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Casual Vs Hardcore- Labels Exploited For Profit And Excuses

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Old 01-01-2011, 08:16 PM   #1
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Casual Vs Hardcore- Labels Exploited For Profit And Excuses

During my time here on OS, I have noticed how quite a few things get repeated over and over again till at some point people began to just accept them as factual. Even though I don't think any company directly starts these things, they have been exploited among the Madden community, for profit and excuses. A great example of this, IMO, is with the casual Madden gamers vs the hardcore Madden gamers, labels that allow gamers to be divided and conquered.

A casual gamer, in general, is just a person who plays a game to have fun and/or socialize but is at least interested in the games genre, while a hardcore gamer is more knowledgeable about the intricate details of a game, its' genre and how to they work. In the case of sports simulation video games and more specifically in this thread, NFL football simulation video games, these labels should have nothing to do with the foundation of the game.

First, the exploitation for profit is accomplished by claiming to target casual gamers interest in socializing by adding things like OTP and Ultimate Team. However, these features are not really targeting casual gamers of NFL football simulations but any gamer that might generally like the NFL and various social network mediums, regardless of their interest level in the sports simulation game genre. This would be all good except for the fact that Madden is advertised to be a NFL football simulation video game and not a new innovative social networking medium with a NFL licensed football theme.

Hardcore gamers are exploited for profit by leaving things out that should be basic for a NFL simulation and slowly adding them in annually or semi-annually. This causes a false sense of appreciation from some hardcore gamers that by focusing on NFL simulation "this year" EA is listening to the fan base. When really, EVERY YEAR that EA releases Madden and claims it is a NFL simulation video game, this basic standard should be met.

Lastly, some excuses these labels are exploited to give merit, have been a real stretch, IMO. For example, in some early podcasts comments where made about there being such a thing as sim to the umph degree and mention of penalties being realistically call "out the box", with both being considered casual adverse. However, these are things Madden gamers, hardcore and casual, look for when playing a NFL simulation video game, as much NFL football simulation as possible and "out the box" NFL football realism.

Madden is alleged to be a NFL football sports simulation video game, so anybody choosing to play this game, no matter your label, should expect that. There is no such thing as a casual simulation or a hardcore simulation, there is just simulation. Someone buying Madden for the first time and someone buying Madden for 20th year straight, should both be getting a NFL simulation, right "out the box". The only difference should be the amount of user input required, which should be dictated by the simple user interface options like, auto strafe, auto sprint, gameflow, etc, on by default but which the Madden vet can turn off.

Casual and hardcore NFL football simulation gamers should demand that this game actually commit to focusing on NFL simulation or remove itself from that video game genre and into some kind of NFL arcadey social networking classification.
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Old 01-01-2011, 09:36 PM   #2
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Re: Casual Vs Hardcore- Labels Exploited For Profit And Excuses

Quote:
Originally Posted by tlc12576
During my time here on OS, I have noticed how quite a few things get repeated over and over again till at some point people began to just accept them as factual. Even though I don't think any company directly starts these things, they have been exploited among the Madden community, for profit and excuses. A great example of this, IMO, is with the casual Madden gamers vs the hardcore Madden gamers, labels that allow gamers to be divided and conquered.

A casual gamer, in general, is just a person who plays a game to have fun and/or socialize but is at least interested in the games genre, while a hardcore gamer is more knowledgeable about the intricate details of a game, its' genre and how to they work. In the case of sports simulation video games and more specifically in this thread, NFL football simulation video games, these labels should have nothing to do with the foundation of the game.

First, the exploitation for profit is accomplished by claiming to target casual gamers interest in socializing by adding things like OTP and Ultimate Team. However, these features are not really targeting casual gamers of NFL football simulations but any gamer that might generally like the NFL and various social network mediums, regardless of their interest level in the sports simulation game genre. This would be all good except for the fact that Madden is advertised to be a NFL football simulation video game and not a new innovative social networking medium with a NFL licensed football theme.

Hardcore gamers are exploited for profit by leaving things out that should be basic for a NFL simulation and slowly adding them in annually or semi-annually. This causes a false sense of appreciation from some hardcore gamers that by focusing on NFL simulation "this year" EA is listening to the fan base. When really, EVERY YEAR that EA releases Madden and claims it is a NFL simulation video game, this basic standard should be met.

Lastly, some excuses these labels are exploited to give merit, have been a real stretch, IMO. For example, in some early podcasts comments where made about there being such a thing as sim to the umph degree and mention of penalties being realistically call "out the box", with both being considered casual adverse. However, these are things Madden gamers, hardcore and casual, look for when playing a NFL simulation video game, as much NFL football simulation as possible and "out the box" NFL football realism.

