How good is Kobe?

**SoMiss2000** · 06-09-2004, 01:02 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Exactly, but you made that connection, and you're not the first person to critique my spelling, grammar, etc. You understood what I was trying to say, but you tested me anyway. Get it?

<hr /></blockquote> Yeah, being able to make the connection means i'm not stupid. I know when someone is trying to insult me even when they say they didn't "directly". If you're going to insult me or call me a name, i'd rather you do it directly and not take the cowardly way out. Good nite kiddo.

**LedouxRoc** · 06-09-2004, 01:02 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Leon said:
It's their opinion to agree with him, why are you saying they just want to disagree with you? Also, I think that '94 team can beat this current Laker team without Kobe but in a series, I think the Lakers edge them out. Why? Shaq.

<hr /></blockquote>

Yea, I can see Shaq hitting all those freethrows and the rest of those guys taking the bulls of the dribble and knocking down the open shot. By the way, Luke Walton is the first Laker besides Kobe I've seen take guys off the dribble in the playoffs this year.

**LedouxRoc** · 06-09-2004, 01:02 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Leon said:
It's their opinion to agree with him, why are you saying they just want to disagree with you? Also, I think that '94 team can beat this current Laker team without Kobe but in a series, I think the Lakers edge them out. Why? Shaq.

<hr /></blockquote>

Yea, I can see Shaq hitting all those freethrows and the rest of those guys taking the bulls of the dribble and knocking down the open shot. By the way, Luke Walton is the first Laker besides Kobe I've seen take guys off the dribble in the playoffs this year.

**LedouxRoc** · 06-09-2004, 01:02 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Leon said:
It's their opinion to agree with him, why are you saying they just want to disagree with you? Also, I think that '94 team can beat this current Laker team without Kobe but in a series, I think the Lakers edge them out. Why? Shaq.

<hr /></blockquote>

Yea, I can see Shaq hitting all those freethrows and the rest of those guys taking the bulls of the dribble and knocking down the open shot. By the way, Luke Walton is the first Laker besides Kobe I've seen take guys off the dribble in the playoffs this year.

**nkhera1** · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

they are both entirely different in different eras. We don't know who is better and we never will because times change. Maybe defense is better now than back then, maybe not, maybe the zone rules affect players more than not having the zone. Also one minus of playing with shaq is that he clogs the lane so its harder to drive and make shots, plus bryant's hands aren't as big as mj's so he can't hold onto the ball as long while in the air.

and btw this years karl malone and gary payton are nowhere near as good as they were in the prime so drop that argument.

**nkhera1** · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

they are both entirely different in different eras. We don't know who is better and we never will because times change. Maybe defense is better now than back then, maybe not, maybe the zone rules affect players more than not having the zone. Also one minus of playing with shaq is that he clogs the lane so its harder to drive and make shots, plus bryant's hands aren't as big as mj's so he can't hold onto the ball as long while in the air.

and btw this years karl malone and gary payton are nowhere near as good as they were in the prime so drop that argument.

**nkhera1** · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

they are both entirely different in different eras. We don't know who is better and we never will because times change. Maybe defense is better now than back then, maybe not, maybe the zone rules affect players more than not having the zone. Also one minus of playing with shaq is that he clogs the lane so its harder to drive and make shots, plus bryant's hands aren't as big as mj's so he can't hold onto the ball as long while in the air.

and btw this years karl malone and gary payton are nowhere near as good as they were in the prime so drop that argument.

23 · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
immortal said:
Statistical breakdown:

Jordan's first career:
Shot above 50% in almost every year.
Kobe has not shot over 45.1% in ANY year.

Jordan's second best player was Pippen.
Kobe's second best player (if not best) is Shaq.

Jordan averaged above 31 ppg every year.
Kobe has averaged above 30 once.

Jordan's best year, he averaged 32.5 ppg (lead league), 3 steals (lead league), 8 rebounds, 8 assists and shot .525 from the field. He won the MVP, DPOY, All-star game MVP, All-NBA first team.

Kobe's best year, he averaged 30 ppg, 5.9 assists, 6.9 rebounds, 2.2 steals, shot .451 from the field.

Jordan was doubled and tripled every night.
Kobe is rarely even doubled.

Jordan averaged 49 ppg in his second year in the league in the first round of the playoffs against the Boston Celtics. Bulls lost in 3 straight, but every game was decided by less than 8 points. Jordan's second best player was Orlando Woolridge.

Kobe's Lakers went 2-9 when Shaq was injured.

Jordan was the Defensive Player of the year more than once.
Kobe hasn't done it once.

Jordan won the scoring title 8 consecutive years.
Kobe hasn't won it yet.

