Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

[TimLawNYC]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

I hate to break to you, but if EA loses this case( and I hope they do) it's likely that you'll have to wait for 2k12 . 2k11 would need to be in development right now to be released by next August.

I think a lot of us would be thrilled if 2K just ported up 2K5, polished the graphics a bit, and updated the rosters and uniforms for next year, then started working on 2K12 as something totally new.

[ZoneBlitz]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

This is getting beyond stupid. I can't believe the idiocy of some people. Learn a thing or two about economy before you start tossing words like "monopoly" around, and stop bringing stupid lawsuits that are costing perfectly good people jobs.

And for the record, this is hardly the "start", people have tried this Lord knows how many times.

Exclusive access to a privately owned intellectual property is NOT a monopoly, as the owner of the I.P. may do with its private property whatever it damn well pleases. Beyond that, the industry in question is not "NFL Based Football Games", it's Video Games.

If some psychotic judge actually ruled in this lawsuits favor, the net effect would be that anything you come up with... a script, a song, a book, anything that can, under current law, be considered your intellectual property (or trademark) would no longer be yours. Anybody would be free to come along and jack your idea.

Allow me to spell it out a bit further; The National Football League (TM) owns trademarks and IPs for 32 NFL football teams. As such, they have the legal and ethical right to allow or disallow the usage of said properties at their discretion. To say that EA has a monopoly on NFL Football games is the same thing as saying Blizzard has a monopoly on Starcraft video games. Thus, a judge rules in their favor, you've got 17 different gaming companies putting out their own version of Starcraft... a property owned by Blizzard and thus rightfully theirs to profit from... just as the NFL license belongs to the NFL to profit from, and they chose to profit off of EA.

There is no illegality here. You don't have to like the way it works, but it is the way it works, and it's the right way.

While I can't stand EA and I think they are one of the greatest obstacles to progress in sports gaming, I must regrettably admit that I agree with the principle of your analysis. If the NFL owns it, then they can decide who they give the rights too; moreover, other companies are not prevented from making football videogames.

Nonetheless, I really, really can't stand EA. They are the greatest threat to sports-gaming innovation.

[exclusivelover]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

I think a lot of us would be thrilled if 2K just ported up 2K5, polished the graphics a bit, and updated the rosters and uniforms for next year, then started working on 2K12 as something totally new.

I would pay A LOT OF MONEY for this game $120+ and I have no money.

[trotsky]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

It seems to me that the NFLPA could already strike a deal with whoever they want as they control the players likeness. Taken from the NFLPA web site:

Licensees

NFL PLAYERS provides numerous licensing and marketing services to companies interested in using the names and likenesses of NFL players. Any program utilizing six (6) or more NFL players in conjunction with consumer products, marketing, advertising or sales initiatives requires a license from NFL PLAYERS. These may include products that are sold at retail or used as promotional or premium items. The players may be depicted individually as a part of a series or collectively with other players. Some NFL PLAYERS group licensing programs utilize as few as six players and others as many as 1,800 league-wide. NFL PLAYERS works with more than 65 licensees whose products include: Trading cards (1,000+ players), Video games (1,500+ players), Apparel (1,000+ players), and Collectibles (75+ players).

I could be wrong though.....

[SoxFan01605]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

I think a lot of us would be thrilled if 2K just ported up 2K5, polished the graphics a bit, and updated the rosters and uniforms for next year, then started working on 2K12 as something totally new.

lol...it would have to be a heck of a lot of polishing. I already have updated rosters and good-enough uniforms for free. 2K5 costs .99 cents. If someone is that hard-up for it, it's easy enough to get.

I've already stated my opinion on the matter earlier, so no need to rehash. SLOYAROLE did reiterate a good point brought up earlier though, and that's likely the best (and potentially only) argument that the case can stand on. We'll see.

[SLOYAROLE]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

They did strike a deal...an exclusive deal...with EA. (see bottom right corner of the Madden cover).

