2018 Off-Season Thread

[RedSceptile]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

Please Phoenix just don't do this. Ahhhhh.

[23]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

You can think what you want, 23.

The guy has people in his ear with ulterior motives. Some of which are to get him in a bigger market and better endorsement deals.

Tony Parker was telling the truth. A complete tear is worse than a strain especially when a strain shouldn't cause you to miss an entire season.

Also, the lashing out happened once they (Ginobili, Parker & Pop) realized he wasn't EVER coming back. The writing was on the wall since March/April....

Anyway, I'm done with Leonard whether he is traded today, tomorrow or next month. He proved to be a bitch and good luck with anyone trying to reign in his "group."

Yes, two years of "discontent" compared to 20 years of being the model franchise that takes care of their guys....

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It's not about what I think. He said nothing about the team but they did all the talking and practically threw him under the bus.

Tony Parker is NOT the expert on injuries, and even then you don't get mad at a player for wanting a 2nd opinion once he's misdiagnosed.

It wasn't a strain, and they didn't even have the same injury. That's the problem, you don't even know what it was since the Spurs did an awful job of actually informing you of what was going on.

He goes from one of the most improving hard working MVP candidates to a guy who sits out a season because "motives in his ear".

That doesn't even make sense.

[cima]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

Hey y'all can stfu about Phoenix making that trade, k thx. I'm trying to get back to the Nash-Amare era of interest, not the purgatory we've been in since.

[jeremym480]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

No way Pheonix is dumb enough to trade the 1st pick for one year of Kawhi..... right?

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[cima]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

No way Pheonix is dumb enough to trade the 1st pick for one year of Kawhi..... right?

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Oh we definitely are dumb enough, yep.

[jfsolo]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

I'll just stay away and wait for things to just happen. Too much bull**** stories at this time.



Whatever happens, I'am good.

Don't say whatever happens, because if we fail on everyone else and max out Boogie and IT, then someone has to die.

[ojandpizza]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

It's not about what I think. He said nothing about the team but they did all the talking and practically threw him under the bus.



Tony Parker is NOT the expert on injuries, and even then you don't get mad at a player for wanting a 2nd opinion once he's misdiagnosed.



It wasn't a strain, and they didn't even have the same injury. That's the problem, you don't even know what it was since the Spurs did an awful job of actually informing you of what was going on.



He goes from one of the most improving hard working MVP candidates to a guy who sits out a season because "motives in his ear".



That doesn't even make sense.

I don’t think the situation is nearly as simple as you’re trying to lay it out here.

For one, Kawhi not saying anything is part of the problem. He’s a laid back guy, I’m not saying he had to make some big media announcement or even to the public in general, but why the **** does his own teammates and coaches not seem to know where he and his progression are? He had no reason to just leave everyone in the dry, and we would have destroyed a LeBron James or Kobe Bryant for something similar to this.

Pop’s answers to the public in general also leave some questions. His normal “oh that’s just Pop being Pop” type of answers would be “when he’s healthy” or “I’m not sure”.. not all this “you need to ask him and his people” or “I would be surprised if he comes back this season”. Pop doesn’t say those things. That on top of there even needing to be meetings between he and Kawhi, and all this other crap over the past few weeks, just shows that their has been some sort of issue going on between either he and Kawhi and the organization and Kawhi.

I think Kawhi just wanted out honestly. If the injury was really worse this whole time, and he was just rehabbing this whole time, and that’s all there was to it there would be no reason for him being disconnected from the team for so long, players not knowing what’s going on, Pop not knowing what’s going on, needing their a meeting with Pop after the season, asking for a trade when you’ve got freedom to go wherever after just one more year.. the whole thing is too fishy for it to be that simple.

You keep referencing people throwing him under the bus, which I think is a bit of stretch to say, but if it was really as simple as he was just hurt and rehabbing why would there even be a need for him to be “thrown under the bus”. Would the team not know that? Pop? The media? I don’t believe for once second it was really as simple as that. There’s a reason everyone has been out of the loop for a whole season now.


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[The 24th Letter]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

The difference is simple really . Uncle Dennis in Kawhis ear. They apparently dont even want Kawhi to meet with Pop.

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[23]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

The difference is simple really . Uncle Dennis in Kawhis ear. They apparently dont even want Kawhi to meet with Pop.

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They don't want him meeting with Pop by himself.

At this point, im not saying that's cool but yeah they dont trust the Spurs.

[CMH]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

Who is most abused by the people around him - Stan Lee or Kawhi Leonard?

Hard to pick.

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[The 24th Letter]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

They don't want him meeting with Pop by himself.

At this point, im not saying that's cool but yeah they dont trust the Spurs.

Worst case scenario is they talk like two grown men, which has always been how Pop has gone about things when there was a conflict....Jackson, Parker, Aldridge etc.

I'm sure both sides have had their hand in getting here...well see how it goes down....definitely a weird situation.

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[King_B_Mack]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

Not sure why Kawhi wants to be in a big market. If you want be silent and not talk and show emotions, then the absolute last thing you want to do is be in a big market. Especially one like LA or New York. Ask Derrick Rose how that works out.


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[23]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

I don’t think the situation is nearly as simple as you’re trying to lay it out here.

For one, Kawhi not saying anything is part of the problem. He’s a laid back guy, I’m not saying he had to make some big media announcement or even to the public in general, but why the **** does his own teammates and coaches not seem to know where he and his progression are? He had no reason to just leave everyone in the dry, and we would have destroyed a LeBron James or Kobe Bryant for something similar to this.

