The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

[Pared]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

For once I ain't gonna hate on Jeffries. You can't be mad he was in there - the play before he made a huge bucket.

And you know what the point difference was in my mind? Walker's dumb *** and that technical.

You can't give away free points like that. It's not going to get any better if Douglas keeps playing D like Rondo is contagious.

[bigfnjoe96]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

Another tough L... As Melo stated the Celtics did what they had to do, know we need to hold up to our end of the bargain.. For us to be even in the postion we were in last night was something.. We just didn't have that 2nd go-to-option out there, which eventually lost us the game...

Friday can't get here soon enough

[bigeastbumrush]

-Why was Jeffries guarding Rondo

Say what you want he wasn't driving in like an "OPEN FOR BUSINESS" sign was at the rim like before.

I give Jeffries his props. Dude works hard, very hard. Jeffries being that situation at the end is all on the coach. He should have had Williams or Turiaf in that play. I'm really putting a bunch of this on the coach shoulders.

Ok..and Rondo still had 30. Pierce got off..shooting over a smaller guy because he had Jeffries guarding the PG.

Yes, I'm armchair QBing, but where was Shawne Williams and Anthony Carter? Williams played well and hit big shots. Walker was 0-10.

Even AC played good minutes when he was in there..so why wasn't he playing backup PG?

Melo was playing out of his mind but yet still bringing the ball up.

D'Antoni is getting schooled by Doc. Completely schooled. He's making D'Antoni look like a high school coach. Where is the offensive genius/guru??

[Pared]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

Two last second shots, a few key injuries and you're going to say D'Antoni is "getting school?" LOL Wow.

Oh please - why do I bother sometimes. I give Doc his props - he's one great coach. That call to KG caught EVERYONE by surprise. Hell - who would think they would go to KG last night again after that horrible game he had.

But give OUR coach some credit - I understand it's cool and all to hate on D'Antoni and give him cute little nicknames... We have been in both games despite Billups getting hurt - Carmelo with a bad game 1 - Stat. getting hurt. The team defensively have stepped it up in the playoffs; Even a blind man can see the different traps and intensity compared to the regular season. I would have like to see AC as well and it seems like Walker was in for his quickness on defense that SWill doesn't have.

The big difference is our guys can't get the last shot. One or two breaks each night and we could easily be up 2-0. But since we're down of course it's "all Damnphony's fault."

[bigfnjoe96]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

Two last second shots, a few key injuries and you're going to say D'Antoni is "getting school?" LOL Wow.

Oh please - why do I bother sometimes. I give Doc his props - he's one great coach. That call to KG caught EVERYONE by surprise. Hell - who would think they would go to KG last night again after that horrible game he had.

But give OUR coach some credit - I understand it's cool and all to hate on D'Antoni and give him cute little nicknames... We have been in both games despite Billups getting hurt - Carmelo with a bad game 1 - Stat. getting hurt. The team defensively have stepped it up in the playoffs; Even a blind man can see the different traps and intensity compared to the regular season. I would have like to see AC as well and it seems like Walker was in for his quickness on defense that SWill doesn't have.

The big difference is our guys can't get the last shot. One or two breaks each night and we could easily be up 2-0. But since we're down of course it's "all Damnphony's fault."

Totally agree with you Pared. There's no way this lost is on D'Antoni... We just didn't have that 2nd option on offense. To be in the position we were is remarkable when with 3 minutes left in the 3rd quarter we were down 11 & probably every Knick Fan thought "Here comes the Blow-out"

[CMH]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

I disagree, I guess.

No way the Knicks are even in the position to think about a last second shot for D'Antoni to screw up if not for Carmelo.

D'Antoni had nothing to do with the Knicks in Game 2. He just rode the coat tails of a Hall of Fame player that was on fire.

And it was obvious because no good offensive coach comes out of a timeout with a play designed to give Carmelo the ball off the in-bound. That's the most ridiculous set ever when you should know Boston is going to double team him. It's not like they had 5 seconds to get a shot off. The Knicks had over half the shot clock to run a full play.

Your star player is on the court, you design a play to get him open. You DO NOT design a play to give him the ball immediately and try to find a lesser player open.

Guarantee if that's the Lakers on the court, Kobe doesn't get the ball immediately. Guarantee if that's the Spurs, Duncan doesn't get the ball immediately. Anthony has legs. Turiaf and Jeffries have bodies. Where are the screens, the picks?

