Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

[aholbert32]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

Yay! Good stuff Skynet!!
And Meowing for testing them!
Any chance you could test Misha Cirkunov, Joe Lauzon, Chris Holdsworth and Charles Rosa??

I'd do it but I'm stuck at work for the next 10 hours like a menace haha, though I'm totally gonna be trying them out as soon as I get off work.

Everyone but Lauzon was updated.

[AeroZeppelin27]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

Everyone but Lauzon was updated.

Thankyou.

Great work Skynet and everyone who helped identify any of the off AIs.

Can't wait to get home and have some matches against Cirkunov and Holdsworth.

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

Ok so it seems like the way to go is tuning sliders/difficulty between each fighter you’re using/ going against.


Just went 1-2 vs Woodley with these sliders if anyone wants a challenge

Pro difficulty

Stamina Cost +1 for both

Damage +2 for computer

Transition speed +4 for computer

Sub speed +1 for both

Everything else default

I really wish we could save slider sets against specific fighters.

Btw is there a way to get the computer to throw less for 5 round fights?

[AeroZeppelin27]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

Ok so it seems like the way to go is tuning sliders/difficulty between each fighter you’re using/ going against.


Just went 1-2 vs Woodley with these sliders if anyone wants a challenge

Pro difficulty

Stamina Cost +1 for both

Damage +2 for computer

Transition speed +4 for computer

Sub speed +1 for both

Everything else default

I really wish we could save slider sets against specific fighters.

Btw is there a way to get the computer to throw less for 5 round fights?

Nice sliders, ill try them tonight, thanks.

As for AI output, No, they'll throw less if you up the stamina drain, but that won't actually help.

I too wish there was basically an alternative AI (just ge same, with lower output) for both 5 round fights and real time clock.

The more passive AI types are good for 5 rounders, as are wrestlers if you have the AI trans high enough to let them land TDs and work on the ground for a few minutes per round.

I get a toooon of 3rd decs with my slow, passive play style, but 5 rounders are usually finishes unless the AI is on point, which occasionally happens and results in a 5 round epic.

This is all for Pro AI.

Edit: Just realized your using the same AI trans as.me, that setting helps matches last longer IMO.

Setting the AI to hard also lowers output, at the cost of challenge.

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

Nice sliders, ill try them tonight, thanks.

As for AI output, No, they'll throw less if you up the stamina drain, but that won't actually help.

I too wish there was basically an alternative AI (just ge same, with lower output) for both 5 round fights and real time clock.

The more passive AI types are good for 5 rounders, as are wrestlers if you have the AI trans high enough to let them land TDs and work on the ground for a few minutes per round.

I get a toooon of 3rd decs with my slow, passive play style, but 5 rounders are usually finishes unless the AI is on point, which occasionally happens and results in a 5 round epic.

This is all for Pro AI.

Edit: Just realized your using the same AI trans as.me, that setting helps matches last longer IMO.

Setting the AI to hard also lowers output, at the cost of challenge.

Yeah I liked the output on hard but the cpu doesnt block enough

Also they should be using more feints. It would save their stamina instead of blasting combos when I dart in and out. I would love to see them pull punches/kicks if they notice you’re no longer in range

[johnmangala]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

I have been watching some AI v AI fights to learn some new set ups.

I find it reveals a lot about the meta- what actually works and what doesn't in the game, as opposed to what one might expect from adhering to reality.

The AI still feels a little godlike at times but it is much better than before.

I think offline would benefit a lot from additional sliders like movement speed, accuracy, etc.

Also why isn't this thread stickied.

[AeroZeppelin27]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

Yeah I liked the output on hard but the cpu doesnt block enough

Also they should be using more feints. It would save their stamina instead of blasting combos when I dart in and out. I would love to see them pull punches/kicks if they notice you’re no longer in range

Completely agree, you can just pop the jab in the hard AI's face for 25 minutes and it'll defend them like Paulo Costa did vs Hall.

Whereas Pro has your timing down if you try to only use jabs, it'll counter the s*** out of that point fighting foolishness.

As for fients, also agree, fienting currently seems broken with the AI, occasionally it uses them properly and even more occasionally still it will actually pull a punch if you drop out of range or if the first punch drops you.

However, 90% of the time it instead will say, fient a left hook.. about 8 times, it feels like a bug, they don't utilise the hole it opens if you bite on one of the fients, it just spams them then abandons them.

Hopefully they can be improved and integrated like ground fakes, where the AI does them more, and better, as the difficulty scales.

[AeroZeppelin27]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

I have been watching some AI v AI fights to learn some new set ups.

I find it reveals a lot about the meta- what actually works and what doesn't in the game, as opposed to what one might expect from adhering to reality.

The AI still feels a little godlike at times but it is much better than before.

I think offline would benefit a lot from additional sliders like movement speed, accuracy, etc.

Also why isn't this thread stickied.

The AI only seems to look godlike vs other AIs now, vs a player its quite rare to have it enter the matrix anymore.

Edit: In my experience, anyway.

Totally agree with a stocky, I've had to bump this thread a few times around patches dropping.

[johnmangala]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

The AI only seems to look godlike vs other AIs now, vs a player its quite rare to have it enter the matrix anymore.

Edit: In my experience, anyway.

Totally agree with a stocky, I've had to bump this thread a few times around patches dropping.

It's less godlike now but it's still godlike. The AI doesn't make as many natural mistakes and is more capable of making superhuman reads and counters.

