Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

[Palo20]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

Manning has won the MVP 4 times. Roethlisberger has made the Pro Bowl once.

Advantage: Manning?

[z Revis]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

As for QB's, give me the the guy with the fantasy football numbers. I love that guy who keeps throwing for yards and TDs when their team has the game in hand already. Nothing like another TD throw inside the 5 or 10 late in the 3rd or 4th when up by 3 or 4 TDs. I also love me some garbage time numbers when i can get them.

Those stats look so pretty, and always tell the true story.

What exactly are you saying here? Brady and Manning get their numbers in garbage time?

[tripwire]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

Calling it a myth is silly. The Steelers have never put up huge rushing numbers, but when they need the tough yards they have always been able to get it

That's the difference and I'm not gonna go digging for examples of huge games by Steelers RBs just to say the obvious. Nothing has changed in Pittsburgh, they still win with running the football tough and great defense. The one year that Ben threw for 4000 yards and the passing game was the main focus(09) they missed the playoffs

They still try running, but NOT anywhere near as much or as successful anymore, that's my point. In the last 5 seasons, they've only had 1 season where they actually had more run attempts vs pass attempts. That was unheard of before Ben. They've struggled in short yardage for years, and that's why you'll see Ben throwing from a gun formation with trips on his right or left. They need to disguise the run more than they ever had before, and the lack of a good Oline is the main reason.

They are a 60-40 pass vs run team now, and have been for years. They're just not stupid enough to give up on the run altogether, unlike other less successful organizations.

Trying to run and being successful at it are 2 different things. The success part is a myth, the trying part is there, but not even close to what it used to be. It's Ben's offense now.

[biglen]

What exactly are you saying here? Brady and Manning get their numbers in garbage time?

I couldn't figure out where he was going with that either.

[tripwire]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

What exactly are you saying here? Brady and Manning get their numbers in garbage time?

Just having some fun with numbers

[skydog71]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

Advantage: Manning?

Yeah kinda. Comparing Roethlisberger to Manning is like comparing a guy who made the NBA All-Star game once to Wilt Chamberlain.

[z Revis]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

They still try running, but NOT anywhere near as much or as successful anymore, that's my point. In the last 5 seasons, they've only had 1 season where they actually had more run attempts vs pass attempts. That was unheard of before Ben. They've struggled in short yardage for years, and that's why you'll see Ben throwing from a gun formation with trips on his right or left. They need to disguise the run more than they ever had before, and the lack of a good Oline is the main reason.

They are a 60-40 pass vs run team now, and have been for years. They're just not stupid enough to give up on the run altogether, unlike other less successful organizations.

Trying to run and being successful at it are 2 different things. The success part is a myth, the trying part is there, but not even close to what it used to be. It's Ben's offense now.

2010

Indy: 24.6 attempts per game - 3.8 yards per carry
Pitt: 29.4 attempts per game - 4.1 yards per carry
NE: 28.4 attempts per game - 4.3 yards per carry

2009

Indy: 22.5 attempts per game - 3.5 yards per carry
Pitt: 26.8 attempts per game - 4.2 yards per carry
NE: 29.1 attempts per game - 4.1 yards per carry

2008

Indy: 23.1 attempts per game - 3.4 yards per carry
Pitt: 28.8 attempts per game - 3.7 yards per carry
NE: 32.1 attempts per game - 4.4 yards per carry

2007

Indy: 27.9 attempts per game - 3.8 yards per carry
Pitt: 31.9 attempts per game - 4.2 yards per carry
NE: 28.2 attempts per game - 4.1 yards per carry

2006

Indy: 27.4 attempts per game - 4.0 yards per carry
Pitt: 29.3 attempts per game - 4.2 yards per carry
NE: 31.2 attempts per game - 3.9 yards per carry

And I could go on. Save for 1 season, I would hardly call it a myth. I threw out Indy and NE for comparison.

Also, the Steelers averaged 29.9 passing attempts this year and 29.4 rushing attempts. 60-40 pass vs run?

[NovaStar]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

Well when the Jets played the Colts and Pats they got pressure and made both QB's look average. With an even worse o-line it would only be magnified.

You forgot the 45-3 Massacre. How avg did Brady look in that game? Or last year when with a healthier Colts team, Peyton put up 30 pts on that Jets D.

