RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

[PVarck31]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

I said the comparison doesn't make sense. Lol you can do what you want.


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You pretty much said you should just not watch if you don't like a shows writing did you not? I think the comparison is valid. Wrestling is sports entertainment. I enjoy the in-ring action and would also like it to make more sense when it comes to the story behind that in-ring action. So criticizing the writing is directly related to the "sports" part of the show. Which makes it fair game.

[Jukeman]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

You pretty much said you should just not watch if you don't like a shows writing did you not? I think the comparison is valid. Wrestling is sports entertainment. I enjoy the in-ring action and would also like it to make more sense when it comes to the story behind that in-ring action. So criticizing the writing is directly related to the "sports" part of the show. Which makes it fair game.

I criticize the writing as much as anyone (maybe not here) but tuning in every week to trash everything they do is different from constructive criticism or opinions maybe you don't fit into that category but I think that is what the OP of the topic was targeting.


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[PVarck31]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

I said the comparison doesn't make sense. Lol you can do what you want.

Fans complaining and supporting a sports teams results in personal getting fired.

Fans complaining about a tv show while supporting it results in nothing happening.


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Disagree with the bold.

I think WWE bringing in guys like Balor, Itami, Crews, AJ Styles, Nakamura, Aries, and so forth is a direct result of the IWC and their tastes. WWE listened to and is listening to their fans more than ever at this point to try to improve the product. That's not to say they are doing everything the fans want. ie Bryan, and Reigns. But there has been a paradigm shift in WWE over the last couple years and a lot of it directly related to the fans.

[PVarck31]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

I criticize the writing as much as anyone (maybe not here) but tuning in every week to trash everything they do is different from constructive criticism or opinions maybe you don't fit into that category but I think that is what the OP of the topic was targeting.


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Okay, well now we are talking two different things. I agree that if you do nothing but trash it and literally hate everything they do, then yeah, you should probably find something else to watch.

[Jukeman]

RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

Disagree with the bold.



I think WWE bringing in guys like Balor, Itami, Crews, AJ Styles, Nakamura, Aries, and so forth is a direct result of the IWC and their tastes. WWE listened to and is listening to their fans more than ever at this point to try to improve the product. That's not to say they are doing everything the fans want. ie Bryan, and Reigns. But there has been a paradigm shift in WWE over the last couple years and a lot of it directly related to the fans.

The in ring action has been good for awhile now. I don't think anyone of those guys (maybe outside of Aries) actually enhance what WWE is having problems with. Its not like the roster is filled with guys who can't wrestle.

Don't give the IWC that much credit. Those guys are the top players not signed by WWE and with TNA doing so bad those top stars would have eventually found their way to NXT. I think its HHH's vision more so than WWE trying to cater to a certain voice. If that was the case WWE would be booked like NXT.


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[PVarck31]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

The in ring action has been good for awhile now. I don't think anyone of those guys (maybe outside of Aries) actually enhance what WWE is having problems with. Its not like the roster is filled with guys who can't wrestle.

Don't give the IWC that much credit. Those guys are the top players not signed by WWE and with TNA doing so bad those top stars would have eventually found their way to NXT. I think its HHH's vision more so than WWE trying to cater to a certain voice. If that was the case WWE would be booked like NXT.


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Those guys definitely deserve to be there, but they are definitely not McMahon's prototypes. I'm sure you're right about a lot of it being Triple H's thing, but Vince still hires everyone. I think he has caved a lot to what the fans want. These guys are the future of WWE so he obviously is on board with Triple H's vision and I feel like H is way more in touch with the fans than Vince.

[PeoplesChampGB]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

The in ring action has been good for awhile now. I don't think anyone of those guys (maybe outside of Aries) actually enhance what WWE is having problems with. Its not like the roster is filled with guys who can't wrestle.

Don't give the IWC that much credit. Those guys are the top players not signed by WWE and with TNA doing so bad those top stars would have eventually found their way to NXT. I think its HHH's vision more so than WWE trying to cater to a certain voice. If that was the case WWE would be booked like NXT.


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Disagree strongly with that point.

