Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling?

[pk500]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

My problem with the whole Sony PR/BS crap is they keep saying that they can't get the license to show damage on their cars. Total crap ask pk500.

It is total horsesh*t. The GT franchise is the biggest driving franchise in the world; Sony is the world giant in console video game entertainment. Sony and Polyphony therefore have the muscle to get damage if they wanted, as lesser tandems have been granted permission to have damage.

Fact is, for the 6,009th time, GT is not a racing game, and Sony and Polyphony don't care that it's not a racing game. It's a driving and car collecting game that sells a bazillion copies, and Sony is tickled pink with that, as it should be.

The fact is the Playstation2 can't handle a damage model.

Simply not true. How do you explain the incredible damage model in Burnout 3 for the PS2 then? Sure, it would take a lot of work to model damage for all of the cars, but Sony and Polyphony could do it if they wanted to. Fact is, they don't because the major allure of GT is graphics, and damage only would tarnish the beautiful graphics.

Don't blame the hardware; blame the publisher and developer.

I agree with your final sentiments about GT wholeheartedly, though. Without those improvements, GT is slowly but surely becoming the Tomb Raider franchise with four wheels. ZZZZZZ ....

Take care,
PK

[pk500]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

My problem with the whole Sony PR/BS crap is they keep saying that they can't get the license to show damage on their cars. Total crap ask pk500.

It is total horsesh*t. The GT franchise is the biggest driving franchise in the world; Sony is the world giant in console video game entertainment. Sony and Polyphony therefore have the muscle to get damage if they wanted, as lesser tandems have been granted permission to have damage.

Fact is, for the 6,009th time, GT is not a racing game, and Sony and Polyphony don't care that it's not a racing game. It's a driving and car collecting game that sells a bazillion copies, and Sony is tickled pink with that, as it should be.

The fact is the Playstation2 can't handle a damage model.

Simply not true. How do you explain the incredible damage model in Burnout 3 for the PS2 then? Sure, it would take a lot of work to model damage for all of the cars, but Sony and Polyphony could do it if they wanted to. Fact is, they don't because the major allure of GT is graphics, and damage only would tarnish the beautiful graphics.

Don't blame the hardware; blame the publisher and developer.

I agree with your final sentiments about GT wholeheartedly, though. Without those improvements, GT is slowly but surely becoming the Tomb Raider franchise with four wheels. ZZZZZZ ....

Take care,
PK

[pk500]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

Car companies are fickle about this issue. Some companies will, others won't. If they do agree on car damage the damage will be minimal. Why do you think Burnout 3 had to use fake cars.. They couldn't get lic cars due to extreme car damage.

Then how do you explain Microsoft and Bizarre Creations getting permission to allow damage in Project Gotham and Project Gotham Racing 2 for many of the same car companies that are in the GT series?

Stop drinking the Sony Kool-Aid, people: There's no damage in the GT series because Sony and Polyphony WANT it that way. They don't care about damage because the GT series is all about driving and car collecting, not racing. Plus damage would only tarnish the beautiful graphics work, in Sony and Polyphony's eyes.

Take care,
PK

[pk500]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

Car companies are fickle about this issue. Some companies will, others won't. If they do agree on car damage the damage will be minimal. Why do you think Burnout 3 had to use fake cars.. They couldn't get lic cars due to extreme car damage.

Then how do you explain Microsoft and Bizarre Creations getting permission to allow damage in Project Gotham and Project Gotham Racing 2 for many of the same car companies that are in the GT series?

Stop drinking the Sony Kool-Aid, people: There's no damage in the GT series because Sony and Polyphony WANT it that way. They don't care about damage because the GT series is all about driving and car collecting, not racing. Plus damage would only tarnish the beautiful graphics work, in Sony and Polyphony's eyes.

Take care,
PK

[ps2king]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

Then how do you explain Microsoft and Bizarre Creations getting permission to allow damage in Project Gotham and Project Gotham Racing 2 for many of the same car companies that are in the GT series?

Because MS pays for that kind of stuff and Sony won't.

Fact is you or nobody else knows what the PS2 is capable of, Only PD/Sony know that.

I've played enough PS2 games to know that a game like GT4 is taking all the system has to make it the way it is, if its topped by another game on the system I'd be shocked.

If the system could handle it then damage would be in. GT4 would look like every other half assed PS2 game if PD pulled off damage the way they wanted to. They wouldn't stop at car damage, they would make sure each car damged different depending on the size of the car and many other factors. When these guys do a new feature they don't just put it in the game just to have it in the game, it has to be perfect.

