FPS: The cover system

[TCrouch]

Re: FPS: The cover system

I think Winback and Kill Switch were the two I was thinking of (mainly Kill Switch, because I wanted to say Kill Zone, which I knew wasn't right). I like the cover system in Vegas a lot. I really like the "look" function when trying to aim in GTA IV, but it needs to be fluid. No separate button at all. Crouch down and move near something and naturally go into a cover-crouch. Move away and you'll leave cover. None of this weird camera-shifting madness that has you covered up on the wrong walls, or invulnerable, aim-all-day-and-pop-out-and-shoot-a-gnat-on-the-***-from-50-yards precision, either.

I have a feeling that, within a year or two, games will start using a fluid cover system that will just incorporate branching animations that automatically trigger if you get near a wall or ledge or corner, etc...and not require extra user input. After all, if I wanted to get up next to a wall and look around a corner, I'd just do it...not think about stopping, turning around, and putting my back against a wall. It's just an evolution, but the technology itself is still fairly new in mainstream shooters. It'll improve, but it'll take time.

[DakkoN]

Re: FPS: The cover system

Gears of War ain't a FPS though. Completely TPS.

[TCrouch]

Re: FPS: The cover system

Any cover system is pretty much TPS. That's why I kept just calling them 'shooters' instead of the hybrid stealth/shooter ones. Even R6V goes into 3rd person when going into cover. It would be a unique perspective though, staring at a concrete block and then popping up to see...more realistic, if they could do it in a true FPS perspective.

[dbeth]

Re: FPS: The cover system

actually, to do the cover system like in R6, but in "true" first-person form, you'd have to kind of be looking away from what you're covering from

Diagram: (X = bad guy, O = you)

X

|
|
|________________
O
vision

If you were in true cover, with your back to the wall, wouldn't your vision be AWAY from the baddy (or even perpendicular)? That would be EXTREMELY disorienting to try to implement in a FPS...but would be cool if it would work.

Kind of like in NFL 2k4/5 in FPF...when you would do a spin; your vision wouldn't spin, even though it should have.

[TCrouch]

Re: FPS: The cover system

Not really. If you went into cover, you'd probably be more sideways than full-on, back-facing-the-target. If anything, you'd probably be looking more sideways and downward. But if you're in an active firefight and ready to pop out, you'd just be ducked behind something, a couple feet back, I'm sure. I don't know, maybe some of our Iraq vets can shed some light on it, because the extent of my hostile zone experience was from the Combat Information Center on a Destroyer...hardly the definitive opinion on the subject.

But I know I don't think I'd stand up and do a 180 in full view of the bad guys...I'd need to just pop up long enough to fire off some rounds, not worry about turning around.

[Cebby]

Re: FPS: The cover system

lol I still don't understand what you mean TS.

Picture someone standing with his back against a wall.

\ 1 /|
..\/ |__________
.......You
......../\
....../ 2 \
.....Bad guy

Alright, the "you" character has his back against the wall.

"1" is the viewpoint that is on the screen, when it pans over to show you what's beyond the wall/cover. "2" is the viewpoint that the depiction of your character should have. However, due to "locking" on the cover system, the player is unable to aim at what should be right in front of them, and the bad guy sitting right in front of you mows you down with no resistance.

GTA IV's cover controls are very sluggish though. It's probably not a very good basis for a cover system.

That's kind of my point though. For a game like Gears that bases its entire system on cover, it works well, but when other games like GTA and Mass Effect just kind of throw it in, it creates problems.

[catcatch22]

Re: FPS: The cover system

Picture someone standing with his back against a wall.

\ 1 /|
..\/ |__________
.......You
......../\
....../ 2 \
.....Bad guy

Alright, the "you" character has his back against the wall.

"1" is the viewpoint that is on the screen, when it pans over to show you what's beyond the wall/cover. "2" is the viewpoint that the depiction of your character should have. However, due to "locking" on the cover system, the player is unable to aim at what should be right in front of them, and the bad guy sitting right in front of you mows you down with no resistance.

That's kind of my point though. For a game like Gears that bases its entire system on cover, it works well, but when other games like GTA and Mass Effect just kind of throw it in, it creates problems.

I totally agree with your assesment, I was in a fire fight in a GTA 4 mission, a "drug deal" and this was a reacurring problem. I then stopped using the cover system and just went with the "first person shooter type system" when you use free aim.

[CaptainZombie]

Re: FPS: The cover system

Killswitch I believe was the first FPS and also Perfect Dark Zero introduced it to current gen. I think these were the games.

[ExtremeGamer]

Re: FPS: The cover system

Killswitch I believe was the first FPS and also Perfect Dark Zero introduced it to current gen. I think these were the games.

Killswitch was 3rd person as well, and I loved that game. It was the first game I remember with cover in a shooter like that though.

[The C]

Re: FPS: The cover system

GTA IV's cover controls are very sluggish though. It's probably not a very good basis for a cover system.

It's so clunky. I never use it.

[CaptainZombie]

Re: FPS: The cover system

Killswitch was 3rd person as well, and I loved that game. It was the first game I remember with cover in a shooter like that though.

Oh yeah, it was 3PS......doh!

[Beantown]

Re: FPS: The cover system

I think Winback and Kill Switch were the two I was thinking of (mainly Kill Switch, because I wanted to say Kill Zone, which I knew wasn't right). I like the cover system in Vegas a lot. I really like the "look" function when trying to aim in GTA IV, but it needs to be fluid. No separate button at all. Crouch down and move near something and naturally go into a cover-crouch. Move away and you'll leave cover. None of this weird camera-shifting madness that has you covered up on the wrong walls, or invulnerable, aim-all-day-and-pop-out-and-shoot-a-gnat-on-the-***-from-50-yards precision, either.

I have a feeling that, within a year or two, games will start using a fluid cover system that will just incorporate branching animations that automatically trigger if you get near a wall or ledge or corner, etc...and not require extra user input. After all, if I wanted to get up next to a wall and look around a corner, I'd just do it...not think about stopping, turning around, and putting my back against a wall. It's just an evolution, but the technology itself is still fairly new in mainstream shooters. It'll improve, but it'll take time.

Yeah, I meant Kill Switch, not Killzone.