Finishers aren't sacred anymore. Matches are too predictable in regards to calling spots. WWE doesn't build the majority of the roster by wins and losses. Pretty much you win a match then you have to lose a match.

And you should give the IWC a lot more credit. WM 30 was probably the greatest writing we have had in the past few years and it was directly because of the IWC. Same with Punk before that.

I said the comparison doesn't make sense. Lol you can do what you want.

Fans complaining and supporting a sports teams results in personal getting fired.

Fans complaining about a tv show while supporting it results in nothing happening.


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So just because we complain about the writing and no writers get fired.......we should not complain about the writing? That's what I took from that.

[Jukeman]

RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

Disagree strongly with that point.

Finishers aren't sacred anymore. Matches are too predictable in regards to calling spots. WWE doesn't build the majority of the roster by wins and losses. Pretty much you win a match then you have to lose a match.

And you should give the IWC a lot more credit. WM 30 was probably the greatest writing we have had in the past few years and it was directly because of the IWC. Same with Punk before that.



So just because we complain about the writing and no writers get fired.......we should not complain about the writing? That's what I took from that.

On your first point, that would be booking. Not really in ring talent and their abilities although psychology does seem to be a lost but thats a industry problem.

DB has been built up as an underdog for years I highly doubt the fans moaning was the result of WM, if that was the case please explain the decision to quickly eliminate him in the rumble. I hope your answer is the injury as that would make more sense than anything else.

No, I am saying if you hate something then why support it? Nothing will change by you hating a product that you support. There are other companies who need support to grow and maybe take on WWE one day. Attitude era would not happen without the massive popularity of ecw...

Guys get freaking brad maddox trending ww for hours because people were complaining about evil wwe firing him yet guys like Jay Lethal barely trend anytime there is a ROH show.


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[StevenSD]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

DB has been built up as an underdog for years I highly doubt the fans moaning was the result of WM, if that was the case please explain the decision to quickly eliminate him in the rumble. I hope your answer is the injury as that would make more sense than anything else.

DB wasn't in the Rumble that year, and that resulted in Rey Mysterio getting boo'd and the rest of the match being crapped on by the fans. Punk quit soon after, he was set to have a feud with Triple H at WM, with Batista and Orton as the main event. Punk quitting but WWE in a bind because HHH had no one, DB was the only one to make sense because of the Authority angle the summer and fall leading up. Even in Bryan's book, he said he was originally supposed to face Shameus at WM 30 until Punk quit and they had to re-write everything.

NOW, if you're talking about last years Rumble, it's pretty obvious why they eliminated him early on, it was a hope and prayer to get the heat over with of him not winning before Reigns eventually won.

That's two years in a row where the fans directly effected WWE's booking, one year they had no choice but to give in the obvious better story, the next they refused to give in and tried to protect the result they wanted KNOWING the fans would crap on it.

[PeoplesChampGB]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

On your first point, that would be booking. Not really in ring talent and their abilities although psychology does seem to be a lost but thats a industry problem.

DB has been built up as an underdog for years I highly doubt the fans moaning was the result of WM, if that was the case please explain the decision to quickly eliminate him in the rumble. I hope your answer is the injury as that would make more sense than anything else.

No, I am saying if you hate something then why support it? Nothing will change by you hating a product that you support. There are other companies who need support to grow and maybe take on WWE one day. Attitude era would not happen without the massive popularity of ecw...

Guys get freaking brad maddox trending ww for hours because people were complaining about evil wwe firing him yet guys like Jay Lethal barely trend anytime there is a ROH show.


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So because I hate the writing (one thing, follow me on this) I should not support it?

You might as well tell Brown's fans to not support the Browns because they hate the way Johnny Manziel acts or the General Manager making bust decisions every year or the owner firing a head coach every other year.

Fans have seen the Browns better. Fans have seen WWE better. Fans hope that their voice gets heard and it helps the Browns or WWE. Nobody wants to see mediocrity.