You say they don't care about damage, well thats totally untrue. Its something they messed around with but again could not do it correctly on the PS2. If they didn't care then why are they working right now on getting it in GT5?

This issue is so overblown its not funny, really sick of talking about it.

[ps2king]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

Then how do you explain Microsoft and Bizarre Creations getting permission to allow damage in Project Gotham and Project Gotham Racing 2 for many of the same car companies that are in the GT series?

Because MS pays for that kind of stuff and Sony won't.

Fact is you or nobody else knows what the PS2 is capable of, Only PD/Sony know that.

I've played enough PS2 games to know that a game like GT4 is taking all the system has to make it the way it is, if its topped by another game on the system I'd be shocked.

If the system could handle it then damage would be in. GT4 would look like every other half assed PS2 game if PD pulled off damage the way they wanted to. They wouldn't stop at car damage, they would make sure each car damged different depending on the size of the car and many other factors. When these guys do a new feature they don't just put it in the game just to have it in the game, it has to be perfect.

You say they don't care about damage, well thats totally untrue. Its something they messed around with but again could not do it correctly on the PS2. If they didn't care then why are they working right now on getting it in GT5?

This issue is so overblown its not funny, really sick of talking about it.

[Rodster]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

Because MS pays for that kind of stuff and Sony won't.

If the system could handle it then damage would be in. GT4 would look like every other half assed PS2 game if PD pulled off damage the way they wanted to. They wouldn't stop at car damage, they would make sure each car damged different depending on the size of the car and many other factors. When these guys do a new feature they don't just put it in the game just to have it in the game, it has to be perfect.

I agree with you there. I don't think the PS2 is capable of running the game at 60FPS lots of detail, track textures etc. Pile on a damage model and I doubt this game would run at 60FPS.

[Rodster]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

Because MS pays for that kind of stuff and Sony won't.

If the system could handle it then damage would be in. GT4 would look like every other half assed PS2 game if PD pulled off damage the way they wanted to. They wouldn't stop at car damage, they would make sure each car damged different depending on the size of the car and many other factors. When these guys do a new feature they don't just put it in the game just to have it in the game, it has to be perfect.

I agree with you there. I don't think the PS2 is capable of running the game at 60FPS lots of detail, track textures etc. Pile on a damage model and I doubt this game would run at 60FPS.

[koolbubbaice]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

Then how do you explain Microsoft and Bizarre Creations getting permission to allow damage in Project Gotham and Project Gotham Racing 2 for many of the same car companies that are in the GT series?

Stop drinking the Sony Kool-Aid, people: There's no damage in the GT series because Sony and Polyphony WANT it that way. They don't care about damage because the GT series is all about driving and car collecting, not racing. Plus damage would only tarnish the beautiful graphics work, in Sony and Polyphony's eyes.

Take care,
PK

Like I said, Most companies will allow for mininal damage to their vehicles.. I'm sure Sony would like realistic car damage, but car companies won't go for it. Why should Sony & poly add in car damage when its half arsed, like Forza & project gotham racing? If a broken windshield & dents in the bumper is realistic car damage to you then you need to stop drinking the kool aid. Car damage should be totally destroying your car if you choose too.. No car company will allow that. I doubt they ever will..

[koolbubbaice]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

Then how do you explain Microsoft and Bizarre Creations getting permission to allow damage in Project Gotham and Project Gotham Racing 2 for many of the same car companies that are in the GT series?

Stop drinking the Sony Kool-Aid, people: There's no damage in the GT series because Sony and Polyphony WANT it that way. They don't care about damage because the GT series is all about driving and car collecting, not racing. Plus damage would only tarnish the beautiful graphics work, in Sony and Polyphony's eyes.

Take care,
PK

Like I said, Most companies will allow for mininal damage to their vehicles.. I'm sure Sony would like realistic car damage, but car companies won't go for it. Why should Sony & poly add in car damage when its half arsed, like Forza & project gotham racing? If a broken windshield & dents in the bumper is realistic car damage to you then you need to stop drinking the kool aid. Car damage should be totally destroying your car if you choose too.. No car company will allow that. I doubt they ever will..

[pk500]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

If the system could handle it then damage would be in. GT4 would look like every other half assed PS2 game if PD pulled off damage the way they wanted to.

The system can handle damage. See TOCA 2, see Burnout 3, see a variety of other racing games.

They wouldn't stop at car damage, they would make sure each car damged different depending on the size of the car and many other factors. When these guys do a new feature they don't just put it in the game just to have it in the game, it has to be perfect.

You mean like the perfect racing model, in which the AI cars never leave a preset line, going nose-to-tail the entire race? You mean how you can bounce off AI cars to gain positions, sending them into the guardrail with no damage? Yep, that's perfection, all right.