You can just tell that all D'Antoni said during that timeout was: "Give Carmelo the ball. If you have a shot, take it. If not, and you're double teamed, find the open man. Score. We win."

No. You lose, D'Antoni.

Charles Barkley had the best comment last night after the TNT team said that D'Antoni reiterated that in that situation Carmelo will get the ball again.

Said Barkely: "And that's why the Knicks are gonna have a new coach next season."

Thank you, Chuck.
(and I should add that this was BEFORE Game 2).

edit:

Now for the game.

Why is Douglas defending Rondo like he's holding a knife? I've seen better defense by blind men. The sad thing is Douglas was trying. Horrendous defensive "effort" on his part. A good coach would, oh, I don't know, tell him to take a charge. Maybe stop letting Rondo get as deep into the paint.

The entire defensive strategy against Rondo is not working. How many points does he have to score to prove that? Even Rondo said that Douglas played off him and didn't body him so he ran like a mad man. That was obvious to anyone. Rondo cannot get into the paint. Cannot. Stop giving him 10 feet of space when he's 15 feet away from the basket.

Bill Walker should sit out the rest of the series for being a knucklehead. As soon as he picked up that T, a good coach should have sat him and never put him back in. Where's the dog pound there, D'Antoni? I guess only mistakes in practice gets you a seat during the games. Ridiculous.

The Boston Celtics are clearly just too good. Doc Rivers clearly understands his roster. The plays the Celtics run during a game are a dream. If I only watched Knicks games all my life and then saw the Celtics last night, I would claim that Rivers was a witch doctor, conjuring spells that involved movements and rotations that no man could possibly ever imagine or conceive.

But that's not reality. Instead it's just a coach who actually runs offensive plays besides pick-and-roll and spread out and pick a spot on the floor.

I don't understand how the Knicks are not running screen plays for Anthony. I hardly ever see Anthony being guarded in a mismatch. The situations are never created because there's no motion, no rotation. It's just go to your spot and receive the ball. I can pick four of my best friends to defend the Knicks and do a good job.

[fsquid]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

Melo played like Wilt last night. Yes, like Wilt that was amazing.

[Pared]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

You're not saying anything new with Carmelo though. That has ALWAYS been his game. Give him the ball and get out of the way. Carmelo has always been a bonafide scorer.

You HAD TO have known this going into that trade. He's basically an offensive black hole.

Edit - I want to point out that everyone's focus was on our defensive problems. Now the issue is our offense. We should be aware of that - it was expected when we got Melo.

He's not going to catch the ball coming off a screen on the block. You KNOW the ball is going to him to isolate and score. Seriously - it's Melo on the court and everyone else. That play was designed to have him draw the double and hit someone else. Walker cut the lane almost as if it were a designed play. KG doesn't get his hand on that ball and you have an open look 3 ft. in front of the hoop.

We have our team and then we have the Celtics. They have 3 HOF players that can take the last second shot; you never have any idea if Pierce is going to be isolated at the top, Ray is coming off a screen or KG is getting the ball in the post. What do we have at the end? You think we can keep going in the playoffs relying on deep 3's from TD, Billups, Mason, Williams, etc. at the end of games?

We're a perimeter team and unless someone becomes a drive and dish PG suddenly over-night you have to just relent and understand the Knicks have to rely on our stars to carry us. This is part of the reason I didn't want Felton shipped - he can create off the dribble for just about everyone on the team.

[CMH]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

Coaches coach. Players play.

If Melo doesn't want to change his game, the coach should do it for him. Otherwise, D'Antoni isn't coaching; he's just watching.

I agree that it is Melo's game. But then you have to see that this is exactly the issue with D'Antoni. If he can't get his team to run plays then there's no need for him. He's gotta go.

All I know is that if I'm an NBA coach and I know the entire state of New York is on my back for not delivering the amazing offensive genius I supposedly have, I'm going to do everything I can to make sure I get it. If the star player hates me for it, at least the population will know I tried and I was booted because the star player didn't want to run my offense.

Instead, he's going to end up being the joke that was fired because he couldn't get a team of three-point shooters with an offensive force inside and a lights out iso shooter to run plays designed to [insert Walt Frazier vocabulary word here] their offense.

[Pared]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

I know we always focus on the here and now but he did do a "pretty decent job" with Felton, Gallo and Chandler.