I find that the AI is more godlike against humans than against other AI. AI v AI fights look way better.

This could be because the meta is transparent to the AI, but most players do not have access to such information.

If we could edit fighter templates I think this is an area where more options can provide more freedom.

[AeroZeppelin27]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

It's less godlike now but it's still godlike. The AI doesn't make as many natural mistakes and is more capable of making superhuman reads and counters.

I find that the AI is more godlike against humans than against other AI. AI v AI fights look way better.

This could be because the meta is transparent to the AI, but most players do not have access to such information.

If we could edit fighter templates I think this is an area where more options can provide more freedom.

Interesting! What difficulty is that referring too?
I'd agree Legendary can feel Godlike still, for sure.
Though I rarely play that difficulty.

But Pro/Hard, I wouldn't say godlike, they're still a bit telepathic however, that I completely agree with.

Whilst I rarely have say, Nik Lentz use headmovement to sway 4 consecutive shots like he used too, I still have him occasionally perfectly counter a strike I'm using for the first time.

Example, ill come in fienting a 1 or 2 then maybe a hook depending on range, all so I can het him blocking high to rip a lead hook low.
Quite often they'll bite on the fient and STILL intercept my hook with an upper, even if its the first I've thrown.

Now that's probably not the greatest example, but it kinda shows what I'm getting at.

Similar applies to the AIs use of the backfist.
Last night Manuwa perfectly countered my FIRST step in jab with a spin backfist.

He just immediately had my timing, which didn't feel realistic to me.

[AeroZeppelin27]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

Pro and especially hard make a fair amount of human Esq error, IME.

I almost don't want to see it increased simply because when the AI stuffs up. It stuffs up big.

Like, 85% of.my AI "mistakes" are it lunging into my headkickz and KO'ing itself.

Occasionally it will sway the wrong way but they often make errors in lunges.

I like it, but because of how much damage they do, I don't want to see them increased.

I'd love too see the AI make mistakes on other ways more often though 100% (standup only, though, ground mistakes are fine as is)

[johnmangala]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

Pro and especially hard make a fair amount of human Esq error, IME.

I almost don't want to see it increased simply because when the AI stuffs up. It stuffs up big.

Like, 85% of.my AI "mistakes" are it lunging into my headkickz and KO'ing itself.

Occasionally it will sway the wrong way but they often make errors in lunges.

I like it, but because of how much damage they do, I don't want to see them increased.

I'd love too see the AI make mistakes on other ways more often though 100% (standup only, though, ground mistakes are fine as is)

Interesting! What difficulty is that referring too?
I'd agree Legendary can feel Godlike still, for sure.
Though I rarely play that difficulty.

But Pro/Hard, I wouldn't say godlike, they're still a bit telepathic however, that I completely agree with.

Whilst I rarely have say, Nik Lentz use headmovement to sway 4 consecutive shots like he used too, I still have him occasionally perfectly counter a strike I'm using for the first time.

Example, ill come in fienting a 1 or 2 then maybe a hook depending on range, all so I can het him blocking high to rip a lead hook low.
Quite often they'll bite on the fient and STILL intercept my hook with an upper, even if its the first I've thrown.

Now that's probably not the greatest example, but it kinda shows what I'm getting at.

Similar applies to the AIs use of the backfist.
Last night Manuwa perfectly countered my FIRST step in jab with a spin backfist.

He just immediately had my timing, which didn't feel realistic to me.

Legendary and Pro, any difficulty above the easy ones.

I am not saying they don't make mistakes. I am saying they make far less mistakes than most humans naturally would.

The AI right now is still in that state where it feels artificial.

The AI in most can make Colby Covington feel like Anderson Silva in his prime.

Despite that, the AI is closer to simulation than it has ever been. So more progress in that direction is desired.

[AeroZeppelin27]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

Legendary and Pro, any difficulty above the easy ones.

I am not saying they don't make mistakes. I am saying they make far less mistakes than most humans naturally would.

The AI right now is still in that state where it feels artificial.

The AI in most can make Colby Covington feel like Anderson Silva in his prime.

Despite that, the AI is closer to simulation than it has ever been. So more progress in that direction is desired.

Ah okay, I'm following you now.

I don't disagree with that. Colbys AI is strangely evasive for me, too.
He was worse before 1.06 but occasionally he does still just dodge all my shots with a brain melting slickness still.

Oddly enough most other wrestler template AIs aren't that bad at all.

But overall. I agree with you.

And I too am all for more and more progress towards a more sim Esq AI, for sure.

So far Skynets been nailing it so I have faith it'll get better still before the patch cycle ends.

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

Legendary and Pro, any difficulty above the easy ones.

I am not saying they don't make mistakes. I am saying they make far less mistakes than most humans naturally would.

The AI right now is still in that state where it feels artificial.

The AI in most can make Colby Covington feel like Anderson Silva in his prime.

Despite that, the AI is closer to simulation than it has ever been. So more progress in that direction is desired.

You have to feint against the AI on legendary. They react hard to it.

Also gotta fake coming forward

[Kingslayer04]

Re: Fighter AI Realism vs Difficulty

I played against Garbrandt on Pro yesterday, the guy shot for takedowns regularly. What's up with that? Also, is there a way to add who the AI is playing against as a factor, too? Because I was Cruz. I mean I get the occasional panic takedown but he was shooting way too much. He shouldn't do it at all unless it's a last resort move when rocked.