Found another portal...

[acermina]

Hey guys. I discovered one thing while testing...

Can't do a 99/100 combo. It makes it funky and it seems to default to a 99/1 setup and then there were like decimals and stuff. Very odd. Gotta go with 98/100 for the backs. Still gets a few carries for the backups on 50 fatigue. I don't think they turned it off guys. It definitely works for the d-line rotation with my 73/95 set and I occassionally see subbing at 98/100 for backs.

I noticed a few other comments on here that I wanted to respond to.

KB Lover, why the need for 100 fatigue? I would think that would totally sap the CPU and make the game not much of a challenge. I've tested at 65 and it was a breeze compared to 50.

Davep, my biggest issue with Jarrod's sliders is the 100/100 opi/dpi combo. I found that this also causes very little offensive resistance from the CPU, both in the passing game and the running game, regardless of fatigue. The challenge then is to open it up for the CPU without making it too easy for us. I found 100 dpi with 75 opi to be perfect for me. I have one other guy testing with me and we both found this to be true. He is the Browns and he beat the Giants and Manning had 6 picks with it at 100. Dropped it to 85 and we saw slight improvements although still not quite there. He just played Pittsburgh and got lit up 42-10 with the 100 dpi/75 opi combo and the 50 fatigue. Let me know if you guys want me to post my full set. I am done tinkering and ready to fire up a franchise.

[KBLover]

Quote: Originally Posted by acermina

KB Lover, why the need for 100 fatigue? I would think that would totally sap the CPU and make the game not much of a challenge. I've tested at 65 and it was a breeze compared to 50.

It worked just fine in M12 - you can see my M12 sliders and such. They weren't "perfect" but weren't 'easy'.

Sometimes, I have easy games at 35 fatigue I'm using now. Difficulty isn't about fatigue in and of itself.

But I want higher fatigue WITHOUT subbing at positions that do not typically sub for fatigue. This stresses the player's STA/INJ/TGH ratings, making conditioning matter more, big hitting have more risk, the risk of taking lots of punishment wearing a guy down (especially the QB), etc.

I remember many a great, tough game in M12 where my QB was "in the gray" but having to lead a comeback drive. My defense sapped and sucking wind, but trying to get that one more stop. Having to care about ball control even over scoring sometimes because too many 3-and-outs, especially on the road would get my guys totally spent much too early. I remember a playoff game late in the 4th, my QB getting knocked out of the game because he was just taking so much abuse (my line basically just was like WTF all day long).

Don't forget that your player's also will tire. So if your sliders are accenting player skills and providing a realistic challenge - your players dropping likely offsets the CPU's dropping as well. After all, the same player AI controls the 10 guys your circle isn't under so if a CPU DB is slipping on coverage due to fatigue, if your defense gets worn, you might be dealing with the same thing on the CPU's possession.

I really felt it on the road, making winning road games that much harder while giving some advantage to me when I was at home. Advantage doesn't mean easy just like it's not easy to win at home in the real game.

That's why I want 100 fatigue again.

And I couldn't get this to work even at 50. Guys still came out "Red" even with the bars about 4/5 full (where 80ish would be). 80-85 is not "Red" condition. I still saw LBs come out when I tested it on 65 fatigue. McClellan came out a few times. Upshaw did too. With bars at the minimum, why are they still coming out in the "Red"?

[Sturzinator]

Some subbing does work. I also have seen the rotation I was after with the D line. I can keep my O line and DBs in the game also. But the system definitely does not work as designed and implemented in years past. It's partially functional, but mostly broken.

I will explore your notion regarding using the bars as a guide vice the numeric inputs.