You say they don't care about damage, well thats totally untrue. Its something they messed around with but again could not do it correctly on the PS2. If they didn't care then why are they working right now on getting it in GT5?

Do you have a credible source for damage being implemented in GT 5? And do you remember that damage -- not visible, but damage that affected performance -- was implemented in the arcade portion of GT 2 for the PSX, of all places? So Polyphony and Sony HAVE had damage in a GT game with tons of cars and ditched it. So they don't care about damage.

This issue is so overblown its not funny, really sick of talking about it.

Indeed. Why should a game that depicts itself as the Real Driving Simulator have damage, which happens in real life when cars collide with another car or other objects? What a f*cking silly concept!

Take care,
PK

[pk500]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

If the system could handle it then damage would be in. GT4 would look like every other half assed PS2 game if PD pulled off damage the way they wanted to.

The system can handle damage. See TOCA 2, see Burnout 3, see a variety of other racing games.

They wouldn't stop at car damage, they would make sure each car damged different depending on the size of the car and many other factors. When these guys do a new feature they don't just put it in the game just to have it in the game, it has to be perfect.

You mean like the perfect racing model, in which the AI cars never leave a preset line, going nose-to-tail the entire race? You mean how you can bounce off AI cars to gain positions, sending them into the guardrail with no damage? Yep, that's perfection, all right.

You say they don't care about damage, well thats totally untrue. Its something they messed around with but again could not do it correctly on the PS2. If they didn't care then why are they working right now on getting it in GT5?

Do you have a credible source for damage being implemented in GT 5? And do you remember that damage -- not visible, but damage that affected performance -- was implemented in the arcade portion of GT 2 for the PSX, of all places? So Polyphony and Sony HAVE had damage in a GT game with tons of cars and ditched it. So they don't care about damage.

This issue is so overblown its not funny, really sick of talking about it.

Indeed. Why should a game that depicts itself as the Real Driving Simulator have damage, which happens in real life when cars collide with another car or other objects? What a f*cking silly concept!

Take care,
PK

[pk500]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

Like I said, Most companies will allow for mininal damage to their vehicles.. I'm sure Sony would like realistic car damage, but car companies won't go for it. Why should Sony & poly add in car damage when its half arsed, like Forza & project gotham racing? If a broken windshield & dents in the bumper is realistic car damage to you then you need to stop drinking the kool aid. Car damage should be totally destroying your car if you choose too.. No car company will allow that. I doubt they ever will..

First, Forza does have damage that affects performance. It's not just cosmetic.

Second, I take it you haven't played TOCA 2 or Colin McRae Rally 2005. TOCA 2 features both fully licensed race and street vehicles that can be destroyed to a pulp. Colin McRae Rally features licensed rally cars from Ford, Peugeot, Subaru, Citroen, etc., that can be destroyed.

So your claim that you doubt car companies ever will allow complete damage is total hogwash.

Take care,
PK

[pk500]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

Like I said, Most companies will allow for mininal damage to their vehicles.. I'm sure Sony would like realistic car damage, but car companies won't go for it. Why should Sony & poly add in car damage when its half arsed, like Forza & project gotham racing? If a broken windshield & dents in the bumper is realistic car damage to you then you need to stop drinking the kool aid. Car damage should be totally destroying your car if you choose too.. No car company will allow that. I doubt they ever will..

First, Forza does have damage that affects performance. It's not just cosmetic.

Second, I take it you haven't played TOCA 2 or Colin McRae Rally 2005. TOCA 2 features both fully licensed race and street vehicles that can be destroyed to a pulp. Colin McRae Rally features licensed rally cars from Ford, Peugeot, Subaru, Citroen, etc., that can be destroyed.

So your claim that you doubt car companies ever will allow complete damage is total hogwash.

Take care,
PK

[ps2king]

Re: Why do companies use the excuse that car manufacturers don't want damage modeling

The system can handle damage. See TOCA 2, see Burnout 3, see a variety of other racing games.

Yea and how do those games look graphics wise huh? They don't even hold a candle to GT4.

Do you have a credible source for damage being implemented in GT 5?

IGN had an article on it, I would dig it up but I'm too busy playing GT4 Its there though if you want to look.

Indeed. Why should a game that depicts itself as the Real Driving Simulator have damage, which happens in real life when cars collide with another car or other objects? What a f*cking silly concept!

The game is still a blast to play. Great have your opinions on the game, I really don't care anymore man. The game is out and I'm having a blast with it, so are many others that have the game and don't look for everything little thing to complain about.

Great game so far