[Jukeman]

RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

DB wasn't in the Rumble that year, and that resulted in Rey Mysterio getting boo'd and the rest of the match being crapped on by the fans. Punk quit soon after, he was set to have a feud with Triple H at WM, with Batista and Orton as the main event. Punk quitting but WWE in a bind because HHH had no one, DB was the only one to make sense because of the Authority angle the summer and fall leading up. Even in Bryan's book, he said he was originally supposed to face Shameus at WM 30 until Punk quit and they had to re-write everything.

NOW, if you're talking about last years Rumble, it's pretty obvious why they eliminated him early on, it was a hope and prayer to get the heat over with of him not winning before Reigns eventually won.

That's two years in a row where the fans directly effected WWE's booking, one year they had no choice but to give in the obvious better story, the next they refused to give in and tried to protect the result they wanted KNOWING the fans would crap on it.

As you said they had to do some change up. Don't confuse crowd reaction to people at these events to keyboard warriors on internet wrestling forums who trashed everything that doesn't involve DB. DB was getting louder pop than CM Punk at this point in time and with Punk quitting they played into DB's underdog story and his reaction and enhanced the Main event which was not getting a reaction from the crowd.

(As much as the Internet give Reigns flack he's actually getting reaction from the crowd lol.)

They did not get rid of the HHH feud and place DB straight into the ME. The storyline went on with some alternative writing and the stipulation of the match and the feud with the auditory gave the match with HHH at mania probably more heat than the Punk match would have gotten. It's not like DB hasn't been doing double duty before.

If arguably their second best star didn't quit do you think they would have erased DB vs Shemus despite the crowd reactions? This is the same company you claimed try to suppress the heat off of reigns with the fast elimination of DB.



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[Bard]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

I criticize the writing as much as anyone (maybe not here) but tuning in every week to trash everything they do is different from constructive criticism or opinions maybe you don't fit into that category but I think that is what the OP of the topic was targeting.


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This is exactly what I was getting at, should have worded exactly like this...but at least discussion happened.

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[PeoplesChampGB]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

This is exactly what I was getting at, should have worded exactly like this...but at least discussion happened.

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Thing is nobody does that here. Nobody goes around saying "Roman Reigns sucks. Dudley Boyz suck. Ambrose/Owens, they suck. New Day sucks. Dolph Ziggler and Daniel Bryan suck."

Usually posters are partial to their guys and that's about it.

But I compare it to "Man, the Browns should've went with Quarterback A instead of Quarterback B in the draft" or "If I was the GM of the Browns, I would've done the draft this way."

[cima]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

This is one of the stranger debates I've seen on here before. There's absolutely nothing wrong with criticizing WWE and still watching it. Obviously it's still watched by said person because he did genuinely enjoy it at one point and WANTS to enjoy it again and still. You can't really decide for yourself if something is good unless you actually watch it.

WWE is garbage right now and extremely uninteresting. But I still subscribe to WWE Network and watch archive footage when I have time because I have enjoyed WWE/WWF/WCW in the past. I want WWE to be interesting again and actually enjoy it. With the way the writing has been since 2014 though, it's been extremely difficult. Rollins was a boring champion, Sheamus was LOL, and Reigns is even worse. Midcard has no direction and hasn't mattered save for Cena's open challenge run. Divas are still boring. The scripted promos are still awful and holding the talent back. Etc etc, there's nothing new that hasn't been said 1000x already.

[dubcity]

Re: RAW 1/18/16: The Highlight Reel

This is one of the stranger debates I've seen on here before. There's absolutely nothing wrong with criticizing WWE and still watching it. Obviously it's still watched by said person because he did genuinely enjoy it at one point and WANTS to enjoy it again and still. You can't really decide for yourself if something is good unless you actually watch it.

In fairness, I could see how people who enjoy the product would be annoyed when following along with these threads while watching Raw and reading 90%, "man, this segment is garbage ... I'm so tired of this crap ... what a predictable match ... well that was stupid," etc etc.

It's one of the reasons I stopped doing the live reax in this Raw threads, because I felt like I was being nothing but bitchy and negative. I mean, I think 99% of the complaints were/are dead-on, but personally I've just given up and stopped watching Raw altogether lol.