Thanks

[davep]

Quote: Originally Posted by acermina

to control the challenge of the CPU in CCM. Keeping all of my sliders the same across the board (I think I have a good set for my style), I started playing around with the fatigue and sub settings and discovered another fascinating angle. Increasing the fatigue setting saps the CPU and makes them weaker across the board. They don't pass as well, they don't defend as well, they make dumber decisions, they don't run the ball as well, etc. At 50, I get an extremely difficult challenge and have to play great football to be successful. If I bump it even to 55, it starts to open up for me and become easier to defend. At 65? Forget it. I could probably go undefeated with even the weakest of teams. Just another find to give you guys headaches! I am keeping it at 50. Personally, I am enjoying being 3-8 right now with my Colts franchise.

I don't know. I tested this out and didn't see any difference with one game. I'm finding a few essential things wrong with the game:

1. Sliders don't work accurately, if they did, we'd all be having so much fun with this game.

2. Once you get fairly decent db's like I did in the 2nd year with the Browns, it's MUCH easier to stop the pass (I have HUM PR at 60 and 15 for INT). I was getting picked apart in my first year.

3. The CPU QB isn't very aware. I have CPU Pass Block on 100 and QB ACC on 100 and he is still not seeing wide open WR'S. The LB's are programmed correctly, just waaaaaay too much mirroring with the db's.

I have to point out that I'm not very good...I'm just an average player which is frustrating because I should be very scared to face Schaub, Brady, Manning, etc....

I thought I had a great slider set but after I improved my db's the CPU offense can't muster more than 10 points a game. Such a drag.

[Jarodd21]

Quote: Originally Posted by davep

I don't know. I tested this out and didn't see any difference with one game. I'm finding a few essential things wrong with the game: 1. Sliders don't work accurately, if they did, we'd all be having so much fun with this game. 2. Once you get fairly decent db's like I did in the 2nd year with the Browns, it's MUCH easier to stop the pass (I have HUM PR at 60 and 15 for INT). I was getting picked apart in my first year. 3. The CPU QB isn't very aware. I have CPU Pass Block on 100 and QB ACC on 100 and he is still not seeing wide open WR'S. The LB's are programmed correctly, just waaaaaay too much mirroring with the db's. I have to point out that I'm not very good...I'm just an average player which is frustrating because I should be very scared to face Schaub, Brady, Manning, etc.... I thought I had a great slider set but after I improved my db's the CPU offense can't muster more than 10 points a game. Such a drag.

Not to derail this thread but can you send me your full slider set. I guarantee I'll spot the exact reason why the CPU is struggling against you. I need your full slider set though. I know you made a mistake somewhere with the USER sliders and it's causing the CPU to play horrible... The sliders work. You just have to set it up right..

[acermina]

Yeah, I am just not seeing this either. I just played the Packers with the 49ers and lost 24-20.

Anyways, here is my full set. I am telling you, with my set, I am seeing a vastly different challenge as I increase fatigue. It may just be due to my set though. Like I said, I am 3-8 with the Colts with these. (I am one of those guys who wants to have a crappy record with the bad teams and has to improve in the offseason and with progression to get into the playoff hunt...I shouldn't be a playoff team unless I am at least in the middle of the pack)

There are other factors that determine CPU competence that I haven't even mentioned yet (int grounding is a big one...this HAS to be on 100, as well as the OPI being 75, no higher and no lower). Remember, you aren't going to get a great rotation with my sub settings like you would on 100 fatigue, but I am definitely seeing subs across the d-line and occassionally with the backs on long drives. That's really all I want because I don't want to sacrifice the great challenge I am seeing on 50 fatigue.

Fatigue - 50
Injuries - 55
Threshold – 60
15 min clock
Normal Speed
15 sec left on play clock after runoff
All-Madden

Player
QB Acc – 6
Pass Block – 5
WR Catch – 48

Broke Tackles – 10
Run Block – 5
Fumble – 5

Pass D Reax – 0
Int – 35
Pass Rush – 5

Rush Reax – 5
Block Shed – 5
Tackle – 10

CPU

QB Acc – 94
Pass Block – 5
WR Catch – 48

Broke Tackles – 10
Run Block – 37
Fumble – 5

Pass Reax – 0
Int – 35
Pass Rush – 5

Rush Reax – 5
Block Shed – 80
Tackle – 10

Special Teams
FG Power – 50
FG Acc – 40
Punt Power – 50
Punt Acc – 75
KO Power - 50




