Thank God LBz and I aren't the only ones who wants this on D

[bang911]

Quote: Originally Posted by mmorg

If I had a choice for tiered play-calling or a better defensive hot read system for Madden 11 I would choose a better hot read system. I would rather wait on a tiered play-calling system if it was included for offense and defense and it needs to be done right. Not half assed.

I am also on this boat. I think a better defensive playmaker system is the simplest and most important fix that this game could receive. As LBz said, the tier-playcalling would be a full time project that would possibly consume a full dev cycle.

Quote: Originally Posted by mmorg

David Ortiz was in charge and allowed people to make shortcuts for certain things. This new team said they are going to revamp things and make the game a foundation for which they can build upon and improve things. Not just keep adding new features like Ring Builder.

That all sounds right to me. I know the current def team isn't to blame, but that the past dev team made the work for this team that much more difficult. That word foundation would be the best advice for the team now, because that is something CG madden has been missing.

[BezO]

Quote: Originally Posted by rgiles36

I disagree Bez...I think people hot route on defense for the same reasons they hot route on offense; to take advantage of mismatches or simply to make an adjustment. I don't think that people complaining about the quick snap necessarily are looking for tiered play calling; they just want time to make an adjustment or two. 2K5 has tiered play calling and I still make adjustments at the line many times.

You really think most Madden gamers are seeing an offensive formation, reading it and making adjustments? Or do you think most of them have an idea, find something close & hot route the rest?

I obviously can't speak for everyone, but everyone I know hot routes on defense because they want a scheme that is not included in the game.

How many Man 1 calls are in base defenses(4-3 & 3-4) on Madden? 4-5? Now think of a team like Philly... how many different blitz/stunt combinations do you think they use throught a game from their base formation? 7 LB blitz combinations alone multiplied by all the stunt combinations that can go in front of that. Then add DB blitzes, 0 coverage...

You can't come close to duplicating that without hot routing your way into schemes. But you could duplicate a lot of it with tiered defensive calling.

I somewhat agree with you though. Many are not wishing for tiered defensive play calling. But I think that's only because they don't know that's how defenses are actually called. They're satisfied hot routing their way into the scheme in their head... until the CPU or human opponent starts quick snapping them.

[LBzrule]

Quote: Originally Posted by kcxiv

So, from a game that was supposedly build for the next gen system, it cant do something that seems fairly easy to do, but a game that was based on the ps2 and ported up can do it? hmm.... That sounds well, NOT RIGHT!

Where do you get the idea that it is easy to do? I know the 2k guy that did it and he said it was hell, but just hunkered down and did it. It's not some easy rewrite.

Also Bezo, the reason why I said what I said is this. Think about when 2k did their rewrite from 2k3-2k4. 2k4 had the rewrite, but they did not have anything new on defense from 2k3 except the beginning of the hot route system. But it was bare bones. For me I want:

1) Coverage Shells
2) Game Planning Defensive Backs based on Coverage/Field
3) Pre-snap Movement system
4) The ability to change the line stunts at the line
5) New fronts/Shift system - blog is ready/video is not

They are not going to be able to do all of that and do a massive rewrite on defensive play calling. I'd rather have 1-5 than the rewrite play calling. All of this alone is a massive undertaking and are things I'd rather them spend their time on. What's the point of having the play calling system right when in two player games the guy can still easily tell it's man defense or it's zone defense? Or, how can we make the game have more varied defenses? It's not going to happen unless we can find a way to overcome the space issue in the defensive playbooks (which if they do the rewrite the space issue will remain), but also have a way to still have all the fronts and more.

I want to be clear though. As a play call method, I'd rather have tiered calling. But on the field I'd rather have some of the things I've blogged about and upcoming blogs. They will not be able to do all of that in one year. This is just me though.

[BezO]

Quote: Originally Posted by bang911

That all sounds right to me. I know the current def team isn't to blame, but that the past dev team made the work for this team that much more difficult. That word foundation would be the best advice for the team now, because that is something CG madden has been missing.

Tiered play calling on defense would be creating a better foundation. That's how coaches call defenses.

Quote: Originally Posted by LBzrule

Also Bezo, the reason why I said what I said is this. Think about when 2k did their rewrite from 2k3-2k4. 2k4 had the rewrite, but they did not have anything new on defense from 2k3 except the beginning of the hot route system. But it was bare bones. For me I want: 1) Coverage Shells 2) Game Planning Defensive Backs based on Coverage/Field 3) Pre-snap Movement system 4) The ability to change the line stunts at the line 5) New fronts/Shift system - blog is ready/video is not They are not going to be able to do all of that and do a massive rewrite on defensive play calling. I'd rather have 1-5 than the rewrite play calling. All of this alone is a massive undertaking and are things I'd rather them spend their time on. What's the point of having the play calling system right when in two player games the guy can still easily tell it's man defense or it's zone defense? Or, how can we make the game have more varied defenses? It's not going to happen unless we can find a way to overcome the space issue in the defensive playbooks (which if they do the rewrite the space issue will remain), but also have a way to still have all the fronts and more. I want to be clear though. As a play call method, I'd rather have tiered calling. But on the field I'd rather have some of the things I've blogged about and upcoming blogs. They will not be able to do all of that in one year. This is just me though.

I like all of those, but this is a case where I want the steak before the gravy. 2, 3 & 5 are sweet, but I'd considere them a bit advanced, at least compared to simply calling a defense.

And I can't stand playmaking my way into schemes! Most opponents won't even give you time to do all of that. IMO, the way you call defensive plays is broken. The only alternative I'd be OK with is them adding enough predetermined schemes to account for what I'd do with a tiered system.

[MattieShoes]

Quote: Originally Posted by NEWYORICAN

You're kidding?..really?...that's funny! Now we know why the game plays more like a sim I guess....interesting! peace

Yes because everybody knows rocket scientists make the best football sims.

Wait, what?

[HolyCrap]

The defensive changes in madden are much need because the Offense is always one step ahead in the case of madden.

Many times the coverage is fine and appropriate in madden but the defenders do the wrong thing and screw up the correct play call.

Such as when you run a 2 Man Under and the comp wants to run a post the Play call should be fine but the CB gives up the inside and the Safety is in either in no mans land or doesn't react fast enough to deliver a hit.

Also on run plays due to lack of run fits and the Linebackers just running straight ahead many run lanes open up due to lack of core programing telling the Linebackers and safeties how to react to run plays properly

Defenders awareness is lacking in the Madden series

[Dmacho]

We need this is madden 11 ; one way to enhance this feature is to allow users to users to change individual assignments in the playcall screen.

[mmorg]

They really need to save the plays that you create on the fly too in your recent plays list. I wonder how possible this would be.