The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

[CMH]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

The Good...

From Stoudemire on his back and whether or not he'll play Game 4: "We understand how bright the future is here with the organization. ... We want to continue that success out here in the next few years. So we don't want to damage anything by overdoing it."

The Bad...

From Carmelo on who knows what. "At this point in time right now, we've got to lay it out there on the court ... the X's and O's go out the window and we've just got to play basketball."

Because that's worked all series.

[Vast]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

Toney Douglas plays atrocious defense. D'antoni is a terrible coach.
The difference after timeouts between doc and danphony is crazy. That is all

[bigeastbumrush]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

Toney Douglas plays atrocious defense.

That's not true.

I missed Games 3 & 4. Didn't miss much I see.

Looking forward to next year. Dolan better re-up Donnie or else.

LOL@ that Melo quote. That's why you need a new coach. Melo needs to be untrained. I get what he's saying but my gosh.

[CMH]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

That's not true.
.

You missed Games 3 and 4. Trust me, Douglas got exposed. Maybe he isn't as bad as Boston (see: Rondo) made him look, but he looked really, really bad.

The Knicks didn't make a run until D'Antoni sat Douglas late in the third and inserted Anthony Carter for the REST OF THE GAME.

My brother and I agreed that if somehow the Knicks had won this game, Carter should start Game 5.

That obviously didn't happen. I did feel pretty good when I saw the Garden applaud the Knicks as the seconds counted down. No one wants to see this 4-0 sweep, but being able to see it happen is just proof that things are moving in the right direction.

A year ago today, the Knicks didn't have two All-Stars. They do now. There's a lot of promise in this franchise.

Now, decisions need to be made. First for Walsh which should be a no-brainer. Second on D'Antoni - who I think will stick around because he should get a season to see what he can do with the talent and there's no one else out there besides Jerry Sloan (who I doubt would ever come to NY) and Rick Adelman (who I like as a coach, but don't think is the solution to this particular roster). Third on Billups - to pick up the option or not.

I do think Shawne Williams needs to be retained. Everyone else like Walker, Roger Mason Jr., Jarred Jeffries and Ronny Turiaf need to go. Go, go, go. Never come back. Be gone.

[kirby314]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

Congrats to the knicks for making the playoffs its been awhile. I hate knicks but it would have been nice to see you guys beat miami and play the bulls an get the old rivalry back jordan vs ewing and just hoping rose,howard vs CP3,STAT,MELO 2012 lets get it

[randombrother]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

I wasn't all that bananas about picking up CP3. I thought our needs were vastly more at the Center position. But I gotta say I'm a believer after watching CP3 work the Lakers tonight. If we can get him then by all means do so.

[Hassan Darkside]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

At this point I'm not against trading anybody. I wouldn't mind if we start shopping Douglas and Fields looking for more depth or guys that are actually true PGs or SGs. Fields is just out of place out there with the addition of Melo.

Also, I wanna give props to Jared Jeffries. I know all you guys are hating on him and whatnot, but he flat out busted his *** the last couple games. If you rewatch any of the games, when he comes in the game he sprints back on defense, unlike anybody else. He makes it a point to try to get back in the paint before Rondo starts dancing around Douglas. When he guarded Rondo he did a better job than anybody else because he didn't stand under the basket like Douglas did, and he helped accordingly. He'd help off on Ray Allen or Paul Pierce when they'd come off of screens and he'd double in the post effectively and rotate properly. Nobody else did.

Douglas isn't a bad defender by any means, but I feel like he was exposed because of D'Antoni telling him how he should defend Rondo. In any other game, Douglas usually picks up the point at half court, denies off ball, plays hard though he does tend to gamble. Against Rondo it's like D'Antoni said "stand 10 feet away from him." Didn't tell him that he should help close out on guys running off screens or close out on Rondo when he looked to shoot. I also get the feeling D'Antoni didn't encourage Douglas at all to stop Rondo in transition before he got to the paint. Douglas used the same principles when Rondo had a full head of steam and wouldn't be in the play till Rondo's Eurostepping around him. We all know TD has spent a lot of time in D'Antoni's doghouse and I'm just under the impression that he was just trying to do what coach told him to do whether it's right or wrong.

[CMH]

That brings up a question that came up between my brother and me: Was D'Antoni telling Carter to play Rondo differently or did Carter basically ignore coach?