Penalty Sliders:
Offside - 54
False Start - 54
Holding - 54
Face mask - 54
DPI - 100
OPI - 75
KPI - 75
Clipping - 54
Int Grounding - 100
Rough Pass - 54
Rough Kick - 75

Auto sub Out/In

QB 2/20
RB 98/100
WR 73/95
FBTE 73/95
OL 2/20

DT 73/95
DE 73/95
LB 2/20
CB 2/20
S 2/20

[KBLover]

Quote: Originally Posted by acermina

(I am one of those guys who wants to have a crappy record with the bad teams and has to improve in the offseason and with progression to get into the playoff hunt...I shouldn't be a playoff team unless I am at least in the middle of the pack)

Last I checked...the Colts are in the playoff hunt...(in fact, they control their destiny at 9-5 with the #5 seed) So are the Redskins - same record as the mighty Giants and Steelers. You're as good or bad as you're playing now. Talent level matters, but, as they say, the game is played on the field, not on paper. Not to mention some teams are bad because of bad coaching decisions which you won't necessarily replicate (or Madden can't replicate)

Strange things happen in the NFL...footballs bounce funny and 16 games is a small sample size...

Quote: Originally Posted by acermina

There are other factors that determine CPU competence that I haven't even mentioned yet (int grounding is a big one...this HAS to be on 100, as well as the OPI being 75, no higher and no lower).

That may work for your set - not doubting that one bit. I don't doubt you're getting a great challenge and are enjoying what you're seeing. I just don't think there's any absolutes as to where something 'must' be. I mean, I just had to fight into OT with it at 0. With IG at 100, I was getting too many sacks, but also had good games - but it's "easier" to stop the CPU when you can dial up 6 or 7 sacks a game. With OPI, 50 works pretty well for me, and have had good, tight games with both at 5, 25, 5 DPI, 100 OPI, it all depends.

Quote: Originally Posted by acermina

Remember, you aren't going to get a great rotation with my sub settings like you would on 100 fatigue, but I am definitely seeing subs across the d-line and occassionally with the backs on long drives.

The problem is I saw subs on LB and DB. Package change subs make sense, same with personnel groupings (Nickle vs Dime vs 3-3-5 Nickle vs 4-4, etc)

But if I stay base 3-4, I shouldn't see Lewis come out (I shouldn't see him come out ever, really, if the man is healthy, he plays). I tried with the bars minimal and still they subbed out in the Red just like default. HB bars are near the top, Ray Rice still stayed in until Red, when that high a percentage should have been taking him out in the Green. I mean, 98/100 is both bars near the top which is barely any energy spent. Why is he still coming out in the Red like the regular 60/80?

I'm not just talking about not having what I had before - the auto-subs are just too screwed up for that, but I'm not seeing any difference from default at all, even if I leave it on 50 fatigue and try the bars, setting them by how they look. That's why now I'm at 35 fatigue, and I STILL see subbing out by the CPU's LBs...which makes it 'easier' when a starting LB has to go out.

Only other thing I can think of to try is putting the Out bar at minimum and In bar at max. That SHOULD, keep the player playing until he has to be just about dragged off the field. But if he still comes out when Red...

[D_Fos]

Idk
I've been testing 75 fatigue for the last 9 games, the fatigue can benefit you(when your converting, moving the chains) or it can hurt you(when your not stopping them on 3rd dwns).

I could see how you/we could see better performance out of the CPU when fatigue is less of factor(they would have the better players in for longer periods of time and having ratings less affected by tiring)

I'm not sold on any specific Fatigue setting but I know I'm able to get a nice competitive challenge every game w/ 75 fatigue, and see more players rotate.
I still set autosubs higher for HBs and D-Lineman, hoping it works since patch 4 seemed to fix the "Injury Reset Glitch", wishful thinking, I know.