had Mutumbo on this team, no?

You won't find too many people that will take Todd MacCulloch and Aaron Williams over Mutumbo, who we got a year too late anyway because he was just about useless for us.

[KG]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

There wasn't a shooting guard in the league who controlled the ball nearly as much as Iverson. Credit his assist totals to his incredible ability to penetrate a defense. Those were the only passes Iverson made though. When the defense collapsed on his penetration he would make an out pass to a shooter. Basically, the only passes he made were ones where he could be credited with an assist.

Even when Iverson did attend practice he was lackadaisical. This was a major problem because ballgames are won and lost in practice.

Yes, because NBA players go all out in practice.

Interesting article regarding his famous practice rant:

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2013-08-22/allen-iverson-practice-76ers-larry-brown-gary-payton-george-karl-stats-net-worth

[AlexBrady]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

You act like Iverson was the most selfish unbelievable player ever. You don't make it that far without working hard and being a team guy. Don't even try the no championship argument. He had trash 6er teams go much farther than they should've because of Iverson.

As I said, you don't make the NBA without working your butt off. Act like he just walked in and messed around his entire career in practice. It happened one time and everyone blew it ot of proportion. There have been a LOT of great NBA shooting guards so I would have to sit and think about his all time placement. But he loved the game just as much if not more than the guys on the list

Iverson was incredibly quick, courageous, and creative. The fact is that he had a selfish game plan and didn't see the game correctly. There are other ways to initiate plays than just using the dribble as Iverson did. His teammates were severely limited by his sticky-fingered game plan.

The infamous rant happened one time, but Iverson rarely showed up to practice ready to work. He loved the game more than the other guys listed? Who are you to make that call?

Yes, because NBA players go all out in practice.

Interesting article regarding his famous practice rant:

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/stor...tats-net-worth

Winners go all out in practice, yes.

[JA Money14]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

Iverson was incredibly quick, courageous, and creative. The fact is that he had a selfish game plan and didn't see the game correctly. There are other ways to initiate plays than just using the dribble as Iverson did. His teammates were severely limited by his sticky-fingered game plan.

The infamous rant happened one time, but Iverson rarely showed up to practice ready to work. He loved the game more than the other guys listed? Who are you to make that call?



Winners go all out in practice, yes.

Who are you to say he didn't?

[AlexBrady]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

Who are you to say he didn't?

His love for the game? I certainly do believe he loved it. It's hard to say he loved it more than the other guys though. I can only go by what I see on the court.

[Dice]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

Iverson had Mutumbo on this team, no?

You won't find too many people that will take Todd MacCulloch and Aaron Williams over Mutumbo, who we got a year too late anyway because he was just about useless for us.

Don't forget, MacCulloch was on the bench behind Mutombo for that 01 Sixers team.

I don't know, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. The 02 Nets to me had slightly better players overall. Yes, the Sixers had one more impact player in Mutombo but overall the collection of talent the Nets had to me is better. The Nets had a better collection of shooters than the Sixers. A young Kenyon Martin. And a 20-year old versatile two-way player in Richard Jefferson who can play both wing positions.

Yes, Iverson and Kidd lifted mediocre teams on their shoulders to take them to the championship round. But where would you rank the 07 Cavs amongst these three minus their superstar?

[AlexBrady]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

Don't forget, MacCulloch was on the bench behind Mutombo for that 01 Sixers team.

I don't know, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. The 02 Nets to me had slightly better players overall. Yes, the Sixers had one more impact player in Mutombo but overall the collection of talent the Nets had to me is better. The Nets had a better collection of shooters than the Sixers. A young Kenyon Martin. And a 20-year old versatile two-way player in Richard Jefferson who can play both wing positions.

Yes, Iverson and Kidd lifted mediocre teams on their shoulders to take them to the championship round. But where would you rank the 07 Cavs amongst these three minus their superstar?

Keith Van Horn could make three-pointers only if nobody was in his face, and never in the clutch. Lucious Harris was an erratic streak shooter.

The Sixers' Aaron McKie was a better perimeter shooter than anybody on the Nets. He could also post, drive both ways, and drill clutch shots. Too bad he didn't have more plays run for him.

Kenyon Martin was powerful and aggressive but he was a choker. Richard Jefferson was energetic but hadn't quite arrived yet.

The 01 Sixers would beat the 02 Nets in seven close games. The 07 Cavs are the worst of the three teams here.

[Dice]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

Keith Van Horn could make three-pointers only if nobody was in his face, and never in the clutch. Lucious Harris was an erratic streak shooter.

The Sixers' Aaron McKie was a better perimeter shooter than anybody on the Nets. He could also post, drive both ways, and drill clutch shots. Too bad he didn't have more plays run for him.