It seems to me that the NFLPA could already strike a deal with whoever they want as they control the players likeness. Taken from the NFLPA web site:

Licensees

NFL PLAYERS provides numerous licensing and marketing services to companies interested in using the names and likenesses of NFL players. Any program utilizing six (6) or more NFL players in conjunction with consumer products, marketing, advertising or sales initiatives requires a license from NFL PLAYERS. These may include products that are sold at retail or used as promotional or premium items. The players may be depicted individually as a part of a series or collectively with other players. Some NFL PLAYERS group licensing programs utilize as few as six players and others as many as 1,800 league-wide. NFL PLAYERS works with more than 65 licensees whose products include: Trading cards (1,000+ players), Video games (1,500+ players), Apparel (1,000+ players), and Collectibles (75+ players).

I could be wrong though.....

[marktg30]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

Why not make Bill Belichick Football with 5 real players on the cover?

[Segagendude]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

^^^^^And they could issue that game free with every purchase of a video camera...........rotflmao!

[DickDalewood]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

***WARNING*** SKIP THIS IF YOU HAVE ADD ***WARNING***.

Fantastic post man, very well put.

[harrisonial2992]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

They did strike a deal...an exclusive deal...with EA. (see bottom right corner of the Madden cover).

Madden has a deal with NFLPA, but that doessnt mean its an exclusive one, it could be but idk.

[Ankido]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

I think a lot of people, understandably unhappy with the exclusive deal, fail to see the legal and ethical ramifications of what they're asking for.

You're asking government to strip the NFL of the right to their own trademarks. This becomes precedent. If the NFL doesn't have the right to license their trademarks as they see fit, then that's going to cross over into other areas.

Any company in the world can start marketing NFL jerseys, caps, leagues can start up using the same team names and colors, even logos. All of the sudden you totally cut off all of the NFL's secondary revenue streams because other companies can step in and do the same thing cheaper. That might sound good on the surface, but it extends to every facet of business. Tom Clancy writes a book, and 15 publishers start printing it, none of them with any obligation to pay Tom Clancy a dime for the work. Kanye West (God Forbid) puts out another album, and every record company in existence is selling that album. Blizzard finally releases Starcraft 2, then EA releases Starcraft 3, and Blizzard says screw it and releases Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas 2.

Does this sound like a fair market to you?

WOW, why are you typing? Do you realize what you're saying? Nobody is asking to sell NFL for themselves to profit. You're being ignorant and naive. The whole point is about the sports gaming community. I most certainly speak for everyone when I say we're tired of the same old crap EA continues to feed us. Yes, they're screwing up the market by publishing a video game and charging more money for extra content. I mean seriously think about it, wouldn't you want as a company to release a game with more content to keep the consumer happy? Why would you add extras and charge more money? Technically you're not spending $59.99 for a video game, you're spending a whole lot more.

I don't think you'll ever understand where we the gamers come from. It's about quality and EA fails to meet that demand. Like I said many many times for the past 4 years. I worked for this company and I know how greedy they are. I was there when the announcement was sent out in a memo and I can't begin to tell you how many EA EMPLOYEE'S were disappointed. I'd say over 50% of the employee's at EA were against it and wanted competition because they felt NFL2K was the better game. That's something you'll never understand because like I said, you're being naive and ignorant with your post. Stop acting like a fan boy and look out the box.

NOBODY WANTS NFL PRODUCTS TO SELL FOR THEMSELVES.

And btw, if the exclusive rights ended and everyone was allowed to make NFL games; I could assure you 2K is ready to step up to the plate. APF might not have been the greatest football game ever, but it sure gave madden competition for a non NFL game. They're ready and waiting my friend, it's all a matter of time.

[RaiderKtulu]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

WOW, why are you typing? Do you realize what you're saying? Nobody is asking to sell NFL for themselves to profit. You're being ignorant and naive. The whole point is about the sports gaming community. I most certainly speak for everyone when I say we're tired of the same old crap EA continues to feed us. Yes, they're screwing up the market by publishing a video game and charging more money for extra content. I mean seriously think about it, wouldn't you want as a company to release a game with more content to keep the consumer happy? Why would you add extras and charge more money? Technically you're not spending $59.99 for a video game, you're spending a whole lot more.

