Run/Pass commit under threat

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  • ggsimmonds
    Hall Of Fame
    • Jan 2009
    • 11235

    #61
    Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

    Originally posted by raypace1
    They shouldn't be relying on us or even talking our thoughts into consideration in what's realistic or sim anyways... Realism and simulation have nothing to do with opinion or feelings.... Its straight up FACT and SCIENCE... we can't pick and choose what's realistic and what's not...


    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    Please tell me more of this science

    Comment

    • raypace1
      Banned
      • Aug 2017
      • 256

      #62
      Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

      Originally posted by brza37
      So what do FACT and SCIENCE say about Run/Pass Commit?


      That it doesn't exist in real football [emoji458]


      Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

      Comment

      • raypace1
        Banned
        • Aug 2017
        • 256

        #63
        Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

        Originally posted by timhere1970
        Except they have to sale the game. Sales drive decisions more than facts and science.


        True, the game sold just fine in 06 07 and they didn't need any input from us..


        Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

        Comment

        • GameBreaker35
          Rookie
          • May 2012
          • 382

          #64
          Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

          Alabama Crimson Tide | Jacksonville Jaguars

          Comment

          • timhere1970
            MVP
            • Sep 2013
            • 1810

            #65
            Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

            Originally posted by raypace1
            True, the game sold just fine in 06 07 and they didn't need any input from us..


            Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

            Of course they had input from customers back then. That is just silly.

            Comment

            • raypace1
              Banned
              • Aug 2017
              • 256

              #66
              Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

              Originally posted by GameBreaker35






              Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

              Comment

              • raypace1
                Banned
                • Aug 2017
                • 256

                #67
                Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

                Originally posted by ggsimmonds
                Please tell me more of this science


                Well, everyone seems to think that each person has a different ideas of what is sim and what is real... There is only one true simulation and that is to replicate what happens in the real world, and there is only one real world and it is not based on or open to interpretation... It is fact, pure fact that run/pass commit is just not used in the nfl period... That is not an opinion, it is real life...


                Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

                Comment

                • ggsimmonds
                  Hall Of Fame
                  • Jan 2009
                  • 11235

                  #68
                  Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

                  Originally posted by raypace1
                  Well, everyone seems to think that each person has a different ideas of what is sim and what is real... There is only one true simulation and that is to replicate what happens in the real world, and there is only one real world and it is not based on or open to interpretation... It is fact, pure fact that run/pass commit is just not used in the nfl period... That is not an opinion, it is real life...


                  Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
                  I ask about science and you give me philosophy

                  Comment

                  • raypace1
                    Banned
                    • Aug 2017
                    • 256

                    #69
                    Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

                    Originally posted by ggsimmonds
                    I ask about science and you give me philosophy


                    I am not a scientist or a philosopher lol


                    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

                    Comment

                    • dsk1317
                      Rookie
                      • Jun 2013
                      • 204

                      #70
                      Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

                      There's no such thing as Run/Pass Commit, it only exist in the world of video game. Players have run pass keys, high hat/low hat -- just google it. It's as realistic as defensive hot routes, and if you didn't know, there's no such thing as a defensive hot route. In real football, there are coverage checks. For example, if a team calls cover 1 or cover 4, and the offense aligns in a bunch, 3×1 formation, most teams auto check to one of the following. The box call: A box call will put 4 over 3 (that means 4 defensive players covering 3 compressed WR's), and this allows one of the 4 defensive players to potentially make a play. Another check versus a bunch set, is have the point man, the #2 WR, locked in man coverage by one of the DB's. The two remaining DB's will banjo #1 and #3. That means they do not know before the snap which WR they will have man to man, because it's based off the releases of #1 & #3. Both of these coverage checks are made to prevent rub routes from working. We need these, not gimmicks such as run/pass commit and defensive hot routes.

