UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

[Nugget7211]

Re: UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

GPD explains the reason Head movement feels wonky is because its read digitally and not analogous, which I guess means there is no "hit detection".

It's based on certain head movement directions causing specific sets of strikes to miss.

There is no actual hit detection, or subtle head movement movements.

It's literally if you move this way, you dodge these strikes, if you move that way, you dodge those strikes.

Subtle movements, and hit detection do not exist in this system.


IMO this couldnt get any more wrong, but GPD actually thinks having subtle headmovement, and actual hit detection is wrong and a waste of time....

I think he has it completely backwards, and it ruins the head movement in this game. For some reason he is actually against having it how it functions in FNC, and thinks there is no point in it being like that......

Extremely disappointing stuff.

The only benefit to this system I could possibly imagine is that it'd work better online. So, I'm going to Edgy Brah it up here and guess that EA wanted to game to function as well as possible online and in ultimate team in order to keep people playing those game modes, especially UT, long term to sell more packs in Ultimate Team/DLC fighters for the regular game.

All I'm saying is, look into it

https://imgur.com/BDjhxfJ

[YourFatZebra]

Re: UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

GPD explains the reason Head movement feels wonky is because its read digitally and not analogous, which I guess means there is no "hit detection".

It's based on certain head movement directions causing specific sets of strikes to miss.

There is no actual hit detection, or subtle head movement movements.

It's literally if you move this way, you dodge these strikes, if you move that way, you dodge those strikes.

Subtle movements, and hit detection do not exist in this system.


IMO this couldnt get any more wrong, but GPD actually thinks having subtle headmovement, and actual hit detection is wrong and a waste of time....

I think he has it completely backwards, and it ruins the head movement in this game. For some reason he is actually against having it how it functions in FNC, and thinks there is no point in it being like that......

Extremely disappointing stuff.

Can you like, show where he said all of this?

I believe you I just want to see for myself because that is baffling. Explains alot of the wonkiness I felt in the beta.

Anyways...
I still have an Undisputed 3 poster on my wall.
I'll have that as long as I can keep it intact.

That game consumed my life, as I was going through some pretty heavy stuff personally at the time, and I recently rebought it for the exact same reasons Pappy laid out here. I too was shocked at the things that it had that had seemingly been forgotten over the years.

A few of these things...

- Fight camps in career mode: I've heard that this is a thing again in UFC 3 but I've seen nothing on it. I doubt it's as extensive as it was in Undisputed 3. Career mode had huge replayability through this one feature alone, ignoring all the other reasons. It might seem like a hindrance when you can just pick whatever moves you want now, but it was a nice touch of authenticity.

- Number of attacks/actions: There were seemingly a hundred strikes in that game. I have to be exaggerating somewhat, but it really was an insane number when I go back and look. Having stuff like "Gsp's head kick" really gave another layer of novelty to the game that's missing when everybody has "Left Roundhouse". Just going into the settings menu and seeing how many sections the tutorial has is a great illustration of how deep that game is. Which brings me to...

- Well put together tutorial: You can say what you want about it being a textbook in a game, but having a built in encyclopedia full of MMA knowledge is a great addition. I was much younger when UFC 3 was released, so my MMA knowledge was substantially less informed. Being able to learn about different guard positions, submissions, and even the history of the UFC itself was amazing. Priceless really when you consider that it was built into the way the game taught you to play.

- Career Fighters in Exhibition: This bothers me to no end in UFC 2. I'll go through a career with a guy, retire him and go to use him in exhibition. Suddenly his record is 0-0 again as if none of that happened. This shouldn't be hard to implement and for CAF guys like myself would go miles in making the experience more complete.

- AI Tendencies for CAF: I really don't know why this was removed. UD3 has this, FNC has this, the damn WWE games have this. I tried to run simulation fights in UFC 2 as I have for years in the WWE games with my friends. There was no consistency. You'd have kickboxers who were outgrappling judo guys, jiu jitsu guys with hands of stone. None of this was because they had insane stats either. We tanked all the overalls to below 80 to try and force the AI to only do the things they were good at. Didn't work. They still just did whatever and fought with no rhyme or reason. Having the ability to choose how my fighter fights as an AI is essential to offline replayability. Otherwise they all feel exactly the same. Also having less than 20 slots is embarrassing, we had like 70 in FNC and 80 in UD3.