[NovaStar]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

2010

Indy: 24.6 attempts per game - 3.8 yards per carry
Pitt: 29.4 attempts per game - 4.1 yards per carry
NE: 28.4 attempts per game - 4.3 yards per carry

2009

Indy: 22.5 attempts per game - 3.5 yards per carry
Pitt: 26.8 attempts per game - 4.2 yards per carry
NE: 29.1 attempts per game - 4.1 yards per carry

2008

Indy: 23.1 attempts per game - 3.4 yards per carry
Pitt: 28.8 attempts per game - 3.7 yards per carry
NE: 32.1 attempts per game - 4.4 yards per carry

2007

Indy: 27.9 attempts per game - 3.8 yards per carry
Pitt: 31.9 attempts per game - 4.2 yards per carry
NE: 28.2 attempts per game - 4.1 yards per carry

2006

Indy: 27.4 attempts per game - 4.0 yards per carry
Pitt: 29.3 attempts per game - 4.2 yards per carry
NE: 31.2 attempts per game - 3.9 yards per carry

And I could go on. Save for 1 season, I would hardly call it a myth. I threw out Indy and NE for comparison.

Also, the Steelers averaged 29.9 passing attempts this year and 29.4 rushing attempts. 60-40 pass vs run?

Good stats, Revis.

[Buckeyes_Doc]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

Peyton Manning. I think all 3 are the best QB's in the NFL, but I've always liked Peyton Manning and how he runs the offense.

[Andrews85]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

Manning has won the MVP 4 times. Roethlisberger has made the Pro Bowl once.

Ben - 2 rings
Peyton - 1 ring

See what i did there.

[tripwire]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

2010

Indy: 24.6 attempts per game - 3.8 yards per carry
Pitt: 29.4 attempts per game - 4.1 yards per carry
NE: 28.4 attempts per game - 4.3 yards per carry

2009

Indy: 22.5 attempts per game - 3.5 yards per carry
Pitt: 26.8 attempts per game - 4.2 yards per carry
NE: 29.1 attempts per game - 4.1 yards per carry

2008

Indy: 23.1 attempts per game - 3.4 yards per carry
Pitt: 28.8 attempts per game - 3.7 yards per carry
NE: 32.1 attempts per game - 4.4 yards per carry

2007

Indy: 27.9 attempts per game - 3.8 yards per carry
Pitt: 31.9 attempts per game - 4.2 yards per carry
NE: 28.2 attempts per game - 4.1 yards per carry

2006

Indy: 27.4 attempts per game - 4.0 yards per carry
Pitt: 29.3 attempts per game - 4.2 yards per carry
NE: 31.2 attempts per game - 3.9 yards per carry

And I could go on. Save for 1 season, I would hardly call it a myth. I threw out Indy and NE for comparison.

Never would have thought you would fall into the trap of numbers. If a RB has 1 or 2 games with 20 carries for 200+ yards, it would skew his total for the season, but it wouldn't tell the whole story if he had more bad games than good ones. The OVERALL numbers are flawed in many ways. All running stats are lumped into those numbers, including reverses and QB scrambles.

A run support game is with running backs. Just to show you what i mean, Ben has played 14 games this season, and he's had 100 yard rushing support in 7 of those from his backs combined (50%). In 5 of those games, it was between 106-116, one game was 145, and the other 188. Just for comparison sake, Brady had 100 or more rushing yards from his backs in 10 of his 17 starts (59%).

There's so many examples of looking inside the true numbers, but i don't want to do all that work to find them right now. I know how good or bad the Steeler run game is, and that comes with watching every game.

Also, the Steelers averaged 29.9 passing attempts this year and 29.4 rushing attempts. 60-40 pass vs run?

I guess you didn't know Ben was suspended 4 games to start the season. During that time, they passed the ball 39.7% of the times. When Ben returned, they passed it 53.4% of the times. Last season was 55.6%. I'll correct my split to 55-45, and that's with the Steelers closing games out by running it, unlike some of the QBs who keep piling stats in games that were over at the half.

Numbers, they don't always tell the whole story.

[Andrews85]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

You forgot the 45-3 Massacre. How avg did Brady look in that game? Or last year when with a healthier Colts team, Peyton put up 30 pts on that Jets D.

That has nothing to do with my point. My point is that when you get pressure on him he folds. Obviously they didn't get the same pressure in both games.

[Andrews85]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

Right, he did some good things, but like I said, he didn't necessarily play better than Brady or Manning against the Jets in the playoffs.

Just for fun, name one player on the Colts OLine not named Saturday.

He did enough to win the game, Brady and Manning failed to do so.

And the o-line is the same with Pittsburgh, no one knows there names, maybe Pouncy.

[tripwire]

Re: Brady, P.Manning or Roethlisberger?

For me, it doesn't matter who anyone thinks is better, or their choice as QB. All of them are good/great, and they do the job their team wants them to. I've already said before that Ben isn't the best passing QB and stat guy out there, but as a football player, i wouldn't want anyone else under center for the Steelers.

I'd expect all the team's fans to support their own, especially if they're Brady, Manning, Rodgers, Brees, Rivers, Ben, etc.