Kenyon Martin was powerful and aggressive but he was a choker. Richard Jefferson was energetic but hadn't quite arrived yet.

The 01 Sixers would beat the 02 Nets in seven close games. The 07 Cavs are the worst of the three teams here.

Is this series with the superstars(Iverson and Kidd) or without them? I'd agree that the 01 Sixers would beat the 02 Nets with their respective star players. However, if we're talking about replacing them with average players and playing a 7-game series, I'm giving the edge to the Nets. I know that series would look ugly but I think the Sixers would struggle more to score than the Nets.

And let's not make Aaron McKie this dynamic scorer you seem to make him out to be. Yes, he was a solid shooter BUT that's all he was. Playoff wise, he was most efficient behind the 3pt line shooting at a 42% clip. HOWEVER, anything inside of the line was at 41%.

And as far as Van Horn, how did he get open? Because no one on the Nets commanded a double team. Kidd could score but opposing team would take a risk of Kidd being the primary scorer. Kidd, more than likely, beats you in other ways besides scoring. Either that or Byron Scott drew up some fabulous screen plays for him.

Jefferson was young and coming into his own. But if memory serves me, he was coming off the bench of that team. Him coming off the bench helps a lot because that puts less pressure on the guy who was 20 years old at that time. PLUS, having that type of player coming off the bench can only strengthen it.

Martin was a choker if you relied on him to score. But that wasn't his forte. Although he did put up some points without being a natural scorer.

I agree the 07 Cavs was the worst. BUT STILL, Iverson at barely 6'0 leading that team to the Finals is still an amazing feat.

[AlexBrady]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

Is this series with the superstars(Iverson and Kidd) or without them? I'd agree that the 01 Sixers would beat the 02 Nets with their respective star players. However, if we're talking about replacing them with average players and playing a 7-game series, I'm giving the edge to the Nets. I know that series would look ugly but I think the Sixers would struggle more to score than the Nets.

And let's not make Aaron McKie this dynamic scorer you seem to make him out to be. Yes, he was a solid shooter BUT that's all he was. Playoff wise, he was most efficient behind the 3pt line shooting at a 42% clip. HOWEVER, anything inside of the line was at 41%.

And as far as Van Horn, how did he get open? Because no one on the Nets commanded a double team. Kidd could score but opposing team would take a risk of Kidd being the primary scorer. Kidd, more than likely, beats you in other ways besides scoring. Either that or Byron Scott drew up some fabulous screen plays for him.

Jefferson was young and coming into his own. But if memory serves me, he was coming off the bench of that team. Him coming off the bench helps a lot because that puts less pressure on the guy who was 20 years old at that time. PLUS, having that type of player coming off the bench can only strengthen it.

Martin was a choker if you relied on him to score. But that wasn't his forte. Although he did put up some points without being a natural scorer.

I agree the 07 Cavs was the worst. BUT STILL, Iverson at barely 6'0 leading that team to the Finals is still an amazing feat.

The Nets sans Kidd would have an even harder time winning. He was the team's best low post scorer, rebounder, defender, and passer. They relied on their running game to win, and without Kidd at the controls they would be done.

Without Iverson, the Sixers would run more plays for McKie who was a versatile scorer and would thrive without having to always create for himself one on one.

How did Van Horn get open? By lagging in the transition game and spotting up. When Kidd posted he stretched the defense out of shape which usually uncovered Van Horn.

Jefferson? His energy was certainly useful but he was a bricklayer back then. On defense, he was still learning the ins and outs of the game.

Well, in your proposed scenario wouldn't Martin be relied upon to score?

Iverson was actually 5-9. I agree that he carried the scoring load for that Sixers team. Really though, it was a bunch of factors coming together at the right time. A once in a lifetime scenario.

[Jukeman]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

McKie shot around 30% from 3 the year The Sixers went to the finals and I remember because I used to cringe every time he and Snow would shoot a 3 after a AI kick out.

Other than that 2000-2001 was probably Mckie's best season of his NBA career especially after turning it up in the playoffs. His role was his peak my friend.

[AlexBrady]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

McKie shot around 30% from 3 the year The Sixers went to the finals and I remember because I used to cringe every time he and Snow would shoot a 3 after a AI kick out.

Other than that 2000-2001 was probably Mckie's best season of his NBA career especially after turning it up in the playoffs. His role was his peak my friend.

McKie shot 31.2% from three-point land in the regular season of the Finals year. In the playoffs, his three-point percentage increased to 42.2%. He was a very good clutch shooter.

[Jukeman]

Re: Is Allen Iverson TOP 5 SG All-Time?

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