- Title Defence Mode/Extra Modes: This was a fun feature. Being able to play gauntlet style fights was great. With there being no random feature in exhibition, this would be a fun addition to the game. Not being able to use a fighter in defence until you cleared the initial Title mode was also a nice touch.

- CAF Reach not being linked to height: I hate this so much. This kills UT, this bugs me in career, this makes CAF just all around worse. Everyone ends up making their dude the max height and so everyone has the same reach. I don't know why this decision was made. I'd assume just like, laziness and assuming nobody cared. FNC and UD3 both allow this if I'm not mistaken.

- Replay Saving: This seems redundant, I know, but hear me out. In the modern day both consoles can record video, but neither allows you to go in game with it. I don't know if this has been confirmed for UFC 3 or not, so this may be a moot point, but if I had a Madden/2K style instant replay feature I'd lose my ****. UD3 saved every round you did up to a certain point.

- No getup from mount: Have you ever tried to do this to someone in real life? Like someone who knows Jiu Jitsu? It would be so much better to have the minor/major system they had in UD3. You shouldn't be able to just get up from mount. You should have to work your way into a better position. But they still need to add a lot of other ground positions that aren't in the game. Butterfly is an obvious one. Whatever the position you throw 'em in to start a calf slicer would be nice as well, name escapes me right now.

I might come back to this thread and add more later if they come to me but I think everything else I would say has already been covered. Sorry that alot of this was CAF focused but it was exponentially better in that game than this one, and has always been a huge gripe of mine.

[godway]

Re: UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

Can you like, show where he said all of this?

I believe you I just want to see for myself because that is baffling. Explains alot of the wonkiness I felt in the beta.

Anyways...
I still have an Undisputed 3 poster on my wall.
I'll have that as long as I can keep it intact.

That game consumed my life, as I was going through some pretty heavy stuff personally at the time, and I recently rebought it for the exact same reasons Pappy laid out here. I too was shocked at the things that it had that had seemingly been forgotten over the years.

A few of these things...

- Fight camps in career mode: I've heard that this is a thing again in UFC 3 but I've seen nothing on it. I doubt it's as extensive as it was in Undisputed 3. Career mode had huge replayability through this one feature alone, ignoring all the other reasons. It might seem like a hindrance when you can just pick whatever moves you want now, but it was a nice touch of authenticity.

- Number of attacks/actions: There were seemingly a hundred strikes in that game. I have to be exaggerating somewhat, but it really was an insane number when I go back and look. Having stuff like "Gsp's head kick" really gave another layer of novelty to the game that's missing when everybody has "Left Roundhouse". Just going into the settings menu and seeing how many sections the tutorial has is a great illustration of how deep that game is. Which brings me to...

- Well put together tutorial: You can say what you want about it being a textbook in a game, but having a built in encyclopedia full of MMA knowledge is a great addition. I was much younger when UFC 3 was released, so my MMA knowledge was substantially less informed. Being able to learn about different guard positions, submissions, and even the history of the UFC itself was amazing. Priceless really when you consider that it was built into the way the game taught you to play.

- Career Fighters in Exhibition: This bothers me to no end in UFC 2. I'll go through a career with a guy, retire him and go to use him in exhibition. Suddenly his record is 0-0 again as if none of that happened. This shouldn't be hard to implement and for CAF guys like myself would go miles in making the experience more complete.

- AI Tendencies for CAF: I really don't know why this was removed. UD3 has this, FNC has this, the damn WWE games have this. I tried to run simulation fights in UFC 2 as I have for years in the WWE games with my friends. There was no consistency. You'd have kickboxers who were outgrappling judo guys, jiu jitsu guys with hands of stone. None of this was because they had insane stats either. We tanked all the overalls to below 80 to try and force the AI to only do the things they were good at. Didn't work. They still just did whatever and fought with no rhyme or reason. Having the ability to choose how my fighter fights as an AI is essential to offline replayability. Otherwise they all feel exactly the same. Also having less than 20 slots is embarrassing, we had like 70 in FNC and 80 in UD3.

- Title Defence Mode/Extra Modes: This was a fun feature. Being able to play gauntlet style fights was great. With there being no random feature in exhibition, this would be a fun addition to the game. Not being able to use a fighter in defence until you cleared the initial Title mode was also a nice touch.

- CAF Reach not being linked to height: I hate this so much. This kills UT, this bugs me in career, this makes CAF just all around worse. Everyone ends up making their dude the max height and so everyone has the same reach. I don't know why this decision was made. I'd assume just like, laziness and assuming nobody cared. FNC and UD3 both allow this if I'm not mistaken.

