Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

[Phillyboi207]

Tbh the grappling is awesome but the rock-paper-scissors mechanic should be based on position/ratings instead of stamina(with long term stamina impacting ratings).

Have minor transition>major transition>blocking>punching>minor transition

Minor transitions shouldnt be reversable. They could also set up submissions. Have like 2-4 minor transitions equal a major one(depending on level and ratings). Also doing minor transitions increase speed of major ones and decrease stages for subs.

So for instance, getting wrist control is a minor transition, shifting your hips to one side is a minor transition, then you can either go straight for a sub with less stages or major transition to get up but it’ll be way faster due to using minor transitions first.

I’d also like to see a scramble mechanic(and rating). Instead of auto reversals when you time a reverse(clicking R3) on a major transition it creates a scramble situation and both players have to try to “win”. Submissions should be possible from here. Maybe a timed button mash like the arm bar submission in EA MMA

These mechanics can also apply to wrestling. I’d like a struggle animation and the same minigame.

What this does is create depth in the ground game for higher level players but newer guys can still use major transitions/punching/blocking which would work the same. Also by switching reversals to clicking R3 it gives us the option to deny only incase someone wants to be on bottom.

For clinch work i’d like to see movement in the clinch impacting transition speeds. If I double under and push forward it should make the body clinch easier. If we’re in single collar I should be able to pivot towards your lead leg and make a sweep easier by taking you off balance. Clinch transition speeds need to also be faster , it is extremely difficult to hold someone in the clinch. Exception being double under.

Single collar punches/elbows need to do same damage as Thai clinch. Think about it, when you throw an elbow or punch from Thai clinch it becomes a single collar strike anyway. Against the fence over/under should always be default. Get rid of auto break on thai clinch, just make it extremely difficult to get there and hold that position.

I also think the choke minigame from EA MMA is much better than the current game. Joint locks are another beast tho and maybe they should be transition based.

A lot of stuff but I’m hoping some of it sounds good to y’all.

Feedback is appreciated.

[BigMoney718]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

Tbh the grappling is awesome but the rock-paper-scissors mechanic should be based on position/ratings instead of stamina(with long term stamina impacting ratings).

Have minor transition>major transition>blocking>punching>minor transition

Minor transitions shouldnt be reversable. They could also set up submissions. Have like 2-4 minor transitions equal a major one(depending on level and ratings). Also doing minor transitions increase speed of major ones and decrease stages for subs.

So for instance, getting wrist control is a minor transition, shifting your hips to one side is a minor transition, then you can either go straight for a sub with less stages or major transition to get up but it’ll be way faster due to using minor transitions first.

I’d also like to see a scramble mechanic(and rating). Instead of auto reversals when you time a reverse(clicking R3) on a major transition it creates a scramble situation and both players have to try to “win”. Submissions should be possible from here. Maybe a timed button mash like the arm bar submission in EA MMA

These mechanics can also apply to wrestling. I’d like a struggle animation and the same minigame.

What this does is create depth in the ground game for higher level players but newer guys can still use major transitions/punching/blocking which would work the same. Also by switching reversals to clicking R3 it gives us the option to deny only incase someone wants to be on bottom.

For clinch work i’d like to see movement in the clinch impacting transition speeds. If I double under and push forward it should make the body clinch easier. If we’re in single collar I should be able to pivot towards your lead leg and make a sweep easier by taking you off balance. Clinch transition speeds need to also be faster , it is extremely difficult to hold someone in the clinch. Exception being double under.

Single collar punches/elbows need to do same damage as Thai clinch. Think about it, when you throw an elbow or punch from Thai clinch it becomes a single collar strike anyway. Against the fence over/under should always be default. Get rid of auto break on thai clinch, just make it extremely difficult to get there and hold that position.

I also think the choke minigame from EA MMA is much better than the current game. Joint locks are another beast tho and maybe they should be transition based.

A lot of stuff but I’m hoping some of it sounds good to y’all.

Feedback is appreciated.

I LOVE IT!!!!!!
Be sure to repost this multiple times during the year though. As great as this development team is at listening to the community and making changes, this level of programming and design can't be done with a patch (I don't think lol). We'd have to wait until UFC 4.



XBGT: Jodie McGregor

[johnmangala]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

Clinch punch health events and head/wrist control.

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

Clinch punch health events and head/wrist control.

Agreed

Minor transition can be wrist control. And the extra damage should come with health events

[iceberg3445]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

I agree! The only thing I would add is increased depth to takedowns and more takedown to clinch animations.

Add depth to takedowns by creating new animations that occur depending on if/when in the takedown window the takedown is defended. I.e. a takedown defend in the middle of the window results in the clinch; a single leg takedown defended late in the window results one player controlling the other player’s leg while standing (new animation), a position from which many grappling options should be available for both players.

I like your ideas for the clinch. I would add making it optional for players to shoot for a takedown and INTENTIONALLY end up in the clinch (commonly pushing the other player against the change).