Jordan - 6 rings with questionable teammates and undoubtedly would've won 8 consecutive if he hadn't retired.

Kobe - 3 rings (maybe 4 this year) with teammates such as Shaquille O'Neal, Karl Malone, Gary Payton.

<hr /></blockquote>

Dude, we are suppose to be talking about whether or not Kobe has the POTENTIAL to reach that level, not if he has done so already. You are basically comparing Jordan's entire career to Kobe, who questionably hasn't reached his prime. Let him finish his career before we compare the two.

As for my opinion, I do think Kobe has a CHANCE of reaching that level based on what he has done and potential, but I do think it is highly unlikely for him to get there.

<hr /></blockquote>

Thing is, he listed some things MJ did in his first 3 years that Kobe hasn't done so he's already off to a bad start then.

23 · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
immortal said:
Statistical breakdown:

Jordan's first career:
Shot above 50% in almost every year.
Kobe has not shot over 45.1% in ANY year.

Jordan's second best player was Pippen.
Kobe's second best player (if not best) is Shaq.

Jordan averaged above 31 ppg every year.
Kobe has averaged above 30 once.

Jordan's best year, he averaged 32.5 ppg (lead league), 3 steals (lead league), 8 rebounds, 8 assists and shot .525 from the field. He won the MVP, DPOY, All-star game MVP, All-NBA first team.

Kobe's best year, he averaged 30 ppg, 5.9 assists, 6.9 rebounds, 2.2 steals, shot .451 from the field.

Jordan was doubled and tripled every night.
Kobe is rarely even doubled.

Jordan averaged 49 ppg in his second year in the league in the first round of the playoffs against the Boston Celtics. Bulls lost in 3 straight, but every game was decided by less than 8 points. Jordan's second best player was Orlando Woolridge.

Kobe's Lakers went 2-9 when Shaq was injured.

Jordan was the Defensive Player of the year more than once.
Kobe hasn't done it once.

Jordan won the scoring title 8 consecutive years.
Kobe hasn't won it yet.

Jordan - 6 rings with questionable teammates and undoubtedly would've won 8 consecutive if he hadn't retired.

Kobe - 3 rings (maybe 4 this year) with teammates such as Shaquille O'Neal, Karl Malone, Gary Payton.

<hr /></blockquote>

Dude, we are suppose to be talking about whether or not Kobe has the POTENTIAL to reach that level, not if he has done so already. You are basically comparing Jordan's entire career to Kobe, who questionably hasn't reached his prime. Let him finish his career before we compare the two.

As for my opinion, I do think Kobe has a CHANCE of reaching that level based on what he has done and potential, but I do think it is highly unlikely for him to get there.

<hr /></blockquote>

Thing is, he listed some things MJ did in his first 3 years that Kobe hasn't done so he's already off to a bad start then.

23 · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
immortal said:
Statistical breakdown:

Jordan's first career:
Shot above 50% in almost every year.
Kobe has not shot over 45.1% in ANY year.

Jordan's second best player was Pippen.
Kobe's second best player (if not best) is Shaq.

Jordan averaged above 31 ppg every year.
Kobe has averaged above 30 once.

Jordan's best year, he averaged 32.5 ppg (lead league), 3 steals (lead league), 8 rebounds, 8 assists and shot .525 from the field. He won the MVP, DPOY, All-star game MVP, All-NBA first team.

Kobe's best year, he averaged 30 ppg, 5.9 assists, 6.9 rebounds, 2.2 steals, shot .451 from the field.

Jordan was doubled and tripled every night.
Kobe is rarely even doubled.

Jordan averaged 49 ppg in his second year in the league in the first round of the playoffs against the Boston Celtics. Bulls lost in 3 straight, but every game was decided by less than 8 points. Jordan's second best player was Orlando Woolridge.

Kobe's Lakers went 2-9 when Shaq was injured.

Jordan was the Defensive Player of the year more than once.
Kobe hasn't done it once.

Jordan won the scoring title 8 consecutive years.
Kobe hasn't won it yet.

Jordan - 6 rings with questionable teammates and undoubtedly would've won 8 consecutive if he hadn't retired.

Kobe - 3 rings (maybe 4 this year) with teammates such as Shaquille O'Neal, Karl Malone, Gary Payton.

<hr /></blockquote>

Dude, we are suppose to be talking about whether or not Kobe has the POTENTIAL to reach that level, not if he has done so already. You are basically comparing Jordan's entire career to Kobe, who questionably hasn't reached his prime. Let him finish his career before we compare the two.

As for my opinion, I do think Kobe has a CHANCE of reaching that level based on what he has done and potential, but I do think it is highly unlikely for him to get there.