                      Sent from my XT1080 using Operation Sports mobile app

                      Comment

                      • HeelGreenRanger
                        Rookie
                        • Sep 2017
                        • 34

                        #71
                        Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

                        Originally posted by dsk1317
                        There's no such thing as Run/Pass Commit, it only exist in the world of video game. Players have run pass keys, high hat/low hat -- just google it. It's as realistic as defensive hot routes, and if you didn't know, there's no such thing as a defensive hot route. In real football, there are coverage checks. For example, if a team calls cover 1 or cover 4, and the offense aligns in a bunch, 3×1 formation, most teams auto check to one of the following. The box call: A box call will put 4 over 3 (that means 4 defensive players covering 3 compressed WR's), and this allows one of the 4 defensive players to potentially make a play. Another check versus a bunch set, is have the point man, the #2 WR, locked in man coverage by one of the DB's. The two remaining DB's will banjo #1 and #3. That means they do not know before the snap which WR they will have man to man, because it's based off the releases of #1 & #3. Both of these coverage checks are made to prevent rub routes from working. We need these, not gimmicks such as run/pass commit and defensive hot routes.

                        Sent from my XT1080 using Operation Sports mobile app


                        And that's the kind of stuff (IMO) that we'll never see unless they make a completely separate "hardcore" type mode.

                        Because all of that stuff. And just general football stuff, is "too hard" and "not fun" to the average NFL fan that just wants to take his team to the SB in a season.

                        I'm not trying to insult that kind of person. I get it. Totally do. When I first started playing madden I'd grab the Browns and do my best to win a SB with them, but over time, on because the Browns suck, I got more into the NFL in general, and the sport of football. Went to school for coaching. Etc. (college sucks when yer old)

                        I miss things like RFAs, Holdouts, trying to convince a player not to retire. Etc.

                        But I can also see someone that just doesn't either get those things totally, or care about them.

                        Hell some fans don't even watch the draft or even the regular season..

                        I'm not asking for Duece's mock up to perfection. I'm just asking mostly for things we already had, and a bit more to make playing a CFM not a bunch of play now games in a row.

                        /rant

                        Comment

                        • timhere1970
                          MVP
                          • Sep 2013
                          • 1810

                          #72
                          Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

                          Originally posted by dsk1317
                          There's no such thing as Run/Pass Commit, it only exist in the world of video game. Players have run pass keys, high hat/low hat -- just google it. It's as realistic as defensive hot routes, and if you didn't know, there's no such thing as a defensive hot route. In real football, there are coverage checks. For example, if a team calls cover 1 or cover 4, and the offense aligns in a bunch, 3×1 formation, most teams auto check to one of the following. The box call: A box call will put 4 over 3 (that means 4 defensive players covering 3 compressed WR's), and this allows one of the 4 defensive players to potentially make a play. Another check versus a bunch set, is have the point man, the #2 WR, locked in man coverage by one of the DB's. The two remaining DB's will banjo #1 and #3. That means they do not know before the snap which WR they will have man to man, because it's based off the releases of #1 & #3. Both of these coverage checks are made to prevent rub routes from working. We need these, not gimmicks such as run/pass commit and defensive hot routes.


                          Sent from my XT1080 using Operation Sports mobile app


                          The problem is my great grandchildren will never see those things in madden so they have to give us enough simple video game mechanics/choices to keep our minds into it.

                          Comment

                          • dsk1317
                            Rookie
                            • Jun 2013
                            • 204

                            #73
                            Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

                            Originally posted by timhere1970
                            The problem is my great grandchildren will never see those things in madden so they have to give us enough simple video game mechanics/choices to keep our minds into it.
                            You may not be aware of this, but last years game did have auto checks for trips, and for 4 strong (that's a 3×1 formation, with the back aligned to the trips side). Sadly, these are nowhere to be found in this years game.
                            With that being said, no one needs to know any of this, if the game makes the auto check for you (and they are auto checks, so the game should do them automatically). People just want their defensive play they called to play correctly, they don't even need to know the why.