The Knicks were, IIRC, the best offensive team in the league.

To fault him straight across the board right now is a train I can't get on. He's stepped up the defense and we're playing with injury after injury.

Take any one player away from Boston like Rondo/Allen/Pierce/Garnet and watch the same drama unfold there.

[fsquid]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

Doc Rivers is a good coach because in 2007, they went and got 2 future HOF players. Coaching in basketball is soooooo overrated. Doc Rivers career record before the three musketeers is a whopping 273-312.

Mike Brown has a better record than Doc Rivers. Is he a great coach or did he have a once in a lifetime player on his squad?

[CMH]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

Doc Rivers is a good coach because in 2007, they went and got 2 future HOF players. Coaching in basketball is soooooo overrated. Doc Rivers career record before the three musketeers is a whopping 273-312.

Mike Brown has a better record than Doc Rivers. Is he a great coach or did he have a once in a lifetime player on his squad?

Mike Brown was a stooge. Doc Rivers had a horrible squad in Orlando and no talent in Boston.

Yes, he has five potential Hall of Famers on his roster now, but he knows what to do with them.

Look at Spoelstra in Miami. That's another team that runs most of the same offensive sets all the time. I bet a good coach would have come up with bounds of offensive ideas to run with Wade, LeBron and Bosh. Instead, he shows up to camp with Mike Brown's playbook and Wade's knees.

You can't simply look at a roster and determine coaching talent. Using that logic, you can say Phil Jackson isn't a good coach or that Jerry Sloan isn't because he never won a ring or a Coach of the Year Award.

Good coaches find ways to make their good teams better. Rivers knows his roster inside-out. He is obviously blessed to have that talent, but he doesn't put it to waste.

D'Antoni has given Carmelo the ball and let him score the team into victory. That will get wins, but it won't make people believe you're a good coach.

Maybe once this series is over next week, D'Antoni can use the whole summer to actually put his genius to work and devise some real plays. Plays that a good coach would come up with considering he has an Amar'e Stoudemire and Carmelo Anthony on his roster.

[Pete1210]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

I'd agree that the Knicks have been out coached so far. Also consider the Celtics core have been together so much longer. They know how to win together.

Those two losses were devastating. I'm afraid that the Knicks will not recover.

[bigeastbumrush]

Doc Rivers is a good coach because in 2007, they went and got 2 future HOF players. Coaching in basketball is soooooo overrated. Doc Rivers career record before the three musketeers is a whopping 273-312.

I'll disagree.

Strip the 2 head coaches away and look who's left.

In Boston, you have a former head coach and guys who have led teams. Guys who have been in situations, playoff games, etc.

In NY, you have Herb Williams and Mike D'Antoni's family who just followed along from Phoenix. No one who's ever led anything and nothing but yes men.

After the stpid midcourt foul by TD against Rondo..Mikey just sat there. Then after Herb got up and showed some emotion, Mikey got out his seat.

Head coaching is overrated but having an experienced staff who can specialize in certain areas does wonders for a team. Most head coaches don't even know how many timeouts a team have left. Most head coaches can't even draw up a play (Mike Brown).

But when you have staff that knows situations and tendancies, it makes a huge difference.

Having 2 HOFers meant nothing last night.

[Vast]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

I'll disagree.

Strip the 2 head coaches away and look who's left.

In Boston, you have a former head coach and guys who have led teams. Guys who have been in situations, playoff games, etc.

In NY, you have Herb Williams and Mike D'Antoni's family who just followed along from Phoenix. No one who's ever led anything and nothing but yes men.After the stpid midcourt foul by TD against Rondo..Mikey just sat there. Then after Herb got up and showed some emotion, Mikey got out his seat.

Head coaching is overrated but having an experienced staff who can specialize in certain areas does wonders for a team. Most head coaches don't even know how many timeouts a team have left. Most head coaches can't even draw up a play (Mike Brown).

But when you have staff that knows situations and tendancies, it makes a huge difference.

Having 2 HOFers meant nothing last night.

Great Post. Needless to say I don't like the Knicks coaching staff. Mostly because they don't have the best coaches they can get. They need better assistant coaches and maybe a better Head coach.

But I still am happy with the way they've played. The refs stole game 1 away from the Knicks and game 2 was a game that just barely slipped away due to having a depleted roster.