UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

[Wet Bandit]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

Have you watched his fights since then? Explain to me where he has NOT dramatically improved.

His striking, wrestling, strength, athleticism, and conditioning did not dramatically improve in those three years.

I think you're severely underestimating the GSP of three years ago. He outwrestled good to great wrestlers in Trigg, Sherk, and Hughes. He used his very good striking to pick apart Sherk and in his two fights against Hughes around that time. And he's been an athletic phenom ever since he debuted.

The only areas I think you can make a good case for GSP dramatically improving are his mentality and his jiu-jitsu. But that hasn't made him a dramatically better fighter. He's still the same guy dominating people with very good kickboxing and outstanding wrestling, strength, and conditioning.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

Finally some valid discussion...

[MC Fatigue]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

His striking, wrestling, strength, athleticism, and conditioning did not dramatically improve in those three years.

I think you're severely underestimating the GSP of three years ago. He outwrestled good to great wrestlers in Trigg, Sherk, and Hughes. He used his very good striking to pick apart Sherk and in his two fights against Hughes around that time. And he's been an athletic phenom ever since he debuted.

The only areas I think you can make a good case for GSP dramatically improving are his mentality and his jiu-jitsu. But that hasn't made him a dramatically better fighter. He's still the same guy dominating people with very good kickboxing and outstanding wrestling, strength, and conditioning.

I think his last fight against Penn compared to his first is proof enough of his evolution as a fighter; the first fight was a battle of two very evenly matched fighters, the second was a complete annihilation and domination. GSP PROVED he's evolved greatly since their last fight.

[DTX3]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

As for the overrated; I know the difference between overrated and unmotivated. What it seems like here too is that people seem to think I said he's not skilled; and I never said that. The best fighters in the world can be overrated. It doesn't mean they're not great, it just means people have it in their head that they're better than they are. He was put in the cage with a man he didn't belong in there with. He dropped to 155, beat up a Pulver who was on the decline already...

Then he puts on a great performance against Sherk for sure, but the guy for some reason went completely one dimensional (and for some reason has it in his head that's some golden glove boxer)... Then chokes out Stevenson.

Definitely some good opponents for sure - but a guy who came in on the decline (Pulver), and one with a poor gameplan (Sherk). Stevenson is a great opponent, he was just completely outclassed.

Then suddenly with 3 LW victories under his belt, he somehow is right up GSP's level? People actually thought he belonged in the ring with the guy?

The guy is phenominal, but he's nowhere near GSP's level - and putting him in there with him puts him in the overrated category... As if there weren't already a few more Welterweights who deserved their shot before Penn did...

I've never seen anyone defend their title once, and then suddenly get a shot at another man's title... that's overrated to me - people seemed to think he deserved a shot at something he did not. He was not the #1 WW contender; and I know he could blow through quite a few WW's, but there are several guys stills above him in that division that he should have fought first to earn his shot.

He's an amazing fighter, and I'll tell you right now that I don't think Florian is going to win (I think Sanchez will probably get a shot next, and he'll do the job). So for the man-crush, yeah - I LOVE Florian. He's my absolute favorite fighter - and I think he's got a chance, but I don't actually think he's going to win. But regardless of that - if someone wants to ask me a question, they can do so without talking down to me or acting like I'm an idiot (which is why I will not directly answer the guy... If he wants to talk, talk like an adult and I'll talk back).

However, I think people have it in their head that Penn is better than he really is; and I think Sanchez is going to come in and show that.

I do agree with you that BJ Penn is nowhere near the level GSP is at. GSP is in a league of his own right now along with Fedor and Anderson Silva. Did Penn deserve to get his rematch against GSP so quickly? No, but Chef was spot on.

Yeah, Penn didnt deserve a fight with GSP after their close decision the first time they fought. UFC is in the money making business and a super fight between two guys who fought to a tough decision the first time would sell more tickets then throwing Penn back in there with another LW who really wasnt going to pose any threat to Penn anyways. Somehow Penn is overrated because of this? Well atleast you finally answered the question, even though I find your answer completely ridiculous.

Not to mention BJ kept bitching and moaning about getting the fight. Is BJ overrated? Compared to GSP, definitely. But I have yet to see anyone here make BJ out to be better than he really is. Honestly, is it really fair to even compare BJ(or anyone else really) to GSP? He dominated Matt Serra, Jon Fitch, BJ and the guy who I thought would actually make a fight outta GSP in Thiago Alves. The man couldn't do ANYTHING against Pierre.

If anyone thinks that todays GSP isn't better than 2006 GSP, than you're just fooling yourself.

One thing is for sure though, if KenFlo doesn't get the job done, Diego Sanchez will.

