So, the Madden name is now a... system seller??

[RubenDouglas]

You sure about that LIGHTNING?
http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/driving/...s_2793291.html

They say gt3 was the first ps2 game to reach 1 million sales and that was released 9 months after madden 2001 on ps2.

[LIGHTNING]

Quote: Originally Posted by RubenDouglas

You sure about that LIGHTNING? http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/driving/...s_2793291.html They say gt3 was the first ps2 game to reach 1 million sales and that was released 9 months after madden 2001 on ps2.

Yes but that was in 2001. My post about Madden 2005 sales is more recent.

[RubenDouglas]

ahhhh. i feel stupid. i didnt see the 2005 there.... When I read system seller, i initially went back to launch date.

my bad

[wwharton]

Quote: Originally Posted by LIGHTNING

Yes but that was in 2001. My post about Madden 2005 sales is more recent.

but lightning, nobody's buying a ps2 in 2005. you'd have to look at 2001 and maybe 2002 or 2003 but the experiment would have to come from when the system was launched. i have friends that bought a ps2 when they did b/c of madden and played the hell out of it, but over the years decided to go another route so they didn't get 2005. does that mean it wasn't a system seller for them?

[LIGHTNING]

Quote: Originally Posted by wwharton

but lightning, nobody's buying a ps2 in 2005. you'd have to look at 2001 and maybe 2002 or 2003 but the experiment would have to come from when the system was launched. i have friends that bought a ps2 when they did b/c of madden and played the hell out of it, but over the years decided to go another route so they didn't get 2005. does that mean it wasn't a system seller for them?

I am not denying that some people bought a PS2 to play Madden in years past. That is certainly true, but there are games much more important to consoles like GTA for the PS2 and Halo for the XBOX. I do not think that a console really needs Madden to prosper. Heck you do not even need a console at all to play Madden just buy the PC version.

[wwharton]

that's not really the question though. if i thought deeper about your question i think i'd agree in some cases, not necessarily all but the question is about madden being a system seller. i think it most definitely is. many people played the ps1 and overlooked the DC b/c it didn't have madden and as soon as the ps2 hit the stores many more people bought it b/c they wanted madden with better graphics and AI. now madden is a driving force behind 360 in many ways.

i don't dismiss your numbers above either. i'm just saying you'd have to do that comparison at launch. if you do that and come up with similar results then i'd give you the point but looking at numbers of how many people "own" a ps2 when they could've bought the system 5 years ago and looking at how many of them bought THIS year's madden... there's no way you can get a conclusion of if the game helped sell the system unless you're only looking at numbers for ps2's sold in 2005 (which you already stated you looked at all ps2's sold).

[LIGHTNING]

Quote: Originally Posted by wwharton

that's not really the question though. if i thought deeper about your question i think i'd agree in some cases, not necessarily all but the question is about madden being a system seller. i think it most definitely is. many people played the ps1 and overlooked the DC b/c it didn't have madden and as soon as the ps2 hit the stores many more people bought it b/c they wanted madden with better graphics and AI. now madden is a driving force behind 360 in many ways. i don't dismiss your numbers above either. i'm just saying you'd have to do that comparison at launch. if you do that and come up with similar results then i'd give you the point but looking at numbers of how many people "own" a ps2 when they could've bought the system 5 years ago and looking at how many of them bought THIS year's madden... there's no way you can get a conclusion of if the game helped sell the system unless you're only looking at numbers for ps2's sold in 2005 (which you already stated you looked at all ps2's sold).

It is a global market and American football outside North America is NOT popular at all. The PS2 would have sold quite well at launch without Madden even in North America IMHO. The Dreamcast did not need Madden and niether does the PS2 or XBOX. Does it help a console to have Madden? Sure but this is also true of lot of other games as well. The bottom line is that the video game business is a global market NOT just a North American market.

[wwharton]

you're changing your point now. AT LAUNCH you can't say the PS2 would've sold the same without madden. To say it would've sold quite well you have to define what "quite well" means. I'm speaking from personal experience, however limited, when I say there are quite a few people that wouldn't have bought a PS2 at launch if it wasn't for madden. I also don't have proof of Madden's effect on the DC but it's no secret thought of mine that Madden + PS2 launch = beginning of the end of the DC. A new console will have that effect but the spiral came quick and swift and many will say Madden on the PS2 is the reason. The only way you can really prove your ORIGINAL argument is to get data on the number of PS2's sold on or around launch and the number of Madden games sold on or around launch. You can even get the numbers for the other launch titles and compare that number to the number of madden games sold. Comparing anything now or even around the launch of Madden 2005 is just not relevant.