- Replay Saving: This seems redundant, I know, but hear me out. In the modern day both consoles can record video, but neither allows you to go in game with it. I don't know if this has been confirmed for UFC 3 or not, so this may be a moot point, but if I had a Madden/2K style instant replay feature I'd lose my ****. UD3 saved every round you did up to a certain point.

- No getup from mount: Have you ever tried to do this to someone in real life? Like someone who knows Jiu Jitsu? It would be so much better to have the minor/major system they had in UD3. You shouldn't be able to just get up from mount. You should have to work your way into a better position. But they still need to add a lot of other ground positions that aren't in the game. Butterfly is an obvious one. Whatever the position you throw 'em in to start a calf slicer would be nice as well, name escapes me right now.

I might come back to this thread and add more later if they come to me but I think everything else I would say has already been covered. Sorry that alot of this was CAF focused but it was exponentially better in that game than this one, and has always been a huge gripe of mine.

CAF reach is soooooo annoying. There's no reason to make a CAF under the max height limit. The reason FN had the option to edit reach is because reach is REALLY IMPORTANT to a fighting sport. And in creating a fighter, you probably want to be able to do that.

[lolwut]

Re: UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

THQ went out of business. Wasn't about loyalty. That being said, great post. Although, you can stop takedowns with strikes in EA UFC 3.

In 2011, THQ and EA discussed a potential sale of THQ as a whole to EA. According to court documents, “THQ provided EA internal financial information including detailed sales and revenue figures for the UFC Franchise, and projected marketing expenditures on the next UFC Franchise game.” Despite initial interests, EA broke off negotiations with THQ in December <del>2013</del> 2011 citing disinterest.
Two weeks later, Zuffa criticized THQ about its expenditures and threatened to terminate its relationship with THQ based on its insolvency. There had been no prior evidence of dissatisfaction with THQ.
THQ entered into a $10 million settlement with Zuffa in exchange for the termination of its license and all intellectual property rights to the UFC game brand in 2012. However, THQ now claims that this was a fraudulent transfer as it believes that EA had contacted Zuffa and conveyed the internal financial information it was provided by THQ during the potential sale of THQ. THQ claims that it was “hamstrung” in negotiations with Zuffa due to its knowledge of THQ’s finances and the actual value of the UFC video game franchise was $20 million.


The basic claim here is that THQ is claiming that when it had entered into negotiations to sell itself to EA due to financial troubles, it revealed confidential financials to EA as EA was doing its due diligence before the potential acquisition. Once acquisition talks failed THQ claims EA took what it had known about THQ finances and sent it to Zuffa. As many recall, EA had developed EA Sports MMA which did not do well because it did not have recognizable UFC names in its game. Thus, THQ argues there was reason why EA wanted Zuffa to terminate its relationship with THQ.

[AeroZeppelin27]

Re: UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

Sadly I can't like posts, as I love this, constructive, not about which is better, just an honest opinion on two MMA games. And as someone who regularly plays UD3 I have to completely agree with everything you've said here, in some areas, UD3 still delivers the best MMA experience to date, the way all 3 systems fluidly transition between eachother, the clinch, the takedown options, the feel of the ground game and the visual feedback it had (I do however enjoy UFC's independent grapple system in 2&3)

Again, fantastic post.

[lolwut]

Re: UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

guys please stop trolling EA. you are looking at this with nostalgia. the ground game is so much better in EA UFC 3. gpd even comes here and talks to us. they support the game so much after release. we got 20 patches. we don't have any right to complain. skynet even talks to us, and the AI rules. its like a real fight. they even had aholbert32 help with AI. its super customized. EA UFC 3 is so much better than Undisputed

[AeroZeppelin27]

Re: UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

GPD explains the reason Head movement feels wonky is because its read digitally and not analogous, which I guess means there is no "hit detection".

It's based on certain head movement directions causing specific sets of strikes to miss.

There is no actual hit detection, or subtle head movement movements.

It's literally if you move this way, you dodge these strikes, if you move that way, you dodge those strikes.

Subtle movements, and hit detection do not exist in this system.


IMO this couldnt get any more wrong, but GPD actually thinks having subtle headmovement, and actual hit detection is wrong and a waste of time....

I think he has it completely backwards, and it ruins the head movement in this game. For some reason he is actually against having it how it functions in FNC, and thinks there is no point in it being like that......

Extremely disappointing stuff.