[MC Fatigue]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

One thing is for sure though, if KenFlo doesn't get the job done, Diego Sanchez will.

Which is what I think will happen. I don't think Kenny will beat him, but I think Sanchez with his win over Guida possibly locked up a title shot next, or at least a #1 contender fight; and I think he'll do the job against Penn.

[DTX3]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

Which is what I think will happen. I don't think Kenny will beat him, but I think Sanchez with his win over Guida possibly locked up a title shot next, or at least a #1 contender fight; and I think he'll do the job against Penn.

I don't like the idea, but if Tyson wins over Hermes, we'll probably see Sanchez-Griffin in a #1 contender fight. Even if Tyson does win, I don't think he deserves a #1 contender fight. Sanchez imo is clearly the #1 contender.

[Wet Bandit]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

If anyone thinks that todays GSP isn't better than 2006 GSP, than you're just fooling yourself.

I hope that's not implied towards me, because that would odd, but I just can't imagine you saying something like this without you horribly misinterpreting the conversation me and Timmay had.

[Wet Bandit]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

I think his last fight against Penn compared to his first is proof enough of his evolution as a fighter; the first fight was a battle of two very evenly matched fighters, the second was a complete annihilation and domination. GSP PROVED he's evolved greatly since their last fight.

I don't totally agree, but I think it's moving too much into nuance that it too open for misinterpretation, so I don't really want to press the point.

Regardless, I still don't think you've got much to stand on saying Penn is overrated. The consensus now seems to be that Penn is great, but not super elite. Just looking at the betting lines, the line on Anderson Silva is 50% higher than Penn's despite the fact that Silva is facing a much more accomplished fighter.

[goh]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

Penn rarely gets cut...no?

I hope he loses though...

I expect him to get on top of him and throw elbows,that should mess him up good.

[feeq14]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

I think penn survives. To me Florian is basically penn without the striking, though I love Florians persona. Either way neither of them are going to survive Sanches when he gets his shot rightfully at the next big fight. I dont think he should have to take another fight without a tittle shot, I havent follwed the UFc as closely as I do now in the last few years, but I dont even know how Florian got a shot before Sanches...

[Jukeman]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

Awww flux!!!

Are their still tickets being sold for this and how much they run?

Everytime I go to Vegas, I miss UFC cant miss this in philly

[TwelveozPlaya21]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

The 2 main bouts are like the most lob sided fights, I love Forrest but Anderson Silva is ahead of him in every way you put it, n BJ Penn is just on a different level. I will enjoy it though it's my first ufc card live and I am a huge Anderson Silva fan.

[DueceDiggla]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

Why are so many people saying Sanchez will beat Penn when Penn just destroyed Sherk who is similar, if not better then Diego?

IMO, Kenny, BJ, Sherk and Edgar all beat Diego at LW. Diego vs. Edgar would be close because I think Diego is much bigger, but lets not fool ourselves here. Diego isn't suddenly a world beater because he dropped a weight class. I think BJ will have a much harder time against Kenny (though I think BJ will win) then he would against Diego.

[XFactah416]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

Why are so many people saying Sanchez will beat Penn when Penn just destroyed Sherk who is similar, if not better then Diego?

IMO, Kenny, BJ, Sherk and Edgar all beat Diego at LW. Diego vs. Edgar would be close because I think Diego is much bigger, but lets not fool ourselves here. Diego isn't suddenly a world beater because he dropped a weight class. I think BJ will have a much harder time against Kenny (though I think BJ will win) then he would against Diego.

Sanchez isn't similar to Sherk style-wise.

Sherk's wrestling is way better then Diego, and while his boxing is decent, he has no reach. Those short limbs of Sherk do nothing for him against BJ, which led to him being jabbed in the face all night.

Sanchez has better striking (as well as more varied) and much, much better BJJ then Sherk. Diego's opening round flurry against Clay Guida was nothing short of amazing. I don't think there's too many LWs in the world who could survive that storm.

(I think Gray Maynard beats Diego though. I would take Diego over Sherk, because Sherk likes to box now and not wrestle. I think Edgar could win a decision over Diego, but I think that'd be a 50/50 fight. KenFlo would be 50/50 too, but I think I would take Diego in that fight. However, yeah, I would definitely take BJ over Diego *actually, I'd take BJ over any 155er on the planet*)

[TwelveozPlaya21]

Re: UFC 101: Declaration - August 8th in Philadelphia

I really am starting to get on the forrest train for this fight vs Anderson Silva, I am a huge Silva fan. I just think everyone is not giving Forrest a chance in this fight, and Silva has been known in the past to not finish fights, Forrest could pull something out of his bag of tricks and pull it out.