Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

[Good Grappler]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

Yh i'm thinking the same. I think Askren will take him down and maintain safe top positions like the guard, stack guard, back side or side control. He'll float around on top and get out of there when he needs to. Maia is most dangerous when he's on top and when he gets your back. Now if Maia takes Askren down, then it gets even more interesting...especially if he can get Askrens back. Cuz 9 times outta 10 if Maia gets your back, it's probably gonna be a wrap.

I’m 100% expecting Askren’s gameplan to be everything you just said. Take down, control, avoid submissions, etc.

But I’m not 100% sure it’s gonna go down like that. We have to remember who Demian Maia is. There’s a reason people don’t go to the ground with that guy.

I still get flashbacks to Fitch vs Maia. Fitch was grinding everyone out, the master of controlling top position whilst defending subs. I remember thinking Fitch could win that. I thought Fitch’s wrestling would allow him to dictate when and how it went to the mat. And I thought if it did go to the ground, Fitch would be able to stay on top, avoiding sweeps and subs.

Maia ended up completely schooling Fitch, taking HIM down, dominating the mat grappling, taking his back at will. Since then I’ve always considered Maia to be untouchable on the mat. I mean look what he did to Gunnar Nelson. Man’s an animal.

Stylistically, it’s a dangerous match for Ben.

[WarMMA]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

I’m 100% expecting Askren’s gameplan to be everything you just said. Take down, control, avoid submissions, etc.

But I’m not 100% sure it’s gonna go down like that. We have to remember who Demian Maia is. There’s a reason people don’t go to the ground with that guy.

I still get flashbacks to Fitch vs Maia. Fitch was grinding everyone out, the master of controlling top position whilst defending subs. I remember thinking Fitch could win that. I thought Fitch’s wrestling would allow him to dictate when and how it went to the mat. And I thought if it did go to the ground, Fitch would be able to stay on top, avoiding sweeps and subs.

Maia ended up completely schooling Fitch, taking HIM down, dominating the mat grappling, taking his back at will. Since then I’ve always considered Maia to be untouchable on the mat. I mean look what he did to Gunnar Nelson. Man’s an animal.

Stylistically, it’s a dangerous match for Ben.

Agreed. Stylistically it is a bad match up for Ben cuz he likes to grapple and Maia is definitely a wizard on the mat. But if you do go to the mat with Maia like Askren likely will, it's a matter of knowing where he's good. If you've watched Maia for a long time, you'll know that Maia isn't really the biggest submission threat off his back, but what he is from his back is a dangerous sweep threat. He loves to look for sweeps where he can stand up into a td attempt or more importantly, get top position. That's the part Askren has to watch out for if he takes Maia down. He has to avoid the sweeps. If he can, Askren has good enough submission awareness and top control to where I can see him coasting to a decision victory over Maia. Now if he gets taken down or swept by Maia, that's where it get's really dangerous for him. Cuz where Maia is really good is when he's on top and even better when he takes your back. Maia has become more of a strangler as of late, a master of the rear naked choke. His whole game now revolves around finding way's to take your back and if he can get Askren's back, it may be over. And then even if he can't get the rnc, he's so good at maintaining back mount, that you may be trapped there for the whole round.

[ZHunter1990]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

I think Stylistically, this is a terrible matchup for Maia.

Maia is a legend, but he's aging. He is 41 years old, and his conditioning has never been his strong point. Where as Askren has great cardio and is pretty damn durable.

I think its a good fight for 1 round. After that I see Maia gassing and Askren getting stronger. Askren has very good awareness of submissions and his BJJ is good as well. It will be hard for Maia to catch him.

[WarMMA]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

I think Stylistically, this is a terrible matchup for Maia.

Maia is a legend, but he's aging. He is 41 years old, and his conditioning has never been his strong point. Where as Askren has great cardio and is pretty damn durable.

I think its a good fight for 1 round. After that I see Maia gassing and Askren getting stronger. Askren has very good awareness of submissions and his BJJ is good as well. It will be hard for Maia to catch him.

Yh good point...Maia has about 2 rounds max in him before he starts gassing. I feel as long as Maia doesn't get Ben's back, it's pretty much Ben's fight to win though. Maia's effective when he can get on top and get to the back mount with body triangle. If he can't take Ben down or he can't sweep him from bottom, I see Ben taking it.

[ZHunter1990]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

I think Stylistically, this is a terrible matchup for Maia.

Maia is a legend, but he's aging. He is 41 years old, and his conditioning has never been his strong point. Where as Askren has great cardio and is pretty damn durable.

I think its a good fight for 1 round. After that I see Maia gassing and Askren getting stronger. Askren has very good awareness of submissions and his BJJ is good as well. It will be hard for Maia to catch him.

This post didnt age well...

[1212headkick]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

You can wrestle and take someone down all you want but if you got nothing on the guy your in the mat with you get what you deserve. Wrestlers need more than wrestling to be effective. You can put someone on their back but against someone like Tony maia nate or Gilbert its best to proceed with caution.