You.. you are joking right.. PLEASE SAY YOU ARE JOKING? oh.. If that's true I wish I honestly didn't know. The head movement mixed with incredible hit detection and accuracy system is what made FNC one of the greatest boxing Sims ever, And also a game, that to my eyes, has the best head movement avalible in a game.

Augh. I really hope you're somehow mistaken but your not the kinda guy who is and.. yeah, that's really, really disappointing. I literally loved being able to dodge flurries with unorthodox head movement in FNC, which simply could not work with this system.

This.. hurts.. a lot. If you have the link to GPD actually saying it, I'd die a little inside to see it..

Edit: Just booted up FNC for the first time since the beta, the head movement feels WAY more responsive, dynamic, fluid and satisfying.. only thing I miss is moving my head while moving.. I fail to see how the new system is considered better than this.. its fantastic.

[Pappy Knuckles]

Re: UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

guys please stop trolling EA. you are looking at this with nostalgia. the ground game is so much better in EA UFC 3. gpd even comes here and talks to us. they support the game so much after release. we got 20 patches. we don't have any right to complain. skynet even talks to us, and the AI rules. its like a real fight. they even had aholbert32 help with AI. its super customized. EA UFC 3 is so much better than Undisputed

I can't even tell if this is a troll, but I'll bite. Nostalgia? This thread is based on my current experience with Undisputed 3. I've put over 1500 fights into UFC 2 and I gave the UFC 3 beta more than enough run to make an honest comparison between the two games. A lot of the others in this thread have extensive playtime between both games as well. I think some good discussion is taking place that could benefit the UFC series.

I strongly disagree with your opinion on the ground game.

We appreciate GPD coming in here and talking to us, and the patches they've dropped have really improved their product. We don't have the right to complain, though? Nah, we owe EA nothing.

I'm sure GPD doesn't like seeing us ripping his hard work, but he's been doing this long enough to know that criticism comes with the territory. If we just say that everything is perfect, how does that help anything? I can't speak for anyone else, but I know EA can make this a great game. Now whether we get there or not is another story. It's all going to depend on where their priorities lie.




Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

[AeroZeppelin27]

Re: UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

I can't even tell if this is a troll, but I'll bite. Nostalgia? This thread is based on my current experience with Undisputed 3. I've put over 1500 fights into UFC 2 and I gave the UFC 3 beta more than enough run to make an honest comparison between the two games. A lot of the others in this thread have extensive playtime between both games as well. I think some good discussion is taking place that could benefit the UFC series.

I strongly disagree with your opinion on the ground game.

We appreciate GPD coming in here and talking to us, and the patches they've dropped have really improved their product. We don't have the right to complain, though? Nah, we owe EA nothing.

I'm sure GPD doesn't like seeing us ripping his hard work, but he's been doing this long enough to know that criticism comes with the territory. If we just say that everything is perfect, how does that help anything? I can't speak for anyone else, but I know EA can make this a great game. Now whether we get there or not is another story. It's all going to depend on where their priorities lie.




Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

I think he's trolling. He posted a thread calling the RPM article pics fake and whatnot, which was straightup odd if you saw it. But I dunno.

I just jumped onto UD3 just then. Man I prefer the new UFC striking (even with its fast low stamina thing) but there still are areas and gameplay elements that UD3 absolutely nails, like GnP posturing, both fighters can block, sway, feint and it feels much more fluid for it.

Same with the motion and flow of the clinch, it just feels more natural.
I don't even mean this as criticism of EA UFC, I just think the UD3 games can still offer interesting insight into gameplay elements EA have yet to attempt or elements that are perhaps done better/different or just how they incorporated extra layers to certain things in UD3. I think the same applies to areas of FNC and UFC 3.

I definitely agree UFC 3 has an insane amount of potential to be great.

[cal7_11]

Re: UFC Undisputed 3: Where it succeeded and what EA UFC can take from it.

guys please stop trolling EA. you are looking at this with nostalgia. the ground game is so much better in EA UFC 3. gpd even comes here and talks to us. they support the game so much after release. we got 20 patches. we don't have any right to complain. skynet even talks to us, and the AI rules. its like a real fight. they even had aholbert32 help with AI. its super customized. EA UFC 3 is so much better than Undisputed

I hope you are affiliated with EA in some way as from a fans point of view, this post is tragic.

We don’t have any right to complain!? Wow. That statement is ludicrous. We have every right to complain given that we are the ones spending our money on this product.