Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

[tdawg3782]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

People were upset with the living's battle strategy more then anything I believe. Even though we know Jon and Dany are not great tacticians by any means.

But as I said what strategy works against someone that can continuously bring back the dead. That is impossible. Not to mention an absolute morale killer.

The battle wasn't about a grand master plan. It was about surviving and holding the North by any means necessary with the known fact that most if not any would survive the night.





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I mean wasn't the battle plan to lure the NK to the Weirwood but using Bran as bait, ambush him, and then kill him with either Dragon Glass or Valyrian Steel? I mean I'm sure the plan was to have Jon Snow be the one but all in all the plan was a success lol.

[Beantown]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

I mean wasn't the battle plan to lure the NK to the Weirwood but using Bran as bait, ambush him, and then kill him with either Dragon Glass or Valyrian Steel? I mean I'm sure the plan was to have Jon Snow be the one but all in all the plan was a success lol.

Yeah, the battle plan worked perfectly. It just wasn’t what 90% of fans thought.

[TMagic]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

I can see both sides (big time GOT binger here...like seriously just watched every season and just finally caught up today lol)...

Spoiler

I get people wanting an epic confrontation between the night king and Jon. At the same time I wasn't too bothered by that not happening. From what I gathered from you guys is the night king wasn't even in the book to begin with. So that in of itself should show that he isn't even the main focus of the story. On top of that, them finally meeting one on one would have been so cliche and forced. And as we all should know, GOT does not do cliche. Lol

Then you have the issue of it being over in one episode. As others have mentioned, this story was never the main story. For the entire show its been all about the throne and the relationships surrounding it. We get the "dead" being brought up here and there throughout the seasons. Probably because they really aren't that interesting to center the story around in the first place. They're zombies that want to kill all the living and the memory of their existence...that's about it. Not all that interesting. Lol

We've had multiple episodes dedicated to them. And it's culminated in, what amounts to an entire movie, an epic battle with them. How much more time do we need given to them at this point?

The way I've seen Thrones play out this short time I've been watching is everything happens for a reason. Everything plays apart. So in this case, the dead brought Dany and John together. And the dead were seemingly used as a weapon by Cersei (the biggest threat in the entire show) to SEVERELY weaken her enemies. It doesn't bother me that that was their role in the overall story because up to that point, Cersei looked like she stood ZERO chance against Dany on her conquest. Lol. And on top of that, from a pure writing perspective, there needed to be something else going on to break up the monotony of the battle over the throne.

[kingkilla56]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

So I've been thinking. I think we're in agreement that the army at Winterfell has been decimated. They can't have many men left. So how are they going to even stand a chance marching/sailing to Kings Landing? Do you think there is a chance that somehow Dorne joins the fight. I honestly can't remember what happened last with them. I know that the wife of Oberyn killed Doran and I guess took over. Then her and the sand snakes got captured by Cersei. I don't remember if she killed them or they are still in the dungeon. Either way will Dorne become something finally or will they still just be there? They are really the only place that still has a full army that I can tell.

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I think all the lands the lannisters have screwed over for 8 seasons will form together to take cersei and them out.

Edmure in the riverlands
Little Robin in the Vale
Whatever is going on at Pike with the ironborn.
Gendry is heir to stormlands ???
Dorne...if anybody remembers dorne.
Is the Reach still a thing?



My biggest annoyance with the battle of winterfell is that nobody south of winterfell has any reason to believe what happened there.

Cersei ultimately was CORRECT to not join the battle. She actually saved many lives.

[ehh]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

Is it ok not too use spoilers now? I'll put my discussion just incase.

Interesting tidbit on the Knight King scene in the end that I read. After rewatching the scene I agree with this now.

Spoiler

Final scenes explained:

If you listen carefully... when jon jumps in front of the dragon, he is screaming "GO! GO... GO" he is screaming at arya.... the dragon is guarding the entrance to the courtyard, he distracts it.

Then, as arya learned from the faceless to be stealth, you see a whitewalkers hair lift from her running by... he looks and sees nothing.

Then she goes for the kill. YOUR WELCOME.

Jon Snow is also looking at something in front of him behind the rock, before facing the dragon, (Longclaw sheathed) which helps the theory of destraction then shouted
"GO!!!! Go, Go, Go!!"

And Jon yelled to dany "BRAANNN" so he knew what he was doing to help arya get to bran.

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How Arya does it is still ridiculous IMO. I don't care how fast she is or how sneaky she is, she's not running some 50 feet past a slew of bad guys, right in their line of sight, and making it all the way to the NK. The fact that the WW's hair blows in her breeze shows just how close she ran to the WWs. As I've said, there were better options out there to have Arya get the kill.

So I've been thinking. I think we're in agreement that the army at Winterfell has been decimated. They can't have many men left. So how are they going to even stand a chance marching/sailing to Kings Landing? Do you think there is a chance that somehow Dorne joins the fight. I honestly can't remember what happened last with them. I know that the wife of Oberyn killed Doran and I guess took over. Then her and the sand snakes got captured by Cersei. I don't remember if she killed them or they are still in the dungeon. Either way will Dorne become something finally or will they still just be there? They are really the only place that still has a full army that I can tell.