[WarMMA]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

This post didnt age well...

Lol yh. Well like I said in my previous post, Maia's a dangerous sweep threat from his back. Ben got on top, but he couldn't avoid the sweeps and on top of that, Maia got his back. You absolutely cannot let Maia take your back. Once Maia gets your back, 9 times outta 10 its gonna be over. It's rare guys survive Maia's back mount with body triangle.

[MacGowan]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

This post didnt age well...

Been there, brotha. I had Askren by decision. I think both fighters have a specialised style that does not age well.

[rabbitfistssaipailo]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

Lol yh. Well like I said in my previous post, Maia's a dangerous sweep threat from his back. Ben got on top, but he couldn't avoid the sweeps and on top of that, Maia got his back. You absolutely cannot let Maia take your back. Once Maia gets your back, 9 times outta 10 its gonna be over. It's rare guys survive Maia's back mount with body triangle.

Masvidal did this for 3 rounds defending for the better part of three rounds and still lost .

Butterfly guard is a must . The more accomplished grapplers for the better part are all missing their key techniques which they use to deal GNP or submit their opponents. These techniques have to be implemented in the game.

Maia cannot bag pack , no butterfly guard

Khabib cannot wrap his legs around yours in that leg lock thing he does to stifle movement and advance to positions where he can hit you .

I pray these things are there in UFC 4 .

Sent from my Infinix X604 using Operation Sports mobile app

[rabbitfistssaipailo]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

Hand fighting , ability to grab your opponent's wrists , holding on to limbs , these should all be implemented in the ground game .





Sent from my Infinix X604 using Operation Sports mobile app

[TGOne]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

Masvidal did this for 3 rounds defending for the better part of three rounds and still lost .

Butterfly guard is a must . The more accomplished grapplers for the better part are all missing their key techniques which they use to deal GNP or submit their opponents. These techniques have to be implemented in the game.

Maia cannot bag pack , no butterfly guard

Khabib cannot wrap his legs around yours in that leg lock thing he does to stifle movement and advance to positions where he can hit you .

I pray these things are there in UFC 4 .

Sent from my Infinix X604 using Operation Sports mobile app

I have a funny story to tell you. Some while back in this forum, i asked the game developer Geoff Harrower why simple techniques such as butterfly guard, back body triangle, or on guard etc wasn't in the game before the release when the reveal about the ground game came out.

His excuse was that techniques like butterfly guard didn't happen frequently, hence why they had to prioritize. I said during Mousasi-Weidman fight, Mousasi used that technique frequently and gave him tons of other examples aswell.

Then he responded that it's mostly a budget issue, and can't mocap these techniques. Then all of the sudden, a trailer 2 weeks before the initial release, they had already implemented Demetrious Johnsons armbar suplex which he only used once, and used it in a UFC event against Ray Borg like three months before the game got gold. Now what should i make of this? You tell me .

Even years prior to that, the game developer Geoff himself made a thread in this forum months before the release of UFC 2 on what grappling positions and submissions people wish to be included in the game. People listed every position you could imagine which included "bag pack" or hanging back mount with the leg hooks in, butterfly guard, buttefly hook sweep, back body triangle and on guard, gift wrap, 50/50 guard, back crucifix, tons of ground positions against the cage, clinch grappling and against the cage etc etc, you name it. It ended up developers not implementing the major positions in the list, barely 1% of the entire list in UFC 2, people taught maybe it was a budget issue and a majority will be included in UFC 3, but nope, NOTHING, instead they ended up prioritising the striking.

Now it's time they are doing it for this upcoming iteration, revamping the grappling, if not (again), i'll sure are moving on from this franchise and not looking back as long as it's EA on the throne.

[rabbitfistssaipailo]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

@TG one , understand your frustration brother but let's give them a chance .

The devs are good guys . They have to work with what their superiors give them.

All I want is news on the development of the game .

Sent from my Infinix X604 using Operation Sports mobile app

[1212headkick]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

I wont be surprised if we only get .2 percent t of what we asked for and that the ground game will be near identical and we only get clinch motion

[rabbitfistssaipailo]

Re: Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

I wont be surprised if we only get .2 percent t of what we asked for and that the ground game will be near identical and we only get clinch motion

Hmmm ...

Sent from my Infinix X604 using Operation Sports mobile app

[TheGentlemanGhost]

Wrestling and Jiu Jitsu need to be differentiated better ON THE MAT

And for the love of god, can an MMA game please make sweeps and reversals that take a few stages to complete instead of just one easy flick or push of a button? Just look at how Maia did it to Askren. It takes multiple stages to pull of a sweep which I don’t see being too difficult to implement into a video game.

I have no idea why all these MMA games make sweeps so effortless when it’s very difficult and not extremely frequent irl.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports