Help me help myself

[ryan36]

Also if doesn't work out, you could always "Go Rainbow".

Somewhat interestingly , even if you did ...all the same rules would still apply.

Seriously , be yourself is bad advice, depending on your goal. If you're annoying it won't help.

But letting your personality come through (while respecting social norms and being confident) works wonders.

[ODogg]

Re: Help me help myself

Plentyoffish didnt do anything for me, a far better free site with a lot of ACTIVE women is okcupid.com

I had more luck there in a month than I had at POF in a year. In fact I met my current g/f of over a year there, check it out...

And I'll tell you another thing too, you have GOT to find some audio mp3s or videos of a guy named David Wygant. A fellow OS member sent me some mp3s of his and after years of failure with women I literally became a different person in regards to how I interacted with women. And just like you I was very shy as well..i only wish to god id found this guy in my 20s instead of when I had just turned 40. The guy gives dating advice for men and women so he's not about cheesy pick up lines or anything like these playah shows you see on tv that teach you how to trick or seduce women. His while routine is just about how to get you comfortable with talking to women with confidence and being yourself....

P.s. I'd send you the mp3s if I could but they were on my work computer so I don't have the them anymore...you can probably find them on net free somewhere but if not whatever he is charging is worth it will help you more than anything else ever could, and believe me, after being single with no luck, no dates nothing, for ten years, after listening to him (i listened to ten hours of his workshop) I was dating multiple women and getting numbers before I found my current girlfriend. And although I got a great girl now I do know if I hadn't found her I could have dated a bunch more hot women, I was even able to pick up a stripper had I wanted too (she was super hot too) but at that point I already had stefanie....if you had told me that a few months before, when I couldnt get ANY women, even the homely, heavier women, I'd have said you were crazy!!

Here is his website, ironically his blog today is about shy men: http://www.davidwygant.com/

[ODogg]

Re: Help me help myself

Oh and you can listen to his 10 minute audio on the blog entry about why shy guys appear as stalkers for free, so check that out...

[BunnyHardaway]

Re: Help me help myself

Also, do you drink?
Im not saying to get hammered before hanging out with chicks...
but like, 2-3 drinks and get a good buzz going and you dont have any nervousness anymore.

Disagree...there's been several instances where I've been more than buzzed and still let nerves get the best of me. I just don't even try anymore

My new plan is to get rich so girls will be interested in me because of my money. You might say "that's incredibly stupid". Yes, yes it is, but here's the thing. I've tried all this stuff...read everything, taken people's advice, etc...but when I'm in real life scenarios, it's like I forgot everything and the whole plan goes out the window. Combine my actual nervousness and trying to remember all that crap on the fly and you get an awkward situation.

Oh, and having terrible wingmen doesn't help the situation. My one friend who I go to the bar with a lot will either say something like "hey can you talk to my friend because he's afraid to talk to girls" or "you're really talking to a girl right now?" or "hey, he's desperate so help him out"...something along those lines.

[the_future420]

Honestly in your situation, I wouldn't even be worried about talking to girls as much as people in general. It seems like you have some pretty strong social awkwardness and that needs to be confronted head on before you really try talking to girls.

What I would suggest is just talking to three random strangers a day, male or female, old or young. Just strike up random convo with them about absolutely anything at all. Since you are in NYC, this shouldn't be a problem at all. Once you get used to the idea of just talking to people, then try honing your target to just girls you find attractive.

I know a lot of people are suggesting online dating, but I really think you would feel better about yourself and your "game" if you got comfortable talking to people/girls you see in public first. Even if you meet a chick online and you end up meeting in person, its going to be very awkward if you can't carry on a conversation with her.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk

[TripleCrown9]

Re: Help me help myself

Where did you get that I was from NYC? Quite the opposite, actually. I live in Lubbock, Texas.

[the_future420]

Re: Help me help myself

Where did you get that I was from NYC? Quite the opposite, actually. I live in Lubbock, Texas.

Lol, my bad. I got you mixed up with somebody else from another post. Its been a rough morning for me

Location aside though, the advice I offered should still help. I know because it helped me. I was never bad with talking to women (I could usually get a number if i talked to a girl) but I never had the confidence to talk to them sometimes. Getting used to talking to strangers and practicing your conversation skills on them will make you so much more confident when you talk to a girl you want to pursue because you will be more relaxed and more at ease when talking to her.

In the end though, you really dont want to talk to a chick in public for too long, u just want to get to know her name, leave a good impression on her, and then ideally give her your number (or get hers for starters) and set up a date. Especailly starting out, the longer you intially talk to a girl, the more chances you end up giving yourself to drop the ball and mess things up. Just be confident when you talk to a girl and look forward to getting rejected because its just gonna happen no matter what.

Look at it as having fun. Go in feeling confident when you approach a girl but when you get rejected be able to laugh it off. If you say something corny or awkward, dont let it get to you. Instead, afterwards just look back at it laugh to yourself at how bad you sounded and try not to make the same mistake next time. Good luck, bro.

[Trevytrev11]

Re: Help me help myself

I'm so far removed from the dating game it's not even funny. I'm 29 and have been with my wife for a total of 15 years.

But maybe my advice will be useful...it makes sense to me

You are single and you are shy so every night you are going home alone and you probably feel like crap about it more times than not. You probably walk out of a failed situation with a female replaying it in your head of what you could have done differently over and over again (like Harold with the chick from the elevator in Harold and Kumar).

I think you've already kind of experienced the worst, you know? In other words if you go talk to 10 girls at a bar or a book store or whatever and you get rejected 10 times, you are still no worse off than you already are. The worst then can say is no and the worst thing that can happen to you is what you already go through on a normal basis.

Eventually, though, someone is going to be interested and you are not going to replay that situation in your head..it only takes one, but to get that one, you are going to have to will yourself out of your comfort zone.

Dare yourself to just start one conversation with one girl over the course of the next week. Force yourself into that awkward moment. Even if you get totally rejected, you will be better off for it.

Then the next week, make it two girls in one week. Library, grocery store, book store, bars, the gym etc.

After a few weeks you might find out what it is that works for you and what doesn't. But regardless of the outcome, you will come out of it better situated for the next time and in no worse shape than you currently are.

[NDAlum]

Re: Help me help myself

Well we need to look at some things:

#1- You say you're average at best. Now you may be serious, may be over shooting, or might be a good looking guy who is just modest. Looks matter

#2- You need to make sure you keep your expectations realistic. If you aren't great looking, you're not going to get the hottest girl around. That's just truth. If you do it's extremely rare and the stars somehow aligned for that miracle.

#3- Be presentable. Look like you take care of yourself. Work out (just stay in shape, no need to bodybuild) and pick up some activities. You'll meet people through these avenues.

#4- Have a **** it attitude. If you become an emotional sapp and resemble that foreveralone.jpg then you will be a sad person.

The less you care, the more they do

[ODogg]

Re: Help me help myself

Disagree...there's been several instances where I've been more than buzzed and still let nerves get the best of me. I just don't even try anymore

My new plan is to get rich so girls will be interested in me because of my money. You might say "that's incredibly stupid". Yes, yes it is, but here's the thing. I've tried all this stuff...read everything, taken people's advice, etc...but when I'm in real life scenarios, it's like I forgot everything and the whole plan goes out the window. Combine my actual nervousness and trying to remember all that crap on the fly and you get an awkward situation.

Oh, and having terrible wingmen doesn't help the situation. My one friend who I go to the bar with a lot will either say something like "hey can you talk to my friend because he's afraid to talk to girls" or "you're really talking to a girl right now?" or "hey, he's desperate so help him out"...something along those lines.

Don't think having money will change anything. I began making six figures when I was in my mid 30's and figured that would help. It didn't change one damned thing. In fact, it made things worse as I knew I had a lot of money and STILL couldn't get women so it actually made things worse confidence wise.

[ODogg]

Re: Help me help myself

Well we need to look at some things:

#1- You say you're average at best. Now you may be serious, may be over shooting, or might be a good looking guy who is just modest. Looks matter

Looks do matter to a certain extent but not as much as one may think. Your attitude and demeanor can make you go from a 6 to a 9 in no time.

#2- You need to make sure you keep your expectations realistic. If you aren't great looking, you're not going to get the hottest girl around. That's just truth. If you do it's extremely rare and the stars somehow aligned for that miracle.

Disagree, you can land women out of your "ball park" if you have the confidence to do so. See my post above. I'm not a great looking guy but I was able to play way outside of my league even if only for a short time. Plus the girlfriend I have now is better looking (and younger) than me by a good margin..

#3- Be presentable. Look like you take care of yourself. Work out (just stay in shape, no need to bodybuild) and pick up some activities. You'll meet people through these avenues.

I agree about the working out part but more than that I'd say grooming is even more important to women. Women like men to be CLEAN. Trim those nose hairs, those disgusting ear hairs, keep your eyebrows trimmed, be neatly shaven or have a nice, trim bear/mustache. Smell good at all times, bathe/shower often. Have a decent hair cut. All of those things are just as important as working out to a lot of women, sometimes even more important. If you do both, working out and grooming yourself, you're already doing more than 75% of your competition is...

#4- Have a **** it attitude. If you become an emotional sapp and resemble that foreveralone.jpg then you will be a sad person.

The less you care, the more they do

Amen to this.. THIS is the key. You cannot give off desperation type vibes. This was my big mistake. I treated each encounter as if this was "the one". You have to have the attitude of, in your mind at all times, there are literally MILLIONS of women in this world and the woman who is speaking with you right now is lucky to be speaking with you. Don't be an arrogant jerk or anything but just keep in mind that you are an important and valuable person and any woman would be lucky to have you.

Also, one other thing, don't handle rejection as the woman is rejecting you because you're ugly, not good enough, too fat, too skinny, not wealthy enough, etc etc. Just as some people like peaches and other people like plums it's just a matter of taste. And just because a woman rejects you doesn't meant there's anything wrong with you but rather you're just not her style for whatever reason. This was another big thing I did wrong, I internalized rejection and constantly felt worse and worse about myself each time I got rejected.

You have to learn to think like an NFL cornerback when it comes to women and them turning you down. When you get burnt deep for a TD (get rejected) you forget about it and move on, because you're the best damned player to ever take to the field. If you dwell on that last TD you're simply going to do worse and worse so move on and forget about it.

BTW - all of this stuff is stuff David covers in his seminar. I know you probably think it's just a bunch of bunk but give it a try and you will see how much it helps.

[TripleCrown9]

Re: Help me help myself

So would clean shaven or a neatly trimmed beard yield better results? I'm asking because I haven't completely shaved in over a year, and I'm known for my beard.

[ScoobySnax]

Re: Help me help myself

So would clean shaven or a neatly trimmed beard yield better results? I'm asking because I haven't completely shaved in over a year, and I'm known for my beard.

I think it would help.

[EnigmaNemesis]

Re: Help me help myself

Looks do matter to a certain extent but not as much as one may think. Your attitude and demeanor can make you go from a 6 to a 9 in no time.



Disagree, you can land women out of your "ball park" if you have the confidence to do so. See my post above. I'm not a great looking guy but I was able to play way outside of my league even if only for a short time. Plus the girlfriend I have now is better looking (and younger) than me by a good margin..



I agree about the working out part but more than that I'd say grooming is even more important to women. Women like men to be CLEAN. Trim those nose hairs, those disgusting ear hairs, keep your eyebrows trimmed, be neatly shaven or have a nice, trim bear/mustache. Smell good at all times, bathe/shower often. Have a decent hair cut. All of those things are just as important as working out to a lot of women, sometimes even more important. If you do both, working out and grooming yourself, you're already doing more than 75% of your competition is...



Amen to this.. THIS is the key. You cannot give off desperation type vibes. This was my big mistake. I treated each encounter as if this was "the one". You have to have the attitude of, in your mind at all times, there are literally MILLIONS of women in this world and the woman who is speaking with you right now is lucky to be speaking with you. Don't be an arrogant jerk or anything but just keep in mind that you are an important and valuable person and any woman would be lucky to have you.

Also, one other thing, don't handle rejection as the woman is rejecting you because you're ugly, not good enough, too fat, too skinny, not wealthy enough, etc etc. Just as some people like peaches and other people like plums it's just a matter of taste. And just because a woman rejects you doesn't meant there's anything wrong with you but rather you're just not her style for whatever reason. This was another big thing I did wrong, I internalized rejection and constantly felt worse and worse about myself each time I got rejected.

You have to learn to think like an NFL cornerback when it comes to women and them turning you down. When you get burnt deep for a TD (get rejected) you forget about it and move on, because you're the best damned player to ever take to the field. If you dwell on that last TD you're simply going to do worse and worse so move on and forget about it.

BTW - all of this stuff is stuff David covers in his seminar. I know you probably think it's just a bunch of bunk but give it a try and you will see how much it helps.

This man speaks the truth... I was depressed a bit the past couple of months when I broke up with my ex. All my friends are good looking dudes, they tell me I am too, but I have to be confident again and change my attitude about myself. Girls that I have that are friends told me the same thing... they said I am good looking, but my attitude really stands out and is a turn off.

So I just woke up one morning last week, said F it... new me (see: old me before long term settle down relationships), the old 21 year old me is coming back.

Friday I went up to this girl at the bar who was AMAZINGLY hot, after seeing her all night. Told her she was gorgeous... she stopped me and called me over to her friends moments later, said to them, "this is the hot guy I told you all about that said I was pretty"... I stopped her and said, "I did not say you were pretty (pause) I said you were gorgeous, there is a distinct difference"... her face lit up, friends faces were lit up.

I introduced myself, she did the same, asked her if she had a boyfriend, she said no... I said, "PERFECT!" just like that. She lit up again... took me outside, talked to me... I made her friends feel important, they left us alone... 1/2 later I am making out with her at the bar. Her friends left, no motherly instincts at all kicked in for them cause I was smart to make them feel good too. Walked her home (she lived around the corner), cause she was in no condition to drive, she tried "raping" me on her front lawn, but I was a gentleman, and declined.

Long story short... She had to go to a family's house at Lake George, she came home a day early cause she could not shake me from her head. Went out with her that very night... she wanted to come back to my place... and the rest is what you guys can guess happened. Now she calls me over every night for it.



Just have confidence, you will be surprised how many women DO NOT get approached, or approached properly, they can smell insecurity and fear like like a dog. And never buy them drinks till you know you are a shoe it... since most expect the "drink approach" right away, and take advantage of it all the time. Funny thing is, she is not that kind of girl, and was newly single... but my attitude, and approach from when I was younger came back, and it was almost effortless. And it drove her nuts.

And like said, cleanliness, smelling good, well groomed, dressed nice works well. But attitude is KEY! More so than ANYTHING. My friends have been preaching this to me for a long time, and are now stoked I snapped out of my lull the past few years, and using the proper attitude they preach.

[ODogg]

Re: Help me help myself

So would clean shaven or a neatly trimmed beard yield better results? I'm asking because I haven't completely shaved in over a year, and I'm known for my beard.

I've come to the conclusion if you have facial hair you're going to do a bit better with the women, whether it's a small mustache or a full beard. However I've read a lot about this and women don't go for the Grizzly Adams big scruffy beards much. It's too intimidating. I actually read a study that boiled down to this:

1. A clean shaven man, with no sideburns, no facial hair at all is viewed negatively by most women because the man will often look somewhat young, and in her subconscious mind a woman doesn't want to be with a teenage boy.

2. A man with a lot of facial hair, be it a large beard, huge mustache, etc, will often be a turn-off for women as it just exudes testosterone and quite frankly can scare a woman. A woman wants a manly man but not a man who looks like he may go savage beats on her.

Because of this when I was dating I would have the Don Johnson look. Instead of shaving every day I'd let it go a bit but I'd keep the stubble short and neat looking. I'd also be sure to keep a well trimmed mustache and very short sideburns.

On a related note I started getting haircuts more often. My hair grows fast so I didn't used to get them all that often but after researching all of this I came to the conclusion you're better off getting a hair cut every so often or at least getting your neck and back hair trimmed up.