Re: Undisputed Early Access Impressions - Coming for the Belt
completely agree but your comment in bold here I'm actually more worried and I'll tell you why. I'm on the discord where there is A LOT of action and the developers routinely answer questions etc. Those guys are on there all day like it's a full time job and so I can see what comments/dispositions are reaching the developers the most. I've commented trying to get them to realize but it's probably to no avail.
The most vocal people are highly competitive and above all else simply want to win. Doesn't matter what the gameplay is like, they simply want to know the 'meta' and exploit it/use it to their advantage and they will saying things like "the counters need to do way more damage!" and one guy even said to me after I commented that would make it less like the sport and that he simply wants to win or make it more Esport/reflex based - he said "I know, I'm just sharing how to win easier" ...
So in short the community is very slanted towards winning competitively above all else - they were bragging about the 1st beta records ffs lol
I think on my list would be:
1. Get rid of counter window's completely just let it happen naturally. UFC 2009 undisputed when it released I think did a great job of just letting those instances happen naturally. There were flash knockdowns, Ko's, stun's - and it for the most part made a lot of sense when it happened. Try to make the core gameplay strong enough that you get results that make sense and reflect 'what you see on tv' - you should be able to try and be a counter-fighter and 'land counters' but it doesn't need it's own mechanic. in FN for example a counter window was rewarding the player for timing a parry or a dodge perfectly by penalizing the other player's movement and leaving their arm out longer! The reward should be that you didn't get smashed in the face and that you're ready to throw while maybe the other guy isn't ready for that - you can't be so heavy handed with 'this is a counter situation and this is not and we'll deliberately make it so' (in my opinion).
2. Make power punches more effective/damagining - especially in situations where both guys are punching at the same time - get the player paranoid to let their hands go at the same time. If someone is running in with their guard down, a good cross should drop them. Have the animations and outcomes be related and make sense. Related to that - No rocked by pidder/padder shots a big issue now is the best shots rarely get the expected result.
3. Make defence easier and more effective, the controls a part of it but also the weave mechanic in general is borderline useless as is. I believe that if I was simply trying to survive and not get hit (shades of Boots Ennis last opponent) I should be able to accomplish that and have you landing 20% if that's all I'm trying to do. Maybe a block should stop 75% but cover the body too? when someone completely shells up irl they usually cover both and some shots get through but I don't necessarily block only my head or only my body.
4. Make the clinch game and inside game a major focus. Clinching in single player is smooth for initiation but then they stand completely still - I have hope for this aspect of early access as they are just implementing it. One fear I have is the commentator saying 'they're going to take a point away!' ... most games have allowed you to do it 3 times. I think they need dynamic clinching where you're just too close to punch and it's a semi-clinch/tie up - ineffective punching abilities, as well as full clinches. You should also be able to move around during those and try to get out or focus on keeping it tied up. Maybe if both players are moving away from each other on the sticks, they naturally break out of it. Tie-ups, clinching and semi-clinching is such a huge part of the sport and really slows it down - it should be a tactic similar to mma games and clinches and wrestling. It would also make it so that if you want to fight inside you can't just ram the controller stick towards the other guy - you need SOME space to do some damage, otherwise you just tie up or are too close sloppy to do anything. On the flip side you could be a jab/cross guy and tie up when you feel you're too close to stifle your opponent like a Kitschko brother. Some people are vocal about punch output #'s being too high - well, that would put a huge dent in it when you can't just freely punch the whole round - it would be interesting to know real life boxing stands on avg clinches per round over say a 5 year period. This would dramatically improve and change the whole gave and give those moments to reset and breathe. FN did a horrible job in that regard and I hope they try to make it more dynamic and fluid and much more often.
completely agree but your comment in bold here I'm actually more worried and I'll tell you why. I'm on the discord where there is A LOT of action and the developers routinely answer questions etc. Those guys are on there all day like it's a full time job and so I can see what comments/dispositions are reaching the developers the most. I've commented trying to get them to realize but it's probably to no avail.
The most vocal people are highly competitive and above all else simply want to win. Doesn't matter what the gameplay is like, they simply want to know the 'meta' and exploit it/use it to their advantage and they will saying things like "the counters need to do way more damage!" and one guy even said to me after I commented that would make it less like the sport and that he simply wants to win or make it more Esport/reflex based - he said "I know, I'm just sharing how to win easier" ...
So in short the community is very slanted towards winning competitively above all else - they were bragging about the 1st beta records ffs lol
I think on my list would be:
1. Get rid of counter window's completely just let it happen naturally. UFC 2009 undisputed when it released I think did a great job of just letting those instances happen naturally. There were flash knockdowns, Ko's, stun's - and it for the most part made a lot of sense when it happened. Try to make the core gameplay strong enough that you get results that make sense and reflect 'what you see on tv' - you should be able to try and be a counter-fighter and 'land counters' but it doesn't need it's own mechanic. in FN for example a counter window was rewarding the player for timing a parry or a dodge perfectly by penalizing the other player's movement and leaving their arm out longer! The reward should be that you didn't get smashed in the face and that you're ready to throw while maybe the other guy isn't ready for that - you can't be so heavy handed with 'this is a counter situation and this is not and we'll deliberately make it so' (in my opinion).
2. Make power punches more effective/damagining - especially in situations where both guys are punching at the same time - get the player paranoid to let their hands go at the same time. If someone is running in with their guard down, a good cross should drop them. Have the animations and outcomes be related and make sense. Related to that - No rocked by pidder/padder shots a big issue now is the best shots rarely get the expected result.
3. Make defence easier and more effective, the controls a part of it but also the weave mechanic in general is borderline useless as is. I believe that if I was simply trying to survive and not get hit (shades of Boots Ennis last opponent) I should be able to accomplish that and have you landing 20% if that's all I'm trying to do. Maybe a block should stop 75% but cover the body too? when someone completely shells up irl they usually cover both and some shots get through but I don't necessarily block only my head or only my body.
4. Make the clinch game and inside game a major focus. Clinching in single player is smooth for initiation but then they stand completely still - I have hope for this aspect of early access as they are just implementing it. One fear I have is the commentator saying 'they're going to take a point away!' ... most games have allowed you to do it 3 times. I think they need dynamic clinching where you're just too close to punch and it's a semi-clinch/tie up - ineffective punching abilities, as well as full clinches. You should also be able to move around during those and try to get out or focus on keeping it tied up. Maybe if both players are moving away from each other on the sticks, they naturally break out of it. Tie-ups, clinching and semi-clinching is such a huge part of the sport and really slows it down - it should be a tactic similar to mma games and clinches and wrestling. It would also make it so that if you want to fight inside you can't just ram the controller stick towards the other guy - you need SOME space to do some damage, otherwise you just tie up or are too close sloppy to do anything. On the flip side you could be a jab/cross guy and tie up when you feel you're too close to stifle your opponent like a Kitschko brother. Some people are vocal about punch output #'s being too high - well, that would put a huge dent in it when you can't just freely punch the whole round - it would be interesting to know real life boxing stands on avg clinches per round over say a 5 year period. This would dramatically improve and change the whole gave and give those moments to reset and breathe. FN did a horrible job in that regard and I hope they try to make it more dynamic and fluid and much more often.
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