Madden is alleged to be a NFL football sports simulation video game, so anybody choosing to play this game, no matter your label, should expect that. There is no such thing as a casual simulation or a hardcore simulation, there is just simulation. Someone buying Madden for the first time and someone buying Madden for 20th year straight, should both be getting a NFL simulation, right "out the box". The only difference should be the amount of user input required, which should be dictated by the simple user interface options like, auto strafe, auto sprint, gameflow, etc, on by default but which the Madden vet can turn off.

Casual and hardcore NFL football simulation gamers should demand that this game actually commit to focusing on NFL simulation or remove itself from that video game genre and into some kind of NFL arcadey social networking classification.
Good post man I agree..I still say the answer to all these problems is by simply creating an arcade (casual)or simulation modebut as long as they are allowed to only improve slightly evry year and claim that its aimed towards simulation we will never get this..
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Old 01-02-2011, 12:07 AM   #3
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Re: Casual Vs Hardcore- Labels Exploited For Profit And Excuses

I understand they have to make the game for all types of people. I will agree that the focus of making games geared toward the casual gamers is the wrong focus. These are the types that play the game for a short period of time then move on. My brother-in-law is this way, he plays a game like Madden for about 3 months then moves on. He does not mess around with sliders. He just plays the game until something new comes out. I have always thought the Madden and NCAA teams should look at what FIFA has done. They make the game for the hardcore. They allow the casual games to enjoy the game though sliders and levels of play. The hardcore fans are the ones that buy the game each year and play it until the next years game comes out. If the game is not up to par then they don't mess with it.
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Old 01-02-2011, 12:48 AM   #4
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Re: Casual Vs Hardcore- Labels Exploited For Profit And Excuses

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Originally Posted by jbrew2411
I understand they have to make the game for all types of people. I will agree that the focus of making games geared toward the casual gamers is the wrong focus. These are the types that play the game for a short period of time then move on. My brother-in-law is this way, he plays a game like Madden for about 3 months then moves on. He does not mess around with sliders. He just plays the game until something new comes out. I have always thought the Madden and NCAA teams should look at what FIFA has done. They make the game for the hardcore. They allow the casual games to enjoy the game though sliders and levels of play. The hardcore fans are the ones that buy the game each year and play it until the next years game comes out. If the game is not up to par then they don't mess with it.
I think you are kind of missing the point of my post. It really shouldn't be about catering to casuals, hardcore or any other label. Madden should just be catering to it's alleged video game genre of NFL football simulation.

This whole red herring about Madden casuals not wanting to play a complete NFL sim, is ridiculous. I don't know the first thing about piloting a plane but I would not buy a flight simulator game and expect it to play like Afterburner. However, I would expect it to have some kind of beginner user interface to help me be successful with a flight sim.

Same thing with Madden, I don't think anybody has actually bought this game and avoided All Madden, or any other difficulty setting, because they made the game play too realistic. LOL.
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Old 01-02-2011, 04:04 AM   #5
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Re: Casual Vs Hardcore- Labels Exploited For Profit And Excuses

Well thought out and with some rational obviously, but as great a forum OS is, the one thing I've noticed is that such notations towards EA are not allowed.

Though it's a nice write-up and not degrading, it might get locked or deleted.

Just letting you know...
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:32 AM   #6
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Re: Casual Vs Hardcore- Labels Exploited For Profit And Excuses

You don't have to know anything about Magic: The Gathering to read this article, and I feel it ties right into our discussion:

http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazin...om/daily/mr11b
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Old 01-02-2011, 12:41 PM   #7
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Re: Casual Vs Hardcore- Labels Exploited For Profit And Excuses

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Originally Posted by PGaither84
You don't have to know anything about Magic: The Gathering to read this article, and I feel it ties right into our discussion:

http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazin...om/daily/mr11b
Ha, I'm probably then a Johnny/Spike combo when it comes to football video games. Most of my friends are Timmy's, and they don't play Madden often.
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Old 01-02-2011, 12:45 PM   #8
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Re: Casual Vs Hardcore- Labels Exploited For Profit And Excuses

I agree for the most part TLC, but don't overestimate the casual audience. My nephew is part of the casual audience and I've tried to explain to him that Madden isn't like the real NFL experience. He replies have been, stop trying to make the game any more complex, there are 4 downs in the game, correct? You still need 10 yds to make a first down, don't you?

All he cares about is getting online with his buddies and gain bragging rights. I chuckled when he accused me of looking at replays all day long.

I know you want to rid the labels, but I feel they will be difficult to remove. All I need to do is look at my nephew and his friends.

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