I don't think you'll ever understand where we the gamers come from. It's about quality and EA fails to meet that demand. Like I said many many times for the past 4 years. I worked for this company and I know how greedy they are. I was there when the announcement was sent out in a memo and I can't begin to tell you how many EA EMPLOYEE'S were disappointed. I'd say over 50% of the employee's at EA were against it and wanted competition because they felt NFL2K was the better game. That's something you'll never understand because like I said, you're being naive and ignorant with your post. Stop acting like a fan boy and look out the box.

NOBODY WANTS NFL PRODUCTS TO SELL FOR THEMSELVES.

And btw, if the exclusive rights ended and everyone was allowed to make NFL games; I could assure you 2K is ready to step up to the plate. APF might not have been the greatest football game ever, but it sure gave madden competition for a non NFL game. They're ready and waiting my friend, it's all a matter of time.

It doesn't matter WHY you want EA to lose the exclusive license. Yeah yeah, Madden isn't as good as we want it to be, 2k would be better..... whatever. You're asking them to tell the NFL that it can't control it's own property.

If you really think Madden is that horrible, why don't you lobby the NFL to kill the deal due to inferior quality? It's in the NFL's best interest that the game representing it does the best possible job, isn't it? No, let's sue EA instead.

[tmccormi]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

Just wanted to get my .02 in here and see if anyone has any answers to my questions...

- First, I'd like to ask if anyone knows exactly how much EA is paying for the deal?

- What is it in the best interest of the NFL to have an exclusive deal? Since I don't know the answer to my first question, I will pretend EA pays $20 million a year for the exclusive deal.

If I were the NFL and I know I can get EA to pay 20mil/yr for the license, why would I not just sell "the right" to use the NFL likeness to separate companies at a lower rate? The football market is huge if the right game is out there, so I would imagine the 3 companies would pony up $8 mil each, which equals to a 4 million increase in the money EA makes.

[Nintari]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

Just wanted to get my .02 in here and see if anyone has any answers to my questions...

- First, I'd like to ask if anyone knows exactly how much EA is paying for the deal?

- What is it in the best interest of the NFL to have an exclusive deal? Since I don't know the answer to my first question, I will pretend EA pays $20 million a year for the exclusive deal.

If I were the NFL and I know I can get EA to pay 20mil/yr for the license, why would I not just sell "the right" to use the NFL likeness to separate companies at a lower rate? The football market is huge if the right game is out there, so I would imagine the 3 companies would pony up $8 mil each, which equals to a 4 million increase in the money EA makes.

The NFL makes more money through this deal then they would if they went with both 2k and EA. The money EA's paying them is far greater then what they were getting before the deal.

Having said that though, EA is actually making LESS money overall because of it then they did before. They're pushing far less in the way of numbers then they use to. I think between the PS2 and Xbox Madden moved well over 7 million units. If you add in the GBA sales the number even gets bigger. If you break that down, even with the fact that the games were $50.00 back then, EA's seeing far less return on Madden now then they did then.

So why have the deal? I have no idea. For some reason, they think it's in their best interest. To me, that's *** backwards and counter productive to good business. If I were a shareholder I know this much......I'd be REALLY pissed off.

[GTheorenHobbes]

Re: Maddens legal battle starts today 09/14/2009!

So why have the deal? I have no idea. For some reason, they think it's in their best interest. To me, that's *** backwards and counter productive to good business. If I were a shareholder I know this much......I'd be REALLY pissed off.

Just my opinion, but EA HAD to overpay when they did. They saw their market share slip from a 10-1 sales advantage (Madden 03 vs. 2k3), to 5-1 (Madden 04 to 2k4), to roughly 2-1 (Madden 05 vs. 2k5), and that last year included being outsold by 2k on the XBox. If EA hadn't overpaid for the exclusive license to kill off the competition, we might not even be talking about Madden today as it could've become the next Gameday. Frankly, in my opinion, we'd have been better off if they had killed their own series, took a year off to create an entirely new, innovative and exciting gameplay engine to compete with what would've been 2k8.