Pop’s answers to the public in general also leave some questions. His normal “oh that’s just Pop being Pop” type of answers would be “when he’s healthy” or “I’m not sure”.. not all this “you need to ask him and his people” or “I would be surprised if he comes back this season”. Pop doesn’t say those things. That on top of there even needing to be meetings between he and Kawhi, and all this other crap over the past few weeks, just shows that their has been some sort of issue going on between either he and Kawhi and the organization and Kawhi.

I think Kawhi just wanted out honestly. If the injury was really worse this whole time, and he was just rehabbing this whole time, and that’s all there was to it there would be no reason for him being disconnected from the team for so long, players not knowing what’s going on, Pop not knowing what’s going on, needing their a meeting with Pop after the season, asking for a trade when you’ve got freedom to go wherever after just one more year.. the whole thing is too fishy for it to be that simple.

You keep referencing people throwing him under the bus, which I think is a bit of stretch to say, but if it was really as simple as he was just hurt and rehabbing why would there even be a need for him to be “thrown under the bus”. Would the team not know that? Pop? The media? I don’t believe for once second it was really as simple as that. There’s a reason everyone has been out of the loop for a whole season now.


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Kawhi had his interview, and since when does anyone from the Spurs talk at all?

Everything was done as a group," Leonard said when asked about his course of treatment. "I don't feel like nothing was friction. I talk to (coach Gregg Popovich) every day. He knows what the progressions were. He knew what I was doing the whole entire time, as well as the front office. We made a group decision."

https://twitter.com/KSATRJ/status/971455037540130816

Group = Kawhi and the Spurs not just Kawhi and people in NY.

Look at the interview, he's in the Spurs practice facility and playing 3 on 3 at that point looking to return.

"Soon," Leonard said. "I don't have a set date right now. I've just got to keep doing what I'm doing. The progression that I'm making has been great."

Then he has another set back during the rehab, and they proceed to throw him under the bus.

Using words like "his people", TP and Manu throwing in their 2 cents questioning his character and integrity both publicly and privately.

Here is a timetable of the events and as you can see even the team wasn't seeing any progress.

Spoiler

9/30/17 – Coach Pop reveals that Kawhi has a quad injury, will miss the pre-season, with no timetable for return
10/13/17 – Spurs confirm that Kawhi’s quad injury will keep him out of the regular season opener
11/7/17 – Coach Pop comments that Kawhi’s quad rehab is coming along slower than expected
11/15/17 – When asked, Coach Pop states that Kawhi should be back sooner rather than later
11/28/17 – Tony Parker returns from quad tendon rupture (over a month earlier than he expected)
12/2/17 – Kawhi returns and plays nine games, averaging up 16, five, and two. He doesn’t play in back to back games.
1/17/18 – The Spurs list Kawhi as being out indefinitely because the quad tendon didn’t respond the way the team wanted
1/23/18 – Rumors of a potential rift between the Spurs and Kawhi
2/7/18 to 2/17/18 – Kawhi spends 10 days in NY with a quad injury specialist for a second opinion
2/21/18 – Coach Pop says that he would be surprised if Kawhi returns this season
2/21/18 – News that Kawhi has been medically cleared but choosing not to play
2/26/18 – Reports come out that Kawhi has begun working out with the team again, is eyeing a March return

They kept him on the roster as some kind of weird injury management thing instead of injured - another sign of their disagreement being handled poorly.

It's not that the players were out of any loop, some of them just didn't believe he was still in pain. It's been explained about his kind of injury which isn't common so you can't compare it to some other kind of injury.

Here is a gauge on where it could be at any time.

Quad tendinopathy is a general catch-all term for a tendon injury. It simply means that there is a disorder in the tendon.

A tendinopathy generally falls into 4 different phases, from least to most severe :

Spoiler

Phase 1 – Reactive tendinopathy
Normal healing process
Excellent prognosis with normal recovery
Normal rehab
Phase 2 – Tendon dysrepair
Mildly abnormal healing processs
The tissue deterioration rate is greater than the repair rate
Good prognosis as the tissue is attempting to heal
Rehab
The goal of rehab is to prevent further deterioration of the tissue so the repair rate becomes greater than the deterioration rate
If deterioration continues, this can lead to phase 3
Phase 3 – Degenerative tendinopathy
Permanent cell and tissue death
Poor prognosis as the cells are giving up on repairing
Phase 4 – Tendon tear or rupture
Severe tissue breakdown resulting in a tear or complete rupture (grade III tear)
Results in a loss of function
Very poor prognosis
Surgery is often the only option

Spoiler

So yes its more than just "oh he sat out now he wants out the entire time"

That's an ESPN narrative and lie which was never the case.

It doesnt matter what Kawhi says as he mentioned, they're going to believe the organization over me anyway, which is true.

[23]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

Worst case scenario is they talk like two grown men, which has always been how Pop has gone about things when there was a conflict....Jackson, Parker, Aldridge etc.

I'm sure both sides have had their hand in getting here...well see how it goes down....definitely a weird situation.

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Pop would be stupid not to try. It's definitely not a good look for future free agents. He's already almost lost both Duncan and Aldridge, gotta do it with Kawhi now too.

Not sure why Kawhi wants to be in a big market. If you want be silent and not talk and show emotions, then the absolute last thing you want to do is be in a big market. Especially one like LA or New York. Ask Derrick Rose how that works out.


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Dang they got you believing he Derrick Rose now? Ouch

[Scofield]

Re: 2017-2018 Off-Season Thread

He's already almost lost both Duncan and Aldridge, gotta do it with Kawhi now too.

You make it sound like Pop is Larry Brown or something. Tim Duncan weighing his options back then made perfect sense. What the Magic almost put together there was amazing. After he committed to San Antonio there was never a problem.

LA opened his mouth and voiced his displeasure. Lo and behold he and Pop hashed everything out.

As far as I know there no pattern of the Spurs treating players badly.

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