How can two different guards be operating under different principles if D'Antoni was calling the shots there? And if he wasn't telling each to play Rondo differently, then it means 1. D'Antoni is as stubborn as they come or 2. Carter doesn't respect him.

Though would Carter be on the floor for the entire fourth if he blatantly disregarded D'Antoni's instructions? If we should assume he did not, doesn't that then imply that Douglas isn't a good defender?

Too many questions about that one thing. It was very clear that both guards had different means of stopping Rondo. One worked (as best it could because no one is saying Rondo won't get his) and the other turned Rondo into the best player on the court (which can be argued, but shouldn't happen every single possession without a change in approach).

D'Antoni's only brilliant move all series was to finally recognize that Carter figured it out and keep him on the court. But if D'Antoni could see that, why didn't he teach Douglas to do different? I'm just going back and forth here because it's either bad coaching or a bad defensive player.


Sent from my mobile device.

[Hassan Darkside]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

I think it's just bad coaching and I think it was D'Antoni just sticking with the old vet because he was making plays happen regardless. I have never seen Douglas defend as poorly as he did this series and I'm not convinced he's that bad of a defender.

[fsquid]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

That was a crap weekend. Hopefully, a training camp will solve some of these problems. So who thinks we should pick up the $14 million option on Billups? Can the Knicks wait until the new collective bargaining agreement to make that decision?

[bigfnjoe96]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

That was a crap weekend. Hopefully, a training camp will solve some of these problems. So who thinks we should pick up the $14 million option on Billups? Can the Knicks wait until the new collective bargaining agreement to make that decision?

The Knicks have until Friday to decide on Billups. My guess is they will pick up his option & then wait on the CBA before making other moves

[bigeastbumrush]

Ruff Ryder- I agree 100% about TD.

YankeePride..I'm sure you've seen enough of TD to know that he doesn't naturally defend like that.

He's agressive, picks the PG up in the backcourt, is great at getting steals and picking a guy's pockets, great at playing the passing lanes.

In the games in Boston, clearly he was told to sag off of Rondo. Yeah, it seemed like matador defense but what's a young player to do? Switch it on and off and piss off his coach?

He was thinking too much on defense.

AC is a veteran who's been in wars. He's heady. TD was in his first playoff series. And that was not the way he plays defense. I'm sure you pull up videos and he's draped on his guy.

Now I am not saying that he had a chance of stopping Rondo. But he wasn't playing his brand of defense.

He came into the league as a defender.

[bigeastbumrush]

That was a crap weekend. Hopefully, a training camp will solve some of these problems. So who thinks we should pick up the $14 million option on Billups? Can the Knicks wait until the new collective bargaining agreement to make that decision?

The Knicks have until Friday to decide on Billups. My guess is they will pick up his option & then wait on the CBA before making other moves

I know Donnie really likes Billups..but that's a bad move to spend $14M on him. They have so many more need areas collectively.

Someone mentioned a few games ago that Raymond Felton wouldve done well in this kind of series and I agree.

1- he wouldve made Rondo play both sides of the floor
2- he knows when to be aggressive and go for his
3- tough as nails

One thing that happened (and this is because he had no time) was that after the trade, D'Antoni had to adjust the offense to Melo and not the other way around.

I think Melo could flourish in a D'Antoni offense if he just got out of that Iso-To-Death mentality that Melo has.

But Melo has to buy in. And he hasn't bought in for his entire career. You tell me he can't play that Shawn Marion role 100 times better?

He can definitely come close to averaging a triple double because of the number of possessions the Knicks get.

But he has to buy in.

That whole "forget the Xs and Os..and just play ball" talk simply scares me.

[Jeffx]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

That's not true.

I missed Games 3 & 4. Didn't miss much I see.

Looking forward to next year. Dolan better re-up Donnie or else.

LOL@ that Melo quote. That's why you need a new coach. Melo needs to be untrained. I get what he's saying but my gosh.

I agree - I've had it with Pringles but unfortunately he has one year left on his contract.

Does Donnie Walsh want to come back? The word is he's still ticked at the owner for sticking his nose in the Carmelo trade. Plus he's old and has had health issues. Why put up with Brain-Dead-Dolan for another year or two?

[fsquid]

Re: The 2011 New York Knicks: The Rebirth

The Knicks have until Friday to decide on Billups. My guess is they will pick up his option & then wait on the CBA before making other moves

Until Friday? Holy crap, had no clue it was that quick. If they come back with a hard cap, the Knicks will be ****ed.