I've thought about this too. I'm curious as to how many people they get to venture south. Not to mention winter has come, dragging an exhausted army thousands of miles south in the middle of winter isn't ideal. Yara still has to reappear so maybe they'll get some ships to bring them south. Something has to give; they can't simply march south and win the battle. At least they have the element of surprise on their side.

At the same time, you have two dragons, a Faceless Man, and maybe we'll finally see Bran do something useful, though I'm not sure the 3ER cares about the political fate of the Seven Kingdoms.

The main focus has always been the Iron Throne. And I know we are in for some really special stuff these next few weeks.

There's been so much debate about this since Sunday and I think that's the main reason why the fanbase is so divided on the episode. Many people, including myself, have always felt the main conflict is about the WW and mankind's survival, not petty normal politics of the realm. If you think the main conflict of the show is the WW, you're disappointed in E3. If you think it's about the Iron Throne then you're fine with E3.

[jeremym480]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

How Arya does it is still ridiculous IMO. I don't care how fast she is or how sneaky she is, she's not running some 50 feet past a slew of bad guys, right in their line of sight, and making it all the way to the NK. The fact that the WW's hair blows in her breeze shows just how close she ran to the WWs. As I've said, there were better options out there to have Arya get the kill.



I've thought about this too. I'm curious as to how many people they get to venture south. Not to mention winter has come, dragging an exhausted army thousands of miles south in the middle of winter isn't ideal. Yara still has to reappear so maybe they'll get some ships to bring them south. Something has to give; they can't simply march south and win the battle. At least they have the element of surprise on their side.

At the same time, you have two dragons, a Faceless Man, and maybe we'll finally see Bran do something useful, though I'm not sure the 3ER cares about the political fate of the Seven Kingdoms.




There's been so much debate about this since Sunday and I think that's the main reason why the fanbase is so divided on the episode. Many people, including myself, have always felt the main conflict is about the WW and mankind's survival, not petty normal politics of the realm. If you think the main conflict of the show is the WW, you're disappointed in E3. If you think it's about the Iron Throne then you're fine with E3.

I'm hoping that it's revealed that Arya did it like this

Spoiler

With Bran's help.



FB_IMG_1556805531996.jpg


That knocks out two of yours (and mines) complaints. The first being how see got more air that Michael Jordan and the second Bran actually doing something useful and the third being the WW's never noticing her. I get that she was able to avoid the wights fairly easily but WW's should have been much more powerful and perceptive than wights.

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[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

Arya trained with the Faceless Man, right?

Then it makes some sense as to how she was able to sneak up on the Night King.

[ehh]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

Arya trained with the Faceless Man, right?

Then it makes some sense as to how she was able to sneak up on the Night King.

I guess. I just don't buy it. Sneaking through the back alleys of Braavos or through the library of Winterfell isn't like running through an outdoor open space right in front of several bad guys.

[Hiro1]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

I guess. I just don't buy it. Sneaking through the back alleys of Braavos or through the library of Winterfell isn't like running through an outdoor open space right in front of several bad guys.

This is funny because Theon did the same thing.


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[jeremym480]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

Arya trained with the Faceless Man, right?

Then it makes some sense as to how she was able to sneak up on the Night King.

Yeah, she did. I could buy her sneaking past them better than I can her jumping like 10 feet in the air. Unless, she jumped out of a window or off of a castle or tree limb or something that we didn't see. if the raven thing actually would have happened that would make me like





and I would take back any negative thing that I said or questioned about the episode.

[TMagic]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

A question I have is how are we so sure that the WW are these elite fighters?

The entire series they've been pretty much just sitting back and just letting the dead overrun their enemies. When we have seen them fight, they seem to only be winning fights because the weapons they have destroyed regular weapons. Without those weapons at their disposal, I can't recall a scene where they showed their fighting prowess. Sure, the NK hit a dragon with a spear. But that only happened once when no one was expecting it. Hes whiffed every time since.

John disposed of the few WW he's fought rather easily if we recall. Like, seriously easy. The "fights" couldn't have lasted more than 10 seconds. Even Sam... ****ing Samwell Tarly... was able to get the jump on one to kill.

Spoiler

They teased the John and NK one on one. Then NK, very smartly, says "umm. Nah." and raises the dead to deal with John. Going one on one with him, based on what we've seen would have been dumb on his part. Much smarter to have him get jumped by the dead.

The Arya kill might have been disappointing to some (not me. Shes been my favorite character this entire show. Lol) and I get that. But as others have suggested, she might have been the only one who could reasonably do it. Seems many of you are bothered that she managed to get the jump on them. But like I mentioned earlier, I can't remember exactly how the scene played out, but SAM TARLY snuck up on one and got the kill. So I have ZERO issues with Arya being able to do the same [emoji23]

But I do recognize that since I just binged it, I may just have the added benefit of never really having time (that two year break would have been BRUTAL) to sit back and read theories or build up my own expectations of what could or what I would have liked to see happen. I've just been able to sit back and take in whats being presented to me without expectation.