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[Nugget7211]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

This sounds great, minor transitions and additional, more specific positions is really all I want to see with the ground game, even the fakes I'm fine with as a mechanic, I just think it's animated bizarrely.

By more specific positions, I basically mean the places that minor transitions would take you (if I'm understanding you correctly), so like deep half guard, or tripoding in someones closed guard, or butterfly guard or body triangle guard and so on.

[Find_the_Door]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

I think that every pass should have multiple animations. Shouldn't be the same universal animation across the board - especially if you're setting up a fake pass (should be specific animations tied to that chain).

For example I should be able to posture up and pass after faking the posture up then it would naturally flow into allowing a clean pass. What's annoying about the current ground game is that I'll fake the first transition and they'll go for it yet when I go to pass the reversal counter essentially resets. This allows less competent ground players to have immense success. There needs to be a huge penalty for trying to reverse a fake by way a bigger window to pass.

That change I believe would improve the ground game considerably and could be done via patch.

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

Ah im an idiot

Forgot to include

POSTURING UP SHOULD NOT BE A TRANSITION

Unless someone does a minor transition to hold you down.

We should be able to freely posture up and down to deliver damage

[johnmangala]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

HUDless submissions

Open guard clinch

[Solid_Altair]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

Do you really think it woul dbe viable to balance a system where perma stam affects the speed of the moves more than temp stam?

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

Do you really think it woul dbe viable to balance a system where perma stam affects the speed of the moves more than temp stam?

Of course

The rating decrease doesnt have to be significant until around 50%.

Ratings, leverage(position), and type of transition should matter the most.

[godway]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

I'll give some of my complaints or random thoughts about it, but grappling is something I think would be very difficult to properly convey in a video game while keeping that game simplistic enough for the average player. In order to do it very well you are probably going to have to implement some complicated systems. To people like us on this forum, who are hardcore about the series, that is welcome. But it is probably not so welcome from the general audience. Anyways, I've already accepted that the ground game is what it is for UFC 3, and it's not the worst thing in the world. With how well they revamped the striking for 3, I have every confidence that grappling will evolve for UFC 4, while maybe if we're lucky, we can see a few test-runs for some new stuff during UFC 3's lifecycle (like they did with the Imanari roll for UFC 2).


- The philosophy behind EA UFC's grappling needs changed. Forget about any type of gameplay or mechanics for a moment. Grappling isn't fighting to deplete your opponent's stamina. That isn't skill based. So the very system they build upon is all wrong to begin with. A lot of people will take a fight TO the ground because they are tired. And the stamina doesn't make any difference on anything besides submissions, anyways. Flicking a stick when you are out of stamina can still cause you to push up, grab your opponents leg, and take him down all in one sweep, and that is stupid.

- The weightlessness to everything is ridiculous. You never truly feel like you're holding someone down or fighting your way out since the mechanic of flicking or holding a stick is so simplistic. I would like to see more ratings involved in the overall science of how you fight on the ground. Stuff that affects strength, weight, etc.

- Striking on the ground in these games is very unrealistic. How often do you see people getting KO'd from ground and pound alone? How often do people get KO'd from side control? This is another area where actually having a ref involved in the gameplay would make this stuff much easier to swallow, since you're not watching people get KO'd, you're watching the ref stop the fight.

- I'd like to see wrist control implemented at some point. I feel like you could do that without making things too complicated on the ground. Even when fighters aren't that active on the ground and in a lay and pray spot, their hands are always busy.

- I'm very disappointed that all of the submission animations are recycled from UFC 2. But I think a bigger issue to me is the way submissions are applied to begin with. Every submission move has a certain difficulty level to apply. For instance, if you're on your back and you just hold a button and flick a stick, putting on something as difficult as a triangle choke is silly. It's one of the most easily defendable holds in grappling. Sticking with the idea of mini-games, I don't min them but I wish it was deeper. I wish the initial mini-game was just to APPLY the hold. Then that kicks up another mini-game to actually finish the hold, providing a whole new level of depth to it all. It can also make ratings a lot more important on the ground, as unskilled grapplers can get the holds on but struggle to finish them compared to the skilled ones.

I'm bolding that part because I like that idea.

[Solid_Altair]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

Of course

The rating decrease doesnt have to be significant until around 50%.

Ratings, leverage(position), and type of transition should matter the most.

So, you're up against a player with good reactions and he is using a great grappler, all you have to speed you up and squeeze a transition in would be GA?

[Haz____]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

Get rid of the mystical, magical, "Grapple Advantage". This is a purely video gamey mechanic, that has no basis in reality, and is only implemented as a cheap, lazy balance fix.

Add more transition, and more options.

We don't need a magic meter that lets you do stuff for free. We need more options to trick and confuse the opponent with.

"Grapple Advantage" removes real grappling strategy.

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Ideas to improve grappling in EA UFC

So, you're up against a player with good reactions and he is using a great grappler, all you have to speed you up and squeeze a transition in would be GA?

Minor transitions should be difficult to block. Your goal would be to do the little things to improve position.

@Haz

I like GA in terms of making TDs more effective in certain situations and in momentum based situations it’s cool.