<hr /></blockquote>

Thing is, he listed some things MJ did in his first 3 years that Kobe hasn't done so he's already off to a bad start then.

**Dynasty4Kobe** · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
SoMiss2000 said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Exactly, but you made that connection, and you're not the first person to critique my spelling, grammar, etc. You understood what I was trying to say, but you tested me anyway. Get it?

<hr /></blockquote> Yeah, being able to make the connection means i'm not stupid. I know when someone is trying to insult me even when they say they didn't "directly". If you're going to insult me or call me a name, i'd rather you do it directly and not take the cowardly way out. Good nite kiddo.

<hr /></blockquote>

The conversation has DRASTICALLY changed paths here.

**Dynasty4Kobe** · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
SoMiss2000 said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Exactly, but you made that connection, and you're not the first person to critique my spelling, grammar, etc. You understood what I was trying to say, but you tested me anyway. Get it?

<hr /></blockquote> Yeah, being able to make the connection means i'm not stupid. I know when someone is trying to insult me even when they say they didn't "directly". If you're going to insult me or call me a name, i'd rather you do it directly and not take the cowardly way out. Good nite kiddo.

<hr /></blockquote>

The conversation has DRASTICALLY changed paths here.

**Dynasty4Kobe** · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
SoMiss2000 said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Exactly, but you made that connection, and you're not the first person to critique my spelling, grammar, etc. You understood what I was trying to say, but you tested me anyway. Get it?

<hr /></blockquote> Yeah, being able to make the connection means i'm not stupid. I know when someone is trying to insult me even when they say they didn't "directly". If you're going to insult me or call me a name, i'd rather you do it directly and not take the cowardly way out. Good nite kiddo.

<hr /></blockquote>

The conversation has DRASTICALLY changed paths here.

**immortal** · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
LedouxRoc said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
immortal said:
Jordan's first 3-peat:
PG: John Paxson
SG: Jordan
SF: Scottie Pippen
PF: Horace Grant
C: Bill Cartwright

Kobe's Lakers:
PG: Gary Payton
SG: Kobe
SF: Devean George
PF: Karl Malone
C: Shaq

If I am not mistaken, the ONLY position the Bulls are better (excluding Kobe and MJ) is SF. And Shaq would DOMINATE any player on either team.

<hr /></blockquote>

Well that team is better too, but I was really talking about the Tony Kukuc, Dennis Rodman, Steve Kerr, Luc Longley team.

Remember bench, and yes Horace Grant was better than present Malone and Paxson was better than present Payton.

<hr /></blockquote>

This is a joke, right?
Horace Grant was a mediocre player AT BEST! Malone averaged 20 ppg and 10 rpg last year.
John Paxson was a 3-point shooter. THAT'S IT!!! He averaged about 7 ppg. Payton can score 20 ppg easily on a team without Kobe or Shaq.

Jordan's bench players in first career: John Salley, Craig Hodges, BJ Armstrong, Pete Myers, Dickie Simpkins, a few other bums.
Kobe's bench players: Derek Fisher, Kareem Rush, Medvedenko, Horace Grant (older), Luke Walton, etc.

I would probably take the Lakers bench.

**immortal** · 06-09-2004, 01:03 AM

Re: How good is Kobe?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
LedouxRoc said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
immortal said:
Jordan's first 3-peat:
PG: John Paxson
SG: Jordan
SF: Scottie Pippen
PF: Horace Grant
C: Bill Cartwright

Kobe's Lakers:
PG: Gary Payton
SG: Kobe
SF: Devean George
PF: Karl Malone
C: Shaq

If I am not mistaken, the ONLY position the Bulls are better (excluding Kobe and MJ) is SF. And Shaq would DOMINATE any player on either team.

<hr /></blockquote>

Well that team is better too, but I was really talking about the Tony Kukuc, Dennis Rodman, Steve Kerr, Luc Longley team.

Remember bench, and yes Horace Grant was better than present Malone and Paxson was better than present Payton.

<hr /></blockquote>

This is a joke, right?
Horace Grant was a mediocre player AT BEST! Malone averaged 20 ppg and 10 rpg last year.
John Paxson was a 3-point shooter. THAT'S IT!!! He averaged about 7 ppg. Payton can score 20 ppg easily on a team without Kobe or Shaq.

Jordan's bench players in first career: John Salley, Craig Hodges, BJ Armstrong, Pete Myers, Dickie Simpkins, a few other bums.
Kobe's bench players: Derek Fisher, Kareem Rush, Medvedenko, Horace Grant (older), Luke Walton, etc.

I would probably take the Lakers bench.

How good is Kobe?

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