                            Sent from my XT1080 using Operation Sports mobile app

                            Comment

                            • dsk1317
                              Rookie
                              • Jun 2013
                              • 204

                              #74
                              Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

                              Originally posted by HeelGreenRanger
                              And that's the kind of stuff (IMO) that we'll never see unless they make a completely separate "hardcore" type mode.

                              Because all of that stuff. And just general football stuff, is "too hard" and "not fun" to the average NFL fan that just wants to take his team to the SB in a season.

                              I'm not trying to insult that kind of person. I get it. Totally do. When I first started playing madden I'd grab the Browns and do my best to win a SB with them, but over time, on because the Browns suck, I got more into the NFL in general, and the sport of football. Went to school for coaching. Etc. (college sucks when yer old)

                              I miss things like RFAs, Holdouts, trying to convince a player not to retire. Etc.

                              But I can also see someone that just doesn't either get those things totally, or care about them.

                              Hell some fans don't even watch the draft or even the regular season..

                              I'm not asking for Duece's mock up to perfection. I'm just asking mostly for things we already had, and a bit more to make playing a CFM not a bunch of play now games in a row.

                              /rant
                              Lmbo I know that awkward feeling, being "that guy," the older college guy.

                              Last years game had auto checks for trips, even trips with 4 strong. Sadly, those auto checks are nowhere to be found in this years game. Things like that, the average Madden/football fan doesn't need (or probably even cares) to know. They just want their defensive play call to work as it would in real life.

                              Man, you have me wanting to go and pick up a PS2 and a PS3. Bringing up all the stuff we used to have, not just in CFM, but in the game as a whole. I was talking to Kia, and he brought up how we used to be able to disguise coverages (and I had completely forgot about this, btw), by choosing to make it look like Man or Zone. That's wasso much better than the absurd base align.


                              Originally posted by HeelGreenRanger
                              And that's the kind of stuff (IMO) that we'll never see unless they make a completely separate "hardcore" type mode.

                              Because all of that stuff. And just general football stuff, is "too hard" and "not fun" to the average NFL fan that just wants to take his team to the SB in a season.

                              I'm not trying to insult that kind of person. I get it. Totally do. When I first started playing madden I'd grab the Browns and do my best to win a SB with them, but over time, on because the Browns suck, I got more into the NFL in general, and the sport of football. Went to school for coaching. Etc. (college sucks when yer old)

                              I miss things like RFAs, Holdouts, trying to convince a player not to retire. Etc.

                              But I can also see someone that just doesn't either get those things totally, or care about them.

                              Hell some fans don't even watch the draft or even the regular season..

                              I'm not asking for Duece's mock up to perfection. I'm just asking mostly for things we already had, and a bit more to make playing a CFM not a bunch of play now games in a row.

                              /rant

                              Sent from my XT1080 using Operation Sports mobile app

                              Comment

                              • mitsurugi_78
                                Rookie
                                • Nov 2014
                                • 134

                                #75
                                Re: Run/Pass commit under threat

                                I like the feature, I look at it as a way of telling the bad AI that we’re defending pass or run so that they don’t do the wrong thing. If a team is expecting pass regardless of the situation and the linebacker says watch for the pass first, why the hell would the LB’s bite on a play fake...that’s just stupid. Just the same for a run defense, I know they aren’t throwing, I want my guys playing downhill and not waiting or taking a step backwards before hitting their gaps.

                                I’m kind of confused as to how people think this isn’t what happens in real life, we sure did it when I played, even in high school, you don’t have to be a genius for someone to tell you hey they’re going to pass don’t bite on the play fake, but with maddens AI that’s exactly what you have to do and this is the only way I know of.

                                Also with guys just throwing bombs and aggressive catching this was needed to get the DB’s to play over the top.


                                Sent from my iPad using Operation Sports

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