Edit:

Another thing to note is that one could see something was coming with Arya. Again, it might just be because it's fresh in my mind. But how many times was it brought up that "the Lord of light" has a purpose for certain characters? It's been a repeated theme throughout the show. From the first time we met dude with eye patch, he gets questioned as to why he's been brought back so many times. So when he finally dies, and it was while saving Arya, it clicked to me right then that she bound to do something great.

[jake44np]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

The main conflict of the show has always been the throne and who ends up with it, not the WW.
I mean its called Game of Thrones.

[jeremym480]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

A question I have is how are we so sure that the WW are these elite fighters?

The entire series they've been pretty much just sitting back and just letting the dead overrun their enemies. When we have seen them fight, they seem to only be winning fights because the weapons they have destroyed regular weapons. Without those weapons at their disposal, I can't recall a scene where they showed their fighting prowess. Sure, the NK hit a dragon with a spear. But that only happened once when no one was expecting it. Hes whiffed every time since.

John disposed of the few WW he's fought rather easily if we recall. Like, seriously easy. The "fights" couldn't have lasted more than 10 seconds. Even Sam... ****ing Samwell Tarly... was able to get the jump on one to kill.

Spoiler

They teased the John and NK one on one. Then NK, very smartly, says "umm. Nah." and raises the dead to deal with John. Going one on one with him, based on what we've seen would have been dumb on his part. Much smarter to have him get jumped by the dead.

The Arya kill might have been disappointing to some (not me. Shes been my favorite character this entire show. Lol) and I get that. But as others have suggested, she might have been the only one who could reasonably do it. Seems many of you are bothered that she managed to get the jump on them. But like I mentioned earlier, I can't remember exactly how the scene played out, but SAM TARLY snuck up on one and got the kill. So I have ZERO issues with Arya being able to do the same [emoji23]

But I do recognize that since I just binged it, I may just have the added benefit of never really having time (that two year break would have been BRUTAL) to sit back and read theories or build up my own expectations of what could or what I would have liked to see happen. I've just been able to sit back and take in whats being presented to me without expectation.

Edit:

Another thing to note is that one could see something was coming with Arya. Again, it might just be because it's fresh in my mind. But how many times was it brought up that "the Lord of light" has a purpose for certain characters? It's been a repeated theme throughout the show. From the first time we met dude with eye patch, he gets questioned as to why he's been brought back so many times. So when he finally dies, and it was while saving Arya, it clicked to me right then that she bound to do something great.

I've never read the books so someone can correct me if I'm wrong... I think the main difference between wights and White Walkers is that wights are basically like mindless zombies and just attack, attack, attack. Whereas, White Walkers can at least do things like block and dodge when they're fighting.

We haven't see the White Walkers fight very much at all. In Hardhome, the one Jon fought did give him a little trouble at first and iirc killed a top Wildling fighter fairly easily but Jon did end up killing him pretty quickly once they fought straight up. I don't think that there's anything to show that the WW's are anything more than average swordsman, but I still believe that they were stronger than wights. Maybe that's all in my mind just because they looked cool.

[ehh]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

The main conflict of the show has always been the throne and who ends up with it, not the WW.
I mean its called Game of Thrones.

Well, really it's a A Song of Ice and Fire. Game of Thrones, the title of the first book, just has sexier mass appeal, but it focused on the events of the first book and the beginning of the turmoil after Robert Baratheon's death. You don't name a TV show A Song of Ice and Fire.

There are many well-written reasons out there as to why the WW are the main conflict. We'll get our answer when (if) the book series ends.

[ehh]

Re: Game of Thrones: Season 8 (Final season)

I've never read the books so someone can correct me if I'm wrong... I think the main difference between wights and White Walkers is that wights are basically like mindless zombies and just attack, attack, attack. Whereas, White Walkers can at least do things like block and dodge when they're fighting.

We haven't see the White Walkers fight very much at all. In Hardhome, the one Jon fought did give him a little trouble at first and iirc killed a top Wildling fighter fairly easily but Jon did end up killing him pretty quickly once they fought straight up. I don't think that there's anything to show that the WW's are anything more than average swordsman, but I still believe that they were stronger than wights. Maybe that's all in my mind just because they looked cool.

That's correct about wights vs WW. We have seen them fight but they're nothing special. Their big, spooky thing was that they can only be killed by dragonglass or Valyerian steel, which were a rare resource (or not known) for much of the show. It's not that they can't be killed because they're such elite fighters.

Really, all they had to do was surround Winterfell with wights and wait it out, true medieval style. Wights don't need to eat, sleep, or rest and Winterfell would run out of food soon enough. The Night King waited 8,000 years for this, he could take his time for a couple of months to ensure victory.

But like most villains, their cockiness and lack of patience was their undoing.